How can I go to a UK school?

[OhHello]

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Hello everyone.

Last time you saw me I had renounced my plans to become a psychologist because I had decided it would take too long. Well, I have new information that has made me reconsider.

First, their PhD programs are three years, though I assume since it's 3-year you need a master's first. So, this goes back to my original plan I had mentioned about wanting to get a master's first and then fast track a PhD. Well, turns out I actually could do it! Even their PhD's they get straight form B.S. are only 3-years, though I'm sure you have to have done lots of research already, hence, I would get a Master's and spend all the time on my master's in research settings. Then, boom, research psychologist.

Or, an even BETTER deal....

I found out that if you want a Clin.Psy.D in the UK, that is also only three years, and you get paid to train there! £25,000/year! That's over $40,000/year! And, it also has research components, possibly more than the U.S. PsyD (which as far as research goes is just about reading it, not conducing it). BUT-- those PsyD programs have about half the acceptance rate of U.S. ones. From wiki: "In the UK, clinical psychologists undertake a Doctor of Clinical Psychology (D.Clin.Psych.), which is a practitioner doctorate with both clinical and research components. This is a three-year full-time salaried program sponsored by the National Health Service (NHS) and based in universities and the NHS. Entry into these programs is highly competitive, and requires at least a three-year undergraduate degree in psychology plus some form of experience, usually in either the NHS as an Assistant Psychologist or in academia as a Research Assistant. It is not unusual for applicants to apply several times before being accepted onto a training course as only about one-fifth of applicants are accepted each year."

Now, as I understand it, acceptance into U.S. PsyD programs is about 40%, but the average debt you are looking at is $120k for 2011 graduates and increasing yearly. So you'd be a nut to get a U.S. PsyD anyway. Plus, they take 5 years, and so any extra experience that the UK one takes to get into, as long as it's not >2 years more than the amount of experience needed to get into a U.S. PsyD program, it still doesn't take as long-- and more importantly doesn't COST $$!

So, here is my other idea:

1.Spend a couple years as an R.A. and maybe even getting some type of relevant work experience (there must be SOME more relevant job for me than server, I have a psych bachelor's!!) and taking whatever UK tests there are
2. Go to Uni in UK for three years, get paid while doing training, come back to U.S. with PsyD, take licencing exam
3. ???
4. Profit!

Have I found THE loophole?!?!?!

 

[paramour]

If you had found the loophole, more people would be doing it.

Are psych admissions turning into the same as med schools' (i.e., I don't want to or can't do what's required of me here, so I'll go elsewhere for that coveted piece of paper)? 🙄

 

[OhHello]

If you had found the loophole, more people would be doing it.

Are psych admissions turning into the same as med schools' (i.e., I don't want to or can't do what's required of me here, so I'll go elsewhere for that coveted piece of paper)? 🙄

Are pre-med students known for doing that?

That's funny, my sister was pre-med and spent all her time doing all these extensive requirements and R.A./volunteering crap for basically an endless undergraduate experience (she's 2 years older than me and still 'working on her bachelor's), and she had basically no life outside studying.... and now she says that med school takes too long so she's just gonna be a P.A.

 

[OhHello]

crap, what if there is a massive influx of U.S. applications to U.K. programs now because a lot of psych students view this forum, and the only reason this loophole has stayed a loophole is bc most people hadn't thought of it

 

[Ollie123]

....seriously (in reference to the last post)?

Some obvious concerns:
1) I'm mildly unclear how this saves that much time, especially given you could still have issues getting licensed here and might have additional requirements/post-doc/etc. to deal with, not to mention the issues getting in. I'm sure its possible if you go to a legit program over there, but its not as simple as flying home and getting licensed.
2) Are you sure the NHS will fund non-UK-citizens? I don't know, but many countries with funded systems work like that. I'm fairly certain people aren't eligible for NIH fellowships here if they aren't citizens.
3) How does this solve all the other issues that came up in the other thread?

 

[erg923]

crap, what if there is a massive influx of U.S. applications to U.K. programs now because a lot of psych students view this forum, and the only reason this loophole has stayed a loophole is bc most people hadn't thought of it

"Simma down na."

-Cheri Oteri

 

[OhHello]

....seriously (in reference to the last post)?

Some obvious concerns:
1) I'm mildly unclear how this saves that much time, especially given you could still have issues getting licensed here and might have additional requirements/post-doc/etc. to deal with, not to mention the issues getting in. I'm sure its possible if you go to a legit program over there, but its not as simple as flying home and getting licensed.
2) Are you sure the NHS will fund non-UK-citizens? I don't know, but many countries with funded systems work like that. I'm fairly certain people aren't eligible for NIH fellowships here if they aren't citizens.
3) How does this solve all the other issues that came up in the other thread?

EDIT: http://www.leeds.ac.uk/chpccp/BasicInternationalFunding.html

So there is even a way around getting a work visa, potentially.

I don't think there was other issues though. As for getting licensed here I don't think they would turn me down if it was approved in the UK, espec since a lot of states don't even require you get your education from an APA accredited program.

 

[Ollie123]

Didn't say they'd turn you down, but there are more hoops you may need to jump through. This seems like a VERY risky approach to what...save a year or so of a time? Maybe? Maybe I'm wrong, and don't take it the wrong way, but from reading your posts I just get a definite sense of "Uh oh"...you seem very impulsive, very unwilling to think things through, and well...like a young undergraduate and not a professional (which you need to become quickly if you want to be successful here). I just get the impression you have absolutely no idea what you are getting into, and I don't see this going well if you don't slow down, stop trying to figure out how to cut corners, etc.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but the website you linked to basically makes it sound like its not looking good for you getting in.

Non-EEA (European Economic Area) applicants are therefore not usually considered because the NHS is unlikely to employ anyone as a Trainee Clinical Psychologist who does not have the right to work in the UK. Their main aim is to train clinical psychologists to work in the UK on a long term basis.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

This thread is full of fail.

You are basically looking for a shortcut, in a very competitive field, without wanting to put in the work. That is not a good approach to graduate training.

Licensure from an international program is very difficult, and it often requires additional classes, additional supervision (1 or more years), passing the EPPP, finding a post-doc, and then you can try and apply for jobs....without an acred. internship. Good luck with that plan.

 

[erg923]

EDIT: I don't think they would turn me down if it was approved in the UK, espec since a lot of states don't even require you get your education from an APA accredited program.

I know right, cause government never has any redtape and always has internally consistent policies that make perfect sense...🙄

Everyone is gonna give you the same advice. Back up about 5 miles and take your time. You will have to do this like all the rest of us did. There is no short cut. You're posts are obviously of a person who has little knowledge of this profession. I would use SDN as a resource to learn about the profession, not so ways you can dive in and smack you head on the bottom of the pool. 😉

All of us learned about this field in school...and by working directly with professors, researchers, and clinicians. This is step one.

A preamble question might be something like, "what you would like to do with the degree?" Depending on your answer, you might not really need this degree to do that.

 

[OhHello]

I know right, cause government never has any redtape and always has internally consistent policies that make perfect sense...🙄

Everyone is gonna give you the same advice. Back up about 5 miles and take your time. You will have to do this like all the rest of us did. There is no short cut. You're posts are obviously of a person who has little knowledge of this profession. I would use SDN as a resource to learn about the profession, not so ways you can dive in and smack you head on the bottom of the pool. 😉

All of us learned about this field in school...and by working directly with professors, researchers, and clinicians. This is step one.

Lets switch gears. Lets start with what you would like to do with the degree?

I guess "social psychology" type of research, and also counseling people w/mental illnesses. But I don't know why I would wait until I know exactly what I want to do before getting the credentials, since it seems that people who do that tend to spend longer in school. I knew a lady who was in undergrad for ten years because she switched her major like 15 times.

 

[erg923]

This thread is full of fail..

http://www.spike.com/video-clips/6lycf9/simmer-down-now

 

[OhHello]

Didn't say they'd turn you down, but there are more hoops you may need to jump through. This seems like a VERY risky approach to what...save a year or so of a time? Maybe? Maybe I'm wrong, and don't take it the wrong way, but from reading your posts I just get a definite sense of "Uh oh"...you seem very impulsive, very unwilling to think things through, and well...like a young undergraduate and not a professional (which you need to become quickly if you want to be successful here). I just get the impression you have absolutely no idea what you are getting into, and I don't see this going well if you don't slow down, stop trying to figure out how to cut corners, etc.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but the website you linked to basically makes it sound like its not looking good for you getting in.

I am pretty impulsive, yeah, and yes I'm young, as I've only recently turned 21. My thing is though that I think it's important to get done w/school fast so as to increase chances of actually finishing it. Cos if I get to a point that I feel enlightened by a desire to take on a certain career I'd like to not be at point zero, from there, and waste time dicking around until then.

Also, just in terms of keeping motivation: the logic behind holding kids back a year in school if they perform badly is that they'll have drown if they go forth, while keeping them behind will help them catch up. In practice, if kids are held back they're more likely to drop out of school and perform worse. Also, high school graduates who weren't sure they could handle a higher-caliber private university for grad school have been found to do better when they opted for the private school instead of the public school, counter-intuitively. I think this took other factors into account but I don't remember the exact study.

 

[erg923]

I guess "social psychology" type of research, and also counseling people w/mental illnesses. But I don't know why I would wait until I know exactly what I want to do before getting the credentials, since it seems that people who do that tend to spend longer in school. I knew a lady who was in undergrad for ten years because she switched her major like 15 times.

We have given you advice. I really dont know what else anyone is going to be able to add to this thread that hasn't already been said.

 

[OhHello]

http://www.spike.com/video-clips/6lycf9/simmer-down-now

-_- my Grandpa said, "What?" He thought that was me.

 

[OhHello]

We have given you advice. I really dont know what else anyone is going to be able to add to this thread that hasn't already been said.

UK it is then 🙂

 

[Ollie123]

Yeah...well, good luck. Each additional post convinces me more and more this is going to go horribly, horribly wrong if you continue to approach things in the way that you are, but I genuinely do wish you the best with this.

By the way, switching majors 15 times in spending 10 years school typically results from EXACTLY what you are doing. Impulsive decisions, and being more concerned with getting into school asap rather than taking your time and thinking things through.

 

[erg923]

Yeah...well, good luck. Each additional post convinces me more and more this is going to go horribly, horribly wrong if you continue to approach things in the way that you are, but I genuinely do wish you the best with this.

By the way, switching majors 15 times in spending 10 years school typically results from EXACTLY what you are doing. Impulsive decisions, and being more concerned with getting into school asap rather than taking your time and thinking things through.

Ollie, this person will not be going to the UK, so no worries there. Tomorrow, it will on to something else.

I always thought it would be cool to Indiana Jones. To bad my History Channel-International subscription doesnt come with a bull whip and can of whoop ass...

 

[Tesseract18]

Oy. The maturity level being exhibited by this person is IMPRESSIVE. While I do wish you well on your journey, I hope you learn some patience and caution from "smacking your head on the bottom of the pool" as you continue to develop. Hopefully you won't have to earn too many bruises before you realize that your life and career are not the best places to choose to "quantity" over quality. Also, you may want to consider other career paths with less red tape and requisite investments of time; I think most of us are hinting that your current attitude and approach is not going to be well suited for a career in psychology. You may be happier pursing something else!

 

[psich]

 

[ClinicalABA]

espec since a lot of states don't even require you get your education from an APA accredited program.

I see this type of statement on the board quite a bit. While there are states that don't require your training or internship program to be APA approved, they do require that that your program(s) meet minimum standards that are often identical to what is required for APA accreditation. When applying for licensure, if your program was APA approved, you usually just check a box indicating so and skip the next few section of the application. If it wasn't APA approved, then you have to complete the next sections, which, in many states, basically requires you to demonstrate that the program would meet APA minimum standards for accreditation. APA accred. just tells the state that you met the minimum standards and they don't have to spend time or resources reviewing more evidence from you. If your program was not APA accred. DOES NOT MEAN that the the minimum standards don't apply! It just means you have to do more work to (a) make sure the program meets the standards; and (b) prove it to the licensing board.! Sorry man, there just aren't short-cuts.

Let's say that you get into a UK program, do your three years time, and then come back to the US to get licensed in, say, Massachusetts (which accepts training in non-APA accred. programs). This makes the big assumption that this is even allowed- something tells me the UK is not in the business of paying for graduate education that will be used in another country, and there might be requirement that you stick around.). If the 3 year UK program didn't involve specific coursework in things like multicultural issues or history and systems of psychology, you'd have to spend a year or so taking these courses somewhere before you can get licensed.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

OP, the UK educational system (along with most of the European Union and Australia) provides a very different training sequence for Masters and Doctoral training. While there are research degrees that can be pursued at the Masters level, the focus of training at the Masters level is on clinical training. Doctoral training is reserved for developing a clinicians research abilities. This training sequence rarely if ever meets state licensure requirements within the US for doctoral licensure because the class sequences are different, as are the required supervision hours and practica experiences.

I'd encourage you to do a lot more reading about the different training paths to be a clinician, as your posting reflects a number of misconceptions and an overall poor understanding of what is involved. There are no shortcuts in the training.

 

[AcronymAllergy]

OP, the UK educational system (along with most of the European Union and Australia) provides a very different training sequence for Masters and Doctoral training. While there are research degrees that can be pursued at the Masters level, the focus of training at the Masters level is on clinical training. Doctoral training is reserved for developing a clinicians research abilities. This training sequence rarely if ever meets state licensure requirements within the US for doctoral licensure because the class sequences are different, as are the required supervision hours and practica experiences.

I'd encourage you to do a lot more reading about the different training paths to be a clinician, as your posting reflects a number of misconceptions and an overall poor understanding of what is involved. There are no shortcuts in the training.

Agreed. I'd also like to point out that, at 21, even were you to complete a master's before considering doctoral study (which seems like it would be a good idea in this situation), you'd still be entering doctoral training at a younger age than many of the people I know, myself included.

This isn't something you want to rush through or make rash decisions regarding. If you aren't willing or able to put in the standard 5+ years of graduate-level training required, then the field likely isn't for you.

 

[AlaskanJustin]

Hello everyone.

Last time you saw me I had renounced my plans to become a psychologist because I had decided it would take too long. Well, I have new information that has made me reconsider.

First, their PhD programs are three years, though I assume since it's 3-year you need a master's first. So, this goes back to my original plan I had mentioned about wanting to get a master's first and then fast track a PhD. Well, turns out I actually could do it! Even their PhD's they get straight form B.S. are only 3-years, though I'm sure you have to have done lots of research already, hence, I would get a Master's and spend all the time on my master's in research settings. Then, boom, research psychologist.

Or, an even BETTER deal....

I found out that if you want a Clin.Psy.D in the UK, that is also only three years, and you get paid to train there! £25,000/year! That's over $40,000/year! And, it also has research components, possibly more than the U.S. PsyD (which as far as research goes is just about reading it, not conducing it). BUT-- those PsyD programs have about half the acceptance rate of U.S. ones. From wiki: "In the UK, clinical psychologists undertake a Doctor of Clinical Psychology (D.Clin.Psych.), which is a practitioner doctorate with both clinical and research components. This is a three-year full-time salaried program sponsored by the National Health Service (NHS) and based in universities and the NHS. Entry into these programs is highly competitive, and requires at least a three-year undergraduate degree in psychology plus some form of experience, usually in either the NHS as an Assistant Psychologist or in academia as a Research Assistant. It is not unusual for applicants to apply several times before being accepted onto a training course as only about one-fifth of applicants are accepted each year."

Now, as I understand it, acceptance into U.S. PsyD programs is about 40%, but the average debt you are looking at is $120k for 2011 graduates and increasing yearly. So you'd be a nut to get a U.S. PsyD anyway. Plus, they take 5 years, and so any extra experience that the UK one takes to get into, as long as it's not >2 years more than the amount of experience needed to get into a U.S. PsyD program, it still doesn't take as long-- and more importantly doesn't COST $$!

So, here is my other idea:

1.Spend a couple years as an R.A. and maybe even getting some type of relevant work experience (there must be SOME more relevant job for me than server, I have a psych bachelor's!!) and taking whatever UK tests there are
2. Go to Uni in UK for three years, get paid while doing training, come back to U.S. with PsyD, take licencing exam
3. ???
4. Profit!

Have I found THE loophole?!?!?!

You will not get into a clin psy degree there. Trust me, I have recently made a friend who makes funding decisions (with a committee) for the individual programs (i.e., works for NHS) and there is an explicit clause that unless you are from a UK or EU country, YOU WILL NOT be admitted to the program. The reason is that when admitted to the clin psy d you are instantly employed as a government employee, I liken it to getting the HPSP scholarship from the Navy, they pay for a few years during training then you owe them service.... exactly the same for the UK schools.

If you want to get into a research degree... you can but you have to win international student funding... and well, unless you get NSF funding GOOD LUCK! They cut the pool by taking the top 5% of major academic universities (like Harvard)...

you could always try Australia or New Zealand...

 

[OhHello]

I am planning to move to the UK anyway tbh. Education aside, I need to move there at some point.

 

[HenryHall]

... If you want to get into a research degree... you can but you have to win international student funding... and well, unless you get NSF funding GOOD LUCK! They cut the pool by taking the top 5% of major academic universities (like Harvard)... you could always try Australia or New Zealand...

I strongly suspect the people here counseling you on the American way of doing things really know their stuff. Dismiss them at your peril.

On the other hand, a number of years spent in education and work abroad, whether in an Anglophile country or not, will give a young person a perspective on, and insight to, life that typical Americans will always lack. You may likely end up lesser qualified but more capable as a result. And I assume if you cared two hoots in Hades about your personal standard of living you would not be in mental health at all.

Go East young man, adventure awaits. (I speak as someone who has multiple citizenships, and has worked years on every continent in the Northern hemisphere)

 

[LHDMMD]

I am planning to move to the UK anyway tbh. Education aside, I need to move there at some point.

I have no doubt that you want to pursue an education in mental health, but this comment makes me think that you are just looking for anything you think will be fast/easy to do while you're in the UK.
We don't know your reasons for NEEDING to move to another country and it may not even be important, but after reading this thread, I have to agree with the other posters that this seems as if you have not thought this through. However, you seem to be pretty young and you have to do what you feel is best and make your own mistakes. There's only so much good advice you can get on an online forum from strangers. I have a feeling there is much more to this than what you are telling us.
If you move to the UK and live there for a considerable time, would you then be able to get citizenship? Then you can apply for whatever program or school you want as a UK citizen. I do not know how that works, how long it would take, or if its even possible for you to do. Good luck!

 

[psich]

I think it's pretty clear what his intentions are: his primary concern is time, not quality of training, so he's looking for loopholes to get to where he wants to be. I think the fact that he's actively searching for exceptions for the sake of buying time says a lot.

Also, I don't appreciate the generalization that "typical" Americans lack insight that comes with working abroad. Working in several different countries is not typical for the average person, I'd reckon. So "lacking insight" would be true for every "typical" person, regardless of their nationality.

Of course, different experiences will give you different perspectives. You could argue that one wouldn't have insight for an infinite number of experiences - not working in an urban environment, nor working in poor conditions, etc. Butnot getting a particular experience (e.g., studying and working abroad) doesn't mean that he or she is incapable of doing their job.

 

[erg923]

Also, I don't appreciate the generalization that "typical" Americans lack insight that comes with working abroad. Working in several different countries is not typical for the average person, I'd reckon. So "lacking insight" would be true for every "typical" person, regardless of their nationality.

Of course, different experiences will give you different perspectives. You could argue that one wouldn't have insight for an infinite number of experiences - not working in an urban environment, nor working in poor conditions, etc. Butnot getting a particular experience (e.g., studying and working abroad) doesn't mean that he or she is incapable of doing their job.

I went to a Shizophrenia conference in Switzerland (University of Zurich) some years back and I really enjoyed pickeing the brains of some of the European grade students about how their system works. It was interesting. 🙂

 

[wigflip]

I really enjoyed pickeing the brains of some of the European grade students

erg, initially I read your typo above as "pickling the brains"--I was getting worried for a second about your hobbies!

OP: one of the following two things will happen to you in life:

1. you will die.

2. if you are lucky enough to avoid being crushed by a moving vehicle or torn asunder by bears or similar, you will first get old, then you will die.

By comparison, getting old(er) ain't so bad. I'm more than twice your age, and still mulling things over re: my career change, the best educational path. And you know what? When I was young I was so sure of myself, and I thought people in my current, 40-something career- and mind-changing position were Big Suckers. Now I can tell you from personal experience that taking the time to develop some maturity and thoughtfully research alternatives is a good thing. You'll learn more about yourself and what really fits for you in time, and even then you may change. Enjoy 21. It ain't comin' back. Your enthusiasm is admirable, but grad school is a long, ugly slog. You'll need fortitude and dedication to get through the dark days once your enthusiasm wanes. An impulsive choice may leave you wondering "Where Are We Going and Why Are We In This Hand Basket?"

 

[HenryHall]

Another point you should be aware of is that UK School is a bit of a misnomer. The higher education systems of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland are greatly different each from the other. My guess, only a guess, is that in today's political climate an American would find Scotland a lot more feasible than England. Especially in health-related fields and especially where it comes to financing. Many deals are financially better for people under 25 years of age. There is no substitute for research and this is best conducted in person after initial correspondence. The Brit-Rail pass is great value for money!

UK citizenship by naturalisation typically follows 6 years employment (3 years if married to a local) and confers the right to work and live throughout most of Europe. As an immigrant to multiple countries myself I can tell you that (1) the process is always complex (2) No does not always mean no (3) Form is commonly more important than substance.

The following is a good website for background reading as to UK immigration for aspiring professionals. But is it only a primer.
http://www.workpermit.com/uk/uk.htm

 

[Neuropsych2be]

OP, the UK educational system (along with most of the European Union and Australia) provides a very different training sequence for Masters and Doctoral training. While there are research degrees that can be pursued at the Masters level, the focus of training at the Masters level is on clinical training. Doctoral training is reserved for developing a clinicians research abilities. This training sequence rarely if ever meets state licensure requirements within the US for doctoral licensure because the class sequences are different, as are the required supervision hours and practica experiences.

I'd encourage you to do a lot more reading about the different training paths to be a clinician, as your posting reflects a number of misconceptions and an overall poor understanding of what is involved. There are no shortcuts in the training.

Getting a doctorate overseas is VERY different process than here in the USA. It will not give you the ability to gain licensure in the USA. The British clinical psychology doctorate is as competitive as the American Ph.D. and unless you are a British citizen you will never be admitted due to funding council requirements. Even if you did, the degree requirements are not as extensive as American Ph.D. requirements. No state board would license you in all probability.

 

[OhHello]

Ok, I understand now, and I agree there's no way an American could get in, considering that I could just jump ship and not really be held accountable. I've never even heard of someone paying a traffic ticket they got in another country.

I wish there was a way a person could get licensed in both the US and UK. I don't see how it's so hard. If you're a doctor in the US you can be a usually doctor in the UK. It's weird that there is no synched system for psych.

And that ours hates us. If you look at the numbers, the PsyD average debt of $120k is exactly what they get paid to do paid training in the UK for that three year program.

Speaking of unpaid training, I think I'm about to get a volunteer gig that involves about 100 hours of training. Of course, I think that means that I'm not legally obligated to follow through on it, as a non-paid thing, but there is always a contract involved.

 

[OhHello]

erg, initially I read your typo above as "pickling the brains"--I was getting worried for a second about your hobbies!

OP: one of the following two things will happen to you in life:

1. you will die.

2. if you are lucky enough to avoid being crushed by a moving vehicle or torn asunder by bears or similar, you will first get old, then you will die.

By comparison, getting old(er) ain't so bad. I'm more than twice your age, and still mulling things over re: my career change, the best educational path. And you know what? When I was young I was so sure of myself, and I thought people in my current, 40-something career- and mind-changing position were Big Suckers. Now I can tell you from personal experience that taking the time to develop some maturity and thoughtfully research alternatives is a good thing. You'll learn more about yourself and what really fits for you in time, and even then you may change. Enjoy 21. It ain't comin' back. Your enthusiasm is admirable, but grad school is a long, ugly slog. You'll need fortitude and dedication to get through the dark days once your enthusiasm wanes. An impulsive choice may leave you wondering "Where Are We Going and Why Are We In This Hand Basket?"

Thank you for this, btw. I hadn't really read this bc I stopped reading posts when the boo-on-ohhell-train started

But I think I needed to read this

 

[Occlumentia]

OhHello, I've seen quite a few social worker jobs advertised for the UK, possibly because of licensing issues. If you're not dead set on psychology, then SW may be a good way to go for the UK.

I've heard that the UK D Clin Psych is very competitive to get into, and, like others have mentioned, I'm not sure the NHS would fund you if you're not a UK citizen (I'm not even 100% sure that they'd fund you if you're a "mere" EU citizen tbh).

In Australia clinical doctoral programs (D Clin Psych/PsyD) are quite competitive as well, and are not free. Our PhDs, however, are free (at least for Aus citizens) and it is possible to get funding as well, however this does not constitute clinical training at all.

Personally, if I were you, I'd decide where I was going to spend the majority of my working life, and look into local requirements. Otherwise, look into what you'd need to do to meet both the requirements of where you're training, as well as the requirements of where you may be moving to.

 

[wigflip]

OhHelloPersonally, if I were you, I'd decide where I was going to spend the majority of my working life, and look into local requirements. Otherwise, look into what you'd need to do to meet both the requirements of where you're training, as well as the requirements of where you may be moving to.

+1

Yeah, I think the "reverse engineering" approach is the best.

1. Figure out whatchoo wanna do (and where).
2. Look around and see who's doin' dat.
3. Figure out what they did to get there.
4. Figure out if conditions now are the same or different than when they did that* and if things are different now, is it still feasible, still worth it.
5. Do the things you need to become like people you identified in #2, or tweak your desired outcome, restarting with #1.

*#4 is the key. e.g. I have a psychologist friend who's been practicing for over 20 years. Private practice, does well. She went non-APA for her internship and doesn't think it's a problem not to go APA. Well, a) she's in private practice and b) she's not on the job market and has no motivation to keep up on those types of trends. She didn't know about the APA internship meltdown until I told her.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

*#4 is the key. e.g. I have a psychologist friend who's been practicing for over 20 years. Private practice, does well. She went non-APA for her internship and doesn't think it's a problem not to go APA. Well, a) she's in private practice and b) she's not on the job market and has no motivation to keep up on those types of trends. She didn't know about the APA internship meltdown until I told her.

It is a very different world today than 20 years ago. Many established private practie clinicians are not in touch with the current issues in training because they don't have regular contact with students and/or are not active with professional psych organizations. I'd hazard to guess that your friend would be in trouble if she took her same path now as a student, as the competition is much greater and building a practice is much more about building a business.

 

[HenryHall]

, I've seen quite a few social worker jobs advertised for the UK, possibly because of licensing issues. If you're not dead set on psychology, then SW may be a good way to go for the UK.

I've heard that the UK D Clin Psych is very competitive to get into, and, like others have mentioned, I'm not sure the NHS would fund you if you're not a UK citizen (I'm not even 100% sure that they'd fund you if you're a "mere" EU citizen tbh). ...

UK resident, not UK citizen. The difference is crucial.
Actually, to be pedantic, there is no UK citizen, only British Citizen (includes for example Channel Island Jersey which is not part of UK).

For example, three years working in Scotland (as a Social Worker or otherwise) will earn you full ride.