Hoping y'all had some advice for a very passionate applicant with a crappy GPA

[wi_shortie]

I had some health issues in my first two years of undergrad that severely affected my academic performance. Like I was pulling 2.4-2.6 semester GPAs. But as a person who has been very, VERY passionate about being a doctor for my entire life, I kept trucking on and after my sophomore year, my health was on the upswing. There was an immediate difference in my GPA, and I started averaging a 3.8 each semester while taking upper-level science courses. Despite working my butt off to try and remedy this very blatant issue , I was unable to pull my cumulative GPA above a 3.216. I got a 517 on the MCAT, have spent a lot of time volunteering in a surgical trauma unit and for various other non-medical community organizations. I did a ton of shadowing, acquired 3 years of research experience and have multiple publications and presentations. I was on the executive board of my pre-med club and also participated in numerous other extracurricular activities.

I applied to 25 schools, but I'm very worried about how my low GPA is going to be received by admissions committees. I'm confident that if I were able to get an interview anywhere, I would be able to knock their socks off with my passion and determination to become a physician, but I'm concerned I won't even be able to get that far in the application process. I addressed the issue in my personal statement, but my dream is feeling a little out of reach at the moment... Does anyone have any advice they could share?

Stats:

• MCAT Scores: 516 (128/130/127/131)
• Research:
  • Lab #1: 1058 hours (~2.5 years); two publications (1 first author, 1 second author), 2 presentations
  • Lab #2: 560 hours; one presentation
• Volunteering (clinical):
  • Surgical trauma unit: 50 hours
  • Medical staff outreach event for underserved communities: 6 hours
• Physician shadowing:
  • Neurology, Neurosurgery, General Surgery, Pediatric Endocrinology, Anesthesiology: 170 hours
• Non-clinical volunteering: *I have more of these but couldn’t fit them in my primary…hoping to squeeze them into my secondary apps somehow.
  • Science Discovery Outreach with kids: 40 hours
  • Agrace HospiceCare: 12 hours
  • Peer Mentoring: 24 hours
• Extracurricular activities: *I have more of these but couldn’t fit them in my primary…hoping to squeeze them into my secondary apps somehow.
  • Pre-Med Club Fundraising Chair: 210 hours
  • Intramural Sports: 30 hours
• Employment history: I was employed in both research labs. I’ve also worked as a karate instructor, camp counselor, grocery store cashier, and gas station attendant. I held each position for one year or more.

Thank you guys so much!

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[chlorocruorin]

Your mcat is definitely good. What is your race? I mean the advice most would give is to take a year of postbacc but you have already applied. My advice is to be Be confident in your application. I had a low MCAT but high gpa and came out with 4 II and 3 acceptances.

 

[deleted480308]

You say passion a lot. I don’t think it’s the “selling point “ you think it is

Mcat is good to tell a school you learned a lot and can pass tests which is important. Gpa tends to tell a school you are reliable at producing academically over time.

One semester of an illness that pops up after you pass the drop deadline hurting a gpa can be blamed on illness. 2 years of that cannot be blamed on illness, it’s just bad decision making. You pull that in med school and you will be expelled for not performing.

If asked, I would focus on how that poor decision making then taught you to be more self aware and make better decisions later.

 

[Moko]

I agree with sb247, almost everyone applying is passionate about medicine (or at least will pretend to be), but passion by itself won't get someone in the door. I personally become more skeptical whenever someone tells me that they always wanted to become a doctor.

The main goal of adcoms is to find students who will succeed academically as medical students. A low GPA or low MCAT serve as potential red flags; however, we do look at the overall trend. A positive GPA trend does works in your favor if this has been sustained for a few years. Thresholds vary by adcom members on how many years of good performance are needed before the bad years are 'overlooked'.

Your research, employment, and shadowing experiences are good. Your clinical volunteering is actually low though, unless a "0" was left out accidentally.

 

[Med Ed]

I had some health issues in my first two years of undergrad that severely affected my academic performance. Like I was pulling 2.4-2.6 semester GPAs. But as a person who has been very, VERY passionate about being a doctor for my entire life, I kept trucking on and after my sophomore year, my health was on the upswing. There was an immediate difference in my GPA, and I started averaging a 3.8 each semester while taking upper-level science courses. Despite working my butt off to try and remedy this very blatant issue , I was unable to pull my cumulative GPA above a 3.216. I got a 517 on the MCAT, have spent a lot of time volunteering in a surgical trauma unit and for various other non-medical community organizations. I did a ton of shadowing, acquired 3 years of research experience and have multiple publications and presentations. I was on the executive board of my pre-med club and also participated in numerous other extracurricular activities.

I applied to 25 schools, but I'm very worried about how my low GPA is going to be received by admissions committees. I'm confident that if I were able to get an interview anywhere, I would be able to knock their socks off with my passion and determination to become a physician, but I'm concerned I won't even be able to get that far in the application process. I addressed the issue in my personal statement, but my dream is feeling a little out of reach at the moment... Does anyone have any advice they could share?

Stats:

• MCAT Scores: 516 (128/130/127/131)
• Research:
  • Lab #1: 1058 hours (~2.5 years); two publications (1 first author, 1 second author), 2 presentations
  • Lab #2: 560 hours; one presentation
• Volunteering (clinical):
  • Surgical trauma unit: 50 hours
  • Medical staff outreach event for underserved communities: 6 hours
• Physician shadowing:
  • Neurology, Neurosurgery, General Surgery, Pediatric Endocrinology, Anesthesiology: 170 hours
• Non-clinical volunteering: *I have more of these but couldn’t fit them in my primary…hoping to squeeze them into my secondary apps somehow.
  • Science Discovery Outreach with kids: 40 hours
  • Agrace HospiceCare: 12 hours
  • Peer Mentoring: 24 hours
• Extracurricular activities: *I have more of these but couldn’t fit them in my primary…hoping to squeeze them into my secondary apps somehow.
  • Pre-Med Club Fundraising Chair: 210 hours
  • Intramural Sports: 30 hours
• Employment history: I was employed in both research labs. I’ve also worked as a karate instructor, camp counselor, grocery store cashier, and gas station attendant. I held each position for one year or more.

Thank you guys so much!

Your GPA is actually less of a problem than your EC's. Premed club 210 hours, shadowing 170 hours, volunteering 132 hours. That's not a good pattern.

The research accomplishments are good, but will typically speak more to schools that will sink you over your GPA. Schools that might be more forgiving of your GPA tend to be enamored with volunteering and service, which you lack. I'm not saying you can't land an acceptance this cycle, but you've sort of painted yourself into a corner.

At this point your best hope is probably a low-tier private MD school that wants to pad its MCAT average a bit, will place more emphasis on recent coursework, and can look past your EC's. I can't comment on your odds at your state school(s).

 

[wi_shortie]

Your GPA is actually less of a problem than your EC's. Premed club 210 hours, shadowing 170 hours, volunteering 132 hours. That's not a good pattern.

The research accomplishments are good, but will typically speak more to schools that will sink you over your GPA. Schools that might be more forgiving of your GPA tend to be enamored with volunteering and service, which you lack. I'm not saying you can't land an acceptance this cycle, but you've sort of painted yourself into a corner.

At this point your best hope is probably a low-tier private MD school that wants to pad its MCAT average a bit, will place more emphasis on recent coursework, and can look past your EC's. I can't comment on your odds at your state school(s).

Could you explain what you mean by the poor pattern within my EC's?

 

[deleted972488]

Could you explain what you mean by the poor pattern within my EC's?

They already did. Ideally you should have more volunteering hours. Keep that in mind if you end up needing to reapply.

 

[chemdoctor]

Well you have a strong upwards trend. And a great MCAT. maybe take some upper division post bac classes at a local CC and get a 4.0

However, your clinical experience is weak. You need to work on that. Maybe take a gap year and apply NEXT year (2020) and just spend this entire year taking a few post bac classes and volunteering. you need way more clinical experience.

I think you should be OK to apply to a few MDs and all DOs

@Goro thoughts?

 

[ciestar]

Your ECs are weak. You don’t have enough volunteeeing.

 

[rdyotz]

56 Clinical volunteering hours - extremely low, as this was the only clinical experience I noticed
76 non-clinical volunteering - also really low. Competitive applicants have ~150.
170 shadowing - this only benefits you, you could have taken 70 hours from here and helped others instead (volunteering).

For your volunteering stuff, every item seemed to be really short term (less than 50 hours). It sounds like you are bouncing around and not showing any dedication/passion for a cause. ADCOMs love to see altruistic applicants. This reads more like checking a ton of boxes to sound better without being altruistic.

 

[Med Ed]

Could you explain what you mean by the poor pattern within my EC's?

You're up against people with hundreds of hours of community service. In that light your EC's look self-serving. Adcoms look for markers of altruism, hoping to be right at least some of the time.

 

[Goro]

I had some health issues in my first two years of undergrad that severely affected my academic performance. Like I was pulling 2.4-2.6 semester GPAs. But as a person who has been very, VERY passionate about being a doctor for my entire life, I kept trucking on and after my sophomore year, my health was on the upswing. There was an immediate difference in my GPA, and I started averaging a 3.8 each semester while taking upper-level science courses. Despite working my butt off to try and remedy this very blatant issue , I was unable to pull my cumulative GPA above a 3.216. I got a 517 on the MCAT, have spent a lot of time volunteering in a surgical trauma unit and for various other non-medical community organizations. I did a ton of shadowing, acquired 3 years of research experience and have multiple publications and presentations. I was on the executive board of my pre-med club and also participated in numerous other extracurricular activities.

I applied to 25 schools, but I'm very worried about how my low GPA is going to be received by admissions committees. I'm confident that if I were able to get an interview anywhere, I would be able to knock their socks off with my passion and determination to become a physician, but I'm concerned I won't even be able to get that far in the application process. I addressed the issue in my personal statement, but my dream is feeling a little out of reach at the moment... Does anyone have any advice they could share?

Stats:

• MCAT Scores: 516 (128/130/127/131)
• Research:
  • Lab #1: 1058 hours (~2.5 years); two publications (1 first author, 1 second author), 2 presentations
  • Lab #2: 560 hours; one presentation
• Volunteering (clinical):
  • Surgical trauma unit: 50 hours
  • Medical staff outreach event for underserved communities: 6 hours
• Physician shadowing:
  • Neurology, Neurosurgery, General Surgery, Pediatric Endocrinology, Anesthesiology: 170 hours
• Non-clinical volunteering: *I have more of these but couldn’t fit them in my primary…hoping to squeeze them into my secondary apps somehow.
  • Science Discovery Outreach with kids: 40 hours
  • Agrace HospiceCare: 12 hours
  • Peer Mentoring: 24 hours
• Extracurricular activities: *I have more of these but couldn’t fit them in my primary…hoping to squeeze them into my secondary apps somehow.
  • Pre-Med Club Fundraising Chair: 210 hours
  • Intramural Sports: 30 hours
• Employment history: I was employed in both research labs. I’ve also worked as a karate instructor, camp counselor, grocery store cashier, and gas station attendant. I held each position for one year or more.

Thank you guys so much!

Can you give us a year by breakdown of your GPAs?

You have lethally low EC hours. My own student interviewers would eat you alive. What are you going to say when asked how you know you are suited for a life of caring for the sick and suffering? “That you just know”? Imagine how that will go over!

I can't sugar coat this, This is not the application of a person who dearly wants to be a physician. It is the application of someone who wants to be a doctor as long as it is doesn't interfere with research.

Here's the deal: You need to show AdComs that you know what you're getting into, and show off your altruistic, humanistic side. We need to know that you're going to like being around sick or injured people for the next 40 years.

Here's another way of looking at it: would you buy a new car without test driving it? Buy a new suit or dress without trying it on??

We're also not looking for merely for good medical students, we're looking for people who will make good doctors, and 4.0 GPA robots are a dime-a-dozen.

I've seen plenty of posts here from high GPA/high MCAT candidates who were rejected because they had little patient contact experience.

Not all volunteering needs to be in a hospital. Think hospice, Planned Parenthood, nursing homes, rehab facilities, crisis hotlines, camps for sick children, or clinics.

Some types of volunteer activities are more appealing than others. Volunteering in a nice suburban hospital is all very well and good and all, but doesn't show that you're willing to dig in and get your hands dirty in the same way that working with the developmentally disabled (or homeless, the dying, or Alzheimers or mentally ill or elderly or ESL or domestic, rural impoverished) does. The uncomfortable situations are the ones that really demonstrate your altruism and get you 'brownie points'. Plus, they frankly teach you more -- they develop your compassion and humanity in ways comfortable situations can't.

Service need not be "unique". If you can alleviate suffering in your community through service to the poor, homeless, illiterate, fatherless, etc, you are meeting an otherwise unmet need and learning more about the lives of the people (or types of people) who will someday be your patients. Check out your local houses of worship for volunteer opportunities. The key thing is service to others less fortunate than you. And get off campus and out of your comfort zone!

Examples include: Habitat for Humanity, Ronald McDonald House, Humane Society, crisis hotlines, soup kitchen, food pantry, homeless or women’s shelter, after-school tutoring for students or coaching a sport in a poor school district, teaching ESL to adults at a community center, Big Brothers/Big Sisters, or Meals on Wheels.

And read this:

• Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

 

[PA_dud3]

Moving to WAMC subforum.

 

[capriccio]

Seconding all of the advice from everyone else here. Passion is nothing without the work to back it up, and unfortunately with only 50ish hours of clinical volunteering, you are more talking the talk rather than walking it. Shoot for at least 150-200 hours, and then we can start talking about your realistic chances.

I'm also pretty sure I can guess your state of residence and alma mater, and this is heavily anecdotal but I interviewed at our state school with hundreds of clinical volunteer hours and got grilled by my interviewer on why medicine, and I think I was saved by virtue of those hours and the experiences that came with them. Long term service commitment is so important, and I think you will have a very tough cycle if that's not rectified.