How late is late for secondary submission?

[Twink]

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As the title says, how late is a November submission? I am verified and ready to submit secondary. My stats are above average, if that matters.

 

[Mosonik]

You definitely still have a good chance especially if you have above average stats. With that said, early submission absolutely is an advantage and so regardless of the strength of your app you would LIKELY have many more options if you were willing to wait until next cycle... after all you are throwing tons of money at this process so consider that.

If you decide to apply now be ready to play the waiting game hard core and be okay with having to play out the cycle up until the back end of the cycle. More than likely by February-April if you interview you are either competing for many less seats (with other applicants) so youll need to rock those interviews or are competing for wait list (and you still need to set yourself apart). Good luck either way!

 

[Twink]

You definitely still have a good chance especially if you have above average stats. With that said, early submission absolutely is an advantage and so regardless of the strength of your app you would LIKELY have many more options if you were willing to wait until next cycle... after all you are throwing tons of money at this process so consider that.

If you decide to apply now be ready to play the waiting game hard core and be okay with having to play out the cycle up until the back end of the cycle. More than likely by February-April if you interview you are either competing for many less seats (with other applicants) so youll need to rock those interviews or are competing for wait list (and you still need to set yourself apart). Good luck either way!

Getting the fee waiver will help me offset the cost of all those applications and I don't mind the wait game, already used to it. Just wanted to know what are my chances with such a late submission.

 

[ShyRem]

Your chances with late submission are infinitely better than with no submission.

Early submission chances are significantly better than late chances admission.

But if you don't submit, your chances are zero.

 

[GunnerBGone]

Yeah....I wouldn't listen to a word of what they're saying.

I did, last season. Spent 6-7 grand, interviewing for a spot on the wait list. The schools all told me it was fine, as did my advisor, and SDN heroes. I even think ShyRem was one of them. "Oh, sure, don't worry pal. Interviews go until March or April! You'll be fine!" Until AFTER the interviews. Then, "oh, that was a pretty dumb move, applying so late. I really tried to tell you not to, and you should have listened. What's wrong with you? You really must be a poor applicant. You must have really screwed up the interview or be a child molester or something."
(My secondaries were complete in December. I went on 8 interviews, which is significant that late in the year. I received several waitlist letters. The small amount of interview feedback I received suggested the lateness was the ONLY reason for not matriculating.)

Browse the school-specific section. Schools that take 100 people have already accepted half, if not more. And, it's only November. If you submit now, you'll receive invites in a month or so due to the review period. Give another month an interview date to open up. You're looking at mid-late December at the earliest at quick schools like, say, PCOM or such. LECOM and some of the other "safety schools" (sincerest apologies, LECOM!) are pushing interview dates back RIGHT NOW for about 2 1/2 months. Everyone will tell you there are 50 or so seats left, and with wonderful smiles on their faces. In reality, there are about 5-10 seats left in late December.
Something they're not telling you, also, is that those remaining seats have a SIGNIFICANTLY greater competitive nature. The majority of the early applicants are accepted (or no one would stress so highly to apply early), meaning that <50% of the applicants have received >75% of the seats. For example, they might interview 500 people by December, and accept 175. Then interview another 500 for the remaining 25 seats. They're "forgetting" to mention that tasty little nugget of info.
If you post on here after receiving rejections, you will be amazed at the change you see in your supporters' personae. You'll be surprised how they deny ever saying anything supportive, or (if you have it in writing) they'll try to convince you it was YOUR fault during the interview. Definitely not their bad advise.

I've spent the last year thinking I had a personality defect or something, which being a member here definitely does not help. Fun times.

If you need the fee waiver badly enough to be able to use it (and I'm not judging), I would really suggest you save your money until next season. Use it to fly to more interviews. The plane ticket to Arizona alone cost me $960. And, it'll save yourself a ton of embarrassment and heartache.


Send a few secondaries out, I'd say. A few hundred dollars worth, if you can, just to see that you can receive interview invites. It's good for the soul. When/If you get an invite to one within driving distance, and you don't need a hotel...go for it. Then come back and talk to me.

Your chances with late submission are infinitely better than with no submission.

You are exactly....wrong.
And you're smart enough to know better.
Late submission and subsequent rejections are infinitely WORSE than not submitting. Debt, depression, social rejection, etc, can lead to students refusing to re-apply if/when necessary. Competing for the handful of remaining seats that late in the season makes you feel doubly, or triply, worse than early applicants upon rejection, because a "better student" would have been accepted. Look how often it's thrown around on here, that So-and-So got accepted in April with a 2.7 GPA, and how he must be the Bruce Willis of pre-meds....

They have a very small chance of getting in, true. But, they risk significant more personal loss for the hope of an even tinier sliver of chance. That puts you in the negative, unless you refuse to consider human emotion as a factor, like a true gunner.

 

[racerwad]

Yeah....I wouldn't listen to a word of what they're saying.

I did, last season. Spent 6-7 grand, interviewing for a spot on the wait list. The schools all told me it was fine, as did my advisor, and SDN heroes. I even think ShyRem was one of them. "Oh, sure, don't worry pal. Interviews go until March or April! You'll be fine!" Until AFTER the interviews. Then, "oh, that was a pretty dumb move, applying so late. I really tried to tell you not to, and you should have listened. What's wrong with you? You really must be a poor applicant. You must have really screwed up the interview or be a child molester or something."
(My secondaries were complete in December. I went on 8 interviews, which is significant that late in the year. I received several waitlist letters. The small amount of interview feedback I received suggested the lateness was the ONLY reason for not matriculating.)

Browse the school-specific section. Schools that take 100 people have already accepted half, if not more. And, it's only November. If you submit now, you'll receive invites in a month or so due to the review period. Give another month an interview date to open up. You're looking at mid-late December at the earliest at quick schools like, say, PCOM or such. LECOM and some of the other "safety schools" (sincerest apologies, LECOM!) are pushing interview dates back RIGHT NOW for about 2 1/2 months. Everyone will tell you there are 50 or so seats left, and with wonderful smiles on their faces. In reality, there are about 5-10 seats left in late December.
Something they're not telling you, also, is that those remaining seats have a SIGNIFICANTLY greater competitive nature. The majority of the early applicants are accepted (or no one would stress so highly to apply early), meaning that <50% of the applicants have received >75% of the seats. For example, they might interview 500 people by December, and accept 175. Then interview another 500 for the remaining 25 seats. They're "forgetting" to mention that tasty little nugget of info.
If you post on here after receiving rejections, you will be amazed at the change you see in your supporters' personae. You'll be surprised how they deny ever saying anything supportive, or (if you have it in writing) they'll try to convince you it was YOUR fault during the interview. Definitely not their bad advise.

I've spent the last year thinking I had a personality defect or something, which being a member here definitely does not help. Fun times.

If you need the fee waiver badly enough to be able to use it (and I'm not judging), I would really suggest you save your money until next season. Use it to fly to more interviews. The plane ticket to Arizona alone cost me $960. And, it'll save yourself a ton of embarrassment and heartache.


Send a few secondaries out, I'd say. A few hundred dollars worth, if you can, just to see that you can receive interview invites. It's good for the soul. When/If you get an invite to one within driving distance, and you don't need a hotel...go for it. Then come back and talk to me.




You are exactly....wrong.
And you're smart enough to know better.
Late submission and subsequent rejections are infinitely WORSE than not submitting. Debt, depression, social rejection, etc, can lead to students refusing to re-apply if/when necessary. Competing for the handful of remaining seats that late in the season makes you feel doubly, or triply, worse than early applicants upon rejection, because a "better student" would have been accepted. Look how often it's thrown around on here, that So-and-So got accepted in April with a 2.7 GPA, and how he must be the Bruce Willis of pre-meds....

They have a very small chance of getting in, true. But, they risk significant more personal loss for the hope of an even tinier sliver of chance. That puts you in the negative, unless you refuse to consider human emotion as a factor, like a true gunner.

What is up with the terrible attitude? No one owes you anything. Just because you listened to someone's advice, it isn't their fault you dropped the ball once you had an interview. I know that your interviewers told you that lateness was your only problem, but I bet that's because being a douche is not a reason that their lawyers will allow.

Anyhow, to the OP, now is not an ideal time to apply, but it is not the kiss of death, especially if you feel like you have a strong application. I was accepted to a few places. GunnerBeGrump is right that you are competing for less spots, but you only need one seat. Apply, get an interview, and make it happen. Good luck.

 

[Wipeout416]

Its not SUPER late.. just slightly. Lots in the same boat! Get 'er done!

 

[GunnerBGone]

t isn't their fault you dropped the ball once you had an interview. I know that your interviewers told you that lateness was your only problem, but I bet that's because being a douche is not a reason that their lawyers will allow.

See what I mean?
Did I not just say this is how people act?
Am I living in an alternate dimension or something? Am I on the Truman Show?
Seriously? In the VERY NEXT post?



No, no one here "owes" anyone here anything. But the saying is a nice, tidy escape route when you're backed into a corner. There is no obligation to give advice when asked, as helpful and truthful as you can, as per the forum raison d'être.
If you give advice, to the severe detriment of the person listening...it is not obligatory to accept blame and apologize. But it is recommended, lest said person comes back and meets you in person. Medicine depends on a patient referral system, if I remember correctly.

 

[racerwad]

See what I mean?
Did I not just say this is how people act?
Am I living in an alternate dimension or something? Am I on the Truman Show?
Seriously? In the VERY NEXT post?



No, no one here "owes" anyone here anything. But the saying is a nice, tidy escape route when you're backed into a corner. There is no obligation to give advice when asked, as helpful and truthful as you can, as per the forum raison d'être.
If you give advice, to the severe detriment of the person listening...it is not obligatory to accept blame and apologize. But it is recommended, lest said person comes back and meets you in person. Medicine depends on a patient referral system, if I remember correctly.

Are you nuts? You're saying that someone's advice was bad because it didn't work for you. How do you interpret the fact that many people (up to half, according to your post) are interviewing late in the season and are able to get seats? Just because the advice didn't work for you does not make it bad advice.

What I'm wondering is, based on your posts, why aren't you willing to accept possibility that perhaps the problem is you? Just curious. You always seem to be looking for an alternative reason (your military service, the time of year you applied, bad advice on SDN, etc) to your attitude. You are the only consistent variable in all eight of your interviews.

 

[GunnerBGone]

Again, see what I mean?

 

[ValentineLissar]

Out of curiosity, did you apply again this year? How are you doing now?

 

[GunnerBGone]

I'll let you know in a few days.
Interviewed at my favorite school recently, which went really well. They had harsh words for SDN, as well. One of you flamed an admissions official personally. They don't appreciate the moderators allowing things to get so out of hand.
Many of you have bashed my MCAT, for example, when I scored the same as a current class president, and their highest scoring M3S. Both whom have been speaking with me often over email, and have given their recommendation.

Interviewing at my 2nd favorite in about 10 days. They don't like the forum either. Their recruiters actively encourage students not to read the forum at all. I'm not doing myself any favors by posting. This will be my second interview with them--I'm sure they hate my personality.
I turned down a LECOM interview last week, because the date would be mid-Febuary.

Had I not given merit to your ad hominem attacks, and submitted to slight depression, I would have applied even earlier and received more invites.


Anyway, would anyone like to actually debate the topic with facts and actual experience, versus attacking my character? Can you find someone who went to >8 interviews, behind the seasonal curve?

 

[GunnerBGone]

Checked the online portal. They just updated a few minutes ago.

Accepted. WVSOM , class of 2017.







Suck it.

 

[ValentineLissar]

I don't believe I said anything negative about you, and I'm glad that you been getting interviews! Hopefully, things work out for you. I was only asking about your experiences this year since you made a detailed and lengthy post about the perils of submitting late last year.

Anyways, to throw my 2 cents in about the OP's question, I think that you still have a chance of getting in, and I think it's a reasonable risk to take if you have the money are not willing to wait another year to apply. While interviewing at some of the schools, I was pleasantly surprised to meet two or three people who applied late, got interviews in February, and were accepted a week later. It depends on the school, but some places still haven't scheduled interviews for December or January, and seeing how realistically we've only had 3 months of interviewing versus another 5 months of interviews, you might land a late winter interview. Good luck!

 

[ValentineLissar]

Congrats!

 

[GunnerBGone]

What I'm wondering is, based on your posts, why aren't you willing to accept possibility that perhaps the problem is you? Just curious. You always seem to be looking for an alternative reason (your military service, the time of year you applied, bad advice on SDN, etc) to your attitude. You are the only consistent variable in all eight of your interviews.

What were you saying, again?

Something about admitting to being a mouthy little ****?

 

[racerwad]

What were you saying, again?

Something about admitting to being a mouthy little ****?

Are you serious? You are the one with the problem. You are the one that posted on this thread suggesting that someone (ShyRem) intentionally gave you bad advice because they're a gunner. In the context of that poster, that doesn't even make any sense since they aren't even in medical school anymore.

I don't have a thing to admit to because I never said anything untrue about you or your experiences.

Sincere congratulations on getting in.

 

[GunnerBGone]

Back pedaling.
The Olympic sport of mouthy little ****s without dignity or class.

You and your buddies owe me an apology. Not holding my breath...just setting you to ignore.
Goodbye.

 

[racerwad]

Back pedaling.
The Olympic sport of mouthy little ****s without dignity or class.

You and your buddies owe me an apology. Not holding my breath...just setting you to ignore.
Goodbye.

Backpedaling?

Maybe you're confusing me for someone else because I still think you are a colossal douche. You were just smart enough to take the advice of those who encouraged you not to be yourself.

I can still acknowledge your accomplishment without liking who you are (at least on SDN).

 

[ShyRem]

Let me remind everyone that foul language is not permitted.

 

[GunnerBGone]

Yes, ma'am.

Good luck, OP.

 

[MedPR]

You are exactly....wrong.

She meant that you can't get in if you don't submit. DO shools don't punish reapplicants like MD schools do.

Cmon bro.

 

[DocRooster]

I know, yes.

I'm trying out a popular social skill, where you can act like a giant c0ck as long as you cite enthusiasm or passion. All the win, none of the guilt. And 40% fewer calories.

I changed my username accordingly. Not sure I like it, though. It's kinda foul.

 

[DrWily]

Checked the online portal. They just updated a few minutes ago.

Accepted. WVSOM , class of 2017.

Suck it.

You have a serious entitlement issue.

No one on here deliberately gives bad information, and if they do, there are others that jump in to correct it pretty damn quick. I personally KNOW people in my MS1 class who applied late, and interviewed in the very last interview session, and got accepted 2 weeks later. N=2, whatever. It can still happen. The issue is that applying late is not a bad idea, nor is it a good idea. It's a gray area where only the applicant can decide if its worth it to them. Applying late reduces your chances dramatically, but you still have a chance. Is it worth it to waste a few hundred to a few thousand for a chance? Again, it's up to the applicant. I would rather throw down a few hundred than to reapply ANOTHER cycle and wait another year. If you got 8 interviews, and you EXPECTED to be accepted then that's again, your fault. Nothing is guaranteed in this process. People go 5-10 interviews, and no acceptance. Doesn't happen often, but it does happen.

Your depression, etc, whatever social issues you have from not being accepted is on you. Nobody here claims to be your psychiatric and knows your issues. SDN gets a lot of crap, but in general the Pre-Osteo forum is a good bunch (or was, I haven't been on lately due to school) and will generally steer your right.

Just because you're a douche, grats on getting into bottom tier of DO schools.

To the OP: You have a chance, it's not the best one.. only you can decide if you are able to put up the money. Do they still give out fee waivers this late?

 

[abolt18]

DrWily and Racerwad... Just wanted to say +1 to everything you have said.

 

[DocRooster]

I thought she said foul langauge isn't permitted. 😕

Since when are DO schools tiered? Why are you always so hung up on it?
You don't think repeatedly alienating and insulting thousands of people isn't being a bit more of a derogatory du jour?
WVSOM students match into very nice programs. Someone went into ortho at Johns Hopkins, this year. It's a nationally recognized, award-winning school. One of the top schools in the world for rural primary care. Their $2.5 million anatomy lab has set the standard for cleanliness and air quality, which YOUR school has used as a template. The simulation and SP lab is one of the largest in the field, also used as a template. One of the first schools to have a sim lab, in fact. It is one of the largest DO campuses in the country with spectacular amenities, an incredibly history, and is documented as having the nicest staff in the profession BY FAR. A five-star resort just five minutes down the road. Thirty minutes from the Blue Ridge Parkway, several national parks, and decent whitewater. Best motorcycle roads in the nation. A brand new cafeteria, gym, and student center, soon. Personalizable classrooms. Research opportunities. A brand new, multi-million dollar public clinic. Rural mission trips throughout the state. Temperate climate. Beautiful small town.

I mean, you get what you pay for. I didnt settle. I CHOSE this school.
Perhaps you are jealous they didn't like you?
Why all the hate?

 

[DrWily]

I thought she said foul langauge isn't permitted. 😕

Since when are DO schools tiered? Why are you always so hung up on it?
You don't think repeatedly alienating and insulting thousands of people isn't being a bit more of a derogatory du jour?
WVSOM students match into very nice programs. Someone went into ortho at Johns Hopkins, this year. It's a nationally recognized, award-winning school. One of the top schools in the world for rural primary care. Their $2.5 million anatomy lab has set the standard for cleanliness and air quality, which YOUR school has used as a template. The simulation and SP lab is one of the largest in the field, also used as a template. One of the first schools to do so, in fact. It is one of the largest DO campuses in the country with spectacular amenities, an incredibly history, and is documented as having the nicest staff in the profession BY FAR.
Perhaps you are jealous they didn't like you?

I apologize for spewing stereotypes as I know next to nothing about WVSOM except that it doesn't get much love here. Was never interested in the program and only applied as I was throwing out a broad net. I'm sure the school does well and produces excellent physicians.

Finals week, stressed, tomorrow is my last final, lashing out at people on interwebs for coping mechanism, displacement etc etc.

 

[gmcguitar4]

If I were you, I would definitely apply now and take the risk of using time/money. One persons experience/advice has no affect on your application. I have some friends in med schools that applied very late with mediocre stats and landed acceptances. If you have a solid app you def still have a shot at DO programs. They aren't close to giving out all acceptances. Also, as people get accepted they drop interviews at other schools so if you monitor schools closely and stay in contact with them, you can snatch up a dropped spot and get a nice early interview.

 

[DocRooster]

Finals week, stressed, tomorrow is my last final, lashing out at people on interwebs for coping mechanism, displacement etc etc.

No big.
My mentor just died, right before this acceptance and my daughter being born. Displacing a bit, myself.



But don't call me entitled again, or I'll find you and pee on your dog.