Hey everyone, I really need your inputs! What should I take: Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute-Albany Medical College 7-yr Physician Scientist Combined med. program or Cornell/Penn/CMU/JHU. I REALLY don't know what to do. For the program, I DON'T have to take the MCAT's, I get LOTS of research done, and I only have to maintain a 3.4 GPA at RPI. Please respond w/ suggestions, comments!
Help Me Choose Between A Bs/md Program And An Ivy
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I'll just start by saying that I'm not a big fan of the 6 or 7 year BA/MD programs. I have no particular knowledge of Albany, so I can't speak specifically about it. I have had several friends in the programs at UMKC and Northwestern. Northwestern seems to be a good program. I find UMKC to be lacking.
I don't like the accelerated MD programs because people who are 18 years old rarely really know that they want to be physicians. They haven't had enough life experience to know themselves well. I think that undergrad is too important of an experience to rush through. The four years of undergrad are an important time to learn about yourself and the world around you, not just to cram biology, chemistry, biochem, and physiology. While most of the accelerated MD program graduates whom I have worked with seem to be clinically competent, they often lack a depth of knowledge beyond medicine. The other problem with the accelerated programs is the rather high burn-out rate that they often have. While I don't have exact figures, I've known several people who've gone two or three years in an accelerated program to quit with a transcript full of classes that don't translate well into an undergrad degree.
Some people are probably a good fit for a 6 or 7 year MD. I guess I just don't see the point. So you'll be a doctor a year or two earlier. That's just another couple of years of hard work that you'll be doing in a great profession. Why not take that extra time and learn about art, music, literature, history, philosophy, or another culture?
My final caveat: if you're smart enough to get into an accelerated program, you're almost certainly going to get into med school via the traditional route. So go to the Ivy League University, take some classes outside of science/medicine, and mix with the interesting people who are studying things completely different from you. It's a great formative experience and one that should not be missed.
I don't like the accelerated MD programs because people who are 18 years old rarely really know that they want to be physicians. They haven't had enough life experience to know themselves well. I think that undergrad is too important of an experience to rush through. The four years of undergrad are an important time to learn about yourself and the world around you, not just to cram biology, chemistry, biochem, and physiology. While most of the accelerated MD program graduates whom I have worked with seem to be clinically competent, they often lack a depth of knowledge beyond medicine. The other problem with the accelerated programs is the rather high burn-out rate that they often have. While I don't have exact figures, I've known several people who've gone two or three years in an accelerated program to quit with a transcript full of classes that don't translate well into an undergrad degree.
Some people are probably a good fit for a 6 or 7 year MD. I guess I just don't see the point. So you'll be a doctor a year or two earlier. That's just another couple of years of hard work that you'll be doing in a great profession. Why not take that extra time and learn about art, music, literature, history, philosophy, or another culture?
My final caveat: if you're smart enough to get into an accelerated program, you're almost certainly going to get into med school via the traditional route. So go to the Ivy League University, take some classes outside of science/medicine, and mix with the interesting people who are studying things completely different from you. It's a great formative experience and one that should not be missed.
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I really don't see why you would take 7 years at a "just ok" program, when you could potentially do 8 years at excellent programs. Pre-meds from all of the undergrads you listed have very high acceptance rates at all of the best medical schools. There is no reason to lock yourself into a program at a 2nd tier undergrad and try to fight your way out if you decide not to go to Albany for med school.
The above only applies if you decide in a couple of years that med school is definitely what you want to do. I have a friend from college that applied to the same sort of program at Brown (PLME?) when she was in high school, didn't get in, and then decided in her first semester at Yale that she wanted to study history. She just finished applying to history grad schools and will be starting a PhD program in the fall.
College, in and of itself, is an extremely important educational experience. Don't rush things, just so you can be a doctor at 25, instead of 26.
By the way, are there financial advantages to doing the 7 year program at RPI/Albany?
Also, MCATs aren't terrible, you can do research anywhere, and a 3.4 GPA at an Ivy will likely get you into a better med school than Albany.
The above only applies if you decide in a couple of years that med school is definitely what you want to do. I have a friend from college that applied to the same sort of program at Brown (PLME?) when she was in high school, didn't get in, and then decided in her first semester at Yale that she wanted to study history. She just finished applying to history grad schools and will be starting a PhD program in the fall.
College, in and of itself, is an extremely important educational experience. Don't rush things, just so you can be a doctor at 25, instead of 26.
By the way, are there financial advantages to doing the 7 year program at RPI/Albany?
Also, MCATs aren't terrible, you can do research anywhere, and a 3.4 GPA at an Ivy will likely get you into a better med school than Albany.
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i agree with the observation that a lot of bs/md students tend to burn out (or at least lack enthusiasm). i would also concur with the advice that you should definitely just go to a nice undergrad institution where you will feel comfortable and enjoy yourself. life expectancies these days should be evidence enough that there is no need to hurry, and there is no doubt that your main focus as an 18 yr old should be developing your life experiences as opposed to honing your career skills. being a complete person will serve you much better in medicine (or any career) than extensive research experience.
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welll i got into a few ba/md programs and am also faced with choosing btwn some high-powered undergrads and these programs....however i distinctly didnt apply to the RPI program for a few reasons....it makes u do research over the summers, its too focused on the sciences and lets face it i highly doubt the social life at RPI is that great....the ba/md program i plan to attend allows me to major in anything, explore all of my academic interests especially outside of the sciences and i dont hafta worry bout the mcat and stuff....considering ur choice of program....i think for the amount of work u'd hafta do and the limitations that would be imposed upon you....deeeeef ditch the rpi program and go to upenn, columbia, cornell or any of ur other choices..from my knowledge of rpi's program.it seems that the program will restrict your undergrad years rather than make them stress free...however if you got into any other programs that might be a different story....
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hey buddy
i had to make a VERY similar decision way back when... i turned down the 7 year program. for what it's worth -- i have NO REGRETS... no doubt, the 7year thing would have been "easier" in many respects (academically, financially, etc), but it is so clear to me now that i would have been selling myself short.
good luck to you.
i had to make a VERY similar decision way back when... i turned down the 7 year program. for what it's worth -- i have NO REGRETS... no doubt, the 7year thing would have been "easier" in many respects (academically, financially, etc), but it is so clear to me now that i would have been selling myself short.
good luck to you.
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Yeah, go to the ivy! otherwise you'll regret it for the rest of your life.... also...
AS MUCH AS THE MCAT STRESSED ME AND I HATED IT.... *IT*, along with some of the experiences I admittingly ORIGINALLY did for the resume, really reinforced the reasons I knew *I* wanted to be a doctor and why. I think you people who just get right into the MD program from high school kinda miss that self-discovery kinda thing all of us normal applicants have to go through.. .and, paradoxically, as difficult and stressful as it sometimes is... it was a good experience I wouldn't want to go to medical school without.
AS MUCH AS THE MCAT STRESSED ME AND I HATED IT.... *IT*, along with some of the experiences I admittingly ORIGINALLY did for the resume, really reinforced the reasons I knew *I* wanted to be a doctor and why. I think you people who just get right into the MD program from high school kinda miss that self-discovery kinda thing all of us normal applicants have to go through.. .and, paradoxically, as difficult and stressful as it sometimes is... it was a good experience I wouldn't want to go to medical school without.
I am currently a student at UMKC's 6-year program. I am very glad that I decided to come here. Everyone else's reply was against these types of programs, but I wanted you to have at least one opinion for them. I am not sure of the program that you are talking about, but in general, don't undestimate the value of these programs. But, I do agree that it does take a certain type of student to complete this programs. You need to know this is what you want to do. Our program is nice in that you get to start working in the hospital the first week. It is nice to know what all of these classes are working towards just a bit earlier. I will have completed my MD by the time other students my age have just entered the hospital for rounds. 🙂 So, do your homework.....if you do, you will probably be happy any route you go.
Ok, I'm back. I'm getting alot of financial aid at RPI and CMU. Not much really from the ivies. When I visited RPI, I liked the facilities, the campus is beautiful, and the professors/students were really ambitious and encouraging of the school. RPI overall IS a first tier national university. In engineering, math, and science it's in the top twenty for undergrad and grad. It beates out alot of schools like Duke, Harvard, and Penn for alot of subjects. It is ranked in the top three in polymer chemistry. CMU is a great engineering school, but I don't know if I would like the small campus and if I want to go through w/ engineering, which itself is tough and concentrate on the pre-med course requirements and MCAT's. Cornell has severe grade deflation and I know alot of intelligent kids with only 3.3 GPA's and mid-30 MCAT's, which isn't too bad, and who only got into one or two schools, which are really not that great at all. Penn is good, but again, it WILL be competitive because there will be alot of intelligent kids in the same class and curves will take place. At RPI, I'll be able to be at the top of my class much easier than being above average at Penn. I can take the MCAT's if I want. If I do really well, then I can apply to other schools and I know kids w/ high (above 3.7) GPA's and mid-30's MCAT's getting into some really prestigious schools like Duke and others. If I do badly for some reason, I have Albany Medical College to fall back on. And, the more and more I'm talking to people, I'm wondering if it really matters to attend a prestigious med. school or residency. I could do residency in neurosurgery at not JHU, but Rush-Presbeterian, which is pretty good if I'm top of my class, and then do fellowship at top places. And, if I decide to do practice, it doesn't matter where I go to med. school and recieve training. ALL US med. schools are excellent and will provide sufficient training and education for a good doctor. Please reply with your suggestions. I'll definately take into account Penn. I just wanted to bring the other side of the argument for why the programs are good in some other ways.
And replying to Phatsebz, the RPI program doesn't make you do research over the summers. Only the summer before entering Albany Medical College, you do a research project. Also, the RPI program allows you to take all types of classes. So, if I want I can major in economics or art or any type of engineering if I want.
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The crappy part about those accelerated programs is that you are sort of locked into one medical school. You may go onto Albany Medical College, and then spend the rest of your life wondering "Could I have gone to Harvard Med, JHU Med, etc.?" You'll be selling yourself short of your true potential, AND it's so damn boring to know exactly what you'll be doing the next 7 years of your life. College is about flexibility, taking all sorts of classes, involving yourself in many different things to grow as a person. Spend a full four years in college, because it'll be one of the best times of your life.
I have some friends in those programs, who only came to drop out and join my undergrad because they were miserable. If you can get into an accelerated program, you can get into medical school the regular way too, and a much better one at that.
I have some friends in those programs, who only came to drop out and join my undergrad because they were miserable. If you can get into an accelerated program, you can get into medical school the regular way too, and a much better one at that.
I second everyone. go have a blast in college. drink, smoke, have lots of sexual experiences, etc. oh yeah, and study too. college (when done in the traditional manner) is one of the best experiences in your life as far as the good times to be had, the people you meet, the friendships you form. Throw in some travelling or studying abroad, and you really learn a lot about yourself. (and you never know, you may find that international relations or something like that is what truly lights your fire) My impression of the BA/MD route is that you're so busy cramming everything into 3 years that you don't have the time to look up from the path you are speeding down and appreciate just how wonderful youth can be, and when you're 35 years old, 7 years into your practice with a ton of money, one day you'll look deep within and say to yourself "what the hell have i done with my life? i'm doing well, i'm alive, but I haven't lived" (I would even recommend taking some time off after college and applying a few years later, but i'm biased). I think that it is important, throughout the process of becoming a doctor (both undergrad and med school), to SLOW DOWN, and appreciate this life, this country, and this earth that we've been so blessed with. I think everybody in this boat (myself included) sometimes can get too caught up in always trying to "better their credentials". For what? how much does it really matter. Summer research or go to Europe? I say opt for the latter.
Anyway, stepping down from soap box now.
Anyway, stepping down from soap box now.
Well about the drinking/sex part. Why would I be able to do when I'm at an ivy struggling to get A's in the hardest science classes for pre-med, when I'm studying my ass off for the MCAT, which is getting more and more difficult, when I'm searching like a madman for internships/volunteer stuff for the summer, and when I am forced to join clubs, get research done! At RPI, NO MCAT's. Those things are REALLY long and VERY hard! I study, but I can enjoy A LOT more w/ friends and I can go out. Even if I'm in NYC or Boston, I'm not going to be drinking every weekend! I'll be studying for tests. I'll be going out around once every two or three weeks and then I'll have to study. And, does it matter if I graduate from Harvard Med. school or Albany Med. College???? "Since I graduated from HMS, I get a special M.D. and I can charge more money." That's ridiculous. I may not get the top residencies, but so what? I do a neurosurgery residency at some big hospital that's only top forty or fifty like the University Hospitals of Cleveland, or UMich Hospitals and then I can stay there for fellowship or if I'm good, go to JHU for fellowship. And, if I want to be a professor or do research, I'm NOT closing doors by going to Albany Med. College. I can always get a Ph.D. separately if I want and find internships in med. school to get that experience. I know so many doctors who went to prestigious and not prestigious med. schools and did residencies from good to only decent places and they're working together in the same hospital. NO med. school is BAD in the US! Some have more facilities/hype, but they ALL give the same core education in the medical sciences. I don't understand why I would be having more fun at Cornell when I'm working my ass of doing engineering and all the pre-med crap then if I can skip ALL those things and get into med. school smoothly while having a great time at RPI meeting awesome people? I don't want to sacrifice my social life for pre-med in Ithaca when I could be having the time of my life (MOST pre-meds can't do this!) and get into med. school w/ no problem! Please give me some comments, suggestions, ideas on my problem. Thanks alot everyone for helpin' me out.
And about the locked thing. In NO way am I locked into going to Albany Medical College. ANY time I want, I can drop out of the program to a traditional 4-yrs at RPI or transfer to another college. I can take the MCAT's if I want and I can apply to other med. school whenever I want. It's all up to me. I can major/minor in anything I want and I don't have to anything in the summers if I want. It's one of the most flexible BS/MD programs out there. And out of the 40 combined med. program in the US, the RPI-Albany Medical College Physician Scientist Program is ranked in the top fifteen and is one of the OLDEST programs and is getting more and more demand. And if I don't want seven years, I can extend the program to eight years.
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lol - well it seems you've got yourself convinced.
well here's some more food for thought:
1) lets not exaggerate the difficulty of the science classes at the schools you are considering. you got into the schools. the adcoms thought you could handle the classes. its really not all that freaking hard to do well at these schools (i went to an ivy). seriously there's a limit to how hard a professor can make intro biology. also the MCATs arent really that bad. certainly not enough of an obstacle for you to choose to go to RPI over say Penn. you'd really base a 7 year decision on a 6 hour test?
2) I went to school in NYC - so by now you've figured out which school i went to. lol. but i went out almost every weekend. look college really isnt only about studying. yeah there are tests, but they really dont break your balls. i'll be honest though - if you're the kind of kid that studies every freaking weekend all the way through - stay away from columbia at least. we dont need that kind of crap. you're too damn young to become a gunner. relax a little.
3) your point about neurosurgery is interesting. while you're right, anyone who graduates from a US allopathic or osteopathic school CAN get an NS residency - what do you make of the data that shows the top tier med schools routinely place way more students into the most competitive residencies than the other schools. wouldnt you rather go to a place where competitive residency placement is the rule rather than the exception?
at the end of the day though, i think you've convinced yourself that the RPI program works for you. from the little that i know about you from this post, i think you'll probably be very happy there. good luck and let us know what you decide to do.
well here's some more food for thought:
1) lets not exaggerate the difficulty of the science classes at the schools you are considering. you got into the schools. the adcoms thought you could handle the classes. its really not all that freaking hard to do well at these schools (i went to an ivy). seriously there's a limit to how hard a professor can make intro biology. also the MCATs arent really that bad. certainly not enough of an obstacle for you to choose to go to RPI over say Penn. you'd really base a 7 year decision on a 6 hour test?
2) I went to school in NYC - so by now you've figured out which school i went to. lol. but i went out almost every weekend. look college really isnt only about studying. yeah there are tests, but they really dont break your balls. i'll be honest though - if you're the kind of kid that studies every freaking weekend all the way through - stay away from columbia at least. we dont need that kind of crap. you're too damn young to become a gunner. relax a little.
3) your point about neurosurgery is interesting. while you're right, anyone who graduates from a US allopathic or osteopathic school CAN get an NS residency - what do you make of the data that shows the top tier med schools routinely place way more students into the most competitive residencies than the other schools. wouldnt you rather go to a place where competitive residency placement is the rule rather than the exception?
at the end of the day though, i think you've convinced yourself that the RPI program works for you. from the little that i know about you from this post, i think you'll probably be very happy there. good luck and let us know what you decide to do.
I see what you're saying and it's great you had such a nice experience at THAT ivy league school in NYC. However, I didn't apply to that school. I've heard alot of Cornell deflation. I'm in the engineering school and thats very competitive. I don't want to transfer to another school in Cornell either. A 3.4 at Cornell is very difficult and I'm really not sure I can do that. The MCAT IS only a 8-hr exam, but it really does determine whether you go to med. school or not. Doesn't mean I won't take it. I just like the security. IF I do badly or I don't feel like taking it, I go to Albany Med. College. IF I choose to take it and I do well, then I just apply to other med. schools. And, if I go to Albany, no matter what, I WILL be top of my class. And, also, I guess I'm a type to not study that much and I don't want to be that type in college. I'll feel guilty going out when I could be studying more and more. But this way when I go out, I can really enjoy because there isn't that uncertainty in the future. And, I mean, if I'm really exceptional in med. school and get the right contacts, I CAN get a top residency. It's been done every year. I just have to work my ass off. Yes, for some people, the ivy classes are not that hard. But, I know so many smart kids at places like Cornell, JHU that are struggling because it's tough. Those are my choices right now and from what DOCTORS that I've talked to are telling me, RPI Medical seems to be the best choice. At worst, I have a great time there and get into med. school and then it's up to me to work really hard and get a good job at a nice hospital. And at best, I go to a really good med. school, get a really good residency/fellowship and end up in the same place that I would've have working my ass off coming from Albany Med. lol. Keep the suggestions going please. I'm still deciding. Just telling the pros of the program to make up for all the cons posted above. Thanks alot.
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You don't need to list the pros. We've been where you've been and some of us were accepted to and/or attended an accelerated program. Based on those experiences, all of the cons were placed into this discussion. Ultimately it's your choice, but like some of the other people said, it's very difficult to know that medicine is for you straight out of high school, in addition to everything else said.
Thanks for the reply. I'm really leaning towards the program. The only con I see in all this is that I may not be able to get that really intellectual undergrad experience that I would at the ivies. But, I guess I can sacrifice that for just a little less intellectual experience.
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just my 2 cents worth - I attend UMKC's six year medical program and I would probably chose the accelerated medical route because you are guaranteed admission into medical school as long as you have a certain GPA - a 3.4 in a regular undergraduate college - even school's like Penn and Cornell - still will put you against some really tough competition from people from other schools when you apply for medical school. What is really nice about your program, like ours, is that you do not need to worry about taking the MCATs - and you can concentrate and do well on the school work and I am sure you can still have a good social life outside of school as well. Go for the accelerated medical program - because now you are guarenteed your MD with a certain GPA - which is not even that high.
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I chose Northwestern's program over Stanford and Harvard and have had no regrets. There are smart people everywhere and you will gravitate towards people like you and with your interests wherever you go. I don't know the specifics about your program, but Northwestern was very flexible and it was a low stress 3year experience for me compared to what other premeds went through and I had a great time all 3 years 🙂
Thanks everyone for replies! UKMC 6-yr program and HPME 7-yr programs are really nice. The specifics of the RPI-AMC program: It's termed 'Physician-Scientist' so they encourage you to do research during the school years, but it's mandatory the summer before entering med. school. It's 7 years long, NO MCAT's, maintain a 3.4 GPA, I can major/minor in any subject, I can get out of the program, and I can apply to other med. schools. I'm just wondering if I'll be able to work at JHU in neurosurgery or some other specialty coming out of Albany Medical College. I know I have to be top there and a lot of doctors are telling me that it really doesn't matter what med. school you graduate from, but I'm just worried. Are the people in these med. programs worried about that also? Thanks again.
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I'm graduating this May from the RPI/AMC program you are referring to. I agree with some of the previous posters in that it sounds like you have already made up your mind. There's already been alot of good advice posted here, so I'm just gonna throw in my $.02 worth.
If I had to choose over again, I would NOT have gone into an accelerated program straight out of high school. I also had to choose between a BS/MD and several upper tier undergrads, and the thought of finishing school two years early and no MCAT finally won me over. Looking back, I'm realizing that I missed out on two-years worth of college experiences. HOWEVER, the RPI/AMC program has changed drastically for the better since I started (7 vs. 6 years, lower mandatory GPA, can now major in anything, option to apply to other med schools, etc.) I think you should have no problem obtaining a wholesome, well-rounded education from RPI.
As far as AMC goes....granted, it's not one of the top medical schools in the US, but does that really matter? The bottom line is that whether or not you went to an upper tier med school is not the most important point when residency application season comes around. All of the RPI kids were at the top of our class, and our class in general turned out a pretty decent rank list this year.
Bottom line.....make absolutely sure this is what you want to do, and enjoy college while you can!!!!
If I had to choose over again, I would NOT have gone into an accelerated program straight out of high school. I also had to choose between a BS/MD and several upper tier undergrads, and the thought of finishing school two years early and no MCAT finally won me over. Looking back, I'm realizing that I missed out on two-years worth of college experiences. HOWEVER, the RPI/AMC program has changed drastically for the better since I started (7 vs. 6 years, lower mandatory GPA, can now major in anything, option to apply to other med schools, etc.) I think you should have no problem obtaining a wholesome, well-rounded education from RPI.
As far as AMC goes....granted, it's not one of the top medical schools in the US, but does that really matter? The bottom line is that whether or not you went to an upper tier med school is not the most important point when residency application season comes around. All of the RPI kids were at the top of our class, and our class in general turned out a pretty decent rank list this year.
Bottom line.....make absolutely sure this is what you want to do, and enjoy college while you can!!!!
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Why is it that every single person on this board (all older than you and more experienced than you - we have been through this premed process and you haven't) tells you to go with Penn, but you are convincing yourself to go with RPI? You're very young and don't have the maturity or knowledge to know what will be best for your future. We are at least 4-5 years older than you and know that Penn is setting you up for a great future. You make it sound easy to go from Albany to a top residency. As someone said, wouldn't you rather go to a med school where top residency is the rule rather than the exception?
You have never been to college, you have never been a premedical student. We have, and every single post on this thread tells you that you'll be making a big mistake by going to RPI. Why don't you consider their advice rather than going with your preconceived, erroneous notions about college and medical school?
You have never been to college, you have never been a premedical student. We have, and every single post on this thread tells you that you'll be making a big mistake by going to RPI. Why don't you consider their advice rather than going with your preconceived, erroneous notions about college and medical school?
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I don't think it's an absolute clear cut choice in favor of the ivy, although I would probably take Penn over RPI/Albany. The difference in the caliber of the schools is great enough I think to outweigh the guaranteed acceptance(imo). I was accepted at Penn for undergrad as well, and I thought it was a good school minus its location.
I think a BA/MD program is a great choice as long as 1) they're flexible in allowing you to pursue what you want 2) they allow you to apply to other medical schools without jeoparidizing your status 3) you have the option to stay a full 4 years (someone I know at NU stayed 5 to get a masters, very flexible) and 4) the other options you have are not substantially more reputable schools.
I was confident about Northwestern but I'm not sure about #4 in your case. You will need to be at the top of your medical school class and have some luck if you want to reach the goals you've mentioned previously. If you want that JHU-neurosurg type of competitive specialty, you ought to go to Penn - it will make it much easier to get into a top medical school.
I think a BA/MD program is a great choice as long as 1) they're flexible in allowing you to pursue what you want 2) they allow you to apply to other medical schools without jeoparidizing your status 3) you have the option to stay a full 4 years (someone I know at NU stayed 5 to get a masters, very flexible) and 4) the other options you have are not substantially more reputable schools.
I was confident about Northwestern but I'm not sure about #4 in your case. You will need to be at the top of your medical school class and have some luck if you want to reach the goals you've mentioned previously. If you want that JHU-neurosurg type of competitive specialty, you ought to go to Penn - it will make it much easier to get into a top medical school.
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I would be surprised if anyone from Albany ever gets a Hopkins residency in a competitive residency. Considering you're competiting against thousands of applicants from top schools, your chances are slim. Albany isn't even in the top 70 in USNews!
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Hey Premed,
Whats your take on the George Washington 7 year BA/MD Program? I was recently accepted to it and am going to go there. What is George Washington Medical School's reputation? How is it as a med school? Is it ranked in the top 70?
Thanks
Whats your take on the George Washington 7 year BA/MD Program? I was recently accepted to it and am going to go there. What is George Washington Medical School's reputation? How is it as a med school? Is it ranked in the top 70?
Thanks
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for what it's worth: if i had to do it all over again, i regret not applying to the ba/md programs. there's no guarantee with med school admissions- harvard has like a 90% acceptance rate, but there's always that 10%. it's a nauseating wait.... and i wish i had the foresight to go for the guaranteed acceptance. the combined programs have prestige of their own...so whether you go for one track or the other your ego can remain intact. go for the combined program and apply to a small group of schools three years from now.
No, I haven't MADE up my mind yet, but I'm getting closer and closer to my decision thats leaning towards RPI. Ok, so everyone's saying that I won't get that undergrad experience? I really don't understand what you mean. I have siblings in college and I know a ton of kids doing regular pre-med undergrad at places like WUSTL, JHU, Cornell, and then I know kids that are doing crappy med. programs like NEOUCOM 6-yr program w/ Youngstown State Univ. in Ohio. First of all, as an undergrad you want to make friends that are like you, who are intellectual and fun. I can definately find this in kids at RPI regular and DEFINATELY w/ kids in the program. Second of all, I know kids in the program RIGHT NOW and they're getting 4.0's. I know kids that got out of the program aand are going to Duke Medical. Compared to 4 years ago, the program is becoming more and more flexible and so more and more competitive. I know plenty of kids that are very well off coming from these "low ranked" med. schools. Yes, you guys know more about college than me, but I'm leaning towards the program AFTER talking w/ students in undergrad, med. school students, and DOCTORS. ALL these people are telling me that it REALLY doesn't matter what med. school you go to. Of course I can get a top residency from Albany Med. if I'm the top and I show I'm the best. It's been done. And, even if I don't get the top 3 residencies in neurosurgery, who cares? I can get a top 30 hospital or even a top 50 hospital residency and I'll be earning the same amount of money and getting the same basic training. I'm not going to be any worse than the other surgeons. Prestige really shouldn't enter the medical field. You learn and you apply wherever. All US Med. schools are GOOD. What does the lowest ranked person from the "worst" med. school get? A M.D. degree. And, I'm NOT limiting myself from going to other med. schools. I have that option. RPI is a great school. I know people that are really happy there. Penn is good, but I've heard alot of bad stuff about it also and I personally think that education is education wherever. This undergrad experience is just hype/show. You'll meet smart people everywhere. What makes Penn special? some research and hype. It gives the same education at all the other schools. There is nothing really special other than that IVY name and I'm frankly sick of people hoaring off of prestige. If I do well, I can do whatever I want. I'm NEVER going to be limited. You might be saying that "oh, but at Penn, you can get contacts and it improves your chances at med. school and you meet great people/environment." That's true to some extent. First of all, getting contacts isn't a problem. You put the effort and it's possible. Secondly, getting a high GPA at a very competitive school like Penn is very tough and I don't want to take the risk of messing up. And, med. school don't really give a **** or weigh undergrad school when selecting people. A 3.7 at Penn is only slightly favorable than a 3.7 at RPI. People know that these sciences class are tough and don't really give a damn that penn is ivy. They want smart, bright people. You can meet great people everywhere. You can go to a state school and find brilliant people. It's up to you to find those people. And, no when I'm a doctor, I won't regret my decision because no matter what route I take, I'll end up in the same place after working hard. Why not take the easier (still tough) path and save my hair from falling out. Pre-med classes are hard and I'm seeing people struggling w/ it. The materials fine, it's just the competition/scaling. You can succeed wherever you go by finding opportunities. If you don't agree, please point out what's wrong and I can think about it and learn. Thanks so much for helping me w/ this decision.
emtji I totally agree w/ you. It's just a hassle to go through it all. Responding to a previous post: Yes, it's tough for an Albany Med. grad to go to Hopkins for residency (of course it's possible and I know people who've done it), but don't think that just because of the med. school you can't get it. There's a bunch of other stuff they look at. Would they choose the top grad at Cornell Med. over the top guy from Albany Med., not necessarily. What if the Albany Med. has top board scores, shows promise by doing many projects w/ that hospital, has contacts w/ people there, is good overally. Sure, they'll take the Albany Med. Don't think that you're settled just because you're going to a top med. school. It all really depends on you. The name goes to a certain extent, it puts your foot in the door, but the rest is ALL up to you. If name is everything, then why aren't all the surgeons at MGH or Cleveland Clinic from the top med. schools??? Shouldn't they be filled by the Harvard, JHU, WUSTL, Penn Medical grads only? More than half of the guys are from lower ranked med. schools. Hospitals want good doctors. They don't care what med. school you went to. They want to know that you're good at what you're doing. The prez of Brigham and Women's is an Albany Med. grad. Nothing is impossible so please don't say that. I know SO many people getting 250k coming from what you will prolly call "****ty" med. schools.
And also, (sorry for the repeated posts, my ideas come in chunks lol) med. school admission isn't easy and is getting tougher and tougher year to year. It's just such a pain to go through w/ it and yes, there's the chance I'll get a top med. school, but my mentality and the doctors' that I talked to's mentalities are that I should take any BA/MD program BECAUSE it doesn't matter what med. school you go to. That's they're point. Going to alot of these top schools gives you opportunities, but you can get them from anywhere. Maybe if you're in an isolated places like Univ. of New Mexico, it'll be hard, far from impossible, but Albany Med.'s in the northeast, I have plenty of places to work at during breaks to get contacts. I'm nothing near isolated. Feel free to post if you disagree w/ some of my points. Just think about this: what's the difference between undergrad/med. school/residency/fellowship job: Yale/Harvard Med./Harvard affiliated hospital/Harvard Med./Harvard Med. and UT-Austin/UC-Irvine Med. school/UCLA hospitals/UCSF Med./Harvard Job and PSU/Jefferson Med./Jefferson hospitals/Jefferson Med./job at Jefferson hospitals???? All these guys are working in the same field and are earning the exact same salaries.
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argh. this is getting frustrating to read.
drdoc -- it sounds like you have a pretty good sense of what's going on (much moreso than i did at the time), and so, if you've made your decision, and are satisfied with it -- and it sounds like you are -- do it and be done with it.
(you are, a little bit, using 2 different arguments, though. on the one hand, yes, either way, you'll be an md, blah blah blah. but a hopkins neuro residency isn't your average md... granted, i've only skimmed the last couple of posts, so maybe this has already been addressed.)
also, just to complicate things further -- someone back me up on this: doesn't rpi sort of have the reputation of being a place where fun goes to die??
drdoc -- it sounds like you have a pretty good sense of what's going on (much moreso than i did at the time), and so, if you've made your decision, and are satisfied with it -- and it sounds like you are -- do it and be done with it.
(you are, a little bit, using 2 different arguments, though. on the one hand, yes, either way, you'll be an md, blah blah blah. but a hopkins neuro residency isn't your average md... granted, i've only skimmed the last couple of posts, so maybe this has already been addressed.)
also, just to complicate things further -- someone back me up on this: doesn't rpi sort of have the reputation of being a place where fun goes to die??
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Although you've stated that you're still deciding, it seems that you're more or less set on going with the program. That's fine, and if you're set on it, don't look back, you'll do fine. The bottom line though that people have tried to point out is that you're making a tradeoff:
You are trading away significant prestige and potentially a more engaging environment for guaranteed admission to medical school. Assuming you don't apply to other medical schools (and it sounds like you don't want to go through the process), you are also trading away the chance to go to a more prestigious medical school. As you've stated earlier, if you're the top student at Albany med, you'll have a good chance at anywhere. But what if you're not? Your medical school grades (the ones that matter in the 3rd year) have VERY little to do with how intelligent you. You might do a rotation with some students who have an amazing rapport with the attendings - no honors for you. So the question is: what if you end up the middle of your Albany class? At that point, yes it WOULD help a lot to instead be in the middle of the Cornell class. You only need to look at Cornell's matchlist to see that nearly everyone places into good residency programs. The same is probably not true at Albany. Yes, the top people do great, but who's to say you'll be at the top?
You are trading away significant prestige and potentially a more engaging environment for guaranteed admission to medical school. Assuming you don't apply to other medical schools (and it sounds like you don't want to go through the process), you are also trading away the chance to go to a more prestigious medical school. As you've stated earlier, if you're the top student at Albany med, you'll have a good chance at anywhere. But what if you're not? Your medical school grades (the ones that matter in the 3rd year) have VERY little to do with how intelligent you. You might do a rotation with some students who have an amazing rapport with the attendings - no honors for you. So the question is: what if you end up the middle of your Albany class? At that point, yes it WOULD help a lot to instead be in the middle of the Cornell class. You only need to look at Cornell's matchlist to see that nearly everyone places into good residency programs. The same is probably not true at Albany. Yes, the top people do great, but who's to say you'll be at the top?
I'm a student in the RPI/Albany Med accelerated med program and am finishing up my first year of med school. (I probably even gave you a tour of the school!) I was faced with a similar dilemma when I got accepted to the program. I was accepted as a Dean's Scholar to Cornell, UPenn, and a host of other schools that seemed pretty tempting. I decided to go with the accelerated program because of the guarantee of acceptance into medical school. People told me that I wouldn't have any college experience because I was "cramming 4 years into 3"...but let me tell you, I had one of the most amazing and unforgettable college experiences ever. RPI gets a bad rep, it really is a decent school and like any school, it's up to the student to make the most of it. I certainly had a great time in college and took classes not because I had to get an 'A' to put on that pre-med resume, but because I was truly interested in the material. It took a lot of pressure off of learning and allowed me to participate in extracurric's because I wanted to not because I HAD to. I'll always have very fond memories of college. The only thing I regret is missing out on going to a larger school with a bigger diversity of people (UC Berkeley would've been my heaven). I really think about that a lot, and that would be my only word of caution to you. Anyway, every day that I attend medical school I feel so fortunate to be here and been able to take a less-stressful path. It doesn't mean that I'm any less qualified than my classmates, any less mature, or any less motivated. If anything I was given the chance to really grow and learn during college. I have a solemn passion to be a doctor and even in the darkest days of 1st year (learning about every freakin' type of biochem pathway out there!) I was thankful to be here and have the opportunity to pursue one of the most amazing careers in the world. Goodluck to you, and I hope you choose the school that you think is most right to YOU. 😎
Yeah, I guess all the bad wrap RPI gets for its social scene comes from the engineers at RPI. Just like you, when I was talking to the medical program students, they loved it. I hope to do alot of stuff at RPI, maybe start some groups/clubs. I just want to have a great time and hang out in college alot. I would be harder at Penn or Cornell to hang out cause I mean I'll be doing an engineering undergrad which is really tough and on top of that, I have pre-med pressure. So, the only bad things about the program I'm hearing is that I have the chance of missing going to an even more well reputed undergrad/med. school. Everyone's avoiding the post I made about how in the medical field it doesn't matter where you do residency or where you practice to an extent. A person who works in NYC will earn more than the person working in Tennessee. But, there isn't any difference between the northeastern states really. I'm just hoping I can do REALLY well in college both academically/socially, I want to develop alot of contacts and wherever I go to med. school I'll be happy. Anyone else see any pros/cons to this program or to Penn. If I had to choose between the program and Cornell or Carnegie Mellon, which would you choose? And, you all know that not all Penn pre-meds get into med. school right? Only the ones who do well and it's pretty tough to do well. Let me know what you think. Thanks. Sorry for annoying anyone who's reading me posts again and again. I just want all the feedback I can get so I'm obssessive. It's a big decision.
NUcat, you said how do I know I can do well? It's a gamble. But, instead of gambling if I'm going to get into med. school, I just need to gamble if I can be top or not and it's all up to me. If I work hard, I can do it. And, usually, the kids in the program are top in med. school because as people have said, the med. school is grabbing top-students at an early stage in the process. I'm not too worried about that. I'll have that drive. You're probably then saying that I could use that drive in undergrad. However, undergrad is a new game. First of all, it's more hectic because not only do I need a great GPA, I have a ton of other stuff in the back of my head. And, it's a pain to do everything for med. school. The doctors who I talked to said that the med. school admission process is just crazy because it's really tough and takes alot out of a person. That's a reason so many people take breaks after. The 1 yr that I miss of undergrad is bad in that I'll miss being in college, but then again, it's more time for me to further my career. I'll be ahead of my peers and I'll be able to relax at a younger age. Plus, as a pre-med, those 4 yrs are not heaven. Yes, college is fun, but that stress is really annoying to bear. The people who are telling me that pre-med classes are no problem are really good and I'm not saying that I'm not good. But, what about the majority of people who don't make it. What, 44% of med. school applicants get in? Thats less than half!
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I agree with much of your reasoning - remember, I went the program route as well 🙂 I guess what I am trying to say is that in college, your success is very much a function of what you put in. If you have the ability and put in enough work, you can get good grades in your premed classes. In medical school though, particularly during the 3rd year, working hard is much LESS likely to ensure good grades. You could be the smartest and most hard working student on a rotation and not get honors - this is reality. Certainly the docs recognize hard work, but your grade can come down to seemingly trivial things - whether you remembered to relay a message from a senior resident to an intern, whether you're late for rounds because of something you couldn't help.
This all goes back to the question of the medical school you're at. If you have some bad luck and end up with average 3rd year grades (mostly passes, 1 or 2 honors) being at a top medical school will really help.
This all goes back to the question of the medical school you're at. If you have some bad luck and end up with average 3rd year grades (mostly passes, 1 or 2 honors) being at a top medical school will really help.
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It's clear to me that you've already decided to go with the guaranteed admissions route at RPI and are just looking for someone to say, "Yeah, you've made the right choice." No one on this thread is saying that and it's frustrating.
C'mon. RPI? I've never even heard of the school before this post. I don't doubt it's a good school. But for you to say it's a "great" school and then say Penn is only a "good" school is borderline absurd. Penn is IVY. If you think that doesn't matter when it comes time to apply to med school, think again. I went to a state school so I'm not being an IVY "*****" when I say that either. We've all been through the admissions process, we know school reputation matters. The bottom line is that going to Penn and doing well is better than going to RPI and doing well if you plan on applying out. Read: You will get into better medical schools coming out of Penn vs applying out of RPI given that you work hard at Penn and don't slack off.
And you speak of landing a neurosurgery residency as if it's a given regardless of whether you go to Albany or some other school. If you're not sure you can get the grades at Penn to get into med school, why do you think you'll automatically be at the top of your med school class at Albany? Do you have any idea how hard it is to be at the top of a med school class? They don't just hand out AOA memberships to anyone. I know many a brilliant student that isn't even close to being eligible for AOA because of how competitive medical school classes are. There is more competition in med school than you'll find in those pre-med courses at an IVY League school.
If you're scared of not getting into med school, then by all means, go with RPI. But please please please don't try to convince yourself that it's a better school than what you're giving up.
C'mon. RPI? I've never even heard of the school before this post. I don't doubt it's a good school. But for you to say it's a "great" school and then say Penn is only a "good" school is borderline absurd. Penn is IVY. If you think that doesn't matter when it comes time to apply to med school, think again. I went to a state school so I'm not being an IVY "*****" when I say that either. We've all been through the admissions process, we know school reputation matters. The bottom line is that going to Penn and doing well is better than going to RPI and doing well if you plan on applying out. Read: You will get into better medical schools coming out of Penn vs applying out of RPI given that you work hard at Penn and don't slack off.
And you speak of landing a neurosurgery residency as if it's a given regardless of whether you go to Albany or some other school. If you're not sure you can get the grades at Penn to get into med school, why do you think you'll automatically be at the top of your med school class at Albany? Do you have any idea how hard it is to be at the top of a med school class? They don't just hand out AOA memberships to anyone. I know many a brilliant student that isn't even close to being eligible for AOA because of how competitive medical school classes are. There is more competition in med school than you'll find in those pre-med courses at an IVY League school.
If you're scared of not getting into med school, then by all means, go with RPI. But please please please don't try to convince yourself that it's a better school than what you're giving up.
you're right. I'm a fool for saying that. I'm really confused. One side (forum people) is telling me I'm an idiot for doing the program and the other side (people I know) is telling me to do the program. I'm confused. Penn does look really nice. I wonder what the kids who turned down places like Harvard were thinking. Do you think it's worth it to turn down the program for Cornell, Carnegie Mellon, JHU, or schools like Tufts, Brandeis, UIUC? Thanks for helping me out. I'm going to think about Penn.
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That has to be the most over-rated argument in this ba/md v.s. regular routes debates.
The truth is that nobody can predict how you do in college compared to highschool. In highschool, you don't need to study smart and don't need to be terribly intelligent. you can do well by sheer hard work and rot memorization. but in college, it is a different ball game. People need to actually sieve through information and spend time on the important info (i.e. study smart). After all, 80-90% of the kids who go to Cornell, Penn, etc. are in the top 10% of their graduating highschool class and yet at premed classes where the median score gets a B-/C+ grading, only the top 1/3 of those classes get decent grades (B+ or above).
3.4 from Harvard might get you into a decent med school, but I am not so sure about 3.4 from Cornell or Penn or CMU.
Check out:
http://www.career.cornell.edu/students/grad/health/humanmedicine/applied.html
Even though kids with 3.0 to 3.4 in 2002 from Cornell get into med schools, I doubt it is anywhere that much better than Albany. Instead better schools are taken by graduates with higher GPA and MCAT scores, and there are some gunners there who can do it! Who can guarantee that which group you will fall in? 3.4 means you are in the top half of the class at Cornell but that won't give you a spot at NYU or Mt. Sinai med even.
I don't think that you should second guess with Penn. It is not Harvard or Princeton you are turning down. Get the book on faculty and students from somebody who has interviewed at Columbia med. Columbia med admissions favors Harvard, yale and maybe princeton and columbia (its own undergraduate division) grads. That's the impression I get. There are only a couple Penn, Cornell, Columbia or other Ivy grads sprinkled here and there at top 10 med schools.
Another thing... Ivy kids are not THAT interesting. Most of them want to get into the best med school, law school or that coveted investment banking job after college (just like you). They are as human as you and me. They want the best GPA's. They want the prestige (or else, they will have gone to a good liberal arts college instead of Penn or Cornell). Many of them have parents you and I have (i.e. prestige-seeking). If you think that by going to an Ivy, you will be surrounded by intellectuals who like to talk about Kant instead of studying for organic chem so they can get into Havard med instead of SUNY med, then you are disillusioned. Look, Cornell and Penn accepted you and you are concerned about Havard or Hopkins med after college. You also know people at some top undergrad schools whose "main" concern is about NOT getting into a med school (are they concerned about exploring the Taoist or Buddhist religions?) Do you think that the rest of the thousands of kids entering these schools will be different from you or your friends? NO!
Lastly, RPI is a very good school. Penn or Cornell don't offer that MUCH of an upgrade in terms of prestige. Trust me, most of the Ivy's is over-rated. If you don't do well at these Ivy's (3.7+), you won't even get interviewed at top 10 med schools (and even if you interview, you have a big chance of getting waitlisted unless your numbers approach 4.0 and 40 MCAT). The only schools that might get some slack are probably Harvard, Yale, Princeton and Stanford.
Go to www.mdapplicants.com to find out for yourself. Go to extended search and type in Cornell and Pennsylvania under undergraduate institutuion, and see what kinds of stats you need to get into a med school that is a serious upgrade from albany med.
And stop thinking about neurosurgery at Hopkins! You might end up doing psychiatry and want a community hospital environment where there is less stress and more direct patient care (instead of rounding all day long in an academic center and argue which SSRI is the best). Most specialties are not that competitive and since they constitute "most" of the specialities out there, your interest will "most" likely fall into one of them eventually.
Also, get all the prestige thing out of your head at this very moment. The chance of an Albany grad getting neurosurgery at Hopkins in slimmer than if, say, you go to Columbia med. But why does it matter? At the end of highschool, you get into the best college you can get into. At the end of college, you get into the best med school you can get into. at the end of med school, you get into the most competitive residencies (not necessarily of interest but because that field offers big $$$ and good life style). And at the end of residencies, you get hold of the best (or highest future income fellowship. for ex., cardiology fellowship following internal medicine residency). After fellowship, you apply for a job that pays you the most money. And if you go into academics, you try to start a lab that cranks out the most papers and give you conference speaking time that allow you to place all glory onto yourself! Where and when does it stop for YOU?
In my opinion, the earlier you stop the viscious cycle above, the earlier you get to do things you "love." There is no end to human greed, and suffering and doubts come with that greed.
Now I shall end my philosophical debate. 😀
Wait, why are my chances slim of getting into the top med. schools. What if I can get a 4.0 at RPI, yeah, then I could've done well at an ivy (not as well because of intense competition), but that's not the point. The point is that I don't know how I'm going to do. Superstar high school students don't all get 4.0 in college also. Through the program, I have assurance. If I don't do too well, I still have med. school. If I do really well, I can get into better med. schools, but like you said, all that may not matter in the long run because ALL med. schools in the US are really good and can get a person anywhere if they work hard. And, yes the chances are slim of getting a JHU residency in neurosurgery, but there are fifty other top hospitals that I can get a residency. UMICH is a great med. school/hospital and they're not top five in neurosurgery, but are in the top thirty and will prepare me very, very well. So, are you saying the program is good or what? If I had gotten into the TOP ivies, I would've gone to them, but my choices are lower level ivies and schools like CMU, JHU, which aren't that, that great to take over a medical program.
Why do people do these programs? Because they want that pre-med stress. They know they can do better but they understand that wherever they do well, they'll do great in the real world. They take the easier path and end up in the same place w/ people who took the tough path. It's the illustration of the stairways with the pre-med struggling to the top stop some thousands of feet above and the program student going up on the elevator. Here's an example:
Jay S. Luxenberg: "While Luxenberg was accepted to every college he applied to, including Harvard, Princeton and Yale, he chose a program through the Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute and Albany Medical College in New York that would allow him to get his bachelor's and medical degrees in six years.
He did his residency at Mount Zion in San Francisco, because it was one of two hospitals in the country where he could study geriatrics while specializing in internal medicine."
The people who do these programs are not idiots. They see things in a different light from other people. They're not stupid because they chose medicine out of high school or they decided to go to only an above average school. They understood what med. education's all about.
Jay S. Luxenberg: "While Luxenberg was accepted to every college he applied to, including Harvard, Princeton and Yale, he chose a program through the Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute and Albany Medical College in New York that would allow him to get his bachelor's and medical degrees in six years.
He did his residency at Mount Zion in San Francisco, because it was one of two hospitals in the country where he could study geriatrics while specializing in internal medicine."
The people who do these programs are not idiots. They see things in a different light from other people. They're not stupid because they chose medicine out of high school or they decided to go to only an above average school. They understood what med. education's all about.
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Dude, you need to just settle down and go to RPI. You argue with every poster who presents an argument against RPI.
You'll still be able to apply to whatever med school you want at the end. You'll still have guaranteed admission to Albany. What is the big deal? I can't imagine that the "low Ivy" versus "fine school but not an Ivy" status will really matter AT ALL if you are successful and round out your application with other stuff, i.e. research, clinical volunteering, etc... I am sure that there are just as many success stories from kids who went to less prestigious schools and kicked ass to get into great med schools as there are Ivys who didn't excell in undergrad and are going to just so-so medical schools.
As someone who finally got into school after years of struggle, I have to tell you that this thread is a little comical to me. In hindsite I definitely would have chosen the path of least resistance. I suppose, though, the complicated path I made for myself is what has actually lead me to this point. I am not trying to belittle your struggle, because I know it is very real for you. I just don't see how you can go wrong. Your guts are leading you to RPI, so just go there.
My guess is that you are going to second guess whatever decision you make, so maybe you should just commit to flipping a coin and then stand by the results.
You'll still be able to apply to whatever med school you want at the end. You'll still have guaranteed admission to Albany. What is the big deal? I can't imagine that the "low Ivy" versus "fine school but not an Ivy" status will really matter AT ALL if you are successful and round out your application with other stuff, i.e. research, clinical volunteering, etc... I am sure that there are just as many success stories from kids who went to less prestigious schools and kicked ass to get into great med schools as there are Ivys who didn't excell in undergrad and are going to just so-so medical schools.
As someone who finally got into school after years of struggle, I have to tell you that this thread is a little comical to me. In hindsite I definitely would have chosen the path of least resistance. I suppose, though, the complicated path I made for myself is what has actually lead me to this point. I am not trying to belittle your struggle, because I know it is very real for you. I just don't see how you can go wrong. Your guts are leading you to RPI, so just go there.
My guess is that you are going to second guess whatever decision you make, so maybe you should just commit to flipping a coin and then stand by the results.
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The problem with thewonderer's argument is that he assumes you'd have to got to a Top 10 medical school to do better. The fact is though, if you got into say, a TOP 40 or 50 med school from Penn, you'd still be at a more highly regarded place than Albany and I really think you could get into such a school.
I guess what I'm saying is that while nothing is guaranteed at Penn, I believe you would still get into a medical school of "Albany medical school or higher caliber".
With all that said, I've been arguing under the assumption that you truly want an extremely competitive residency in an extremely competitive specialty. If this were not the case, and you may change your mind, I would say - go to the program.
I guess what I'm saying is that while nothing is guaranteed at Penn, I believe you would still get into a medical school of "Albany medical school or higher caliber".
With all that said, I've been arguing under the assumption that you truly want an extremely competitive residency in an extremely competitive specialty. If this were not the case, and you may change your mind, I would say - go to the program.
Hey thanks everyone for the responses. REALLY appreciate them. Well I can still get into other med. schools going through RPI. I'm not purposely shutting down anyone who says to go to Penn because it seems like they're disrespecting the med. program and I just don't want them to understimate it. ALL med. programs are tough and deserve some respect lol. I'm not really buying into that growth thing either drexel future grad. I'll meet some great people at RPI. And, maybe I'll go to Penn for med. school or maybe I'll stay at Albany and do great getting a competitive residency at a competitive place. I'm not worried about failing at Penn. Just don't want to do the bull**** stuff, but want to enjoy my undergrad years w/ a very low stress level. So, name is the only thing that is lacking in the program besides the name "medical program."
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Why anyone would go to Penn over RPI rinky dink is beyond me. If you pass RPI, you'll do well at Penn and you'll get into a med school a ton better than Albany. Do you not realize that Albany is one of the worst schools in the country? On top of that, it's one of the most expensive in the country.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2002
- Messages
- 174
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- 0
hello, sorry to sound really dumb but coming from England, I don't know what an "ivy" is. Would appreciate it if one of you would tell me.
