How do they expect you to do research?

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I'm a MS3 and am kinda frustrated.. I was examining some of the competitive fields out there and noticed that they all seem to require excessive research/publications/etc..

I'm confused as to how I'm supposed to know which field I am interested in during the first 2 yrs of medical school? For example.. I have yet to see Uro/Ortho/ENT/etc.. so why/how can I do research in these fields with no knowledge of them?

For example.. over the summer of MS1 I did research in Rad Onc b/c I thought I might be interested in it but now I'm not so sure.. so is that research now pointless?

Anyway.. interested to see what ppl think

 

[Antibodies]

From what I been told, the research is still good even if it is not in the specialty you ultimately want to match. They want to see that you are capable of doing research and so forth.

 

[drizzt3117]

Any research that is published or presented is valuable, obviously more so if it's in your field of interest.

 

[Ponger]

There's definitely a gradient to research experience. From a purely research standpoint your best candidate is going to have 5+ basic science publications in the field he is applying to. The worst has no research at all. I've seen people get in to competitive fields with no research. My preceptor this summer had no research and he got into ENT at UNC. He was, however, top 1% (AOA) at Rush though.

Research doesn't have to take years to do; it can be as simple as a case report on something interesting and novel.

The hierarchy of research publications goes:
Basic Science > Clinical Science > Comprehensive Literature review > Case report.

And of course 1st authorship improves each of those.

 

[Legacy87]

I am an incoming M1 and have a 1st author publication (basic science) during undergrad. I am not sure what field I am going in, but is doing research during the summer between M1-M2 and possibly during M4 be enough to be competitive for residency (of course with good step 1, lor, etc.).

 

[coralfangs]

a lot of people take a year off or for those who don't want to take a year off, suck it up and sacrifice your sleep.
I am one of the latter. For example, I just got out of my 18hr shift today at 1pm and I went straight to my office to work. Got home at 7pm and I am getting back to the hospital in 3 hrs.

My friends think I'm on drugs.

 

[Momentum70]

I know its encouraged at some schools, and I have had a few friends that took a year off for research. A good time is in between 3rd and 4th year as you should have an idea by then what specialty you want.

 

[abmd]

I know this is too late you but for other people but I was told not to do research the first year and to focus on school. I found that I had a lot of free time and now I wish I had done research. You can definitely fit it in first year. I came in without taking any of the subjects so its not like I have an advantage or anything

 

[ShinyDome19]

When people say they took a year off of medical school to do research, how does this work? Are they doing research as a student still - requiring them to take out tuition loans + living expenses for that year of research? or are they temporarily employed by the research facility...if so, wouldnt this wreak havoc on your student loans - if I remember correctly, if your not enrolled in classes for 6 months, your loans come out of deferment...

 

[C5toC9]

are there any stats comparing matches/residency successes of those who did the straight 4 yrs vs those who took year off for research?

is the opportunity cost of a year off worth it?

 

[FutureDoc4]

As someone doing one of those "year off" programs. I felt compelled to jump in.

Things like NIH Cloisters, Doris Duke, HHMI-fellows allow people to land more competitive residencies for a number of reasons:

A) Dedicated year to publish, publish, publish / and the opportunity to go to conferences to talk with important people in fields you may be interested in (and schmooz)

B) Very important we have "panel" meetings and dinners with other fellows, program directors, residents and former participants in the program (aka the opportunity to schmooz), I cannot over emphasize how important this is--getting to know important people in certain fields.

C) There is a "prestige" to many of these research fellowships and programs like to brag about having them.

There are more benefits, but these are some one of the main ones that come to mind

 

[Narmerguy]

As someone doing one of those "year off" programs. I felt compelled to jump in.

Things like NIH Cloisters, Doris Duke, HHMI-fellows allow people to land more competitive residencies for a number of reasons:

A) Dedicated year to publish, publish, publish / and the opportunity to go to conferences to talk with important people in fields you may be interested in (and schmooz)

B) Very important we have "panel" meetings and dinners with other fellows, program directors, residents and former participants in the program (aka the opportunity to schmooz), I cannot over emphasize how important this is--getting to know important people in certain fields.

C) There is a "prestige" to many of these research fellowships and programs like to brag about having them.

There are more benefits, but these are some one of the main ones that come to mind

What years is this generally taken between?

 

[Law2Doc]

are there any stats comparing matches/residency successes of those who did the straight 4 yrs vs those who took year off for research?

is the opportunity cost of a year off worth it?

There would be no way to assess this -- you can't really tell how someone would do if they didn't take a year off as compared to how they did since they did. Looking at OTHER people who did and didn't take a year off is useless because residency admission is done on an individual basis with many other factors in the mix. I can tell you anecdotally that the folks I know who did this reaped benefits, but it probably depends on the credentials that were your starting point.

Typically people get to or through third year and realize that although they thought they wanted to do, say, peds, which doesn't put as much of a premium on research, now they want to do peds ortho, or peds rads etc. They talk to a mentor in the school who suggests that since their credentials are a bit on the low side for such competitive paths, they ought to bolster it with some research. So they take a year off, find a PI and spend the year doing targeted research and hopefully at least getting abstracts submitted by year's end. Then they resume med school, submit ERAS and match with the class behind them (which is now their graduating class).

 

[Encephalectomy]

The people I know who did it (not that many people, so small n etc...) fall into one of two categories. Most are people like L2D described who decide on a competitive specialty and want to make sure that they match with average to somewhat below average credentials for their field. The other group are people with very good credentials who want to try and maximize their chance of getting into a top residency in their competitive field of choice.

 

[Mr hawkings]

The people I know who did it (not that many people, so small n etc...) fall into one of two categories. Most are people like L2D described who decide on a competitive specialty and want to make sure that they match with average to somewhat below average credentials for their field. The other group are people with very good credentials who want to try and maximize their chance of getting into a top residency in their competitive field of choice.

I would add a thirs group who want to do basic science research as well as practicing medicine and are using the research year to gain research experience without going the MD/pHD route.

 

[bencasey]

are there any stats comparing matches/residency successes of those who did the straight 4 yrs vs those who took year off for research?is the opportunity cost of a year off worth it?

The website below doesn't exactly address your question about "year off" vs "straight through", but does provide some evidence re:applicant characteristics in a variety of specialties, including research, board scores, AOA, etc. The data are a year old, but are the latest available.

http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes2009v3.pdf

 

[C5toC9]

Thanks. I think the trend is definitely toward more and more five-year-plans or dual degrees of some nature because everything is getting more competitive over time. I just want to finish quickly lol

 

[Encephalectomy]

I know this is too late you but for other people but I was told not to do research the first year and to focus on school. I found that I had a lot of free time and now I wish I had done research. You can definitely fit it in first year. I came in without taking any of the subjects so its not like I have an advantage or anything

Just thought I would second this because I think it is important. First year is a very very good time to do research. Like abmd said, there is a fair amount of free time. The course load is as manageable as it ever will be in medical school. You aren't ramping up for boards along side classwork and unlike 3rd year, your schedule is more or less whatever you make it. In addition to having the time to do research, your projects will be fully published by the time you are applying for residency which is nice. I spent a lot of time last year doing research and it was definitely a good time to do it. Also, as somebody who did both basic science and clinical research during school at different points, I would highly recommend clinical or chart based research. There is time first year, but finding the time to get anything significant done at the bench is very difficult.