How important is Shelf COMAT Grades to residency application?

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KeikoTanaka

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Do residencies even see these grades? Does "Honors" only matter if you are applying to said specialty?

Does any of it matter if you just do well on Step 2?

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This is complicated and dependent on your specialty you are pursing and some other factors.

You should contact your school to determine how and what clerkship grades go on your MSPE to get the ball rolling. You should also figure out how you even honor rotations at your school. It varies greatly.

Residencies see your MSPE. Honors in clerkships matter for some specialties but not all. Step 2 matters more than all of that.

There's more of course but this will get the convo started.
 
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This is complicated and dependent on your specialty you are pursing and some other factors.

You should contact your school to determine how and what clerkship grades go on your MSPE to get the ball rolling. You should also figure out how you even honor rotations at your school. It varies greatly.

Residences see your MSPE. Honors in clerkships matter for some specialties but not all. Step 2 matters more than all of that.

There's more of course but this will get the convo started.

The fact it's so school dependent is really weird. Also one of the reasons I don't think they should even bother listing them. You should show basic competency, as a way for the school to know you won't fail the COMLEX miserably, but it just seems quite arbitrary one Honor means something to someone else. But thank you, I will have to see what my school says.
 
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The fact it's so school dependent is really weird. Also one of the reasons I don't think they should even bother listing them. You should show basic competency, as a way for the school to know you won't fail the COMLEX miserably, but it just seems quite arbitrary one Honor means something to someone else. But thank you, I will have to see what my school says.
3rd year grades are strange and there are several mentalities people have toward them with good results. It all depends on how grades are determined to decide how you want to expend your energy. In some schools it doesn't make any sense to even attempt to achieve honors so time is better spent elsewhere on research and learning things that are important for future practice but not for comats or boards. OR, like a decent chunk of students do, just barely study during third year and pass your rotations and enjoy your year... I know if I was applying to FM or something I wouldn't have worked even half as hard as I did third year like a lot of my classmates.

Some school's MSPEs contain contextual information that help identify whether most students honor a specific rotation or not. This helps PDs determine how to view your grade. Also, you have to remember there are some trends to see from your 3rd year grades based on the written evaluation comments. Look, I completely admit that 3rd year grades can definitely be about luck and a crapshoot, but the idea is that your 3rd year information ideally tells a narrative for your growth during your intro into clinical medicine. Also, we have to stratify people somehow. Everyone is always wanting to take any way of stratifying people out just because something isn't a perfectly objective measure. It's just not practical unfortunately.

Competency on the wards has nothing to do with failing comlex. The worst test taker at your school will likely pass their rotations fine. The bar to fail a rotation is incredibly low and you will not be prepared for boards if you just go based on your preceptors' comments saying you showed up on time, weren't rude and answered some pimp questions correctly lol. Hell, to fail a comat at most schools is almost unheard of due to the score one needs to fail.

What I mean by some honors mattering is that some specialties have a trend. Surgery cares about honors in surgery. Radiology ideally wants honors in medicine and surgery. Medicine wants honors in medicine. It's not a big deal but it helps. Getting a pass isn't a bad thing by any means and doesn't really hurt you. It just doesn't help you.

All of this ties in to your original question regarding comats. If comats make up most of your grade then by default they matter a lot. In that case, you should be happy because it means you can control your own destiny and aren't going to be as worried about getting 3-bombed by some douchebag attending/resident even if you are doing awesome on the wards. There is no excuse not to score well on comats other than deciding it doesn't matter because you can't really achieve honors due to the evaluation system.

If you haven't, I suggest your check out the NRMP program director survery for your specialty to see the importance of boards, third year grades, research etc. in interviewing and ranking applicants. Maybe your specialty and goal program type (community vs academic) doesn't really emphasize third year grades. Who knows.
 
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3rd year grades are strange and there are several mentalities people have toward them with good results. It all depends on how grades are determined to decide how you want to expend your energy. In some schools it doesn't make any sense to even attempt to achieve honors so time is better spent elsewhere on research and learning things that are important for future practice but not for comats or boards. OR, like a decent chunk of students do, just barely study during third year and pass your rotations and enjoy your year... I know if I was applying to FM or something I wouldn't have worked even half as hard as I did third year like a lot of my classmates.

Some school's MSPEs contain contextual information that help identify whether most students honor a specific rotation or not. This helps PDs determine how to view your grade. Also, you have to remember there are some trends to see from your 3rd year grades based on the written evaluation comments. Look, I completely admit that 3rd year grades can definitely be about luck and a crapshoot, but the idea is that your 3rd year information ideally tells a narrative for your growth during your intro into clinical medicine. Also, we have to stratify people somehow. Everyone is always wanting to take any way of stratifying people out just because something isn't a perfectly objective measure. It's just not practical unfortunately.

Competency on the wards has nothing to do with failing comlex. The worst test taker at your school will likely pass their rotations fine. The bar to fail a rotation is incredibly low and you will not be prepared for boards if you just go based on your preceptors' comments saying you showed up on time, weren't rude and answered some pimp questions correctly lol. Hell, to fail a comat at most schools is almost unheard of due to the score one needs to fail.

What I mean by some honors mattering is that some specialties have a trend. Surgery cares about honors in surgery. Radiology ideally wants honors in medicine and surgery. Medicine wants honors in medicine. It's not a big deal but it helps. Getting a pass isn't a bad thing by any means and doesn't really hurt you. It just doesn't help you.

All of this ties in to your original question regarding comats. If comats make up most of your grade then by default they matter a lot. In that case, you should be happy because it means you can control your own destiny and aren't going to be as worried about getting 3-bombed by some douchebag attending/resident even if you are doing awesome on the wards. There is no excuse not to score well on comats other than deciding it doesn't matter because you can't really achieve honors due to the evaluation system.

If you haven't, I suggest your check out the NRMP program director survery for your specialty to see the importance of boards, third year grades, research etc. in interviewing and ranking applicants. Maybe your specialty and goal program type (community vs academic) doesn't really emphasize third year grades. Who knows.

Thank you for the thoughtful response. I did "okay" on my first COMAT exam, but not as well as I wanted because I was simultaneously studying for STEP 1 given it was pushed back in light of COVID. Which is why I asked, because I passed, but not by the amount I wanted/what I usually do performance-wise. I just wanted to know how much it'd hurt me that I didn't get honors. It wasn't in the specialty I wanted anyways, so I'm not that much concerned about it, but I'd just like to know in general how these things are perceived. Plus, since I don't think raw scores are published by the NBOME, I'm nervous that my "slightly below average performance" was due to everyone being at home cheating on their exams, which I didn't do.... but if I'm now being compared to those who are on uptodate, it'll make the bar much higher for honors on the COMATs, which is why I asked. I feel like COVID effed up a lot with rotations, our expectations, and how much energy we can put into them if some people (like many I know) have not yet completed their first round of boards and are trying to juggle everything.
 
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