High Taxes for W-2 MD's?

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drusso

drusso

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There really aren’t any tax havens outside of real
estate that I’m aware of for a w-2 employee. And I’m not sure how much real
Estate helps
 
SSdoc33 said:
There really aren’t any tax havens outside of real
estate that I’m aware of for a w-2 employee. And I’m not sure how much real
Estate helps
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Certainly you don’t think that’s enough do you? Fair share? How much would you prefer that amount be increased for it to be more fair and equitable? I’ll pose this question to our other staunch liberals. How much more should be taken out for it to be his fair share? @Ducttape @callmeanesthesia
 
SpineandWine said:
Why does it feel that I’m effectively paying 50% taxes even though top bracket is 37%.
State tax is 5%, then property tax?
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Medicare, Medicaid, social security, AMT, additional 3.8% Medicare tax, + state and local taxes which you likely won’t be able to deduct bc it phases out at $500k.

Just be thankful. Your combined tax burden would be closer to 70% had Kamala won. Then again some on this board think that’s fair @Ducttape @SSdoc33
 
Hellllll no.

My income is in that range, also a w2 employee, and don’t pay anything close to that. Move out of California dude
 
paindoc007 said:
Hellllll no.

My income is in that range, also a w2 employee, and don’t pay anything close to that. Move out of California dude
Click to expand...
How do you not pay that? You must be using some of those loopholes only available to the super wealthy
 
clubdeac said:
How do you not pay that? You must be using some of those loopholes only available to the super wealthy
Click to expand...

No… I do literally nothing out of the ordinary. Effective fed tax rate is usually around 26% or something. Those numbers are insane. I think state tax is the difference
 
If I look at my paystub, it’s the federal tax that is the big killer. My state tax is high but doesn’t account for nearly the significant hit from federal
 
mdo1738 said:
Must be California or somewhere similar. I “only” paid $231k taxes on $750k in 2024. And I am sure not getting my money’s worth on those taxes.
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Are you in a state with no state income tax? How else is that possible.
 
Last edited:
clubdeac said:
Are you in a state with no state income tax? How else is that possible. I think I paid $350k total on that amount
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My state income tax would be $35k on $750k. I would have owed like $23k when I filed but I had a K1 with losses I could deduct. Would have been a little over $250k taxes I think without that, counting federal, FICA and state.
 
mdo1738 said:
My state income tax would be $35k on $750k. I would have owed like $23k when I filed but I had a K1 with losses I could deduct. Would have been a little over $250k taxes I think without that, counting federal, FICA and state.
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Are you including social security, Medicare, Medicaid, AMT etc? Is that your total tax burden?
 
clubdeac said:
Certainly you don’t think that’s enough do you? Fair share? How much would you prefer that amount be increased for it to be more fair and equitable? I’ll pose this question to our other staunch liberals. How much more should be taken out for it to be his fair share? @Ducttape @callmeanesthesia
Click to expand...
that may be a fair share for someone in his tax bracket. it is high.


tell me, why should he be paying so much than millionaires and billionaires that pay little to no taxes?

www.propublica.org

The Secret IRS Files: Trove of Never-Before-Seen Records Reveal How the Wealthiest Avoid Income Tax

ProPublica has obtained a vast cache of IRS information showing how billionaires like Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk and Warren Buffett pay little in income tax compared to their massive wealth — sometimes, even nothing.
www.propublica.org www.propublica.org

you could (not so easily) glance at Donald Trumps tax returns from 2015 to 2020, as those have been made public. i am not trying to single him out as special and this is not TDS - i am using his numbers because they are the easiest accessible numbers and as a representative of the ultra rich that is the main target of wealth inequality. (i tried looking up Musk, Bezos, Mcconnell, Pelosi)

suffice to say, he paid zero dollars (ie zilch, nicht, nada) in 2020, and $750 in 2016 and 2017. for the other years, 2015, and 2019, he paid 4% of his earnings in taxes.
 
Ducttape said:
that may be a fair share for someone in his tax bracket. it is high.


tell me, why should he be paying so much than millionaires and billionaires that pay little to no taxes?

www.propublica.org

The Secret IRS Files: Trove of Never-Before-Seen Records Reveal How the Wealthiest Avoid Income Tax

ProPublica has obtained a vast cache of IRS information showing how billionaires like Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk and Warren Buffett pay little in income tax compared to their massive wealth — sometimes, even nothing.
www.propublica.org www.propublica.org

you could (not so easily) glance at Donald Trumps tax returns from 2015 to 2020, as those have been made public. i am not trying to single him out as special and this is not TDS - i am using his numbers because they are the easiest accessible numbers and as a representative of the ultra rich that is the main target of wealth inequality. (i tried looking up Musk, Bezos, Mcconnell, Pelosi)

suffice to say, he paid zero dollars (ie zilch, nicht, nada) in 2020, and $750 in 2016 and 2017. for the other years, 2015, and 2019, he paid 4% of his earnings in taxes.
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Again I think you’re pushing a lie. We are all millionaires and we pay 50% in taxes. If I was a billionaire and I worked extremely hard for my money and I was now living off of dividends and was required to pay only my dividends or capital gains tax of 20% that is perfectly reasonable. All those prior yrs amassing that wealth, I likely put in 50%. Why is it fair to continue to tax the hell out of me when that hard earned money was already taxed at 50%? It’s asinine logic. If you’d like to pay 70% to the govt by all means please do
 
SSdoc33 said:
state tax is not the difference between 50% and 26%
Click to expand...

Where did you get the number 50? The Reddit poster is at 41% total tax. I’m more than 10% less w/ the same income. So thats incorrect. State tax matters quite a bit.
 
clubdeac said:
. All those prior yrs amassing that wealth, I likely put in 50%.
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That right there is fundamentally incorrect. No one gets filthy rich on a W2 salary. The mega-rich got that way through some combination of inheritance (in which case they benefitted massively from the step-up basis on their inherited wealth) and stock options in their company and capital gains.
 
clubdeac said:
Again I think you’re pushing a lie. We are all millionaires and we pay 50% in taxes. If I was a billionaire and I worked extremely hard for my money and I was now living off of dividends and was required to pay only my dividends or capital gains tax of 20% that is perfectly reasonable. All those prior yrs amassing that wealth, I likely put in 50%. Why is it fair to continue to tax the hell out of me when that hard earned money was already taxed at 50%? It’s asinine logic. If you’d like to pay 70% to the govt by all means please do
Click to expand...
yes, it is asinine logic. because what you posted is clearly incorrect. if you start with erroneous assumptions, you will come up with erroneous conclusions.

but that never stopped you before, so i dont know why you would start now.
 
paindoc007 said:
Where did you get the number 50? The Reddit poster is at 41% total tax. I’m more than 10% less w/ the same income. So thats incorrect. State tax matters quite a bit.
Click to expand...
from post # 6

"Why does it feel that I’m effectively paying 50% taxes even though top bracket is 37%.
State tax is 5%, then property tax?"
 
SSdoc33 said:
yes, it is asinine logic. because what you posted is clearly incorrect. if you start with erroneous assumptions, you will come up with erroneous conclusions.

but that never stopped you before, so i dont know why you would start now.
Click to expand...
Can you expound on what’s incorrect specifically
 
clubdeac said:
Again I think you’re pushing a lie. We are all millionaires and we pay 50% in taxes. If I was a billionaire and I worked extremely hard for my money and I was now living off of dividends and was required to pay only my dividends or capital gains tax of 20% that is perfectly reasonable. All those prior yrs amassing that wealth, I likely put in 50%. Why is it fair to continue to tax the hell out of me when that hard earned money was already taxed at 50%? It’s asinine logic. If you’d like to pay 70% to the govt by all means please do
Click to expand...
we are probably not all millionaires. we dont pay 50% in taxes. billionaires dont put in years at 50% amassing wealth.

im not arguing for higher taxes. i dont want to pay more.

but get your facts straight before you blow off some steam and dont paint all of the "left" with the same brush. its not a single entity with homogenous ideology.
 
SSdoc33 said:
we are probably not all millionaires. we dont pay 50% in taxes. billionaires dont put in years at 50% amassing wealth.

im not arguing for higher taxes. i dont want to pay more.

but get your facts straight before you blow off some steam and dont paint all of the "left" with the same brush. its not a single entity with homogenous ideology.
Click to expand...
If you’re saving appropriately and have been in practice over 5 yrs you should be. And 40%. That’s definitely accurate

And you have no idea how most billionaires get their wealth whether mostly through hard work or inheritance so don’t paint them all with the same brush
 
clubdeac said:
If you’re saving appropriately and have been in practice over 5 yrs you should be. And 40%. That’s definitely accurate

And you have no idea how most billionaires get their wealth whether mostly through hard work or inheritance so don’t paint them all with the same brush
Click to expand...
a lot of docs on this board. some out of training. some with a bunch of kids. some with big loans. some with disabilities. yeah, we should all be in that category eventually.

40% yes. 50% no.

most billionaires start a company, scale it up, and it then increases in value. that value increase is usually in equity or stocks, which is not taxed at "50%". or they inherit a boatload of cash and that appreciates via investments which is also taxed at capital gains rates

you know, its ok to admit you are wrong....
 
Those billionaires keep most of their wealth out of the income category.. it was never there.. and thus was never subject to “income” tax. This is how they get and stay so wealthy. “Taxable income” is the root of the wealth divide in this country. There will always be those with more and less but the extremes of wealth that leads a few families to be worth trillions is that they had a lack of taxable income.
 
clubdeac said:
Again I think you’re pushing a lie. We are all millionaires and we pay 50% in taxes. If I was a billionaire and I worked extremely hard for my money and I was now living off of dividends and was required to pay only my dividends or capital gains tax of 20% that is perfectly reasonable. All those prior yrs amassing that wealth, I likely put in 50%. Why is it fair to continue to tax the hell out of me when that hard earned money was already taxed at 50%? It’s asinine logic. If you’d like to pay 70% to the govt by all means please do
Click to expand...
you are clearly delusional if you think you belong to the ultra rich class.

but those billionaires built their wealth on the backs of average americans.

Laryngospasm said:
Those billionaires keep most of their wealth out of the income category.. it was never there.. and thus was never subject to “income” tax. This is how they get and stay so wealthy. “Taxable income” is the root of the wealth divide in this country. There will always be those with more and less but the extremes of wealth that leads a few families to be worth trillions is that they had a lack of taxable income.
Click to expand...
you have made an arbitrary distinction that some wealth is not taxable and that only income is taxable.

and the ultra rich buy politicians to make sure that they have loopholes, such as taking ultra low salaries as income and the rest as stocks or dividends or shares to promulgate their wealth while avoiding taxes and paying any share. and its legal, because we bought politicians to make it that way.



that fits the aspirations of the ultra rich as they continue to manipulate the system and the minds and thoughts of the middle class in to believing that propogation and growth of their wealth is the most important.
 
bubaghanush said:
I am w2, total income 600s, effective tax rate 24%. No state income tax. We have matching, 403b, 457k, fsa
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Effective tax rate of 24%. Is that effective federal tax rate of 24% or total tax? My effective tax rate was about 31% however total tax when one includes state, local, Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid is closer to 40% all set all said and done
 
clubdeac said:
Effective tax rate of 24%. Is that effective federal tax rate of 24% or total tax? My effective tax rate was about 31% however total tax when one includes state, local, Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid is closer to 40% all set all said and done
Click to expand...
I was going for total with SS and Medicare/medicaid. No state tax where I am. But if I put in property tax would bump it 2-3%
 
SSdoc33 said:
There really aren’t any tax havens outside of real
estate that I’m aware of for a w-2 employee. And I’m not sure how much real
Estate helps
Click to expand...
RE has been great to diffuse some W2 tax burden. Most of what we're doing isn't going to be realistic for most on here (my wife is a full time real estate professional), so deductions galore and growing...

However, anyone can do what we did in this example: I put $50k into a syndication, becoming passive owner in an apartment complex. Outside of looking at spreadsheets 2x/year, completely passive investment. I got about a $6000 deduction last year on this alone. This is a suboptimal investment property with no positive cash flow on paper yet, though it's likely appreciated a fair amount... Anyone can do this and you just need to work with some competent, trustworthy people, as there are some clowns in this space, for sure.

I had an effective rate of 21% for fed tax on ~700k.
 
My fed tax rate was 31%. Own my own practice. Fill up every bucket possible. It does get confusing as a lot of the deductions (cash balance pension plan/employer portion of 401k/health insurance) come off like a direct practice expense same as lidocaine. We do have state income tax but we are able to expense that through the LLC to bypass SALT $10k. I still well exceeded SALT with my W2 income I pay myself and my wife and property taxes on our home.
 
Ducttape said:
you are clearly delusional if you think you belong to the ultra rich class.

but those billionaires built their wealth on the backs of average americans.


you have made an arbitrary distinction that some wealth is not taxable and that only income is taxable.

and the ultra rich buy politicians to make sure that they have loopholes, such as taking ultra low salaries as income and the rest as stocks or dividends or shares to promulgate their wealth while avoiding taxes and paying any share. and its legal, because we bought politicians to make it that way.



that fits the aspirations of the ultra rich as they continue to manipulate the system and the minds and thoughts of the middle class in to believing that propogation and growth of their wealth is the most important.
Click to expand...
Did I say only income was taxable?
 
clubdeac said:
How do you not pay that? You must be using some of those loopholes only available to the super wealthy
Click to expand...
The OP is ~47% tax. That's nuts. I also make in that range. I don't get taxed anywhere near that much.

We don't pay 37% for federal income taxes until you hit over 626k if you're a single filer, and over 750k if filing jointly. The federal tax system is progressive. Federal taxes for 770k is about 260k (~33% total). The extra 100k in taxes comes from whatever jacked up state that person lives in - sounds like California. You get what you vote for.
 
1 Up said:
The OP is ~47% tax. That's nuts. I also make in that range. I don't get taxed anywhere near that much.

We don't pay 37% for federal income taxes until you hit over 626k if you're a single filer, and over 750k if filing jointly. The federal tax system is progressive. Federal taxes for 770k is about 260k (~33% total). The extra 100k in taxes comes from whatever jacked up state that person lives in - sounds like California. You get what you vote for.
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You’re talking only fed taxes. You need to add another 10-15% on top of that 33% effective tax rate to get ever you’re paying total. Fed rate of 33% is only part of your income tax
 
Don’t all these 1099ers do their own taxes and deduct everything under the sun legal or not?
 
BobBarker said:
My fed tax rate was 31%. Own my own practice. Fill up every bucket possible. It does get confusing as a lot of the deductions (cash balance pension plan/employer portion of 401k/health insurance) come off like a direct practice expense same as lidocaine. We do have state income tax but we are able to expense that through the LLC to bypass SALT $10k. I still well exceeded SALT with my W2 income I pay myself and my wife and property taxes on our home.
Click to expand...

Bob-did u mention elsewhere u only have yourself and wife on cbp? Do u have a separate entity for your other employees so not part of cbp?
 
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