GPA and hooks

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I fully intend to hit 300. Trust me, I have a good reason to believe this will happen.

I scored a 302...on my DIAGNOSTIC USMLE.

Maybe the OP WILL score a 38 and maybe he won't. You should take a diagnostic MCAT tonight and report back.
 
If I were the OP I'd report back I hit a 37, and that I need to work a little bit to hit my eventual target. 😉

Heh, I guess so; I would, too, if I'd claimed a 38+.

HOWEVER, some people are bluntly honest without the slightest shred of common sense and I suspect the OP may be one of them. I bet he'd tell us the true score.
 
Damn I'm glad I didn't go to this guy's high school--college level organic chemistry as a HS senior?
 
Heh, I guess so; I would, too, if I'd claimed a 38+.

HOWEVER, some people are bluntly honest without the slightest shred of common sense and I suspect the OP may be one of them. I bet he'd tell us the true score.
As I said in my first post in this thread, before I knew about the beast, I would have claimed I would get a 99th percentile any day. I'd never gotten below that on a standardized test. (Still haven't, but the MCAT took a hell of a lot more work than I would have expected back in the day.)
 
I took organic chem at a college...most of the other courses I learned the material on my own and did lab work on my own as well. =/

Anyway, I took the PR diag and here are my (didn't do the essays + inflated curve?) results (name removed obv):

http://img378.imageshack.us/img378/4860/mcatscoremi0.jpg

I know I'm going to get crap either way, so I'll just say that I'll continue to work my hardest for the next 3 years 🙂

(common sense is overrated lolz, but I apologize for being bluntly honest...it's called real talk)
 
Why the hell would a med school DISFAVOR their premed undergrads?

I've heard of it being for reasons of "expanding your horizons." Not to say I wouldn't mind going somewhere else for med school, but HMS would be nice (obviously).
 
If you break 20, I'd be very surprised. Why even bother worrying about the MCAT until you've taken all the classes it tests? 😕

lol ok now this is just hate. There are many people who can break 20 on a diagnostic based off high school coursework. If you've had really good AP classes that's totally possible.
 
I hate to flatter the OP by saying this but:

people who do olympiads are generally as good if not better than 99th percentile MCAT scorers.

I know people who do olympiads (these people are better than I am ... I would say I am just a tad below). I just scored 40 on my last diagnostic (AAMC). You be the judge.


Nevertheless, the MCAT does require a bit of luck and complacency will not get you anywhere. So yes, I see the argument in people saying "not to assume a 38 on the MCAT". Nevertheless, these same people should also not be so quick to shoot someone down just because they project a high MCAT score.

Similar to OP, I projected a 35 on my real MCAT before I even entered freshmen year (and I based this on, once again, being just under that olympiad category of people). In something like 7 or 8 practice tests I have scored above 35 on all but one. Once again, some people are justified. Most people simply haven't heard of olympiads but, trust me, the people are good. If you don't believe this, look up IMO (International Mathematical Olympiad) and look up the questions. I guarantee you won't be able to solve a single one from any year and these are supposedly high school questions.

Olympiads are hardcore. Give original poster a break please.
 
^THANK YOU, I've been waiting for posters of your (our?) ilk to come out of the woodwork. I know the path to a 38+ is arduous, but at least someone understands why I'm feeling optimistic.

And BTW a few years ago there was a girl who got a gold medal on IBO right after she got a 44 on a real MCAT.
 
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Most people simply haven't heard of olympiads but, trust me, the people are good. If you don't believe this, look up IMO (International Mathematical Olympiad) and look up the questions. I guarantee you won't be able to solve a single one from any year and these are supposedly high school questions.

Olympiads are hardcore. Give original poster a break please.
I was part of both science and math olympiads, thanks. 😉
 
Similar to OP, I projected a 35 on my real MCAT before I even entered freshmen year (and I based this on, once again, being just under that olympiad category of people). In something like 7 or 8 practice tests I have scored above 35 on all but one. Once again, some people are justified. Most people simply haven't heard of olympiads but, trust me, the people are good. If you don't believe this, look up IMO (International Mathematical Olympiad) and look up the questions. I guarantee you won't be able to solve a single one from any year and these are supposedly high school questions.

Olympiads are hardcore. Give original poster a break please.

OK, so I wasn't going to get involved, but I just had to respond to the above. I looked up the problems, and they aren't any harder than the A1 and A2 problems of the Putnam. In addition, you get three times as much time for each of the IMO problems as for the Putnam. Please don't assume that we (the readers, in general) lack particular skills without justification.

That said, I'd opine that the OP has presented sufficient evidence that he (?) has a fair shot at a 38. Though I'd far rather trust the AAMC practice exams, and luck most certainly is a major factor, getting the score he did on the PR diagnostic before doing dedicated test prep would seem to bode well.

As for the original question, I must agree with previous posters and say that while sports are a nice EC, simply having it won't make up for a lack in some other department. Of course, if you win major honors in the sport that'll help, but that's by no means guaranteed. If you enjoy it though, go for it; just don't slack elsewhere.

Best of luck :luck:

p.s. I have absolutely nothing against IMO. Those look like very fun problems.

p.p.s. Saying "I have my reasons", even when true, does not enamor you to a crowd that's heard unwarranted claims of that type many times.
 
Adamska, regardless of whether or not your diagnostic is real (which I somewhat doubt given your seemingly unnecessary blacking out of the first name) you have displayed great arrogance and immaturity in this thread and you have a lot to learn if you truly want to be a physician someday.
 
^so because I don't want to make my name known on the internet (in fact, a sensible person would make it a priority), I'm faking? Someone sounds bitter.

I'm thinking of MD/PhD and I don't know where the immaturity and arrogance attacks are coming from. I made a claim and backed it up...please get over it. There are people who've scored higher on the real thing at a younger age, so obviously I KNOW I'm not the best.
 
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I'm extremely pleased to have correctly predicted that he would present a diagnostic score and I believe my assessment of him as "bluntly honest with no common sense" is right on the mark.

Well, ok, to get back to your original question, OP: You're obviously a very gifted/educated individual with a lot of promise re: MCAT, etc. You have a very obvious forte in academics; as long as you can keep up your grades and don't somehow start scoring lower on the MCAT, feel free to explore any extracurriculars of your choice with any depth you desire. It's up to you to maintain a balance that you deem 'acceptable' between outside activities and academics. I think a 38 will automatically make you very competitive at any school in the country assuming you don't let your GPA drop. Looks like you're probably going to have a lot of options.

A word of caution: Common sense is very possibly overrated, but I suspect it's helpful at interviews. And situations where you need to predict what other people are thinking...

Oh well, good luck and thanks for not applying for entrance in 2009.
 
dude it's the internet how are you seriously gonna judge someone's common sense over an online forum? If I really were one of those one-dimensional types I wouldn't even be asking an athletics-related question on this forum, but hey to each his own.
 
Making you first name known on the internet is no big deal... and really, if everything you have already posted on SDN is true it would not be overly hard to find out your full name and more, after all, how many people are Olympiad semifinalists, D1 athletes (at Harvard no less), and will be published authors next quarter? With all your amazing accomplishments you should probably look to just skip undergrad and head straight to HMS, that is of course unless the HMS Adcom thinks you should "broaden your horizons" and attend JHU.
 
lol @ next quarter

Even still, I'd rather know the people IRL instead of just saying "OH HEY GUYS THIS IS ____ YEAH REMEMBER ME WITH THE GPA THREAD NOW IM HITTING IT BIG LOL" on SDN, ya smell me?
 
^so because I don't want to make my name known on the internet (in fact, a sensible person would make it a priority), I'm faking? Someone sounds bitter.

I'm thinking of MD/PhD and I don't know where the immaturity and arrogance attacks are coming from. I made a claim and backed it up...please get over it. There are people who've scored higher on the real thing at a younger age, so obviously I KNOW I'm not the best.

Dude, this is the internet. You haven't "backed up" any claim.

Get over yourself. Come back in 4 years and wow us with your 38+ then...
 
I took organic chem at a college...most of the other courses I learned the material on my own and did lab work on my own as well. =/

Anyway, I took the PR diag and here are my (didn't do the essays + inflated curve?) results (name removed obv):

http://img378.imageshack.us/img378/4860/mcatscoremi0.jpg

I know I'm going to get crap either way, so I'll just say that I'll continue to work my hardest for the next 3 years 🙂

(common sense is overrated lolz, but I apologize for being bluntly honest...it's called real talk)
Good diagnostic score. Thats pretty impressive if you did it straight out of high school, though the real MCAT will probably be quite different than the princeton review one. None of the practice tests compare to the later AAMC ones.

Oh, why do you have Calculator open in the background? Nothing but a pencil allowed on the MCAT. (Well, paper too. But still...)
 
^I took the test on a macbook (well, VMfusion windows) and I can't print screen on a virtual machine on a mac, so I had to open up the score from my desktop (if you think that's improbable then in any case it's a four-function calculator so it would be more of a hassle to use than pencil & paper).

Dude, this is the internet. You haven't "backed up" any claim
dude I was talking about the olympiads, not the mcat score. Get over yourself.
 
^I took the test on a macbook (well, VMfusion windows) and I can't print screen on a virtual machine on a mac, so I had to open up the score from my desktop.



dude I was talking about the olympiads, not the mcat score. Get over yourself.

Dude, nobody here knows who the **** you are - this is the internet - people can come here and claim anything they want - just your "saying it" and repeating it doesn't "back it up."

Seriously, you need to move along, little fella, and scurry off to Cambridge and start that storybook life...

Buh Bye!!!
 
"little fella"? lol sounds like a 45 year old professional to me.


nice photoshop, you should go into graphic design instead of medicine
picard-facepalm.jpg


sry I just needed a reason to use this one again.
 
If I truly have a diagnostic score that high, I wouldn't even bother posting it.
 
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doesn't matter what you score on the diag, it is the real thing that matters (this is from my amcas app)


 
^OMG PHOTOSHOP SKILLZ

I guess I'm not being as prudent (i.e., thinking it's realistic to score above a 35) as I should because I know of someone who got your score as a senior in HS (not trying to insult you at all, but just explaining why my perception is skewed).
 
^OMG PHOTOSHOP SKILLZ

I guess I'm not being as prudent (i.e., thinking it's realistic to score above a 35) as I should because I know of someone who got your score as a senior in HS.
Now that I'll call bull**** on. Most years, maybe one person in the entire country scores a 44. Some years, none.

If its 44 on some crappy diagnostic, maybe, but I've done that. And I'm not that much older than your HS buddies. Doesn't mean anything.
 
No, real thing. She just graduated from MIT.
 
^OMG PHOTOSHOP SKILLZ

I guess I'm not being as prudent (i.e., thinking it's realistic to score above a 35) as I should because I know of someone who got your score as a senior in HS.

I actually got a 45 as a HS junior but I didn't realize that schools didn't consider MCAT scores that were more than 3 years old, so I had to retake. 😡
 
I actually got a 45 as a HS junior but I didn't realize that schools didn't consider MCAT scores that were more than 3 years old, so I had to retake. 😡

LMAO

Anyway, nice job on the 44. That ****'s ballin.
 
A couple of points for the OP while trying to stay civil, not quite sure why he's gotten so much flak, even if he's come off as a bit obnoxious:

1) I am suspicious of the diagnostic score you posted, mostly because I'm not familiar with that Princeton Review test. I don't even know if it's passage-based or just a set of freebie discrete questions. If you really took a 5 and a half hour full length test just to prove a point to anonymous people on an internet forum: a) congrats on your score b) you really have way, way, too much time on your hands. If the test you claim to have taken was anything less than a full-length MCAT, you're score means less than nothing.

2) I am suspicious of the score you posted because of your insistence on comparing the science olympiad material to the MCAT even after claiming to have taken a diagnostic. The MCAT is at its most fundamental level critical reading test, not a knowledge-based one, and having a strong high school background will not help you perform better than other students.

Now some actual advice:

3) Being a varsity athlete will not compensate for poor(er) grades. If you are aiming for highly-ranked medical schools (which I assume you are given your presumption of a 38 and desire to go MD-PhD), you need to have everything - high grades, high MCAT (the mean at the top may well be near a 38 by the time you apply), great ECs, great research, great clinical experience, etc. Unless you have a truly unique set of experiences (and being a varsity athlete does not count for these purposes), you will be rejected in favor of an applicant who has a more complete application.

4) If you are seriously considering applying MD-PhD, then I do not think you have time to be both a varsity athlete and a competitive applicant at the more well-regarded programs. You need to have an EXTENSIVE research background, relying on what you did in high school and working during the summers in college is simply not sufficient to develop the requisite resume. You numbers will need to be even higher for the top programs (it is not unusual at all to see 3.9/39 among accepted MD-PhD applicants to Harvard/Hopkins/WashU/Penn/etc.). Also consider that you will be trained to be a scientist, not a clinician, in most cases, and decide if that's your cup of tea.

5) Regarding your second question: yes, many schools actively discriminate against their own undergrads in graduate school admissions, or are at the very least indifferent to your coming from their undergrad. HMS in particular has a rep for discriminating against its own undergrads, as does Hopkins. A few schools favor their own undergrads, such as WashU and to a lesser extent Duke. Penn used to give a fair amount of preference to its own, but the administration has reversed course in recent years with a new administration that favors having students 'branch out' for their graduate education (this is the main rationale behind schools discriminating against their own undergrads).
 
A couple of points for the OP while trying to stay civil, not quite sure why he's gotten so much flak, even if he's come off as a bit obnoxious:

1) I am suspicious of the diagnostic score you posted, mostly because I'm not familiar with that Princeton Review test. I don't even know if it's passage-based or just a set of freebie discrete questions. If you really took a 5 and a half hour full length test just to prove a point to anonymous people on an internet forum: a) congrats on your score b) you really have way, way, too much time on your hands. If the test you claim to have taken was anything less than a full-length MCAT, you're score means less than nothing.

This was just the catalyst (pun unintended), I'd been meaning to try a full-length test out for a few weeks now (and it's the fortnight to the start of college, you're right I do have a lot of time on my hands atm). It was a full-length test.

2) I am suspicious of the score you posted because of your insistence on comparing the science olympiad material to the MCAT even after claiming to have taken a diagnostic. The MCAT is at its most fundamental level critical reading test, not a knowledge-based one, and having a strong high school background will not help you perform better than other students.
...and the olympiads at their most fundamental levels are critical thinking tests. This is the ultimate reward of competing in them: a holistic approach to the problem (leave no stone unturned). Worked well enough here. Although if the PR diag isn't reliable then that might be affecting the score.

Now some actual advice:

3) Being a varsity athlete will not compensate for poor(er) grades. If you are aiming for highly-ranked medical schools (which I assume you are given your presumption of a 38 and desire to go MD-PhD), you need to have everything - high grades, high MCAT (the mean at the top may well be near a 38 by the time you apply), great ECs, great research, great clinical experience, etc. Unless you have a truly unique set of experiences (and being a varsity athlete does not count for these purposes), you will be rejected in favor of an applicant who has a more complete application.
duly noted.

4) If you are seriously considering applying MD-PhD, then I do not think you have time to be both a varsity athlete and a competitive applicant at the more well-regarded programs. You need to have an EXTENSIVE research background, relying on what you did in high school and working during the summers in college is simply not sufficient to develop the requisite resume. You numbers will need to be even higher for the top programs (it is not unusual at all to see 3.9/39 among accepted MD-PhD applicants to Harvard/Hopkins/WashU/Penn/etc.). Also consider that you will be trained to be a scientist, not a clinician, in most cases, and decide if that's your cup of tea.
duly noted as well. Is it a problem that my two previous projects (both of which were in separate fields themselves) will more than likely not be in the same field as my next haul?

5) Regarding your second question: yes, many schools actively discriminate against their own undergrads in graduate school admissions, or are at the very least indifferent to your coming from their undergrad. HMS in particular has a rep for discriminating against its own undergrads, as does Hopkins. A few schools favor their own undergrads, such as WashU and to a lesser extent Duke. Penn used to give a fair amount of preference to its own, but the administration has reversed course in recent years with a new administration that favors having students 'branch out' for their graduate education (this is the main rationale behind schools discriminating against their own undergrads).
Ahh I see. Thanks for the info.
 
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Sorry if it sounded like I was trying to call you out, but it seems that anytime someone sets a high goal, even a goal not as high as 38, people make those comments. It's just something that I've never seen outside of SDN.
If he said a 38 was his goal it would be one thing, but he obviously believes that he will definitely get a 38 or greater. I too would like to know the reasons behind such confidence. Especially since he is asking about balancing classwork and playing basketball which makes me assume that he is a freshman. If he isn't a freshman, he should already know what the time commitment for classwork is.

EDIT: Just realized he admitted to being a freshman.
 
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@gators: to see how what I've learned in the past 2 years stacks up to the test.

@milkman: how do you know I haven't done so already?
Well mainly because I don't know too many high schools that offer organic chemistry, but your confidence will definitely make for an interesting interview experience if you ever get that far. :laugh:
 
Is it a problem that my two previous projects (both of which were in separate fields themselves) will more than likely not be in the same field as my next haul?


It's not a problem because your research from high school will not really count in med school admissions, in fact it will seem like you have very little to offer if you mention it in your application beyond citing a publication if you were lucky enough to get on one. It is however, somewhat important to have a consistent project or area of research during undergrad, rather than jumping from lab to lab as some prefer to do, because in MD-PhD interviews you need to talk about your research in intimate detail, as well as be able to have at least some sense of where you want to go with your graduate research.
 
5) Regarding your second question: yes, many schools actively discriminate against their own undergrads in graduate school admissions, or are at the very least indifferent to your coming from their undergrad. HMS in particular has a rep for discriminating against its own undergrads, as does Hopkins. A few schools favor their own undergrads, such as WashU and to a lesser extent Duke. Penn used to give a fair amount of preference to its own, but the administration has reversed course in recent years with a new administration that favors having students 'branch out' for their graduate education (this is the main rationale behind schools discriminating against their own undergrads).

Ehh, I think this is more SDN Urban Myth than factual...med school is extremely competitive, and the classes they are filling are quite small...with 10,000 apps and 100 to 200 seats to fill, I think it is pretty hard to make the case that applicants who don't get in at the UG affiliated med school have been "discriminated" against...in fact, if you look at the incoming med class rosters at schools like Yale, more of the incoming class comes from Yale UG than any other school - this data is not always readily available, but I suspect the same is very true for most med schools...I seriously doubt that there is any discrimination against these applicants at any of these schools.

I really think it is more a case of sour grapes from those applicants who got rejected...
 
Ehh, I think this is more SDN Urban Myth than factual...med school is extremely competitive, and the classes they are filling are quite small...with 10,000 apps and 100 to 200 seats to fill, I think it is pretty hard to make the case that applicants who don't get in at the UG affiliated med school have been "discriminated" against...in fact, if you look at the incoming med class rosters at schools like Yale, more of the incoming class comes from Yale UG than any other school - this data is not always readily available, but I suspect the same is very true for most med schools...I seriously doubt that there is any discrimination against these applicants at any of these schools.

I really think it is more a case of sour grapes from those applicants who got rejected...

Not to overly nitpick, but Yale is not the most represented school at Yale Med, Harvard is, though by a very small margin (for the 2007 entering class, 9 came from Yale and 10 from Harvard for a class of 100, still a big percentage). Even if your idea held true in this case, as it certainly does for some (like HMS and PennMed), it hardly proves that the school does not disfavor it's own premeds. Every premed applicant will almost certainly apply to the MD program at their respective university, creating a disproportionate representation in the applicant pool and in the resulting incoming class. This is most likely to be observed at schools where both the undergrad and med school are very highly regarded; they produce many highly qualified applicants and the applicant pool for the med school is much more along the lines of 3-4,000 applicants than the 10,000 observed at some less competitive programs (self-selection). This does not even touch on the idea that a number of the students admitted from the affiliated undergrad may have some special 'in' at the med school (i.e. worked in an influential PI's lab or know a few adcom members).

Additionally, such discrimination may not be entirely the fault of the adcoms. When all of the applicants at your school are apply the same place you are, it makes it that much harder to set yourself apart, and at some point the med school must start turning away otherwise qualified applicants from your school to avoid jeopardizing the makeup of their first year class. At other schools, where every single one of your premed classmates did not apply, this situation does not arise.

More to the point though, the idea that med schools actively look with disfavor upon their own undergrads is hardly myth. At my undergrad, an ivy premed factory, our premed advisors specifically described this situation to us, and how it would indeed hurt some of our chances at gaining admittance to the school's med school. I have also been to panel sessions with med school admissions officers where the issue has come up, and the answer has been as I stated above; that it varies and some schools will give you a boost, some hurt you, and some not care.
 
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Congrats to the OP, but I truly feel sorry for you!

In HS I hung out with my friends every night and had a great time. Didn't do any homework and I ended up at a school where a lot of my classmates (who had very high GPAs) also attend.

We didn't have the opportunity to do college courses (no colleges nearby) or the olympiads (sounds like something I would be interested in, though), but I am much happier that I didn't sacrifice social aptitude so that I could take orgo and the MCAT in HS.

Good luck, but it is clear you are missing a lot of qualities that attract human beings and fun times (ie talking about how awesome you are).

Have fun, I have no doubt that youll get into medical school.
 
So OP, what makes you so sure you can play D1 sports?
Little league footballish-basketball?

and for all interested...
Yodarules.jpg

It's real, I swearz on my mothers' graves.
 
So OP, what makes you so sure you can play D1 sports?
Little league footballish-basketball?

and for all interested...

It's real, I swearz on my mothers' graves.

you need to work on that writing score, next time don't just string together a series of curses!
 
The OP's original question I believe is being a varsity athlete in college and how med school admissions committee look at the time it takes, particularly in Div !. It is tremendously demanding and my guess is that there are better ways to look good to an adcom committee. But that is beside the point. What you will personally gain from DI varsity (or whatever) must be invaluable to you or you shouldnt do it no matter what. And if it is so important to you, then you should do it, no matter what. Twenty or forty hours per week of practice, travel, conditioning etc has to be done because you love being an athlete, and because you only go thru college once. So, if you love it, do it, it will never be available again (Unless you make pro). And don't worry about medical school, if you want to be a doctor and have the discipline to do well in college and be an athlete, you WILL get in.
 
^yeah, I'm not worrying anymore (even though you approached this from the wrong view, I was asking if it would hurt, not if doing it would help). D1 ftw.

Congrats to the OP, but I truly feel sorry for you!

congrats for what? A diagnostic score?

In HS I hung out with my friends every night and had a great time. Didn't do any homework and I ended up at a school where a lot of my classmates (who had very high GPAs) also attend.

We didn't have the opportunity to do college courses (no colleges nearby) or the olympiads (sounds like something I would be interested in, though), but I am much happier that I didn't sacrifice social aptitude so that I could take orgo and the MCAT in HS.
Well considering orgo was my only class as a senior and I just took a diagnostic after HS, I don't know what you're talking about. +5 for good strawman/defense mechanism though.

Good luck, but it is clear you are missing a lot of qualities that attract human beings and fun times (ie talking about how awesome you are).
talking about olympiads = talking about how awesome I am? lol...

So OP, what makes you so sure you can play D1 sports?
Little league footballish-basketball?

....

and for all interested...
Yodarules.jpg

It's real, I swearz on my mothers' graves.
If the 5's weren't ****ed up I'd be all "zomgwtfbbq hax"
 
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Congrats to the OP, but I truly feel sorry for you!

In HS I hung out with my friends every night and had a great time. Didn't do any homework and I ended up at a school where a lot of my classmates (who had very high GPAs) also attend.

We didn't have the opportunity to do college courses (no colleges nearby) or the olympiads (sounds like something I would be interested in, though), but I am much happier that I didn't sacrifice social aptitude so that I could take orgo and the MCAT in HS.

Good luck, but it is clear you are missing a lot of qualities that attract human beings and fun times (ie talking about how awesome you are).

Have fun, I have no doubt that youll get into medical school.

Just because the OP went to a rigorous program for high school, and flaunts of his superiority on SDN, doesn't mean that he had no fun and lacks in social aptitude. There certainly are people out there that can succeed at academics and also have their share of fun at the same time. Just because you or I couldn't do it, doesn't mean that others can't.
 
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