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I just watched a lifestyle video on the specialty. It looks demanding and you always have someone's life on the line, so why is it road?
ROAD are for "controlled" lifestyle specialties, not necessarily due to the daily demands of the specialty itself.I just watched a lifestyle video on the specialty. It looks demanding and you always have someone's life on the line, so why is it road?
ROAD are for "controlled" lifestyle specialties, not necessarily due to the daily demands of the specialty itself.
http://yalemedicine.yale.edu/autumn2007/features/feature/51534
Anesthesiology tends to have more "controlled" hours, and once you're done, you're done. No pager kept on you when you go home, no actual patients that you have of your own, etc.
EM as a specialty is very young and it's growth is likely after the ROAD acronym became dogma.So why is EM left off the list?
ROAD is a 40+ year old acronym, cemented into history in House of God.
Lots of things have changed since then.
Every 6-8 months someone will post a suggestion of how it should be "modified" or asking why XXX lifestyle field isn't included.
man, for anyone wanting to do EM, there's a thread on the EM forums that is just the most depressing stuff you can read.
read that and then think whether or not EM is a lifestyle specialty.
The things that knock fields out of the realm of sweetness are control over lifestyle and compensation per hour of labor. For EM it's the control issue. It should be noted that when jailors and torturers want to break down the psyche of their prisoners step 1 is removing all control the prisoner has over themselves and their environment.
Oh geez... that book again? I should probably suck it up and read it. Every time I try, I just can't get into it.
For the record, I don't think EM should be part of the awesome-lifestyle club. I just offered it up as a foil. I figured there had to be more to the criteria than just controlled hours, lack of pager, etc.
Didn't know it was a book reference...
(hint, it's not)
EM is, perhaps, the cause of many other specialty's lack of control. You think you have your day all planned out, then *bam* a consult from the ED, followed by *bam* another, and another and another!
Oh geez... that book again? I should probably suck it up and read it. Every time I try, I just can't get into it.
For the record, I don't think EM should be part of the awesome-lifestyle club. I just offered it up as a foil. I figured there had to be more to the criteria than just controlled hours, lack of pager, etc.
Didn't know it was a book reference...
(hint, it's not)
EM is, perhaps, the cause of many other specialty's lack of control. You think you have your day all planned out, then *bam* a consult from the ED, followed by *bam* another, and another and another!
They sound like a bunch of crybabies. Average EM physician only works 1700 hours a year or so. I worked swing shift 40-50 hours a week and it wasn't that bad, and I had coworkers who were in their 50s and 60s pulling the same hours.man, for anyone wanting to do EM, there's a thread on the EM forums that is just the most depressing stuff you can read.
read that and then think whether or not EM is a lifestyle specialty.
They sound like a bunch of crybabies. Average EM physician only works 1700 hours a year or so. I worked swing shift 40-50 hours a week and it wasn't that bad, and I had coworkers who were in their 50s and 60s pulling the same hours.
1700/48 = 35 hours a week with 4 weeks of vacation.Yeah, because working 40-50 hours as an emergency physician is analogous to working 40-50 hours at whatever job you used to do.
You should probably refrain from these kind of judgements as you haven't even started medical school yet.
This is normal for EM, 35-37 hr work weeks. According to residents and attendings around these forums, that is plenty of hours. There is a reason it is that way....Just saying I haven't even started med school.1700/48 = 35 hours a week with 4 weeks of vacation.
1700/48 = 35 hours a week with 4 weeks of vacation.
They sound like a bunch of crybabies. Average EM physician only works 1700 hours a year or so. I worked swing shift 40-50 hours a week and it wasn't that bad, and I had coworkers who were in their 50s and 60s pulling the same hours.
They sound like a bunch of crybabies. Average EM physician only works 1700 hours a year or so. I worked swing shift 40-50 hours a week and it wasn't that bad, and I had coworkers who were in their 50s and 60s pulling the same hours.
Do you really think I worked harder or dealt with the same level of stress in those 80 hours than an EP in 35-40? Have you ever spent any significant amount of time in an ED doing something other than volunteering/shadowing, or are you just bored and trolling?
If you look at the Yale article, they've updated it to E-ROAD.So why is EM left off the list?
man, for anyone wanting to do EM, there's a thread on the EM forums that is just the most depressing stuff you can read.
read that and then think whether or not EM is a lifestyle specialty.
Which one? The threads discussing CMGs or the "Medicine sucks" (i.e. "Congrats... your scan came back and your cancer decided to vacation in your brain") thread?
I didn't say the job wasn't hard, I said the hours weren't bad. Working 35 hours a week on shift is a great lifestyle even if you're going balls to the wall 100% productivity for those 35 hours. I don't know about you, but I don't like being at work if I don't have to be. I'd rather work myself to the bone for 35 hours than work the typical pace of other specialties for 50-60 hours a week. If you enjoy EM, the lifestyle is unmatched.
Were you working the entire 40-50 hours? It seems those guys don't even get a chance to piss the entire shift.They sound like a bunch of crybabies. Average EM physician only works 1700 hours a year or so. I worked swing shift 40-50 hours a week and it wasn't that bad, and I had coworkers who were in their 50s and 60s pulling the same hours.
I didn't say the job wasn't hard, I said the hours weren't bad. Working 35 hours a week on shift is a great lifestyle even if you're going balls to the wall 100% productivity for those 35 hours. I don't know about you, but I don't like being at work if I don't have to be. I'd rather work myself to the bone for 35 hours than work the typical pace of other specialties for 50-60 hours a week. If you enjoy EM, the lifestyle is unmatched.
Were you working the entire 40-50 hours? It seems those guys don't even get a chance to piss the entire shift.
What are the pathways to get to trauma surgery? Could you do it through EM?
noWhat are the pathways to get to trauma surgery? Could you do it through EM?
This comment is a breath of fresh air, specially after hearing all the doom and gloom going on at the anesthesiology forum...The referenced "book" by S. Shem, is dated, but if you can't get into it, don't wast your time. Much of the material is dated. Just a note on anesthesiology as a specialty choice: A fair number of folks move into pain management. This isn't for everyone, but it is an option. A few of my friends (over 60) are still practicing—imagine that—and they're having the time of their life. Pain practice as an anesthesiologist offers a nice mix of the intellectual challenges of medicine with evolving procedures. The downside is on the regulatory side, but Pain Medicine is truly fascinating, and the opportunities in private practice will continue to thrive—despite the ACA.
Well the ones that are over 60 enjoying themselves are close to retirement and won't be affected.This comment is a breath of fresh air, specially after hearing all the doom and gloom going on at the anesthesiology forum...
Well the ones that are over 60 enjoying themselves are close to retirement and won't be affected.
I'm shocked too that they're doing that. As if the CRNA threat isn't enough of a PIA.Not affected? More like they're the ones that are selling out the new generation and the profession for golden parachutes into retirement. "Hey give us 4 years and we'll make you a partner. Just kidding, we'll take 3 years of your life and turn you into an employee while getting rich off your labor."
Not affected? More like they're the ones that are selling out the new generation and the profession for golden parachutes into retirement. "Hey give us 4 years and we'll make you a partner. Just kidding, we'll take 3 years of your life and turn you into an employee while getting rich off your labor."
They don't owe you anything, but I'm sure your sense of entitlement will serve you well throughout life.Not affected? More like they're the ones that are selling out the new generation and the profession for golden parachutes into retirement. "Hey give us 4 years and we'll make you a partner. Just kidding, we'll take 3 years of your life and turn you into an employee while getting rich off your labor."
It's not just the medical profession. The baby boomers have leeched off the country in every sector and made our generation pay the price. They have been spoiled from their very beginnings as the product of a prosperous post-war environment and subsequently enjoyed affordable education, housing, and favorable labor and equity markets. They have raped our country of natural resources, sold us out to foreign nations, turned America into a third rate superpower, pushed all of us away from actual productive careers into service industries, saddled us with debt (rather forced it down our throats), and basically turned us into a nation of effeminate pansies effectively neutered and unable to accomplish anything in life under the threat of constant litigation or political retribution at work if we step out of line or try to take measures to better ourselves. They inherited the wealth of their parents after leading self-centered lives and used it to invest in themselves driving up to cost of real estate and education making it virtually unaffordable for anyone who missed the train that left decades ago and ensuring that the vast majority of young people will never be able to achieve what they did in financial security through guaranteed pensions and appreciated real estate. They will continue sucking everything they can off us until they are dead all the while continuing to criticize us and label us as entitled all along the way.
It's not just the medical profession. The baby boomers have leeched off the country in every sector and made our generation pay the price. They have been spoiled from their very beginnings as the product of a prosperous post-war environment and subsequently enjoyed affordable education, housing, and favorable labor and equity markets. They have raped our country of natural resources, sold us out to foreign nations, turned America into a third rate superpower, pushed all of us away from actual productive careers into service industries, saddled us with debt (rather forced it down our throats), and basically turned us into a nation of effeminate pansies effectively neutered and unable to accomplish anything in life under the threat of constant litigation or political retribution at work if we step out of line or try to take measures to better ourselves. They inherited the wealth of their parents after leading self-centered lives and used it to invest in themselves driving up to cost of real estate and education making it virtually unaffordable for anyone who missed the train that left decades ago and ensuring that the vast majority of young people will never be able to achieve what they did in financial security through guaranteed pensions and appreciated real estate. They will continue sucking everything they can off us until they are dead all the while continuing to criticize us and label us as entitled all along the way.
It's not just the medical profession. The baby boomers have leeched off the country in every sector and made our generation pay the price. They have been spoiled from their very beginnings as the product of a prosperous post-war environment and subsequently enjoyed affordable education, housing, and favorable labor and equity markets. They have raped our country of natural resources, sold us out to foreign nations, turned America into a third rate superpower, pushed all of us away from actual productive careers into service industries, saddled us with debt (rather forced it down our throats), and basically turned us into a nation of effeminate pansies effectively neutered and unable to accomplish anything in life under the threat of constant litigation or political retribution at work if we step out of line or try to take measures to better ourselves. They inherited the wealth of their parents after leading self-centered lives and used it to invest in themselves driving up to cost of real estate and education making it virtually unaffordable for anyone who missed the train that left decades ago and ensuring that the vast majority of young people will never be able to achieve what they did in financial security through guaranteed pensions and appreciated real estate. They will continue sucking everything they can off us until they are dead all the while continuing to criticize us and label us as entitled all along the way.
THIS. THIS. THIS. Quite disgusting IMHO.It's not just the medical profession. The baby boomers have leeched off the country in every sector and made our generation pay the price. They have been spoiled from their very beginnings as the product of a prosperous post-war environment and subsequently enjoyed affordable education, housing, and favorable labor and equity markets. They have raped our country of natural resources, sold us out to foreign nations, turned America into a third rate superpower, pushed all of us away from actual productive careers into service industries, saddled us with debt (rather forced it down our throats), and basically turned us into a nation of effeminate pansies effectively neutered and unable to accomplish anything in life under the threat of constant litigation or political retribution at work if we step out of line or try to take measures to better ourselves. They inherited the wealth of their parents after leading self-centered lives and used it to invest in themselves driving up to cost of real estate and education making it virtually unaffordable for anyone who missed the train that left decades ago and ensuring that the vast majority of young people will never be able to achieve what they did in financial security through guaranteed pensions and appreciated real estate. They will continue sucking everything they can off us until they are dead all the while continuing to criticize us and label us as entitled all along the way.
They don't owe you anything, but I'm sure your sense of entitlement will serve you well throughout life.
Everyone wants to reap the benefits of owning a successful practice but no one wants to take on the risk. People like Psai think they're entitled to something just because the practice was bought out 2 years into a 3 year track? Well, tough ****. No one is entitled to partnership or a steady job. The partners are free to do whatever falls under the contract, and no one held a gun to his head when he signed it.You're knocking it out of the park in this thread. Somebody's been listening to that "How to Win Friends and Influence People" audiobook on the way to organic chem class.
You don't know the things that you don't know about the context of the senior generation of anesthesiologists and the ASA (and lots of specialties) not protecting the longer term interests of their specialties. Please just disengage from this one. It's not a nail for your usual class-warfare hammer.Everyone wants to reap the benefits of owning a successful practice but no one wants to take on the risk. People like Psai think they're entitled to something just because the practice was bought out 2 years into a 3 year track? Well, tough ****. No one is entitled to partnership or a steady job. The partners are free to do whatever falls under the contract, and no one held a gun to his head when he signed it.
Funny how these guys bitch about the government ruining medicine but in the same breath want to bleed the practice owners dry.
They don't owe you anything, but I'm sure your sense of entitlement will serve you well throughout life.
Hope he has the same attitude as a resident.You're knocking it out of the park in this thread. Somebody's been listening to that "How to Win Friends and Influence People" audiobook on the way to organic chem class.
Hope he has the same attitude as a resident.
Sorry, I forgot that starting a practice in the 1980s or 1990s was a 0% down, risk-free endeavor.You don't know the things that you don't know about the context of the senior generation of anesthesiologists and the ASA (and lots of specialties) not protecting the longer term interests of their specialties. Please just disengage from this one. It's not a nail for your usual class-warfare hammer.