Harvard Stem Cell Institute, HHMI-Brown, or wait for Caltech SURF & others?

[glutamate]

Hi everybody!

I've been accepted to two programs so far for my first summer, the Harvard Stem Cell Institute Internship, and Brown's own HHMI Scholars Program. Both want me to respond by mid-March, but I'm also waiting on a SURF decision from Caltech, which should come April 2nd, and REUs at Tufts and Harvard.

I have no idea how to rank these programs and was wondering if any of you could provide insight? Is there any summer program "ranking"? I'm a first year pre-med at Brown looking into neuropsychiatry in the long run, maybe an M.D./Ph.D. but probably just an M.D.

The HHMI project I've been accepted to is looking at genetic control of neural diseases in drosophila that correlate to humans. I don't know which research program I've been accepted to at Harvard (I expressed interest in the nervous system diseases & translational research programs), and the SURF project I applied for is about neurogenetic conrol of c. elegans' sleep.

I have personal ties to Caltech, and I spent a LOT of time finding a mentor to possibly SURF with. That being said, I realize the non-Caltech acceptance rate for SURFs is significantly lower than it is for Caltech students, and it would be understatedly stupid to let both Brown-HHMI and Harvard slip by to get rejected by SURF.

That being said, I've (tactfully) emailed the program coordinators for both HHMI and HSC asking for more time while conveying excitement for their respective programs. I'm just in a bit of a bind now and really hoping for any advice/questions to ask myself that could help me figure out what to choose.

Thank you guys!

Edit: I declined HHMI-Brown today and my potential SURF mentor told me I could count on a 6K stipend even if the SURF funding didn't work out, so I can assume I have the offer.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[flatearth22]

If you can continue your project into the school year I would jump on the Brown-HHMI because it will increase your chances of getting a great LOR from the PI and possibly a publication as well. Definitely try to get extensions though so you can have more options from which to choose. Do they just want a deposit or something?

 

[glutamate]

See, that's the thing--when I start research at Brown sophomore year, I want to do it at the medical school and wish for clinical psychiatric research. I plan on contacting PIs in the departments of neurology or psychiatry, not just molecular bio. Would it be awkward if I did HHMI and didn't continue into the school year?

They just want me to accept or decline. They're offering a stipend and want us to find our own housing and food. Harvard's internship offers housing that we can pay for with part of our stipend.

 

[flatearth22]

There's nothing binding though right? I mean if you accept a spot at Harvard and/or Brown but then you get into WashU and CalTech and want to go to one of those instead what will happen? If there's no deposit or contract then they can't hold you hostage and commit to their program before seeing what else is out there.

It wouldn't be awkward if you didn't continue the research at HHMI....they would rather you be where you are happy. But it might be hard to be as productive in another lab that you start in the school year with a full course-load as opposed to continue at one where you already know the ropes and stuff.

 

[glutamate]

The acceptance email for Harvard and the offer letter for HHMI don't say anything about negative consequences if I accept and then back out, but isn't that a general no-no? Especially at my home institution. or if I reapply for the program(s) I don't choose, right?

I agree with you there--next semester will be hard enough as it is. but I really feel like my passions align more with clinical research. (It's just really hard, at least for me, to find summer programs for it!) If I choose HHMI and absolutely love it, then I'd try to continue and see no reason why I wouldn't be able to, but the HSCI had an 8% acceptance rate this year and I'm a freshman, whereas HHMI-Brown is for rising sophomores and juniors at Brown only. I feel like I would benefit more from the diversity that a national program would offer, but, again, your point about continuing research at Brown during the school year is compelling.

I might contact the HHMI PI to see if I could tour the lab sometime, and I've asked the HIP program coordinator if there was a way for me to find out which research program I would be accepted to...

Also, is it worth trying to contact Caltech's Student Faculty Programs office, tell them my situation, and ask if it's possible to get an early decision? It sounds kind of dumb and presumptuous, but I'm (obviously) kinda clueless about this process. 🙂

Thanks so much for your help!

 

[flatearth22]

I mean it's just a summer program. If they were that worried about it they would make you pay a hefty deposit or sign a contract. I'm sure others have been in your position before and backed out to go to another program so I highly doubt that they would blacklist you or anything. On a related note, these programs should really get together and have some sort of uniform deadline like how med schools have on May 15th so stuff like this doesn't occur.

 

[glutamate]

I KNOW RIGHT? I mentioned that in my emails with the HHMI program coordinator.. like, really? applying to summer programs is a HUGE pain. keeping track of all of those recommendation letters....such a headache. There should be like a common app.

 

[plumazul]

I KNOW RIGHT? I mentioned that in my emails with the HHMI program coordinator.. like, really? applying to summer programs is a HUGE pain. keeping track of all of those recommendation letters....such a headache. There should be like a common app.

ikr, or maybe a common thread on SDN about summer programs. Oh wait, there IS a common thread on summer programs

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=874354&page=14

 

[jonc1001]

Harvardddd ;D

 

[kduck]

I personally don't think it's right to jump ship on a place after you commit, but I guess there's nothing holding you back financially.

Regardless, you can't let both programs slip away, even if they aren't your favorites of the ones you applied to. There are no guarantees with these programs and you might not be accepted to any of the others. Pick the one you would go to based on whichever you like more; personally, since this is kind of a getting-your-toes-wet with research experience, I would pick the one that works out better financially. Then let the other one go. If you get into another you like better later, you could always feel out the situation then; but don't let both deadlines slip by, unless your extension is granted.

 

[glutamate]

trololol, I did a search for the programs I'm considering and judged that a new thread with my specific situation to be the best choice. no need for sass.

the harvard program director got back to me and basically said they can't offer me an extension...would it be ridiculous to call caltech and ask for my decision two weeks early?

 

[AticusHolmes]

Harvard Stem Cell, much more cool.

 

[kduck]

trololol, I did a search for the programs I'm considering and judged that a new thread with my specific situation to be the best choice. no need for sass.

the harvard program director got back to me and basically said they can't offer me an extension...would it be ridiculous to call caltech and ask for my decision two weeks early?

It can't hurt to try.

 

[IMSingular]

...

the harvard program director got back to me and basically said they can't offer me an extension...would it be ridiculous to call caltech and ask for my decision two weeks early?

Yes. If you are at the top of the list they would probably send you an acceptance. If they say they can't do anything you just make a choice.

 

[Stirbar]

I did the HSCI program last summer and can assure you that it was an incredibly rewarding experience. I developed a relationship with my PI (who already wrote me an LOR for a scholarship) and got a nice pub out of the whole deal. Not to mention, stem cell research is an exciting topic in science right now and most university's don't have labs or departments dedicated to pursuing it.

The classroom component of the program featured reputable professors and guest speakers each week who came to discuss their research and career paths. I wouldn't have traded that experience for any other opportunity. For what it's worth, I chose HSCI over the HMS pre-baccalaureate program program, the Harvard immunology program, and Stanford's Amgen. I was invited to return to the lab this summer.

From what I heard, not everyone had such an enjoyable experience, though. Neither one of my two roommates liked their lab assignments very much and didn't get any of the long-term benefits I was fortunate enough to receive. It's the luck of the draw, I suppose.

I would pick HSCI and go with the sure bet. Plus, you seem to want to begin research at Brown in the fall so why not mix things up a bit and get a change of scenery? If you change your mind and/or get in elsewhere, you can always withdraw.

 

[glutamate]

Thank you for everyone's advice!!

Stirbar, that's amazing to hear...I thought that HSCI interns couldn't do it again, though. Did your invitation to return include some kind of funding? Which research program did you work in? I expressed interest in the nervous system diseases and the translational research programs. Do you know if most people you met were placed into their first choice projects?? Knowing for sure that I'd be working with neurological applications would increase my willingness to accept right away.

I'm so excited... definitely leaning toward Harvard. I called Caltech's SFP office though and they said I should call again on the 15th.. we'll see. I'm kind of hoping I don't have to choose. (My boyfriend goes to Caltech and is probably SURFing this summer as well.)

 

[Stirbar]

The invite to come back wasn't through HSCI - it was directly from the lab I worked in. My PI told me they will give a stipend equivalent to the pay a research assistant would receive for a three month period. I worked in hematology/oncology; it was my top choice program. From talking with other interns, it seemed like most people matched into their first-choice department. I think that there are plenty of opportunities to get involved in your area of interest due to the large number of different labs in the Harvard network. Willy and Maureen were really receptive to the requests of the interns.

If you have any other questions, I'm happy to answer them! The bit about your boyfriend attending Caltech is an understandable incentive. Given that information, I would be inclined to go there if I were you (and received an acceptance). But there's no harm in taking Harvard's offer and pulling out if CalTech accepts you. The HSCI program has an alternates list so I'm sure you would just be opening up a spot for someone else.

Either way, you can't go wrong. Best of luck to you, glutamate!

 

[deleted393595]

See, that's the thing--when I start research at Brown sophomore year, I want to do it at the medical school and wish for clinical psychiatric research. I plan on contacting PIs in the departments of neurology or psychiatry, not just molecular bio. Would it be awkward if I did HHMI and didn't continue into the school year?

They just want me to accept or decline. They're offering a stipend and want us to find our own housing and food. Harvard's internship offers housing that we can pay for with part of our stipend.

Clinical is harder to contribute to than basic science

 

[glutamate]

Clinical is harder to contribute to than basic science

But when I read about it, I get excited. Basic neuroscience fascinates me, but there's something particularly about affective disorders that gets to me. I can't quite articulate it yet (and I hope that further exposure will help me express my passions in personal statements when the time comes to apply).

I really feel like it's worth pursuing at least by talking to a few PIs and touring a few labs in the psychiatry and/or neurology departments here. If I get my way, I'll have at least 6 semesters' worth of research here--hopefully that's enough time to make a contribution to my passions (or what I think I'm most passionate about at the moment), even if it is harder.

Sorry if I sound naive.. I've just been told over and over, and experienced for myself, that research simply isn't as rewarding as it could be if you settle for something that doesn't truly resonate with your interests.

The invite to come back wasn't through HSCI - it was directly from the lab I worked in. My PI told me they will give a stipend equivalent to the pay a research assistant would receive for a three month period. I worked in hematology/oncology; it was my top choice program. From talking with other interns, it seemed like most people matched into their first-choice department. I think that there are plenty of opportunities to get involved in your area of interest due to the large number of different labs in the Harvard network. Willy and Maureen were really receptive to the requests of the interns.

If you have any other questions, I'm happy to answer them! The bit about your boyfriend attending Caltech is an understandable incentive. Given that information, I would be inclined to go there if I were you (and received an acceptance). But there's no harm in taking Harvard's offer and pulling out if CalTech accepts you. The HSCI program has an alternates list so I'm sure you would just be opening up a spot for someone else.

Either way, you can't go wrong. Best of luck to you, glutamate!

Wahhhhh. Thanks for being so understanding. I still feel like I would be extremely torn if I got a SURF though! I think if it weren't for him, I would choose HSCI because of its more direct medical applications. But Caltech is obviously great, too, and sleep is a really important topic in neuroscience. 😕 I just wonder if I would eventually regret passing up HSCI for proximity to my boyfriend. Especially if he didn't get his SURF. That'd be awkward.

 

[glutamate]

deleted! double post.

 

[glutamate]

Hi everyone

I should hear back from the SFP office by Monday, a few hours before I have to tell Harvard my decision. My potential SURF mentor told me basically if I don't get a SURF, I will still have the 6k stipend to work there (and all the benefits the SFP office offers to SURF students anyway). Harvard's stipend is only 4k, and 3/4ths of my Harvard stipend would probably go toward housing there since I literally know no one in Cambridge. It's hard to find how much housing would cost at Caltech.

I've also spoken with a recently graduated TA from Brown who did HSCI and told me that it actually wouldn't give me any clinical application-like advantages over SURF...but there's still a part of me that is thinking I would just choose SURF to be with my boyfriend. And I also can't ignore the HSCI internship's 8% acceptance rate.

Thoughts in response to these updates?

 

[chronicidal]

I've also spoken with a recently graduated TA from Brown who did HSCI and told me that it actually wouldn't give me any clinical application-like advantages over SURF...but there's still a part of me that is thinking I would just choose SURF to be with my boyfriend. And I also can't ignore the HSCI internship's 8% acceptance rate.

I did HSCI last summer. I can't comment on the boyfriend bit, but I will say I lived with my girlfriend and not-living-alone makes life easier in terms of food and rent.

It is true it won't give you more 'clinical application-like advantages.' It's still basic science research, albeit in a field that is highly conscious of all translational potential.

There are a few ways in which HSCI leans towards the more translational side. Several of the principal faculty who speak and who take HIP students are MDs. They share about their career and how they went from medicine to research, what that meant to them, how their clinical training informs their research. I can think of a pulmonogist (MGH) and two heme/onc docs (MGH, Children's) off the top of my head who spoke and also supervised students. One of them talked about a project that went from basic science Nature paper to human trials in two years; pretty cool stuff. Also, one student was in the lab of the chief of surgery at BIDMC. You may also appreciate that there are two co-directors of HSCI, who both speak to and supervise students, one of them a heme-onc MD mentioned perviously, and one with a PhD who has a son with type 1 diabetes, who typically mentions that as a key motivation to change into stem cell research relevant to pancreatic beta cells, and who does not think a PhD is really worth the extra time on top of an MD. The HIP program director, Willy, has his PhD in human genetics and is also cognizant of all these patient-related ideas.

On top of this, there are occasions when a patient/advocate speaks to the class. Last summer specifically, a quadriplegic with a spinal cord injury spoke to us about her life and her thoughts on stem cell research.

All this to say that although doing HIP will not give you tangible clinical-type exposure, the way scientific issues are framed by all the big name people, the speakers, other students' research, will indoctrinate you towards doing translational-like research.

 

[glutamate]

I appreciate your insight! If I chose Caltech, I'm not sure if we would room together... It's getting tougher for me to choose! I'm not sure which factors to weigh the heaviest--the slant toward translational research or a bigger stipend & being with my boyfriend? I think I might choose Caltech now that I've talked to a few pre-med upperclassmen & medical school acceptancees at Brown.

 

[BartsDentist]

Those of you that have applied and been successful, I would really appreciate some tips on the application process for the Harvard Stem Cell internship.
Also, does your internship have to be 10 weeks or could it be discussed (possibly reduced)?