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ClickityClack

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Just got onto Facebook. Apparently, my old platoon leader in Kosovo is a co-founder and chairman of VoteVet.org.
Great.
While I've been studying myself sick and slumming it in my low-rent shack... he's been having chats with Larry King and Olberman.
Dude's spending the holidays globe-trotting through Hawaii and who-knows-where.

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Just got onto Facebook. Apparently, my old platoon leader in Kosovo is a co-founder and chairman of VoteVet.org.
Great.
While I've been studying myself sick and slumming it in my low-rent shack... he's been having chats with Larry King and Olberman.
Dude's spending the holidays globe-trotting through Hawaii and who-knows-where.



F-ing awesome.

Wow, way to hate on someone else's achievements
 
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WTH? Get over being upset with other people's achievements. There will always be someone smarter, better connected and cuter than you. Focus on your own life goals!
 
I love you guys.

I understand. While you're studying chemistry and doing other not so interesting things he's engaged in activities that seem like accomplishments, successes, and feats of greatness. You'll have your own someday. He just has a different job than you do right now.
 
Being pre-med's like being Janet Jackson's left boob. The one she didn't flop out at the Superbowl.
 
premed'ing does in fact suck like a vacuum

I'm trying to figure out what this thread is about but I'm missing it. Are you all complaining about doing school work? Why? Learning should be enjoyable. Are you all complaining about the long road ahead of us? So what, we'll all be doing something until we die.

I don't understand what there is to complain about. I understand the med students complaining. They are the ones drinking from the fire hose. I understand the residents complaining. They have long hours and low pay. But the pre-med life looks pretty easy to me.
 
he's been having chats with Larry King and Olberman.

Who wants to talk to Keith Olberman anyway? Might end up as the "worst person in the world" for the day if you say something he doesn't like.
 
Learning should be enjoyable.

Yet too often it isn't particularly when the requisite courses aren't ones that a person (me, for example) would ordinarily take. I finished college six years ago, and these are just hoops we have to jump through to meet an end goal. I wish I'd done it then when I had more time and mindset for it. It's not the learning that isn't fun. It's the assignments. I'm not an academic. There are things I want to know and others I don't really care about. School is not a fanciful activity for me that it appears to be for you. Again, I like certain subjects, but those complained about on here aren't really interesting to me. The medical school portion is, yeah, and I understand there is a small area learned in the premed stuff that medical school builds upon, yet even in medical school there are classes, that don't seem that appealing while others do. React to this how you want. It may be blasphemy to some of you, but remember we're all different with very different interests.
 
Yet too often it isn't particularly when the requisite courses aren't ones that a person (me, for example) would ordinarily take. I finished college six years ago, and these are just hoops we have to jump through to meet an end goal.

I'm not trying to be a Pollyanna here. But given the choice between Pollyanna and Eeyore, I think I'd prefer the sickly, sweet positivism. Actually, to stretch the metaphor, I'd really rather be Tigger.

If we are pre-meds and already bemoaning our fates, then we're going to make medical school miserable for ourselves and everyone around us.

Several decades ago I went a few days without food. For a couple of days I had some Nestle's instant chocolate powder (the old mix-with-milk kind) that I would stir with a teaspoon of water and eat. Then the powder ran out. After that experience when I would sit down to pray and say thanks before a meal I would nearly have a pentecostal runaway. I have a MEAL! HalleLUjah! I have FOOD in the cabinet! GLORY!

This memory helps me switch off the complaint button.
 
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I'm not trying to be a Pollyanna here. But given the choice between Pollyanna and Eeyore, I think I'd prefer the sickly, sweet positivism. Actually, to stretch the metaphor, I'd really rather be Tigger.

If we are pre-meds and already bemoaning our fates, then we're going to make medical school miserable for ourselves and everyone around us.

Several decades ago I went a few days without food. For a couple of days I had some Nestle's instant chocolate powder (the old mix-with-milk kind) that I would stir with a teaspoon of water and eat. Then the powder ran out. After that experience when I would sit down to pray and say thanks before a meal I would nearly have a pentecostal runaway. I have a MEAL! HalleLUjah! I have FOOD in the cabinet! GLORY!

This memory helps me switch off the complaint button.

Oh, Ed. AKRanger and Wladziu are just going through a phase of kicking themselves for certain choices made in the past, if only because it makes the present a little suckier for the moment. Let the boys vent. I daresay most of us on the nontrad forum have gone through this phase in some form or other, and I have faith in them that they'll rant it out, suck it up, and keep on toughing it out.

BTW, I, personally, am a Heffalump. Everyone thinks I'm without substance until they actually witness me in action. Or, if you prefer, like Janet's left boob until suddenly I'm the right boob. HELLO!
 
Oh, Ed. AKRanger and Wladziu are just going through a phase of kicking themselves for certain choices made in the past, !

When did I kick myself for choices made in the past? I'm on the other side of the argument. Don't include me among the Eeyore's.
 
I ain't calling you Eeyore, Tigger, that's why I said "most" of us have done the same thing rather than "all". From my own personal experience, I've arrived at a place in my life where I can be honestly appreciative for every experience of my life, good and bad, because they all have taught me lessons and shaped me into who I am now, a person whom I rather like.

But I didn't get to this place without a whole lotta soul searching--which, sometimes, necessitates the kicking of one's own arse before the wisdom, acceptance, and appreciation settles in. Not all of us have been so lucky to have been born into a family or an environment where these life skills have been taught since day one, or to have been even luckier to have been born with these life skills fully intact. Some of us have to teach them to ourselves.

Or, sometimes one is just having a bad day and would like to vent for a little while to a sympathetic soul.
 
Can we go back to hating each other?
Cause I don't know what a Heffalump is. And, I'm too scared to look it up.

Thanks for the sentiment, Jinx. You're a sweetheart.
Let's knock it off, now, before we get trolled.

Quick! Everyone look busy!
Acetylcholine!
I don't like you!
I'm smarter than Jesus!
*and so on
 
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I'm not trying to be a Pollyanna here. But given the choice between Pollyanna and Eeyore, I think I'd prefer the sickly, sweet positivism. Actually, to stretch the metaphor, I'd really rather be Tigger.

If we are pre-meds and already bemoaning our fates, then we're going to make medical school miserable for ourselves and everyone around us.

Several decades ago I went a few days without food. For a couple of days I had some Nestle's instant chocolate powder (the old mix-with-milk kind) that I would stir with a teaspoon of water and eat. Then the powder ran out. After that experience when I would sit down to pray and say thanks before a meal I would nearly have a pentecostal runaway. I have a MEAL! HalleLUjah! I have FOOD in the cabinet! GLORY!

This memory helps me switch off the complaint button.

Let me point out that I never bemoaned medical school or a future path since that, as I tried to point out, is a goal I look forward to. However, the path getting there isn't one I would wish on another person. It's like any other game albeit a game that isn't at all fun. Simply, the most competitive player who gets through all rounds of the game without being knocked out; college classes that to me aren't really interesting, MCAT, volunteerism, clinical exposure, letters of recommendation, and the interview is the winner.
 
Let me point out that I never bemoaned medical school or a future path since that, as I tried to point out, is a goal I look forward to. However, the path getting there isn't one I would wish on another person. It's like any other game albeit a game that isn't at all fun. Simply, the most competitive player who gets through all rounds of the game without being knocked out; college classes that to me aren't really interesting, MCAT, volunteerism, clinical exposure, letters of recommendation, and the interview is the winner.

I can't remember your story very well. So I don't know if you have shown a history of jumping from one thing into another. But what you just said here is fairly unattractive. I wouldn't say this in front of an adcomm. I'm not the judge, but the paragraph above sounds like a "grass is always greener" syndrome.
 
Ed, you're starting to sound like the kids on pre-allo. "If you don't enjoy every single part of the premed process and you are even remotely thinking about a salary when your training is over, you will make a bad doctor", blah, blah, blah. I agree with AKRanger; there are sucky parts along this path and no, you don't have to enjoy every stinking minute of it. Just recognize it's a game, figure the rules out, and play to win. That's all. Nobody said anything about going in front of an adcom and bitching about the process--I doubt that anyone here is that dumb.

A Heffalump is Winnie-the-Pooh's drunken nightmare.
 
i don't know about you guys, but I am really enjoying these science and math premed prereq courses that I have already taken and will be taking. To the point that my life feels more full now that I now know these theories and equations. I mean wow, using cal to figure out exactly the area of space between two curves, how electrons transfer energy to figuring out friction forces and etc... wow!

I mean I don't think I will be able to withstand another 10 years of studying if I wasn't enjoying the process. So I guess my humble suggestion as a beginner nontrad. premed is to take it easy and don't get so caught up in what lies in the future and enjoy what you are learning and doing right at the current moment. That way if somehow you discover later on that this isn't the right path for you, you can still feel that you have enjoyed the process and been enlightened.
 
--I doubt that anyone here is that dumb.

You know better than that...

His argument serves a purpose to those on the path.



Apologies for the whining while I've been under the weather, folks. But, thanks for the support.

I'm sure Winnie the Pooh had lots of nightmares, Jinx. His mind was blown from all those bad acid trips and that year in 'Nam, after all.
 
I heard a rumor that Winnie keeps a necklace of ears in his closet.
 
I can't remember your story very well. So I don't know if you have shown a history of jumping from one thing into another. But what you just said here is fairly unattractive. I wouldn't say this in front of an adcomm. I'm not the judge, but the paragraph above sounds like a "grass is always greener" syndrome.

Who would say it? I only mention it here because it's come into question. Think what you will because I have my own opinions as well.

By the way, if a person elects to jump around in their occupation, as I have, why do you have a dim view of it. Work is work, and I only do it to make a living. Sure, I like it because it's what I chose to do, but I could think of other things to fill my day. I left teaching to enter law enforcement because enforcement has more appeal to me than education. I can do more that interests me, and I can do it better. If I decided tomorrow that being a skilled tradesmen would better suit me I'd be all on board for it. I've got all my ducks in a row, and I can tell you for fact that the grass is greener.
 
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Just got onto Facebook. Apparently, my old platoon leader in Kosovo is a co-founder and chairman of VoteVet.org.
Great.
While I've been studying myself sick and slumming it in my low-rent shack... he's been having chats with Larry King and Olberman.
Dude's spending the holidays globe-trotting through Hawaii and who-knows-where.



F-ing awesome.

Now you can "hit him up" for a letter of recommendation. It's a win-win situation for you!:thumbup:
 
Ed, you're starting to sound like the kids on pre-allo. "If you don't enjoy every single part of the premed process and you are even remotely thinking about a salary when your training is over, you will make a bad doctor", blah, blah, blah. I agree with AKRanger; there are sucky parts along this path and no, you don't have to enjoy every stinking minute of it. Just recognize it's a game, figure the rules out, and play to win. That's all. Nobody said anything about going in front of an adcom and bitching about the process--I doubt that anyone here is that dumb.

A Heffalump is Winnie-the-Pooh's drunken nightmare.

You hit the nail on the head there. Realistically how can anyone enjoy, or be expected to enjoy, ever step of the way to becoming a doctor. I surely don't, but medicine is just something I want to do so I'm making every attempt to get there. I think that's all anyone can do really. With regards to salary, I personally am quite satisfied with my current salary and lifestyle the dollar signs aren't even there, and I'm sure it's the same way for a lot of other working non-traditional students.
 
You hit the nail on the head there. Realistically how can anyone enjoy, or be expected to enjoy, ever step of the way to becoming a doctor. I surely don't, but medicine is just something I want to do so I'm making every attempt to get there. I think that's all anyone can do really. With regards to salary, I personally am quite satisfied with my current salary and lifestyle the dollar signs aren't even there, and I'm sure it's the same way for a lot of other working non-traditional students.

Did you ever play sports in High School? Did you ever hear the line "your forget the practices, but remember the games"?

I believe that to be true.

Everything worth doing in life has it's hard parts. It also has it's rewarding parts (if it didn't, no one would make the effort).

We selectively forget the hard parts and remember the good times.

Yeah, a lot of pre-med work just sucks. A lot of med school sucks. It's just like anything else, one foot in front of the other until you get to where you want to be.

On that note, back to re-teaching myself biochem.
 
Did you ever play sports in High School? Did you ever hear the line "your forget the practices, but remember the games"?

I believe that to be true.

Everything worth doing in life has it's hard parts. It also has it's rewarding parts (if it didn't, no one would make the effort).

We selectively forget the hard parts and remember the good times.

Yeah, a lot of pre-med work just sucks. A lot of med school sucks. It's just like anything else, one foot in front of the other until you get to where you want to be.

On that note, back to re-teaching myself biochem.

kinda what i said isnt it
 
Yeah, some kind of necklace.



All the points made here have weight.
Warms the cockles of my heart to see such positivism.
Or maybe the sub-cockle region.
Somewhere in the kidneys.

Glad this thread didn't turn south. I've got to start coming here when I'm not sick and pissed at the world.
 
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Wladziu, I am a girl and now I must go to bed wondering to what slightly inappropriate necklace you were referring to.
 
You hit the nail on the head there. Realistically how can anyone enjoy, or be expected to enjoy, ever step of the way to becoming a doctor. I surely don't, but medicine is just something I want to do so I'm making every attempt to get there. I think that's all anyone can do really. With regards to salary, I personally am quite satisfied with my current salary and lifestyle the dollar signs aren't even there, and I'm sure it's the same way for a lot of other working non-traditional students.

My problem isn't with people who don't enjoy every step of the process. Nor am I trying (as I said before) to be a Pollyanna. But that may be too obscure a literary reference, maybe I ought to stick with Disney and sports.

Since we have a battle of metaphors here, I'll run with the sports one. The reason that so many of us love Brett Favre is precisely because he loves the game so much. I'm sure he doesn't love getting knocked on his backend. I'm sure he doesn't love throwing interceptions. But he loves football and he acts glad to be one of the favored few who get to go out and get assaulted and battered every week.

That's the attitude that I like to see in pre-med and med students. We are lucky to be one of the favored few who get to even consider medical school. I remember a day when I would have thought myself lucky to even have one full-time job instead of supporting a family on 2 and sometimes 3 part-time positions. I tried to find a way to go back to college in those days and couldn't find a way to do it.

I don't know what kind of doctors we all will be. But I do know the kind of students that I like to hang around, and nightmares about an imaginary Heffalump monster aren't very enjoyable to hear.
 
Don't be knockin' on my Heffalump, Ed, he's only a baby.

That's okay, Baby Heffalump, Mommy still wuvs you.

Huffalump_Lumpy_Valentine051808073431.gif
 
:thumbup: to you jinx and Ark. I hear ya too.

Sometimes I think people don't want to hear reality stories from those that have worked quite some time in crazy, university hospital settings. They haven't really lived enough in that environment, so. . .

There are extremes to either side here. Old Grunt, it's true. The only way is one foot in front of the other. You find out how it will be for you as you go through it, and you keep in mind people have different perspectives for a number of reasons.

From where I've been for a very decent amount of time, there's no "glory road" in medicine. It's a fine profession. But it's not about great honor or prestige or the money. LOL, truly. Some "make it big" as compared with most others I suppose, but in all professions that is the way it goes.

There's better money and prestige to be made elsewhere without the same amount of educational frontloading and other hoops and the particular brand of frustration that can come with going down the pre-med-to-medical-school-to-no-less-than-three-years-residency-to-low-man-on-totem-pole-in-the-practice road.

I figured out, as many do, what the luckiest residents are making during residency. The lucky ones in my part of the country are making what comes out to be $10-$12 per hour (That is based on residents 80 hr--work week, not including their own study time for practice at work in residency, step 3, and board certification prep. BC can mean oral exams too, which many surg. res and fellows have shared can be tough.)

As most physicians will share, don't go into this if you can really see yourself doing and loving something else.

Thing is, most don't get to see things as they truly are until they have been through it, unless they have somehow seen from the inside. Yes that inside perspective may be limited as compared with actually going through it. But nurses that I know that have been on the indirect and then direct perspective will admit their eyes were more open to what the whole process is about as compared with a fair amount of their MS peers.

Medicine is really about humble pie, nose to the grindstone, day in and day out service. The truth is a good number of physicians try to talk their own kids out of pursuing it if they can. I've heard them do so. And there is a reason for that other than them being complainers, whiners, or bitter people. It's a bit similar to why a number of nurses will totally discourage their kids from going into nursing. Sure, they know they can't stop them. But they will let their peace be spoken and for good reason.

Yes, there is a lot to medicine from points all the way around; but when you reduce it down, it's more about service than a lot of the glorious ideals of what it is. And I can bring forth numerous physicians that will say this. Yes they may well like what they do, but they will tell you that it is no glory road or the road to wealth or some kind of prestige.

Honestly this fixation with this is a little bit strange to me coming from a NT. I say go to physicians and speak with them. If they are straight-up, they will speak the balanced truth of all sides, and that includes the sucky sides, though they really won't have enough time to go into great detail about the sucky sides of it--too many and too long. You have to wait to the book comes out.

Princeton has a book out that includes movies and book recommendation about medicine.

I personally thought"Learning to Play God" was a good non-fiction re-telling of things. It's got some good perspectives on the PGY/intern blues. Robert Marion is honest in his recounting. It's a little bid dated now, as his experiences go back to the late 70's early 80's. But there are things that are mostly relevant in it. And folks can thank his influence in the movement to reduce residency work hours down from 120/wk. No he wasn't a lone wolf in this; but he had been railing against it for some time.
Anyway, the book is worth the few bucks to me, or I say pick it up from the library. Actually a lot of physicians have written non-fiction perspectives of the whole process.

Here's the link of reviews on it from amazon:
http://www.amazon.com/Learning-Play...ts=1&colid=&sortBy=bySubmissionDateDescending



Thanks jinx and Ark for being straight up and hitting it where it really is.
 
Yeah, a lot of pre-med work just sucks. A lot of med school sucks. It's just like anything else, one foot in front of the other until you get to where you want to be.

Yup, and I'm sure a lot about practicing medicine will suck, unless you enjoy mountains of endless paperwork, business ethics in medicine, patients who can't be cured, people who try (unsuccessfully) to kill themselves, ad nauseum.

That doesn't mean that someone wont enjoy being a doctor though. There are things in life that suck, thats life. I just try to view the sucky parts as part of the "life experience" and take pleasure in the parts I love. If anyone thinks being a doctor is a perfect job with no negatives, I need to show you my real estate license.
 
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