Grades vs. P/F

[cubsfan]

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Here's a question that could become an issue:

If there are two schools that are similar in stature and reputation (let's say CWRU and Emory), yet one school is P/F(Case) and one is on a letter grade system(Emory)...should that be a significant factor in choosing schools (to clarify--I am not in at either school---just posing the question).

 

[BeckyG]

I would definitely advocate for the pass/fail system - I think it removes a lot of the competitiveness in the class and makes people less stressed. (I am assuming that both schools are good and will offer excellent educations AND that you would be happy at both schools.)

 

[racergirl]

I'd go P/F as well

 

[altaskier]

I've heard P/F is better as well.

 

[deleted7807]

It should only be a significant factor in choosing schools if it is important to you. If you care, then make it a significant factor, if you don't care, then don't worry about it.

 

[THE instiGATOR]

I guess I am different. I've never been exceptionally good at taking standardized exams, so I rely heavily on my ability to perform well in the classroom (no, I'm not a gunner 😎 ). I need every opportunity I can to shine, considering I wish to pursue academic medicine, and would not be able to use class placement to my advantage in a P/F school. So, if two schools were similar...I'd opt for the A - F school.

 

[rajneel1]

i think that even p/f schools are going to keep track of your class rank and percentage when it comes time to apply to competitive residencies. so that is probably true with these schools and maybe you should ask them.

 

[WSUreds]

No, they do not keep track of your grades considering that you are given a number which sealed and only known to yourself. The P/F is usually instituted in the preclinical years and your defining features towards residencies are your personality and your performance during rotation and your board scores.

 

[UCLA2000]

I had enough competition to last me a life time during my undergrad. I don't want to deal with that bullsh*t during medical school too. It was hard to really get to know my classmates at UCLA because everyone was so busy viewing each other as the "enemy" someone they must do better than in order to succeed in life. Do you really want that during med school? I would rather go to a school that ranked much lower but was P/F than a school that was better and A-C. I really value new friendships, and happiness and I feel that a P/F med school would be much more apt to provide me with those things.

 

[DesperatelySeekingMD]

Ask someone at Emory what percentage of people get A's, B's, C's...at many schools with grades the grade distribution really makes it almost exactly like High Pass/Pass/Fail. I know that just Pass/Fail is a different matter. I don't know much about Emory, but I loved Case. I had a great feeling when I visited and have heard wonderful things from all of the students and faculty that I talked to- also important I have heard from many residency directors how prepared case students are.
If it really comes down to those two schools and if you have the time and money I would visit them again and get a better feeling for each. Sometimes on an initial visit you don't get the "real" feel of the school.

 

[USeF]

good to see someone actually giving a PRO for grades, Swampman. good point.

Yet the way UChicago outlined their system seemed ideal. They have P/F and NO ranking for 1st 2 yrs and then receive ratings (forget exactly how) for the clinical years. This seems ideal for me, as your performance in clinical years is truly your own personal performance and more crucial to your competency as a physician than the previous two.

Having the same problem deciding on H/P/F vs. grades (pitt vs. UF).. I'll deal with that hurdle if it comes though.

 

[The Fly]

To me this is a non-decision--after being graded our whole lives, why wouldn't you want a P/F system??

Oh, the Fail/Pass/High-Pass/Honors systems that exist out there don't count as P/F (to me that is!)...what do you guys think ???

 

[tBw]

Originally posted by GG16:
•To me this is a non-decision--after being graded our whole lives, why wouldn't you want a P/F system??

Oh, the Fail/Pass/High-Pass/Honors systems that exist out there don't count as P/F (to me that is!)...what do you guys think ???•••

I couldn't agree more! As you may see from one of my other posts I am tired of 'pre-med' syndrome and think it is far more likely to continue in a graded med-school than a P/F one...and whether you call it A,B,C,D,F, Fail/Pass/High-Pass/Honors or Monkeys/Zebras/Lions and Do-Do Birds really doesn't make any difference (except in how stupid your transcript looks...)

 

[Jalby]

I'm with Swampman here. I really like the grades and that is one of the reasons Baylor is one of my top choices. I work out with the residency director for a well known hospital here at UCLA and he tells me that he finds it a lot easier to judge people from schools with grades. He doesn't like UCLA because it is PF all 4 years and the only thing he really has to go on is the lettter from the dean, but that doesn't say much because all it says is every student can walk on water. So I would definately choice a school with some form of grading. I like Michigan's style in that the grades are fixed points, so tons of people can get a high pass if they study hard enough.

Besides, who syas P/F isn't stressfull? (unsubstanciated rumer here) UCSD is P/F but I always here the students hate it because it is extremely comperarive.

 

[THE instiGATOR]

USeF: At my interview w/ UF last year, they told us that they work really hard not to foster competition. I was told that grades aren't posted, so one can't judge his/her peers. I think you track your placement with a password or something. Maybe Cobragirl can help us better understand UF's system?

 

[Scooby Doo]

Ahem, "screw the raiders"...

I am going to choose a school that is pass/fail over a graded school inspite of the rankings or whatever. When it comes down to it, residencies don't give diddly squat about your first two years and thats when most of the schools are P/F...UCLA I guess is unique that it's completely pass/fail....Ah well, oh..and I consider H/P/F the same thing as Pass/Fail....Such as the system that Penn has....

 

[tBw]

Originally posted by Screw the Raiders:
•I'm with Swampman here. I really like the grades and that is one of the reasons Baylor is one of my top choices. I work out with the residency director for Cedars Sinai here at UCLA and he tells me that he finds it a lot easier to judge people from schools with grades. He doesn't like UCLA because it is PF all 4 years and the only thing he really has to go on is the lettter from the dean•••

I thought that's what USMLE board scores were for? I guess different strokes for different folks but I know that I would feel far less stressed knowing it was Pass/Fail, and happiness/less stress is much more important to me than providing a GPA that I suspect will be ignored in favor of USMLE anyway. Now if UCLA students had problems getting decent residencies I might concur, but they don't, so...I guess I'm glad some of us like grades and some of us don't...there are different med schools for each of us and we can all be happy 🙂

onwis

 

[pcl]

Hey, I'm at Case and loving P/F. I think it makes it less stressful.

We are only P/F in our pre-clinical years though. Once we are on the floors, we are Honors/HP/P/F from what I understand.

Good Luck with your decision.

 

[oneironaut]

Incidentally, UConn is also completely pass/fail the first two years, then p/f/honors in residency.

I don't know about UCLA, but then its the written evaluations that I think count more then grades in clinical rotations. I think.