How did/would you rank programs with strong MSK/OutPT setting??

[pyoj]

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i have several interviews lined up but i'm trying to figure out how to differentiate one program to another. i'm mainly interested in a program that would provide strong outpatient/musculoskeletal/EMG's/pain management/ alternative therapies.

i was just curious to see how people ranked (or will rank) based on these interest??

So far i have interviews scheduled with Sinai of Baltimore, NUMC, Einstein-LIJ, and Stony Brook all before Christmas.

Thanks for your responses.
~pyoj

 

[paz5559]

i have several interviews lined up but i'm trying to figure out how to differentiate one program to another. i'm mainly interested in a program that would provide strong outpatient/musculoskeletal/EMG's/pain management/ alternative therapies.

i was just curious to see how people ranked (or will rank) based on these interest??

So far i have interviews scheduled with Sinai of Baltimore, NUMC, Einstein-LIJ, and Stony Brook all before Christmas.

Thanks for your responses.
~pyoj

Not sure about the residents's experience, but I can tell you that Mike Furman's fellowship in interventional pain management is affiliated with Sinai, and Brian Krabek is an awesome sports guy in Baltimore at Hopkins. If you get to spend any time with either of them, I might put Sinai above the rest

 

[drvlad2004]

i have several interviews lined up but i'm trying to figure out how to differentiate one program to another. i'm mainly interested in a program that would provide strong outpatient/musculoskeletal/EMG's/pain management/ alternative therapies.

i was just curious to see how people ranked (or will rank) based on these interest??

So far i have interviews scheduled with Sinai of Baltimore, NUMC, Einstein-LIJ, and Stony Brook all before Christmas.

Thanks for your responses.
~pyoj

Sinai has solid outpatient exposure. Hopkins is still on continued provisional accredition according ACGME.com. Stony Brook is more inpatient oriented. Last time that I remember, the Stony Brook residents did say that they don't get enough EMGs. Einstein-LIJ is again very inpatient oriented but very weak in outpatient exposure. NUMC (I begin there in 2005) has excellent outpatient exposure. The program is very focused towards musculoskeletal/sports/EMG/outpatient/interventional/OMM. The residents do a lot of OMM in the clinics and inpatient. NUMC has an OMM specialist on staff that also does lecture every week. Every resident usually DOES well over the 200 EMGs required for the boards. The PD, Lyn Weiss is an EMG specialist. The inpatient exposure is very limited at NUMC. If you are interested in SCI or TBI, then I wouldn't recommend NUMC. However TBI and SCI fellowships are easy to obtain (from any program) compared to sports and pain. The NUMC residents seem to be more than satisfied with the breadth of outpatient exposure and that is what most of them were initially interested in, including myself.

 

[pyoj]

thanks for the input on sinai and numc. of course i would like a good balance of TBI and SCI and having a strong inpt base will allow you to build your clientel (sp?) when/if you decide to go private practive. but my interests are more outpt based. i may even consider EMG or Interventional Spine fellowships (i like doing procedures).

i'm actually doing my pmr rotation at numc this month. great bunch of residents and dr. weiss is great.

anyone else have some input on st. vincent's, greater LA VA, or philly programs?

thanks for your replies!! keep em comming!!

~pyoj
MS4 COMP

 

[drvlad2004]

thanks for the input on sinai and numc. of course i would like a good balance of TBI and SCI and having a strong inpt base will allow you to build your clientel (sp?) when/if you decide to go private practive. but my interests are more outpt based. i may even consider EMG or Interventional Spine fellowships (i like doing procedures).

i'm actually doing my pmr rotation at numc this month. great bunch of residents and dr. weiss is great.

anyone else have some input on st. vincent's, greater LA VA, or philly programs?

thanks for your replies!! keep em comming!!

~pyoj
MS4 COMP

St. Vincent's is comparable to NUMC. Again this residency program is very focused on outpatient musculoskeletal. There isn't much on inpatient at St. V's. Their housing in the city is quite nice! St. Vincent's is in a very nice part of Manhattan. I interviewed at UPenn. I actually liked the program since they are strong in MSK and interventional spine. UPenn has one of the best interventional spine fellowships in the northeast. Most of the better interventional spine/pain programs that I found were in the south (i.e. Emory, MCV, San Antonio, LSU). I think that Temple and Thomas Jefferson are maybe the 2 better programs in Philly since they are more well-rounded.

 

[prefontaine]

Penn's strength's are musculoskeletal, pain, sports and spine. They have many fellowships, as well as a # of interventionally trained, pain and EMG boarded physicians. Also, the least amount of inpatient of the Philly programs and they are perhaps one of the best kept secrets in PM&R residencies. All of the residents that I know there are very happy to be part of the program. Apparently, it takes awhile to shed the outdated image from the 1990s.

thanks for the input on sinai and numc. of course i would like a good balance of TBI and SCI and having a strong inpt base will allow you to build your clientel (sp?) when/if you decide to go private practive. but my interests are more outpt based. i may even consider EMG or Interventional Spine fellowships (i like doing procedures).

i'm actually doing my pmr rotation at numc this month. great bunch of residents and dr. weiss is great.

anyone else have some input on st. vincent's, greater LA VA, or philly programs?

thanks for your replies!! keep em comming!!

~pyoj
MS4 COMP

 

[paz5559]

Penn's strength's are musculoskeletal, pain, sports and spine. They have many fellowships, as well as a # of interventionally trained, pain and EMG boarded physicians. Also, the least amount of inpatient of the Philly programs and they are perhaps one of the best kept secrets in PM&R residencies. All of the residents that I know there are very happy to be part of the program. Apparently, it takes awhile to shed the outdated image from the 1990s.

I spent a week at Penn interviewing for their interventional spine fellowship. I was surprised that none of fellowship applicants were internal candidates from Penn. It is renouned for being a year of VERY hard work, but the lack of interest demonstrated by Penn residents still surprised me, and I wondered if anyone else had any insight as to why that was the case.

 

[prefontaine]

In the past, they have done Slipman's fellowship. Recently, they have gravitated to ACGME pain fellowships.

I spent a week at Penn interviewing for their interventional spine fellowship. I was surprised that none of fellowship applicants were internal candidates from Penn. It is renouned for being a year of VERY hard work, but the lack of interest demonstrated by Penn residents still surprised me, and I wondered if anyone else had any insight as to why that was the case.

 

[paz5559]

In the past, they have done Slipman's fellowship. Recently, they have gravitated to ACGME pain fellowships.

Actually, that is simply not the case - the only guy interested in interventional pain in this year's graduating class is going to a local, non-acreditted pain fellowship

And NONE of the Slipman fellows in the past three years have been Penn grads - prior to that, the general perception was that the program was sufficently academically rigorous, but now that it has upgraded significantly, one would thing internal candidates would have the inside track.

 

[pyoj]

here's another question...

will/did you rank your top five based on reputation (US News top 25) or career interests (eg. TBI vs. SCI vs. OutPt)? For example, suppose you are interested in OutPt based PM&R but you rank Mt. Sinai (#17), which is overwhelmingly InPt, higher than a program like St. Vincents, which focuses on OutPt.

and...

do you think the reason people dont get their #1 or #2 choice is because they rank the top 25 programs...just like everyone else?

no inflammatory responses please, i'm just playing the "devil's advocate"...

US News rehabilitation hospitals top 25 ranking:
http://www.usnews.com/usnews/health/hosptl/rankings/specrepreha.htm

 

[Disciple]

When I interviewed at Penn last year, the residents told me they simply were not interested in spending another year with Slipman. Apparently notoriously malignant....

Good to know for future reference.

Thanks.

 

[Disciple]

here's another question...

will/did you rank your top five based on reputation (US News top 25) or career interests (eg. TBI vs. SCI vs. OutPt)? For example, suppose you are interested in OutPt based PM&R but you rank Mt. Sinai (#17), which is overwhelmingly InPt, higher than a program like St. Vincents, which focuses on OutPt.

and...

do you think the reason people dont get their #1 or #2 choice is because they rank the top 25 programs...just like everyone else?

no inflammatory responses please, i'm just playing the "devil's advocate"...

US News rehabilitation hospitals top 25 ranking:
http://www.usnews.com/usnews/health/hosptl/rankings/specrepreha.htm

Excellent question.

When I was interviewing a few years ago I didn't know about this board. I basically had the US NEWS rankings and word of mouth to go by.

Looking back on it. I'm sure I made a few mistakes on my rank list and choice of interviews.

 

[prefontaine]

You are wrong, one will be staying at Penn (pain/anes), another is going to Beth Israel in NYC, also for an ACGME pain program.

Actually, that is simply not the case - the only guy interested in interventional pain in this year's graduating class is going to a local, non-acreditted pain fellowship

And NONE of the Slipman fellows in the past three years have been Penn grads - prior to that, the general perception was that the program was sufficently academically rigorous, but now that it has upgraded significantly, one would thing internal candidates would have the inside track.

 

[paz5559]

You are wrong, one will be staying at Penn (pain/anes), another is going to Beth Israel in NYC, also for an ACGME pain program.

Actually, my information comes from having rotated there last year, and having spoken with Dr. Lenrow during the interview process - by all means, enlighten me what your source of information is. Oh, and just so we are clear, the Beth Israel PM&R sports and interventional program is NOT ACGME accredited. now maybe they wnet into an anesthesia pain program, but again, that is not what a knowledgeable Penn staff member advised me of

 

[prefontaine]

My post states ACGME pain...no reference to BI's sports and interventional program. Joe is staying at Penn, Bev is going to BI. Call Penn's PM&R office if you want verification.

Actually, my information comes from having rotated there last year, and having spoken with Dr. Lenrow during the interview process - by all means, enlighten me what your source of information is. Oh, and just so we are clear, the Beth Israel PM&R sports and interventional program is NOT ACGME accredited. now maybe they wnet into an anesthesia pain program, but again, that is not what a knowledgeable Penn staff member advised me of

 

[DigableCat]

Actually, my information comes from having rotated there last year, and having spoken with Dr. Lenrow during the interview process - by all means, enlighten me what your source of information is. Oh, and just so we are clear, the Beth Israel PM&R sports and interventional program is NOT ACGME accredited. now maybe they wnet into an anesthesia pain program, but again, that is not what a knowledgeable Penn staff member advised me of

I do know one of the PGY 4's at U PENN, and they were offered the spot at Beth Israel ANESTHESIA pain. Don't know about the others.

 

[chauffeur]

I do know one of the PGY 4's at U PENN, and they were offered the spot at Beth Israel ANESTHESIA pain. Don't know about the others.

another resident is going somewhere in Arizona to do an interventional pain or spine fellowship (heard during the interview).

 

[axm397]

In terms of the Sinai-Furman link, I would say that is non-existent. Sinai resident can rotate with him and some of his fellows lecture at Sinai BUT I have yet to see a Sinai resident land a fellowship with him.