watermen

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Anyone applying for Jefferson Medical School? Anyone studying there?

I would like to know how is this school rated? I mean how is it actually like? It is ranked in the top 50. What do you all think about this school?
 

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watermen said:
Anyone applying for Jefferson Medical School? Anyone studying there?

I would like to know how is this school rated? I mean how is it actually like? It is ranked in the top 50. What do you all think about this school?
It's bottom of the heap. Remember, don't kid yourself. School that ranks near the 50s are not really in the 50s. They are more like 90 or 100 out of 125 due to many schools being repeat.
 
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watermen

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xadmin said:
It's bottom of the heap. Remember, don't kid yourself. School that ranks near the 50s are not really in the 50s. They are more like 90 or 100 out of 125 due to many schools being repeat.
90 or 100 out of 125...is it really that low?

Is this school considered a low tier school? (sorry, really no offend)

When it comes to residency, how will those PDs look at student from this school? Are they highly regarded or..... :confused:
 

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xadmin said:
It's bottom of the heap. Remember, don't kid yourself. School that ranks near the 50s are not really in the 50s. They are more like 90 or 100 out of 125 due to many schools being repeat.
It's called the top 50 for a reason - there are only 50 schools. If you look carefully enough at the ratings, you'll realize that schools are not repeated - they may tie for spots (so let's say that Penn and Hopkins tie for #2 - that takes up the second and third spots) - so if Jeff ranks near the 50s, thats exactly where it is. Jefferson is not considered a low tier school - it is very well known, partly because of its huge class - thus, everywhere you go throughout the country, jefferson grads are found.
 
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watermen

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BubbleWand1 said:
It's called the top 50 for a reason - there are only 50 schools. If you look carefully enough at the ratings, you'll realize that schools are not repeated - they may tie for spots (so let's say that Penn and Hopkins tie for #2 - that takes up the second and third spots) - so if Jeff ranks near the 50s, thats exactly where it is. Jefferson is not considered a low tier school - it is very well known, partly because of its huge class - thus, everywhere you go throughout the country, jefferson grads are found.
sound like it is just quantity...not quality....sad...

by the way, how do jefferson's grads perform? I mean are they favourable when compare to those ranked higher? What is the prospect of getting a competitive residency? or just base on USMLE..?
 

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watermen said:
sound like it is just quantity...not quality....sad...

by the way, how do jefferson's grads perform? I mean are they favourable when compare to those ranked higher? What is the prospect of getting a competitive residency? or just base on USMLE..?
No, Jefferson is a back up and safety school. They are in no ways compared to those ranked higher. Getting a competitive residency and USMLE is based on you, not so much as the school.
 

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Umm i was under the impression that Jefferson has a 3% acceptance rate. How does that make it a safety school?
 

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jefferson is a great school with great alumni and very good residency placements. I dont think you know what you are talking about.
 

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nycmed8 said:
Umm i was under the impression that Jefferson has a 3% acceptance rate. How does that make it a safety school?

3% means squat when you can't attract top students.
 

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watermen said:
sound like it is just quantity...not quality....sad...

by the way, how do jefferson's grads perform? I mean are they favourable when compare to those ranked higher? What is the prospect of getting a competitive residency? or just base on USMLE..?
if you interviewed at jefferson, they handed you a match list in the interview folder. or, call up the office and find out what percentage of students applying to X competitive residency end up matching. Or, perhaps even more quickly, find out what percent of students DON"T match (usually, the only students who don't match anywhere are the ones applying to competitive residencies).

This is somewhat of a silly question since every medical school turns out specialists. Some schools turn out more than other schools do, but what you make out of your medical education is really up to you.
 

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Also, to give you an idea of Jefferson's peers, (and since every one here seems to be obsessed with U.S. News rankings...), some of the other schools ranked along with jefferson in 40-50 are (in no particular order):

Boston University
Brown University
Tufts University
Univ. of Florida
Wake Forest
Georgetown
Univ. of Cinci
Univ. of Maryland
Univ. of Utah
UC Davis
 
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watermen

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nycmed8 said:
Umm i was under the impression that Jefferson has a 3% acceptance rate. How does that make it a safety school?
would you mind to explain the concept of acceptance rate of a medical school to me, I am not familiar with this. What is deemed good acceptance rate? Is it easy to get into Jefferson compare to other at the same ranking or higher?
 

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3% means squat when you can't attract top students.
Their average MCAT is a 32. Dr. Roberto Gallo, co-discoverer of the AIDS virus is a Jefferson grad.

Researchers at the Jefferson Cancer Institute led b y Carlo Croce, M.D., found a genetic cause of certain types of leukemia in 1992. Croce earlier identified the involvement of the C-myc oncogene in Burkitt's lymphoma. He is one of the dozen most cited scientists in the world.
(from The Jefferson Medical College Alumni Bulletin)

Yeah, it sounds like Jefferson is just full of screw-ups. Who do you think you are anyway? Oh, nevermind, i just looked at your other posts. You're just another Californian with a stick up your @ss because you couldn't get into your state schools. and don't even both lying and saying that you got into harvard, duke, or whatever other top tier school you can imagine yourself at because we all know you're full of sh1t.
 

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Dr Turninkoff said:
Their average MCAT is a 32. Dr. Roberto Gallo, co-discoverer of the AIDS virus is a Jefferson grad.

Researchers at the Jefferson Cancer Institute led b y Carlo Croce, M.D., found a genetic cause of certain types of leukemia in 1992. Croce earlier identified the involvement of the C-myc oncogene in Burkitt's lymphoma. He is one of the dozen most cited scientists in the world.
(from The Jefferson Medical College Alumni Bulletin)

Yeah, it sounds like Jefferson is just full of screw-ups. Who do you think you are anyway? Oh, nevermind, i just looked at your other posts. You're just another Californian with a stick up your @ss because you couldn't get into your state schools. and don't even both lying and saying that you got into harvard, duke, or whatever other top tier school you can imagine yourself at because we all know you're full of sh1t.

Funny, you can't defend against my claim and must resort to personal attack. Lol, I made you mad without personally attacking you? I am good. DAMN. Jefferson medical school is for reject from other schools.
 

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Funny, you can't defend against my claim and must resort to personal attack. Lol, I made you mad without personally attacking you? I am good. DAMN. Jefferson medical school is for reject from other schools.
Their average MCAT score is higher than the average for the only school that I saw you were accepted to.
 

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maybe his hatred is misguided bitterness towards jefferson. :D
 
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watermen

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Sorry, I don't mean to start a quarrel here.

I just want to know how is Jefferson, I know nothing about medical schools, but may want to apply. How about Brown University? How about Canadian medical schools? Like Calgary, Dalhousie, etc...Which one is better?
 

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honestly....have you even looked into Jefferson seriously. It's a really good school with a long tradition of excellence. If you look at their graduate match list, students get good residencies. To be honest, I've gotten into a handful of schools and Jefferson is probably where I'll end up going (despite what www.usnews.com tells me to do). Furthermore, the staff at the school is the friendliest that I've seen and the students I met all seemed pretty happy and friendly. Why the hell are you so bitter? Sounds like someone got rejected by Jefferson......it's ok

xadmin said:
3% means squat when you can't attract top students.
 

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No, Jefferson is a back up and safety school. They are in no ways compared to those ranked higher. Getting a competitive residency and USMLE is based on you, not so much as the school.

Jefferson is a back up school only to those who have a choice between Hopkins and Harvard.
 

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I really find it so hard to believe that you can be so arrogant as to trash an entire school and its reputation. Can you afford to be so picky? I would consider it an honor to gain acceptance to any of the fine allopathic schools within the states.

By trashing this school, you're trashing all of the qualified, intelligent, and potentially valuable future physicians who are applying to Jefferson. Do you really need a place to assert your supposed superiority to us 'low-tier seeking students' this urgently? Again, I don't desire to resort to personal attacks, but your attitude astounds me.
 

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Timmythemic22 said:
I really find it so hard to believe that you can be so arrogant as to trash an entire school and its reputation. Can you afford to be so picky? I would consider it an honor to gain acceptance to any of the fine allopathic schools within the states.

By trashing this school, you're trashing all of the qualified, intelligent, and potentially valuable future physicians who are applying to Jefferson. Do you really need a place to assert your supposed superiority to us 'low-tier seeking students' this urgently? Again, I don't desire to resort to personal attacks, but your attitude astounds me.

Well said!
 

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watermen said:
Sorry, I don't mean to start a quarrel here.

I just want to know how is Jefferson, I know nothing about medical schools, but may want to apply. How about Brown University? How about Canadian medical schools? Like Calgary, Dalhousie, etc...Which one is better?

Sorry waterman about all this arguing. I applied to Jefferson and I really like it. Like someone said before, the admin and the students are some of the nicest I met. It is in probably the nicest part of Philadelphia and it is the most wellknown school there also other than Penn. The curriculum is just like anyone elses but since its one of the oldest schools in the country, they have a lot figured out. They are building and planning to build more new facilities. I dont know off the top of my head what the match list looks like but its not ranked inthe top 50 because its a low tiered school. However, the class size is very large (if you dont like large classes) and I think its rather expensive. Hope this helps. I dont know much about the other schools you asked about.
 
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afr0dite01 said:
Sorry waterman about all this arguing. I applied to Jefferson and I really like it. Like someone said before, the admin and the students are some of the nicest I met. It is in probably the nicest part of Philadelphia and it is the most wellknown school there also other than Penn. The curriculum is just like anyone elses but since its one of the oldest schools in the country, they have a lot figured out. They are building and planning to build more new facilities. I dont know off the top of my head what the match list looks like but its not ranked inthe top 50 because its a low tiered school. However, the class size is very large (if you dont like large classes) and I think its rather expensive. Hope this helps. I dont know much about the other schools you asked about.
Thanks for your reply. According to USNews, it is ranked just at the 50. Is this still considered low tier?

It is one of the oldest school in the country, established in 1824. But why isn't it one of the best? ( no offend, just wondering why only?), is there something wrong with the ranking system? or...

By the way, is it easy to get accepted? How many applicants are there in an intake? How many get accepted? You say the class size is large, how large is it?
 

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It really depends on your perspective. There are ~125 allopathic schools in the US - do you think top 50 is a low tier?

It is not easy to get accepted into any US allopathic school. Jefferson's acceptance rate is 4.4% (~7500 applicants) according to the latest US news.

You should really consider investing in an online subscription to the US news rankings. It has a lot of the info you are looking for.
 

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watermen said:
Thanks for your reply. According to USNews, it is ranked just at the 50. Is this still considered low tier?

It is one of the oldest school in the country, established in 1824. But why isn't it one of the best? ( no offend, just wondering why only?), is there something wrong with the ranking system? or...

By the way, is it easy to get accepted? How many applicants are there in an intake? How many get accepted? You say the class size is large, how large is it?

I think one of the reasons it isn't ranked higher is that it doesn't concentrate a lot on research.

The class size is currently 230 but I believe next year, because AMCAS recommendation, it will be about 250.
 

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watermen said:
Thanks for your reply. According to USNews, it is ranked just at the 50. Is this still considered low tier?

It is one of the oldest school in the country, established in 1824. But why isn't it one of the best? ( no offend, just wondering why only?), is there something wrong with the ranking system? or...

By the way, is it easy to get accepted? How many applicants are there in an intake? How many get accepted? You say the class size is large, how large is it?

This is because it is not good as the others.
 

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watermen said:
Thanks for your reply. According to USNews, it is ranked just at the 50. Is this still considered low tier?

It is one of the oldest school in the country, established in 1824. But why isn't it one of the best? ( no offend, just wondering why only?), is there something wrong with the ranking system? or...

By the way, is it easy to get accepted? How many applicants are there in an intake? How many get accepted? You say the class size is large, how large is it?
Jefferson is one of the oldest schools in the country. (I attend Jefferson right now.) I don't think that there is such a thing as a "best" medical school - it's not like undergraduate schools, or business schools, or law schools, which are easier to rank. Every medical school has a different focus, so you'd have to list a "best" medical school for each area. For example, Pitt is one of the best medical schools for research, but there's less of a focus on clinical care. Jefferson doesn't focus on research so much, but they start you on your clinical skills early. (VERY early - I've already done a scrotum exam, and my friend spent an afternoon feeling prostates, and we're only first year students.) I don't like the USNews rankings because I think that they only measure things like research, NIH funding, etc. Sorry, but I have no intention of doing bench research ever again, so how much NIH funding a medical school gets means nothing to me. I'd much rather see patients every day. Jefferson has a very good reputation for training clinicians, so if you like clinical medicine, Jefferson is a good choice.

There are probably about 7500 applicants a year, roughly 400 -500 get accepted, and the class size is around 230. (That will increase to 250 soon.) As medical schools go, that is considered large. If you make it to the interview stage, you probably won't get rejected outright, but you may get waitlisted.

Look, Jefferson's a good school - a little more well known in the East Coast than some schools, but not a research behemoth, and it doesn't have an Ivy League name connected to it. Match Day is March 17th, so we'll see how this year's class did. So far, from what I've been told by the Dean's office, everyone who hoped to match in optho did. (Optho has an earlier match day than other specialties.) This doesn't surprise me, since Jefferson is affiliated with Wills Eye Hospital, one of the best eye hospitals in the country. (We have students from across the country come here to do away rotations.) So, really, it all depends on what is important to you.

What kind of doctor you end up being and what residency you get depends entirely on you, not the school. You can go to Harvard and be a mediocre student and get into a mediocre residency, or you can go to your state school, be an outstanding student, and get into a top residency. The school you go to doesn't matter that much.

Umm...why all the curiosity about Jefferson? You also seem really determined to be skeptical about everything that people have posted about the school so far....
 

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I agree with the poster above who said that Jeff would be considered mid tier and competitive with BU, Tufts, Brown, etc. The only reason not to go to Jeff would be if you got into a top tier school like Hopkins or Harvard. Then again I really liked their block curriculum, pass fail grading, and note taking services which might take a load off your mind during your first year med school experience. If you want Philly and you don't get into Penn, then Jeff! :)
 

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I am a current student at Jeff and I love it here. I think the only reason that we are not ranked higher is because Jeff has a clinical focus and US news is primarily based on research dollars. According to a 4th year I spoke with recently, the early matches (which are for Optho, derm, ENT, neuro, neuro-surgery,and urology) went VERY well. I heard that the class matched almost everyone in early match and some were selected to some great places. So, we produce good students and great clinicians. If that means its a crappy school then I dont know what the hell you are looking.
 
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dmk724 said:
Umm...why all the curiosity about Jefferson? You also seem really determined to be skeptical about everything that people have posted about the school so far....
Sorry about that, you know this is a forum anyway, I don't know who is saying the true who is bullshiiiting...so...you know...

Your reply is really helpful to me, thanks a lot for taking so much time to write such a detailed post.

Since you are from Jefferson, how do jefferson students score in USMLE? Does jefferson prepare you enough for USMLE?
 

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i'll be interviewing at jeff next wed and am excited! it was one of the first schools i looked into. and i like the fact that it isnt heavily research based because i'm not that into research.

you have to go where you'll be happy. that includes the students, admin, city, program and just the general feel. how far you want to climb the ladder is up to you. i go to one of the best schools in canada or so they say :rolleyes: (the president of princeton got her bchm degree at my school) and everyone oooohs and ahhhhhhs when i say where i go, but it counts for **** when i apply to med schools. they're not going to say, that girl goes there oh wow. they look at my gpa and mcat and reject/interview me accordingly. if i have the drive, i can go anywhere and still get into a comp specialty.
 

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what is special about jeff's clinical education/exposure that makes it a better clinical learning environment than research-focused schools?
 

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watermen said:
Sorry about that, you know this is a forum anyway, I don't know who is saying the true who is bullshiiiting...so...you know...

Your reply is really helpful to me, thanks a lot for taking so much time to write such a detailed post.

Since you are from Jefferson, how do jefferson students score in USMLE? Does jefferson prepare you enough for USMLE?
Jefferson students tend to do very well. I think something like 96% of the students passed the first time, compared to 92% of students nationally. Jefferson's average score was 220, while the national average was 216. So, all in all, pretty good. (To put that into perspective, the highest score technically possible on the Step 1 is 300 (analogous to the legendary 45 on the MCAT). Above a 280 is supposed to be nearly impossible. Above a 250 is really, really, REALLY good. (i.e. Most people don't come anywhere close to that.) The minimum passing score is around a 180. You take the test about a month after you finish classes in your second year.) A 215-220 is around what you would need to stay competitive for the more difficult residencies.

Jefferson has a lot of resources available for students, and will help you find prep courses if you want them. I guess the best way that they prepare you is by teaching you well in your first two years.

No problem - I was just wondering why you were so curious, that's all :)
 

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For the current Jeff students:

I generally see the large class size to be a good thing, but I'm a little worried about rotations. Does the large class size translate to more students per rotation team? Does this mean that you end up having to "wait your turn" to see/do a procedure? Also, how far does the Jeff network reach and how many of your rotations require you to travel to the site by car?
 

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davedavedave said:
what is special about jeff's clinical education/exposure that makes it a better clinical learning environment than research-focused schools?
They start you really early, and provide a lot of opportunities to get out into the community. With clinical care, the only way to learn how to perform certain skills well is to do them over and over again. For instance, the only way that you'll identify abnormal lung sounds is if you've heard a lot of normal lung sounds. They send you out to JeffHOPE (and it's numerous offshoots), JeffYES, JeffELECT, JeffMOMS, etc. The Asian students group, JADE, also does a lot of glaucoma screenings, AOA offered the opportunity to do routine physical exams on Special Olympics participants, and there are a lot of groups that go out to do glucose tests in various parts of the city. Everything's student run, so the students stay involved, and don't get shunted off to the side. I don't think I've heard of many other med schools that have this many community service organizations. I feel that research focused schools wouldn't necessarily have these kinds of organizations, but I may be wrong.

Plus, you must do at least 3 preceptor visits (some people choose to do more), so you have a chance to actually interact with patients. I guess, in a nutshell, it's speed of clinical exposure and frequency of clinical exposure. Jefferson's also at a good location to expose students to all demographics, since we're right in Center City.

As for the increasing class size, there is no way that the LCME would approve the class size increase if they didn't have proof that Jefferson's clinical rotations could accomodate this increase. It would be an increase of about 20 students, so it wouldn't overtax the system.

Jefferson's farthest rotation is in Pittsburgh at Mercy hospital. There are a couple others in Geisinger, which is about 4 hours away by car. There are also a few in Delaware, which is about 30 minutes away by car. I haven't heard about anyone having trouble getting to a rotation - the hardest seems to be for those who are married or are in serious, long-term relationships (they don't want to leave the area, for obvious reasons.) But logistically it's not difficult.
 

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xadmin said:
It's bottom of the heap. Remember, don't kid yourself. School that ranks near the 50s are not really in the 50s. They are more like 90 or 100 out of 125 due to many schools being repeat.
I know this has been responded to already, but...

xadmin, youre an idiot. excuse the personal attack, but its not possible to have a reasonnable discussion with someone who is so severely misinformed and arrogant. if you looked at this list which you think is so damn important, you would have quickly realized that the schools which are tied (i assume this is what you meant by repeats) take up the same number of spots. There are 52 schools on the published list because 3 schools are tied for 50th.

xadmin, unless you're a troll, you are really really stupid.
 

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MatthewLaz said:
I know this has been responded to already, but...

xadmin, youre an idiot. excuse the personal attack, but its not possible to have a reasonnable discussion with someone who is so severely misinformed and arrogant. if you looked at this list which you think is so damn important, you would have quickly realized that the schools which are tied (i assume this is what you meant by repeats) take up the same number of spots. There are 52 schools on the published list because 3 schools are tied for 50th.

xadmin, unless you're a troll, you are really really stupid.
Funny, this is what happened when people have disagreement, name calling, etc... Jefferson is a safety school, low ranking. Of course people defend their school to justify going there.
 

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Funny, this is what happened when people have disagreement, name calling, etc... Jefferson is a safety school, low ranking. Of course people defend their school to justify going there.

Everyone else has stated actual information for their opinions on this forum so I would like to hear why you think Jeff is a back up school. Thats the only way people will take you seriously. You cant just expect people to take your word when you dont back it up. Is it just because of "low ranking" because theres a lot more to schools than just numbers.
 

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xadmin said:
Funny, this is what happened when people have disagreement, name calling, etc... Jefferson is a safety school, low ranking. Of course people defend their school to justify going there.
Do you at least admit that you were wrong about Jefferson's rank actually meaning it is in the 90s or 100s?
 

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XADMIN Just wondering where you will be headed next year? Is it top ten, top 20? If its not top 20 then why even bother attending?

Your bad mouthing of several schools on here is just ridiculous (NYMC and MCO) and it seems to me like maybe you have a vendeta against certain places. Seriously, you obviously have no clue about Jefferson so why dont you just keep your mouth shut. Making your snide comments based on US News rankings is a little off base since we are in the top 50 and saying this equates to low-teir is just lame. Lower tier of what? The top 125, no -- we are smack in the middle there. So I guess BU, Tufts, and other around us also suck. We are right next to UMiama, wow they suck also. They are so a "safety school".
 

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i think there's no need to bash schools either

i jsut want to say that my treatment so far from jeff has been amazing! and i havent even been there yet! i need to stay two nights and my student host couldnt do the second night and she like totally went out of her way to help me find someone!! and she has an exam on the friday. i am very very impressed.
 

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Hey kids,

Get your nose up from US News. Rankings are WAY more important to prospective students than to future PD's and employers.

Ask yourself two simple questions:
A) Which patient will ever ask you where you graduated from?
B) What is "better", a AOA top 10% grad from Jefferson or xyz university, or a lower third graduate from Columbia, Cornell or UCSF?

Among law schools, tier ranking is important because there's so many law schools, and ABA accreditation isn't really that meaningful. In medicine, LCME takes their job VERY seriously, so ANYONE graduating from an accredited school and passing the USMLE are considered to be a proficient physician.

Yes, Yale, Harvard and a few others do have a name advantage which makes it easier to get into competitive residencies. But other than that, I can assure you that PD's look at the person and not the school.

So is Jefferson lower in the pecking order than the top 5/10? Sure. Is it "better" or "worse" than the majority of other US schools? That's basically a subjective judgement. Is it "better" than non-accredited schools? You bet.
 
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watermen

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I read everyone's message, it is infomative. Seems that everyone has been saying good things about Jefferson, is there any downside about Jefferson? I mean every school will sure has it's own downside, no matter how prestige the school is?
 

afr0dite01

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I would say that if you're interested in doing research, it wouldn't be the best place to go. And I think its somewhat expensive.
 

skypilot

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watermen said:
I read everyone's message, it is infomative. Seems that everyone has been saying good things about Jefferson, is there any downside about Jefferson? I mean every school will sure has it's own downside, no matter how prestige the school is?
Heh heh, the only downside is its location in Philly. ;) That having being said there are lots of students that are really happy with their decision to go to Jeff.
 

AmieJ5757

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I'm going to Jefferson this fall and proud of it! I didn't know much about the school until I went but I fell in love! They have a fabulous reputation... especially for clinical stuff... I got into a handfull of Med schools but in the end, the USNEWS ranking are worthless... what's gonna get you through med school is the people around you... the people at Jeff seemed great!

They were warm and polite, and seemed like real people who were worried about being doctors because they are interested in helping people, not rankings... anyway, they definately had more tact than XADMIN...