GWU PsyD

[Fali1991]

Hi everyone. I know this forum is not usually friendly towards non-funded PsyD programs, especially those with a psychodynamic emphasis as a training model.

My question is specifically about the program's reputation as I am quite intrigued by GW's PsyD program for many reasons. Any insight would be much appreciated. My end goal here is private practice.

I anticipate this veering off into some back and forth argument about PsyD and fully funded PhD's, but my hope is that it won't. Thank you in advance.

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[WisNeuro]

Accredited match rates vacillated between 42-76% in recent years. That is.....not good.

 

[LadyHalcyon]

Hi everyone. I know this forum is not usually friendly towards non-funded PsyD programs, especially those with a psychodynamic emphasis as a training model.

My question is specifically about the program's reputation as I am quite intrigued by GW's PsyD program for many reasons. Any insight would be much appreciated. My end goal here is private practice.

I anticipate this veering off into some back and forth argument about PsyD and fully funded PhD's, but my hope is that it won't. Thank you in advance.

All I'll say is that their apa accredited internship match rates seem low to me.

 

[LadyHalcyon]

Accredited match rates vacillated between 42-76% in recent years. That is.....not good.

Yeah. That's especially concerning given the recent increase in apa accredited internships over the last several years.

 

[Fali1991]

Yeah. That's especially concerning given the recent increase in apa accredited internships over the last several years.

This is completely valid, and there are so many factors that go into this it seems. Some programs have close to a 100% match rate but when I look more deeply into it it seems it is due to having a captive internship site. I'm not defending the program, but am open to other opinions. The match rate does concern me.

 

[WisNeuro]

This is completely valid, and there are so many factors that go into this it seems. Some programs have close to a 100% match rate but when I look more deeply into it it seems it is due to having a captive internship site. I'm not defending the program, but am open to other opinions. The match rate does concern me.

The captive internships are for larger cohort programs. There are plenty of 100% match rates over the course of several years in reputable PhD/PsyD programs that don't have captive internships/

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

Good for GWU. Seems they are sticking to their psychoanalytically-informed principles. There is more to the world of psychology than APA accreditation.

 

[WisNeuro]

Plenty of psychodynamic programs with high accredited match rates out there. Many are also fully-funded.

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

Plenty of psychodynamic programs with high accredited match rates out there. Many are also fully-funded.

I disagree that we have anything like "plenty" of psychodynamic programs, at all, but I get your point. Nevertheless, I wonder if GWU might favor an orthodox approach to psychoanalytic theory and practice, one that tends to set them apart from those others. Even then, I wonder how many of these many other programs, which might be theoretically similar, have a similarly strong emphasis on practice.

 

[WisNeuro]

I disagree that we have anything like "plenty" of psychodynamic programs, at all, but I get your point. Nevertheless, I wonder if GWU might favor an orthodox approach to psychoanalytic theory and practice, one that tends to set them apart from those others. Even then, I wonder how many of these many other programs, which might be theoretically similar, have a similarly strong emphasis on practice.

There are a lot of programs with significant psychodynamic training, the insider's guide can detail this. There are fewer psychoanalytic programs, but still many with full-funding.

Psychoanalytic-Friendly Graduate Programs in Psychoanalysis

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

There are a lot of programs with significant psychodynamic training, the insider's guide can detail this. There are fewer psychoanalytic programs, but still many with full-funding.

Psychoanalytic-Friendly Graduate Programs in Psychoanalysis

Interesting. Outside of New York, the opportunities for "primarily psychoanalytic" training are actually quite rare. Outside of New York (primarily NYC), there are only three other programs nationwide that offer a level of psychoanalytic specificity comparable to GWU. Of those three, one is not accredited. Of the two that are accredited, one has a captive internship program. New York has a critical mass of programs (and likely training sites) that seems to ensure students have a far greater likelihood of "success," as you seem to define it. There are simply far more options. But should program outcome in NYC be used as a national metric for evaluating the soundness of psychoanalytic training?

 

[WisNeuro]

Supply and demand. Why should there be a great number of programs that primarily focus on this outside of the hotbeds, if there is little to no market for it outside of those areas?

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

You say supply and demand, I say APA has created a virtual command economy.

 

[WisNeuro]

You say supply and demand, I say APA has created a virtual command economy.

Not really. Mostly it's that insurance won't cover several times a week sessions of therapy for years on end. So, you're generally looking at people with lots of expendable income, who generally do not have a condition that needs acute treatment. Generally a narrow demand. APA has nothing to do with relatively few people being willing to pay for something.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

I anticipate this veering off into some back and forth argument about PsyD and fully funded PhD's, but my hope is that it won't. Thank you in advance.

Luckily for you the thread veered off into a very unexpected debate.

Reputation is tricky. I am not in the DC area, so I don't know how people view it there. Otherwise, I don't think it has much of a reputation otherwise. I don't think people know this program well. Maybe its better known in the psychodynamic community.

 

[DynamicDidactic]

@Buzzwordsoldier I did my internship in Chicago,which is a psychodynamic and psychoanalytic stronghold. If a student desired to have that sort of training, it would be very easy in Chicago.

@Fali1991 I attended a Midwestern program that is very CBT but there was a psychodynamic supervisor. Based on my anecdotal experience, finding psychodynamic (less so psychoanalytic) training isn't difficult. As mentioned, I would prioritize a strong program (costs, cohort size, match rates) and then find opportunities for the type training that interests you. As mentioned in other threads, there are very strong and affordable PsyD programs out there and GWU doesn't seem all that great.

 

[Buzzwordsoldier]

Not really. Mostly it's that insurance won't cover several times a week sessions of therapy for years on end. So, you're generally looking at people with lots of expendable income, who generally do not have a condition that needs acute treatment. Generally a narrow demand. APA has nothing to do with relatively few people being willing to pay for something.

Not really, but sortakinda. At the level of clinical practica, there are many more sites offering psychoanalytically informed services to marginalized populations (generally unable to afford much of anything by way of psychological services). There is plenty of demand for those services. Let's just say APA leadership, such as it is, picks its battles.

 

[LadyHalcyon]

I went to American for undergrad. George Washington has a good reputation, although Georgetown had the best. It's a fairly difficult school to get into for undergrad. I'm not sure about their psyd program, but overall GWU has a good reputation. IMO the cost is WAY for their Psy.D program is way too high and I'm not impressed by their match rates. Ultimately, I think (especially if you moved outside the DC area), many people would be impressed with a doctorate from GW.

 

[LadyHalcyon]

This is completely valid, and there are so many factors that go into this it seems. Some programs have close to a 100% match rate but when I look more deeply into it it seems it is due to having a captive internship site. I'm not defending the program, but am open to other opinions. The match rate does concern me.

My psyd program has had an 100% match rate for the last 3 years and we don't have a captive internship. I would be curious as to why people aren't matching. It's possible it is by choice because they want to stay in the area

 

[msgeorgeeliot]

I went to American for undergrad. George Washington has a good reputation, although Georgetown had the best. It's a fairly difficult school to get into for undergrad. I'm not sure about their psyd program, but overall GWU has a good reputation. IMO the cost is WAY for their Psy.D program is way too high and I'm not impressed by their match rates. Ultimately, I think (especially if you moved outside the DC area), many people would be impressed with a doctorate from GW.

A school’s undergraduate brand is a total non sequitur in this arena

GWU’s PsyD program is a mayonnaise sandwich

 

[Seven_Costanza]

A school’s undergraduate brand is a total non sequitur in this arena

GWU’s PsyD program is a mayonnaise sandwich

Completely agree. GWU’s PhD program has a decent reputation but the PsyD program isn’t regarded very well at all. You may also likely have difficulty finding jobs outside of NYC because their training is exclusively psychodynamic. With that said, I knew somebody who went to their PsyD program and worked for a group practice in Manhattan. She said that she barely broke even with the costs of childcare and that she was only able to afford to live in NYC because her husband was a partner at a major law firm.

 

[foreverbull]

I knew someone who graduated from this program, and while I don't know the ins and outs of the program itself, my colleague operated from a deep psychoanalytic conceptual framework. I was impressed by her grasp of the theory, being from a different foundation, and enjoyed bouncing ideas off each other. But I don’t know if that was because my colleague was very intelligent or because she had good training (in spite of vs. the result of). I do recall that she had been trained to administer the Rorschach & had taken a semester course in it at GWU.

 

[Sanman]

From my somewhat limited knowledge of this program, it seems similar to Adelphi's PhD program in that it has more of an emphasis on psychoanalytic training than the mainstream. NY and DC psychoanalytic institutes are also tied into them, respectively. That said, the market for psychoanalytic training and places to do such work seem to be shrinking and money is becoming a problem. Grads may not be well suited for many modern psych jobs, IMO. Take that with a giant grain of salt. I am much more familiar with Adelphi.

 

[super.ego]

I knew someone who graduated from this program, and while I don't know the ins and outs of the program itself, my colleague operated from a deep psychoanalytic conceptual framework. I was impressed by her grasp of the theory, being from a different foundation, and enjoyed bouncing ideas off each other. But I don’t know if that was because my colleague was very intelligent or because she had good training (in spite of vs. the result of). I do recall that she had been trained to administer the Rorschach & had taken a semester course in it at GWU.

The GW PsyD program has a solid reputation in psychoanalytic/psychodynamic circles and the DC metro area. Their students typically present at APA Division 39 gatherings (and hold leadership positions in the division) and receive training rotations and externships at sites like Howard University CC, American University CC, GW Hospital, Kennedy Krieger Institute, University of DC CC, Georgetown University CC, and Sheppard Pratt.

 

[LadyHalcyon]

Maybe their match rates are so low because people are opting to choose unaccredited psychoanalytic internships. I have a friend who graduated from Columbia many years ago with a literature degree. He returned to Columbia a decade later obtain a pre-med post-bac; his goal was to go to NYU med school and become a psychiatrist. In order to boost his application for med school he started working at Bellevue; I believe his mentor was an analyst. Anyway, I talked to him last month and he tells me he is enrolled in the Boston Graduate School of Psychoanalysis for his Psya.D. (Doctor in Psychoanalysis). I was actually surprised their prices were very reasonable! I interviewed at NY hospital for internship and it was very psychodynamic. Definitely more common on the east coast.

I personally belive many programs don't place emphasis on receiving psychodynamic classes, training, and supervision. Even if a psychologist chooses to rely primarily on CBT interventions, I think it is important to learn how to conceptualize from a dynamic perspective, understand how to interpret transference/countertransference, and realize how all of these factors are impacting what is happening in the therapy room. That being said, I would be hesitant to attend such a specialized program. I wanted to receive a generalist training, with opportunities to emphasize in specialty areas (e.g. Forensic, Health). Psychoanalysis is a very niche market and will severely limit your professional flexibility, which is one of the main reasons I wanted to become a psychologist.

The GW PsyD program has a solid reputation in psychoanalytic/psychodynamic circles and the DC metro area. Their students typically present at APA Division 39 gatherings (and hold leadership positions in the division) and receive training rotations and externships at sites like Howard U. CC, American U. CC, GW Hospital, Kennedy Krieger Institute, University of DC, Georgetown U., and Sheppard Pratt.

 

[msgeorgeeliot]

The GW PsyD program has a solid reputation in psychoanalytic/psychodynamic circles and the DC metro area. Their students typically present at APA Division 39 gatherings (and hold leadership positions in the division) and receive training rotations and externships at sites like Howard University CC, American University CC, GW Hospital, Kennedy Krieger Institute, University of DC CC, Georgetown University CC, and Sheppard Pratt.

Where are the actual outcomes? Oh right, not so great.

 

[super.ego]

Where are the actual outcomes? Oh right, not so great.

I'm unsure to what extent you're familiar the program, its students, and its graduates (I'm certainly not an authority on the program), but from what I can gather as someone who practices in DC and has collaborated with GW PsyD faculty, graduates, and students, the outcomes seem pretty good. Again, this is only one person's [incomplete] viewpoint.

This is not to say that the program is without flaw. The tuition, for example, is outrageous.

 

[msgeorgeeliot]

I'm unsure to what extent you're familiar the program, its students, and its graduates (I'm certainly not an authority on the program), but from what I can gather as someone who practices in DC and has collaborated with GW PsyD faculty, graduates, and students, the outcomes seem pretty good. Again, this is only one person's [incomplete] viewpoint.

This is not to say that the program is without flaw. The tuition, for example, is outrageous.

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

This guy--Johnny Cash--is concerned in this area, white man though he is.

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[Fan_of_Meehl]

Hi everyone. I know this forum is not usually friendly towards non-funded PsyD programs, especially those with a psychodynamic emphasis as a training model.

My question is specifically about the program's reputation as I am quite intrigued by GW's PsyD program for many reasons. Any insight would be much appreciated. My end goal here is private practice.

I anticipate this veering off into some back and forth argument about PsyD and fully funded PhD's, but my hope is that it won't. Thank you in advance.

You are getting realistic feedback---though it is not loving.

You can maneuver into a better position.

 

[VirginiaIsForLovers]

I graduated from the GWU PsyD program. You get what you put into it (cliche I know). Really appreciate the really strong dynamic/analytical foundation early on in my training. After my first year I obtained externships outside of our clinic which allowed me to get supervision and clinical practice from other orientations, specifically CBT. I came into the program with a terminal masters and clinical hours, so maybe my experience was different than others. I matched phase 1 to an APA accredited site which happened to be my top choice internship. Interviewed at a least a dozen internships. I didn’t apply to any non-APA sites. Like someone said above, GWU brand is well respected maybe not by many in the field, but more so respected by clients since they equate the name to the undergraduate, law, and medical school. It’s become more well respected since decreasing their cohorts size so therefore not being compared to a for-profit Argosy.

The APA match rates are low for multiple reasons:
-Wanting to stay in DC, most students stay in the DC metropolitan area
-Not seeing the value of APA accreditation since most end up in private practice
-Low hours, therefore not meeting requirement for many internship sites

It is quite expensive and there are limited grants/scholarships. I am licensed, working for a non-profit in the Midwest, earn about 100k annually, and am 6 years into public service loan forgiveness.

 

[futureapppsy2]

I graduated from the GWU PsyD program. You get what you put into it (cliche I know). Really appreciate the really strong dynamic/analytical foundation early on in my training. After my first year I obtained externships outside of our clinic which allowed me to get supervision and clinical practice from other orientations, specifically CBT. I came into the program with a terminal masters and clinical hours, so maybe my experience was different than others. I matched phase 1 to an APA accredited site which happened to be my top choice internship. Interviewed at a least a dozen internships. I didn’t apply to any non-APA sites. Like someone said above, GWU brand is well respected maybe not by many in the field, but more so respected by clients since they equate the name to the undergraduate, law, and medical school. It’s become more well respected since decreasing their cohorts size so therefore not being compared to a for-profit Argosy.

The APA match rates are low for multiple reasons:
-Wanting to stay in DC, most students stay in the DC metropolitan area
-Not seeing the value of APA accreditation since most end up in private practice
-Low hours, therefore not meeting requirement for many internship sites

It is quite expensive and there are limited grants/scholarships. I am licensed, working for a non-profit in the Midwest, earn about 100k annually, and am 6 years into public service loan forgiveness.

Thanks for sharing your experiencs.
How much debt do you have? Are you finding if difficult to repay? Any concerns about PSLF not going through?

 

[denimfan]

Here’s what I’ll say. I’m in the DC area and all of the GWU PsyD program student I’ve met in some capacity has been White women who has rich husbands paying for their tuition.

 

[deleted656923]

Here’s what I’ll say. I’m in the DC area and all of the GWU PsyD program student I’ve met in some capacity has been White women who has rich husbands paying for their tuition.

I wish I was rich so I can have a wife