How easy should college be?

[Esviel]

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Hey everyone.

I'm a highschool senior who recently got accepted to University of Pennsylvania and I want to be a doctor. I hear that premed is ridiculously difficult for even the smartest people, but that Med school is even harder. So.....say I struggle through premed and get into med school....if I had a hard time with pre-med, will it signal that i can't handle med school (since its supposedly so much harder)?

Basically i'm asking....what should be my average stress level in undergrad? I sincerely don't want to study every hour of every day, i wanna do extracurriculars, have fun, etc. What's the maximum hours of studying that I should be doing before I realize that i'm just not cut out for it? I don't wanna find out that i can't cut it after its too late!

perhaps i'll give you some insight into my study habits now......basically high school is a joke....despite the fact that i'm in the 53rd best school in the country and have a 4.0 gpa, i study ZERO hours per week, do everything at the very last minute possible, and i do everything on about 4 hrs of sleep per night because i'm up talking on the phone or procrastinating on the web. basically my study habits SUCK TREMENDOUSLY.

and i'm not trying to brag because personally i don't think i'm all that smart, there are some certified geniuses at my school haha it scares me actually, seeing what i'm gonna be up against at penn...

anyway, the only class i actually study for is AP Chemistry...we have a chapter test about every other week, so i study the entire chapter and do all the practice problems on a saturday or sunday (takes about all day, 6 or 7 hrs at my local library) and i'm usually good to go from there. and i only started doing that because my grade slipped to a B.

okay so i figure that me coasting thru school with minimal effort will soon come to an end, but i don't wanna have one of those "rude awakenings" when i start college, i want to make sure i go in fully prepared to kill those premed courses with maximum efficiency, aka studying a whole lot, but in a way that i absorb information easily and understand it without having to be all stressed out like everybody says pre-med students are.

so, any tips, info, stories, study hints from successful premeds (if you're out there)....i wanna know exactly what i'm up against, maybe i'll be motivated to change my study habits or something, who knows lol.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Hey everyone.

I'm a highschool senior who recently got accepted to University of Pennsylvania and I want to be a doctor. I hear that premed is ridiculously difficult for even the smartest people, but that Med school is even harder. So.....say I struggle through premed and get into med school....if I had a hard time with pre-med, will it signal that i can't handle med school (since its supposedly so much harder)?

Basically i'm asking....what should be my average stress level in undergrad? I sincerely don't want to study every hour of every day, i wanna do extracurriculars, have fun, etc. What's the maximum hours of studying that I should be doing before I realize that i'm just not cut out for it? I don't wanna find out that i can't cut it after its too late!

perhaps i'll give you some insight into my study habits now......basically high school is a joke....despite the fact that i'm in the 53rd best school in the country and have a 4.0 gpa, i study ZERO hours per week, do everything at the very last minute possible, and i do everything on about 4 hrs of sleep per night because i'm up talking on the phone or procrastinating on the web. basically my study habits SUCK TREMENDOUSLY.

and i'm not trying to brag because personally i don't think i'm all that smart, there are some certified geniuses at my school haha it scares me actually, seeing what i'm gonna be up against at penn...

anyway, the only class i actually study for is AP Chemistry...we have a chapter test about every other week, so i study the entire chapter and do all the practice problems on a saturday or sunday (takes about all day, 6 or 7 hrs at my local library) and i'm usually good to go from there. and i only started doing that because my grade slipped to a B.

okay so i figure that me coasting thru school with minimal effort will soon come to an end, but i don't wanna have one of those "rude awakenings" when i start college, i want to make sure i go in fully prepared to kill those premed courses with maximum efficiency, aka studying a whole lot, but in a way that i absorb information easily and understand it without having to be all stressed out like everybody says pre-med students are.

so, any tips, info, stories, study hints from successful premeds (if you're out there)....i wanna know exactly what i'm up against, maybe i'll be motivated to change my study habits or something, who knows lol.

While not many ppl follow this rule, I hear that 2 -4 hours of study time per credit hour is the amount of study time you should shoot for. If you have to do more than that to do well then yous hould probably find a different carrer, IMO.

If you can make it as a premed and get into Medical school, I hear it is very hard to flunk out. So unlike college, if you are good enough to get in, you are good enough to graduate.

My advice is to quit worrying about it, realize that pretty much everyone that gets into med school coasted through high school like you (some even coasted through college), and just do your best. That is all you can ask of yourself

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Btw, did you get into that program you were applying for? Future high school doctors or some crap.

 

[Moshe Rabbenu]

You'll be fine. I am taking 20 credits, plus a research project and I work, not to mention my extracurriculars. I study practically zero hours per week. I look at the stuff for the exam the morning or afternoon of the exam, and my papers are written a day in advance at most. I don't have a 4.0, but that's because I don't care about the stupid classes I have to take just to graduate (cough, english lit, cough); it is a respectable GPA though. I'm just going to be applying this upcoming cycle, so I'm not "successful" yet. But, I have good grades, lots of resume stuff and I'm virtually stress-free, so that's pretty successful in my book.

 

[emttim]

go in fully prepared to kill those premed courses with maximum efficiency, aka studying a whole lot.

This is pretty much all you have to do in college vs. HS....actually spend time studying, work problems if it's a problem-based subject such as chemistry, and actually just do the assignments.

Oh, and use ratemyprofessors.com religiously since it makes no sense to take a class with a ****ty teacher who's going to defraud you of an education when you could take a good teacher. Now, don't interpret that as take the teacher who's supposedly the easiest according to ratemyprofessors...just avoid the teachers with unfair/ridiculous grading practices, unhelpful, rude during office hours, immature, etc....if a review says a teacher sucks or rocks without explaining why, ignore it. If a student dislikes a teacher or likes a teacher because of something inane such as "he/she was hard" or "he/she was hot", ignore it. Just use common sense.

The only other thing I can recommend is don't tell any of your classmates that you're pre-med so your lab experiments don't get sabotaged.

 

[Rotinaj1985]

Some people are gifted in one area, others are gifted in another. For me, biology came incredibly easy. Chemistry always required a lot more of me.

The point is: If its something you want, you'll put in whatever it takes, and you'll do fine. If it isn't something you really want, you'll get out of it sooner rather than later.

Also, I've been giving this advice to a lot of people. I don't think doing the typical "Pre-Med" approach is very good. I would do something different. Pick a major that interests you and that sticks out, then do the usual bio, chem, biochem, physics, etc. seperately. Chances are you'll end up doing those anyway if you're an Arts and Science major.

The main benefit to this is that a lot of medical schools are saturated with "Pre-Meds" and they all have the same crap. Do something early to stand out. "Wow, a theatre major with a 34 MCAT and a 3.95 Science GPA." That makes you stand out. And the one thing every medical school will do flips for is diversity. They want some fresh blood, and honestly, everyone, including myself, coming at them with some biology degree or chemistry degree is just run of the mill.

 

[135892]

Its not hard, there are many other programs that are tougher than pre-med, despite what some pre-meds will tell you

 

[ChubbyChaser]

You'll be fine. I am taking 20 credits, plus a research project and I work, not to mention my extracurriculars. I study practically zero hours per week. I look at the stuff for the exam the morning or afternoon of the exam, and my papers are written a day in advance at most. I don't have a 4.0, but that's because I don't care about the stupid classes I have to take just to graduate (cough, english lit, cough); it is a respectable GPA though. I'm just going to be applying this upcoming cycle, so I'm not "successful" yet. But, I have good grades, lots of resume stuff and I'm virtually stress-free, so that's pretty successful in my book.

O and dont think you will get by like this. Either this guy is incredibly smart, goes to a Community college, or is lieing.

College is very doable but, atleast for me, definitely not stress free.

 

[Moshe Rabbenu]

Some people consider Rutgers a community college, so I guess it depends on how you look at it. It doesn't really matter to me whether or not you believe me, I just recognize the type of guy the OP is, which is similar to myself re: school.

Edit: Also, I'm not trying to brag at all, hence me not listing my GPA, but saying it isn't 4.0. It probably could have been, and was my first two years of college, but I'm the first to admit that my kryptonite is not caring about classes I'm only taking because I have to (and don't help me in getting to my goal other than fulfilling a graduation requirement).

 

[gbennett]

Its not hard, there are many other programs that are tougher than pre-med, despite what some pre-meds will tell you

this is very true!

also, the transition to college may be difficult for you. i was like you once--never studied and got awesome grades in high school. got into every undergrad i wanted...the problem was, this no longer cuts it in college (depending the difficulty of the school i would say. some people do continue to do very well with poor high school study habits). anyways, if necessary, you will learn and it may be painful. my gpa was under 3 for a while, then i learned to study and saw a slow, steady, but substantial increase.

i would recommend taking it slowly first semester. (i did not do this) watch your credits, try to take a minimum possible. dont take all / most of your science prereqs in 1 year, and personally, i would say dont take the AP exams. sure, you do the class again, but so what? i took a few APs and was placed in 2nd year courses and it killed me. i would rather have sat through the classes again. esp since my friends did and got As, whereas i was close to failing the second year courses. i just didnt know how to study.

if this is possible, i would say try to take a summer class. even if its not at penn, but near where you live. i know it kills your summer, but one 3-credit class will help you learn what is expected of a university student. youll be more prepared come fall.

this is my retrospective advice, kind of my "wish" book...ive been fortunate though, because my gpa hasnt completely tanked my application and it couldve.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Yeah definitely dont get yourself overwhelmed first semester freshman year. Take something like 12-15 Credit hours. Go meet a few ppl and work out. Other than that focus on your grades and adapting to college life. Later on you can add your ECS.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Some people consider Rutgers a community college, so I guess it depends on how you look at it. It doesn't really matter to me whether or not you believe me, I just recognize the type of guy the OP is, which is similar to myself re: school.

Edit: Also, I'm not trying to brag at all, hence me not listing my GPA, but saying it isn't 4.0. It probably could have been, and was my first two years of college, but I'm the first to admit that my kryptonite is not caring about classes I'm only taking because I have to (and don't help me in getting to my goal other than fulfilling a graduation requirement).

Sure I believe you do all those things, I guess I just cant imagine college as stress free, that seems a stretch to me. Even the brightest students on SDN would feel stressed out with 20 hours and work and such.

 

[Moshe Rabbenu]

Sorry if my response seemed harsh, but the "or this person is lieing" got me a little. I really don't get stressed out at all (okay, except when I'm driving; idiots really piss me off!). I mean, it's just school. There is always another exam or paper or something you can use to make up a bad day. I guess I'm just really laid back.

It could also be that I've worked in the OR for the last 4 years, which is certainly a lot more stressful than college. I don't let myself get stressed out when a AAA comes flying through the door into my room when I've been thinking that I have a lap tubal next, so it's hard to get stressed out about an exam.

 

[decafplease]

The short answer: your stress level should be at whatever level is required for you to get as close to a 4.0 as you can. Some people thrive on stress (myself included) and some don't. Find out which kind you are and adjust life accordingly.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Yeah,, sorry, I guess im like Decaf even though I wish I was more laid back.

 

[Begaster]

You'll be fine. I am taking 20 credits, plus a research project and I work, not to mention my extracurriculars. I study practically zero hours per week. I look at the stuff for the exam the morning or afternoon of the exam, and my papers are written a day in advance at most. I don't have a 4.0, but that's because I don't care about the stupid classes I have to take just to graduate (cough, english lit, cough); it is a respectable GPA though. I'm just going to be applying this upcoming cycle, so I'm not "successful" yet. But, I have good grades, lots of resume stuff and I'm virtually stress-free, so that's pretty successful in my book.

Now, I know it's enjoyable to pat one's self on the back, but really, perhaps you should avoid giving the OP terrible advice, regardless of how smart you believe it'll make the rest of us perceive you as.

 

[Perrotfish]

Yeah definitely dont get yourself overwhelmed first semester freshman year. Take something like 12-15 Credit hours. Go meet a few ppl and work out. Other than that focus on your grades and adapting to college life. Later on you can add your ECS.

Second this. I was scholarship chair at my fraternity and 90% of my job was counsuling people to drop down to 12 hours. We generally found that when we could pursuade people to drop to 12 credits (hopefully very easy credits) they did well that semester and then they did well with normal course loads in subsequent semesters. When they insisted on taking 15, 18, or in once case 20 hours they tended to do badly, then shame spiral and do just as badly or worse the next semester.

Adapting to college should be treated as a 3 credit course, unless you pledge in which case it's a 5 credit course.

 

[Moshe Rabbenu]

I'm not going to give him terrible advice. I think he'll be fine, and I wanted to tell him why. Someone thought it was odd that I didn't get stressed out in school, so I told him why. I don't see how that's patting myself on the back. My GPA is actually not that great compared to most people on here, so I'm certainly not bragging about that, I just happen to be okay with where it is.

 

[Begaster]

Sorry bud, when you start spouting notions like him having to study "practically zero hours per week" and only needing to "look at the stuff for the exam the morning or afternoon of the exam," you cross the fine line between telling him that he should be fine, and giving him an outrageous, nonsensical notion of what college material is actually like. Mainly, I imagine, because you want to show the world how amazing you truly are. Kudos. You are clearly a genius among geniuses.

 

[Cegar]

Taking 22 credits/quarter isn't bad if you're good with the material and you like to take classes. There's nothing wrong with it.

 

[bcat85]

The short answer: your stress level should be at whatever level is required for you to get as close to a 4.0 as you can. Some people thrive on stress (myself included) and some don't. Find out which kind you are and adjust life accordingly.

I'm definitely one who feeds of stress too. I have to admit, I have a 4.0 by complete accident. I just happened to get one my first semester in college, so i decided I would try to do it every semester (and I was lucky enough to make it...). Like you, I coasted through high school.. though I certainly did not go to the 53rd best HS in the country... actually more like 53rd from the bottom. My point is I didn't have good study habits because I didn't have to study in HS, as I'm sure many successful premeds didn't. Work hard your first semester to do two things. (1) Do well in your classes (the obvious one). (2) Make sure when you sit down to study you are not only focusing on the techniques, but that you are also focusing on the process you are using to study. I often quiz myself, rewrite problems, and paraphrase things to myself (or the unfortunate people who tend to be sitting around me), but those are only suggestions. Good luck... just work hard and you'll do fine.

 

[Moshe Rabbenu]

Sorry bud, when you start spouting notions like him having to study "practically zero hours per week" and only needing to "look at the stuff for the exam the morning or afternoon of the exam," you cross the fine line between telling him that he should be fine, and giving him an outrageous, nonsensical notion of what college material is actually like. Mainly, I imagine, because you want to show the world how amazing you truly are. Kudos. You are clearly a genius among geniuses.

I'm not trying to argue with you, just let you know the method to my madness. I can see where you're coming from though. I just didn't think that it looked that way at all, but I guess it could come off that way. Apologies if it looked like I was trying to brag.

 

[littlealex]

Most top students didn't study in high school. You will learn proper studying habits quickly in college, or you will sink and get weeded out of PreMed.
So don't worry. Yes, the expectations and the material keeps getting higher and denser, but you will continue to adapt to the new levels of competition.

 

[paranoid_eyes]

going to upenn automatically increases your chances a little....

 

[[pj]]

Edit: Also, I'm not trying to brag at all, hence me not listing my GPA, but saying it isn't 4.0. It probably could have been, and was my first two years of college, but I'm the first to admit that my kryptonite is not caring about classes I'm only taking because I have to (and don't help me in getting to my goal other than fulfilling a graduation requirement).

But you have an mdapps in your signature... Is that accidentally there so we accidentally look at it and are accidentally amazed?

 

[decafplease]

college should be as easy as this question:

Okay - lay off with the pics, dude.

 

[191159]

Not to downplay this thread but you will find out how much you'll need to study very quickly. Some classes take more work then others, and it doesn't really get that difficult until the third or fourth year. If you're GPA dips within your first or second year, 9/10 times it is because of laziness. Like mine 🙂

 

[MattD]

I hear that premed is ridiculously difficult for even the smartest people,

It's not. Pre-med consists of the most basic coursework available in bio, physics, and chemistry. Plus whatever you choose to major in. People say it's sooo hard to a.) intimidate people not there yet, b.) impress people, and c.) justify why they're having such a hard time. The people complaining the hardest about the difficulty are the people making 98% on their exams. They're just naturally stress balls.

but that Med school is even harder. So.....say I struggle through premed and get into med school....if I had a hard time with pre-med, will it signal that i can't handle med school (since its supposedly so much harder)?

Med school is harder in the sense that the volume of material is greater and you have to incorporate large masses of information quickly in order to keep up. In terms of difficulty of comprehension, it's not hard. At all. It's just hard to REMEMBER all of it 🙂

Basically i'm asking....what should be my average stress level in undergrad? I sincerely don't want to study every hour of every day, i wanna do extracurriculars, have fun, etc.

You should have plenty of time to have fun, join clubs, play intramurals, go to parties, get laid, pickle your liver, etc. You'll have to actually study for many of your classes at this level, but not 24/7 by any stretch of the imagination.

While not many ppl follow this rule, I hear that 2 -4 hours of study time per credit hour is the amount of study time you should shoot for.

That's the generic line most universities will give you when asked about study time. It all depends on the course, the amount of studying needed, and the amount of problem solving required.

If you have to do more than that to do well then yous hould probably find a different carrer, IMO.

Your opinion is stupid. It's totally dependant on major and individual ability. If you're spending 16 hours per day, every day, just to stay afloat, then yeah, that's not going to work when the load increases in med school. But it's more likely that you need some academic counseling and study training to improve your efficiency than it is that that's your actual study-speed limit. You can train yourself to do better. But to suggest that someone who spends more than 45 hours per week during a 15 hour semester needs to 'find a different carrer (sic)' is a pretty smug and condescending thing to say, and it's certainly not accurate. I had a 14-16 hour semester (don't recall precisely) during which I had ochem II, ochem lab, energy systems design w/ lab, a mechanics course, and a tissue mechanics special topics course. Or something along those lines. You'd better believe I spend more than 60 hours per week including lecture and lab time that semester. I spent at LEAST the 2-3 hours per credit most semesters I was in school. However, I almost never spent 2-3 hours per credit on the pre-med stuff 🙂 Maybe I should find a different career.... I've made it through the first 2 years of med school, but I guess the part that's gonna crush me is still coming up.

How about finding a better way to help people out than putting your boot in the face of people just because they have to study a few hours more than you do. And save telling people to quit and find another career until you've at least managed to get into the career yourself. You're not a lock either, until you're done.

 

[MattD]

Second this. I was scholarship chair at my fraternity and 90% of my job was counsuling people to drop down to 12 hours. We generally found that when we could pursuade people to drop to 12 credits (hopefully very easy credits) they did well that semester and then they did well with normal course loads in subsequent semesters. When they insisted on taking 15, 18, or in once case 20 hours they tended to do badly, then shame spiral and do just as badly or worse the next semester.

Adapting to college should be treated as a 3 credit course, unless you pledge in which case it's a 5 credit course.

Is it possible they could have handled more than 12 hours if they, oh, I don't know, weren't being manipulated into being the on call designated driver for the entire frat 7 days per week, going to mandatory parties with mandatory drinking 3-4 days per week, and being generally abused by upperclassmen they foolishly felt the need to impress?

Sorry if your frat wasn't like that, but I saw WAY too many freshman abused during their pledge time, and it left a bad taste in my mouth. But then, I did go to a school with a MAJOR greek presence, so maybe they were just overboard compared to the rest of the country.

 

[SoxPatriots]

I was just like you - never picked up a book in a top high school and went to Penn.

Penn is sweet and my only advice is to make friends outside all the lame pre-meds. Most of them only get good grades because they work too hard and never have fun. College shouldn't be a problem for you, and if you just attend class you'll be fine (it took me a year to realize this).

My advice is get a good fake ID and head to Smokey Joe's Cafe as soon as you get to school. That will keep you away from the pre-meds who wont venture in that direction until theyre into med school senior year.

 

[coldweatherblue]

just have good study habits and you'll do fine.

I had horrible study habits and I still managed to get "average" matriculant numbers and get in.

Honestly college was an amazingly fun time for me and I don't regret not studying more. I worked 25-30hrs while in school and it still never really seemed "difficult."

I basically procrastinated everything until the last minute, then got into rockstar student mode and crammed. It depends on the class and what kind of student you are whether or not you can be successful with this method. Like for microbiology I would start studying a few hours before the test and often it wasn't enough time to learn all the random microbial stuff. But for o-chem I would start studying the day before and since o-chem is mostly conceptual and not rote-memorization, I would do fine on the tests.

basically my goal in college was to have as much fun as I could without screwing up my chances of getting into med school.

 

[ESzczesniak]

Undergrad is less about learning academics and more about being human. Go drink some and do well in some of your classes. If for no other reason than a lot can change in 4 years and you may not want to be a doctor when you graduate.

 

[dizzyorange]

Like the poster two posts above said, it all depends if you can go into rockstar student mode at will. If so, it'll be a breeze. Just cram before exams and you'll be fine.

 

[sunny1]

I wouldn't call college (or at least the standard premed prerequisites) hard. If you have decent professors, it's more so a matter of good time management to be sure you leave yourself enough time to study, do lots of practice problems, and always turn in homework/take small quizzes seriously in addition to doing well on exams.

And as other people have said, take it easy the first few semesters and don't overload yourself with classes. 12-15 credit hours (that includes 1-2 classes you might consider easy or not require too much effort for your skills) should be a good starting point. Better to do well with the average amount of classes in a semester than to find out too late that you can't handle 18+ credits and tank the GPA.

Do you have an idea of what you might like the major in?

 

[armybound]

once you get some good study habits down, college is not hard.

it's going to be hard for you at first though, since you have no study habits right now.

 

[Drogba]

College is entirely what you make of it. This is not just a cliche it is absolutely true. You can make it as hard or as easy as you want, though you will need a minimum performance to get into med school. If you find a subject that you are passionate about you will want to challenge yourself and not just breeze through the 4 years. Also it depends where your priorities lie. You have to decide what balance you want to strike between the academic and social aspects of college. Of course these don't always need to be mutually exclusive. If you are going to a school like Penn it would be a shame to not take advantage of everything they have to offer. If you come in with the mindset of "how can I make this as easy as possible" you are unlikely to do that.

 

[Lokhtar]

I found college extremely easy when I didn't do anything, and almost flunked out. Last two years, I got a 3.9 and the only difference was I went to class (no studying needed).

It depends on your major and college, but you certainly shouldn't be overtly stressed.

 

[Perrotfish]

Is it possible they could have handled more than 12 hours if they, oh, I don't know, weren't being manipulated into being the on call designated driver for the entire frat 7 days per week, going to mandatory parties with mandatory drinking 3-4 days per week, and being generally abused by upperclassmen they foolishly felt the need to impress?

Sorry if your frat wasn't like that, but I saw WAY too many freshman abused during their pledge time, and it left a bad taste in my mouth. But then, I did go to a school with a MAJOR greek presence, so maybe they were just overboard compared to the rest of the country.

No mandatory drinking, and a party was only mandatory if you drew the short straw and ended up being one of the two 'sober moniters' (generally happens once in a given pledge semester). I never drank at all, actually. When houses start making the drunken parts mandatory they're generally a year or two from being shut down. I actually found it was easier not to drink in the fraternity, since they were sort of stuck with you. In the dorms when they found out I didn't drink they started treating me like an RA, shutting the doors whenever I came by and they were drinking. I also don't think we 'abused' our associate members, again I think that's much more rare than you think. People don't stay Greek if it's making them unhappy.

It is true, though, that pledge period is supposed to invlove a lot of time, even if it doesn't involve a lot of stress. Basically you're supposed to be taking between 60-120 complete strangers and getting to know them well enough that you can consider them close friends, in one semester. That's a time intensive activity. Also you're right about DDing alot during your pledge semester.

However I do feel that Greek life makes up for it by being much more forgiving than other activities once you finish that first semester. I did about half a dozen other activities in college, and they all ended the same way: I would get into a really intense period in school, would miss a couple meetings/ practices/whatever because I have priorities, and would come back to find out I wasn't welcome. You can't miss practices and be part of the team. Greek life was the only fun, social activity that I found to be really compatible with a premed/engineering double major lifestyle where I would occasionally need to lock myself in the library for a night, week, or (in the case of the MCATs) a full semester.

As for my original point (that the people who did best were the people who did the least their first semester) I did see the same pattern in the dorms, though maybe to a lesser extent. Incoming HS kids should only take 12 credits, and they should take the easiest credits they can find. Maybe they can handle more, just like maybe they can handle drinking 5 nights a week, it's just that in my experience neither is a good plan.

 

[CHAINCHOMPER]

Pre-med life is a tough one to live, but as long as you can find the easy A classes, you'll be straight. Every school has tons of them w/ easy teachers, you need to find some good upperclassmen or ask your buddies which ones they are taking. College is MUCH more better than high school, you don't even HAVE to go to class😱. All you really have to do is take the exams/quizzes, write those papers, and let your teachers hand you your grade.

 

[Isoprop]

Hey everyone.

I'm a highschool senior who recently got accepted to University of Pennsylvania and I want to be a doctor. I hear that premed is ridiculously difficult for even the smartest people, but that Med school is even harder. So.....say I struggle through premed and get into med school....if I had a hard time with pre-med, will it signal that i can't handle med school (since its supposedly so much harder)?

Basically i'm asking....what should be my average stress level in undergrad? I sincerely don't want to study every hour of every day, i wanna do extracurriculars, have fun, etc. What's the maximum hours of studying that I should be doing before I realize that i'm just not cut out for it? I don't wanna find out that i can't cut it after its too late!

perhaps i'll give you some insight into my study habits now......basically high school is a joke....despite the fact that i'm in the 53rd best school in the country and have a 4.0 gpa, i study ZERO hours per week, do everything at the very last minute possible, and i do everything on about 4 hrs of sleep per night because i'm up talking on the phone or procrastinating on the web. basically my study habits SUCK TREMENDOUSLY.

and i'm not trying to brag because personally i don't think i'm all that smart, there are some certified geniuses at my school haha it scares me actually, seeing what i'm gonna be up against at penn...

anyway, the only class i actually study for is AP Chemistry...we have a chapter test about every other week, so i study the entire chapter and do all the practice problems on a saturday or sunday (takes about all day, 6 or 7 hrs at my local library) and i'm usually good to go from there. and i only started doing that because my grade slipped to a B.

okay so i figure that me coasting thru school with minimal effort will soon come to an end, but i don't wanna have one of those "rude awakenings" when i start college, i want to make sure i go in fully prepared to kill those premed courses with maximum efficiency, aka studying a whole lot, but in a way that i absorb information easily and understand it without having to be all stressed out like everybody says pre-med students are.

so, any tips, info, stories, study hints from successful premeds (if you're out there)....i wanna know exactly what i'm up against, maybe i'll be motivated to change my study habits or something, who knows lol.

part of college is learning how to study. as you take more and more classes, you're going to realize (at least i did) that studying hard and studying smart are two different things. so here's my advice.

learn to be flexible. a lot of people get fixated on one great study method that works... but the big secret is that what may work for say chemistry may not work for biology. so be flexible and experiment. find out what works for you FOR EACH TYPE OF CLASS.

in the beginning, go to class, even if it seems like it doesn't help. after a year or two of good grades, you will be better at judging which classes you don't have to attend (i.e. you're better off spending your time reading the slides/notes/book), but don't do this at least for the first year.

i highly recommend you not go into your courses with the "i'm going to knock this class out of the park" type of attitude. this may keep you motivated for the first few weeks but lemme tell you it won't last the four years of college. HUMBLE YOURSELF. you're here to gain some appreciation about science and hopefully learn something new. this approach will serve you well in subsequent classes, on the mcat, and into medical school.

finally, have a well-balanced college experience. don't make any enemies even with people you don't like. be charitable to your peers but never at a significant cost to yourself. don't make stupid mistakes with drugs, alcohol, and academic dishonesty. peer pressure is a powerful thing... even among older and mature adults.

 

[ChubbyChaser]

Your opinion is stupid. It's totally dependant on major and individual ability. If you're spending 16 hours per day, every day, just to stay afloat, then yeah, that's not going to work when the load increases in med school. But it's more likely that you need some academic counseling and study training to improve your efficiency than it is that that's your actual study-speed limit. You can train yourself to do better. But to suggest that someone who spends more than 45 hours per week during a 15 hour semester needs to 'find a different carrer (sic)' is a pretty smug and condescending thing to say, and it's certainly not accurate. I had a 14-16 hour semester (don't recall precisely) during which I had ochem II, ochem lab, energy systems design w/ lab, a mechanics course, and a tissue mechanics special topics course. Or something along those lines. You'd better believe I spend more than 60 hours per week including lecture and lab time that semester. I spent at LEAST the 2-3 hours per credit most semesters I was in school. However, I almost never spent 2-3 hours per credit on the pre-med stuff 🙂 Maybe I should find a different career.... I've made it through the first 2 years of med school, but I guess the part that's gonna crush me is still coming up.

How about finding a better way to help people out than putting your boot in the face of people just because they have to study a few hours more than you do. And save telling people to quit and find another career until you've at least managed to get into the career yourself. You're not a lock either, until you're done.

Dude, Give me a break. If you have to spend more than 60 hours a week studying for 12-15 credits of first year classes such as basic bio, gen chem, algebra or whatever, then how are you supposed to make it through medical school or even get into medical school? There wont be a spare minute in your day.

I dont think my comment was any more "smug or condescending" then your personal attack on me.

 

[tf2medic]

it's not bad at all. it's the upper science classes that are harder, if anything. the premed courses aren't bad and are basic, which is why they are required to take higher sciences. 🙂 as for the upper level classes, they're just harder b/c they throw more info at you. they aren't harder intellectually but, at least for me, definitely need better study habits for upper classes than the basic premed ones. premed ones are cake, especially if you had exposure to them in high school. honestly, i think a high schooler having taken IB/AP chem, bio, and physics can do almost as well on the MCAT as some premed taking the premed requirements in college. they're the same material except for ochem, and the mcat doesn't even have much ochem on it.

 

[aaj117]

You should be working hard, there will be nothing easy about it. The way you know whether or not it's for you is that you're still happy and able to balance your life. If it's ridiculously hard, you spend 24/7 studying, have no friends, don't party, don't join extracurriculars, etc, then it's not at all for you. But, if you work your butt off and still find the time to go out and do things you enjoy and explore other interests, then you can handle med school.

 

[tf2medic]

okay about that guy everyone is bashing. i agree with everyone. he's an idiot. he's also a history/humanities major. that's why he can more easily not do **** all week till the test day. but also, since he is a history major, history requires TONS of reading which cannot be read THE MORNING OF THE TEST. so he is a liar or Rutger's history program is a huge joke. and yes as far as i know Rutger's is a community college. haha you were like "last time i checked Rutger's wasn't a CC." is that supposed to impress everyone? i've heard of the name, nothing else. doesn't mean anything to me.

ahh, owning arrogant premed douches is sooo tight.

 

[45408]

College is MUCH more better than high school, you don't even HAVE to go to class😱.

Unless you want to sit in the back and snicker at the professor.

 

[uzybear]

i really don't dig on all the pressure, expectations, and anxiety concerning testing; i much prefer an environment focused on the passion of learning, rather than "achievement"

 

[Esviel]

Thank you all for your great advice!

So basically, what I'm gathering is that the general consensus is to take the minimum credit hours necessary during my first semester, and take the easiest courses/professors.

Now, don't get me wrong, I by no means intend to skate through college, but I want to minimize my study time so that I can devote as much time as possible to research/volunteer/extracurricular activities (and maybe get some partying in there every once in a while too hahaha). Taking only 12-15 hours sounds like a good plan.

I have no clue what the hell I want to major in. Another thing that factors into what I major in is the fact that Penn groups people together in dorms based on their major. If I major in something like biology or chemistry and am housed with a bunch of other premeds, what will life be like as opposed to me being the only premed living around other English majors? Are humanities majors easier than science majors? I'm the type of guy who can bull**** an epic paper hours before its due, btw....but this is highschool hahaha, i might not be able to get away with it in college.

And biology.....well it was so ridiculously easy the first time around that i didn't even bother to take the AP (had to choose either ap bio or ap chem) because all it was was reading the chapter and remembering what happened.....i might as well have been reading a novel but with a bunch of scientific vocab words lol. Bio tests were not too much more than reading comprehension tests. What's college bio like?

Oh, and another thing: I take AP Chemistry now, and I'm pretty confident that I am going to get a 5 on the AP test....now, if I do get a 5, then will I automatically get college credit for it or do I have the option to choose whether to apply that credit? I ask this because I hear that med schools do not take AP credit as a replacement for the prerequisites, so If I were to take the Chem AP test, then how would I fill the prerequisite in college? Take a higher level chemistry class? And if that is the case, will that be desirable? Or should I just not even take the chem AP test at all and re-take general chemistry (basically guaranteeing me an A)? I mean, I want to take the AP test because i feel like i have to prove that i can score well on college level stuff but i just don't want it to actually count for anything.

And I don't know if there's a major greek presence at penn but if so, and I joined, would it significantly cut into my research/extracurricular/volunteer time? And even if it did so a little bit, will the party time I gain be worth it?

 

[Drogba]

Thank you all for your great advice!

So basically, what I'm gathering is that the general consensus is to take the minimum credit hours necessary during my first semester, and take the easiest courses/professors.

Now, don't get me wrong, I by no means intend to skate through college, but I want to minimize my study time so that I can devote as much time as possible to research/volunteer/extracurricular activities (and maybe get some partying in there every once in a while too hahaha). Taking only 12-15 hours sounds like a good plan.

I have no clue what the hell I want to major in. Another thing that factors into what I major in is the fact that Penn groups people together in dorms based on their major. If I major in something like biology or chemistry and am housed with a bunch of other premeds, what will life be like as opposed to me being the only premed living around other English majors? Are humanities majors easier than science majors? I'm the type of guy who can bull**** an epic paper hours before its due, btw....but this is highschool hahaha, i might not be able to get away with it in college.

Are you sure this is mandatory?

And biology.....well it was so ridiculously easy the first time around that i didn't even bother to take the AP (had to choose either ap bio or ap chem) because all it was was reading the chapter and remembering what happened.....i might as well have been reading a novel but with a bunch of scientific vocab words lol. Bio tests were not too much more than reading comprehension tests. What's college bio like?

College classes are completely different than highschool. But you'll see when you get there, enjoy your time before school starts. No need to hear about what you will be living in just a few months. 🙂

Oh, and another thing: I take AP Chemistry now, and I'm pretty confident that I am going to get a 5 on the AP test....now, if I do get a 5, then will I automatically get college credit for it or do I have the option to choose whether to apply that credit? I ask this because I hear that med schools do not take AP credit as a replacement for the prerequisites, so If I were to take the Chem AP test, then how would I fill the prerequisite in college? Take a higher level chemistry class? And if that is the case, will that be desirable? Or should I just not even take the chem AP test at all and re-take general chemistry (basically guaranteeing me an A)? I mean, I want to take the AP test because i feel like i have to prove that i can score well on college level stuff but i just don't want it to actually count for anything.

And I don't know if there's a major greek presence at penn but if so, and I joined, would it significantly cut into my research/extracurricular/volunteer time? And even if it did so a little bit, will the party time I gain be worth it?

Take Gen Chem even if you have ap credit.

One last piece of advice, don't make up your mind on your major right away and really explore some other career paths before setting yourself on medicine. You never know what you are going to like.

I entered college thinking I wanted to major in bio but I quickly decided that going in to medicine with a pure science background would give me tunnel vision in thinking about health. I was and am much more interested in expanding my perception beyond a purely biomedical/treatment/pathways model of health care. You owe it to yourself to expose yourself to alternative ways of thinking about health and disease even if you decide you want to do the straight science path.

 

[Perrotfish]

And I don't know if there's a major greek presence at penn but if so, and I joined, would it significantly cut into my research/extracurricular/volunteer time? And even if it did so a little bit, will the party time I gain be worth it?

It will eat up the vast majority of your time your first (pledge) semester. After that no, it shouldn't make a major dent into your study/reserach/extracirricular time unless you choose to spend that time volunteering with your fraternity. Whether or not it's worth it depends on how much you enjoy what you see: if you get a bad feeling about Greek life from either rush of your pledge semester then don't do it, if you like it then it's probably worth it.

humanities majors easier than science majors?

 

[Perrotfish]

And I don't know if there's a major greek presence at penn but if so, and I joined, would it significantly cut into my research/extracurricular/volunteer time? And even if it did so a little bit, will the party time I gain be worth it?

It will eat up the vast majority of your time your first (pledge) semester. After that no, it shouldn't make a major dent into your study/reserach/extracirricular time unless you choose to spend that time working/volunteering/partying with your fraternity. Whether or not it's worth it depends on how much you enjoy what you see: if you get a bad feeling about Greek life from either rush of your pledge semester then don't do it, if you like it then it's probably worth it.

humanities majors easier than science majors?

Most people seeem to feel so (though some can't stand the humanities). However keep in mind that the further you go from Biology/Biochemistry the more extra credits you're probably going to need to take to fulfill the premed requirements, not to mention the 'recommended' prememd coursework like physiology, cell biology, and Biochemistry.