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Good luck non-tradjust remember your smart, pretty, by god people like you
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Depression is definitely something you should address sooner rather than later. I've read many different approaches listed in this forum and the fact remains that not all of them come from people who have experienced this sort of thing before, so take them with a grain of salt. Many people will simply not understand what you are talking about, and write it off as something you "will get over". It may take a lot more than that for others to overcome true clinical depression.
Yes, many medical students experience depression, partly due to the insane amount of work, and the paultry payoffs at times, but also due to the fact that most of us are overachievers who may be using success as a crutch. Alot of us may have a propensity for depression by nature, or a lurking OCD (hmmm....voluntarily spending our time emersing ourselves in books? For some this behavior alleviates anxiety to some degree.....food for thought)
I believe the DSM-IV says that you need to have feelings of hopelessness, sadness, etc. for a period of two weeks or more to be diagnosed with clinical depression. I think in all reality, most people would fall under this category at one point or another in their lives. DON'T IGNORE IT!!!!
As for excercise - this has been PROVEN to alleviate depression. The latest studies say that excercise 5-7xs a week for 30min give you the best effects (yes, almost everyday!). It's tough, but it definitely works. When it comes down to it, what's a half an hour out of your day? You think you're going to miss something by not studying for that half an hour? The amount of positive energy you'll get from the work out will enable you to be sharper for the rest of the day anyway.
Meds - there are many out there and depending on the severity of your symptoms you should definitely consider this option. The best results here come in combination with psychotherapy. If you see a therapist, MAKE SURE you find one that you like. If you don't feel like you are getting anything out of the session, for God's sake find someone else. Finding one that works for you is very important and any therapist will understand if you decide to split from his/her care.
Good luck to anyone struggling with this right now. It is an illness that should be treated like any other. Take care of yourself, an important rule you should adopt in general. Listen to your body and mind and take some time off when they tell you to. Remember that we will one day be taking care of others, and its crucial that you maintain your own health in order to do so...
All the best 🙂 😀 🙂 😀
Yes, many medical students experience depression, partly due to the insane amount of work, and the paultry payoffs at times, but also due to the fact that most of us are overachievers who may be using success as a crutch. Alot of us may have a propensity for depression by nature, or a lurking OCD (hmmm....voluntarily spending our time emersing ourselves in books? For some this behavior alleviates anxiety to some degree.....food for thought)
I believe the DSM-IV says that you need to have feelings of hopelessness, sadness, etc. for a period of two weeks or more to be diagnosed with clinical depression. I think in all reality, most people would fall under this category at one point or another in their lives. DON'T IGNORE IT!!!!
As for excercise - this has been PROVEN to alleviate depression. The latest studies say that excercise 5-7xs a week for 30min give you the best effects (yes, almost everyday!). It's tough, but it definitely works. When it comes down to it, what's a half an hour out of your day? You think you're going to miss something by not studying for that half an hour? The amount of positive energy you'll get from the work out will enable you to be sharper for the rest of the day anyway.
Meds - there are many out there and depending on the severity of your symptoms you should definitely consider this option. The best results here come in combination with psychotherapy. If you see a therapist, MAKE SURE you find one that you like. If you don't feel like you are getting anything out of the session, for God's sake find someone else. Finding one that works for you is very important and any therapist will understand if you decide to split from his/her care.
Good luck to anyone struggling with this right now. It is an illness that should be treated like any other. Take care of yourself, an important rule you should adopt in general. Listen to your body and mind and take some time off when they tell you to. Remember that we will one day be taking care of others, and its crucial that you maintain your own health in order to do so...
All the best 🙂 😀 🙂 😀
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Whatever we say about depression, we should remember that we are talking about subjective mental events, and hence not necessarily about the same thing. People can describe themselves or others as "depressed" and mean anything from a mild-to-moderate sense of unhappiness to an incapacitating illness, as agonizing as cancer, and as deadly.
All advice depends heavily on our audience sharing our experience of depression, rather than something more or less intense. I had some painful sadness in my life recently, and I tried a number of things to get through it, including standing up striaght and taking deep breaths (sounds silly, but it's hard to be really anxious and sad while standing tall and breathing deeply -- try it). Some people are going to need meds. Some people need more regular exercise, or better self-talk (bad self-talk is a killer.) Everybody needs friends to talk to.
Best wishes to anyone feeling sad, anxious, hopeless, or alone. Take care of yourself -- be your own patient. Whatever you have to do, do it, and screw making honors or whatever else. As they say in fire academy, you can't help the casualities if you become one.
All advice depends heavily on our audience sharing our experience of depression, rather than something more or less intense. I had some painful sadness in my life recently, and I tried a number of things to get through it, including standing up striaght and taking deep breaths (sounds silly, but it's hard to be really anxious and sad while standing tall and breathing deeply -- try it). Some people are going to need meds. Some people need more regular exercise, or better self-talk (bad self-talk is a killer.) Everybody needs friends to talk to.
Best wishes to anyone feeling sad, anxious, hopeless, or alone. Take care of yourself -- be your own patient. Whatever you have to do, do it, and screw making honors or whatever else. As they say in fire academy, you can't help the casualities if you become one.
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sorry, i never responded to this; i didn't realize it was addressed to me. If you really don't think you will snaqp out of it, you need professional haelp. If you are still feeling this way (it's been about 3 weeks), do not put it off asnd think yuou can handle it on your own; you probably can't and it's not worth what you make go thru if you attempt to resolve it on your own. feel free to PM me if you want. all the best.
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Can someone let me know what the hell they are depressed about? I just can't see how a person could have survived in this world when taking a bunch of exams over the course of a week causes them to crumble??
Would you crumble as your spent the nights eating chinese and sitting on the floor of your office ruffling through the endless briefs you have to read to prepare for your clients huge multi million dollar lawsuit?
Lets say we have boring desk jobs. A project is due this month but theres no way were going to get it out the door. Our boss is saying that if we can't get it out the door, a bunch of new college grads would be able to fill in for us. If I would see anyone suddenly break down from the pressure, I would have a strong feeling that the person was coodled as a kid/teen/college student and didn't learn anything about the real world..
Grow up people.. It's not the end of the world..
Would you crumble as your spent the nights eating chinese and sitting on the floor of your office ruffling through the endless briefs you have to read to prepare for your clients huge multi million dollar lawsuit?
Lets say we have boring desk jobs. A project is due this month but theres no way were going to get it out the door. Our boss is saying that if we can't get it out the door, a bunch of new college grads would be able to fill in for us. If I would see anyone suddenly break down from the pressure, I would have a strong feeling that the person was coodled as a kid/teen/college student and didn't learn anything about the real world..
Grow up people.. It's not the end of the world..
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Once again, another misinformed post from our friend Polska. 🙄
If you tell your patients that and one of them commits suicide, I hope you get your a&& handed to you in a law suit. One would think a medical student would have a little more sensitivity and *gasp* knowledge about mental illness.
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I'm depressed but I honestly think it has far more to do with the location of my school, lack of interest in my classmates, and not knowing anyone outside of medical school that is depressing me. Its not the massive amount of work, if anything that makes the depression go away because I am too busy to reflect on how crappy my life has become.
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I was anything but coddled and medschool depresses the hell out of me. Also, depression usually doesn't have a direct cause in what is happening in someones life. A lot of times depression comes on for no apparent reason at all.
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Low serotonin levels, wise guy.
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That's it? Your stopping at a dx of low serotonin? You should know to dig deeper to understand the true cause of the low serotonin levels. Is it a genetic defect in these people? Just a lack of exercise? Lack of sex?
Just complaining about a problem doesn't solve it.
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So much for compassion. Hope you are planning on becoming a military doctor.
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I didn't expect for my fellow students to have *GASP* mental illnesses.
If parents would just raise their children the right way, we wouldn't be having these problems.
For more info on raising your kid the right way:
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=beat
👍
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Yeah, you got it all figured out *****. And as much as Maddox kicks ass, if you are using him as justification for your *****ic ideas, you are dumber than the people who write him hate mail.
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This is probably a manifestation of your own depression
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I see you posted such a helpful response below showing your huge understanding of mental illness. BTW, it's spelled "you're" (you know, short for you are). If third graders can get it right, medical students should, too.
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Then you're even more clueless than I thought you were.
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You're right. Everyone has depression. They just don't know it. 👍
I like how the thread suddenly became about me versus just answering why is <10% of the SDN community complaining how this is SOO horribly bad. Its freaking school. Do you think anyone wants to be sitting on their ass listening to lectures for 7 hrs? Yet, we don't see all 20,000 med students rushing SDN to find some comfort in the fact that their life which they picked supposedly sucks.
If your depression is due to being tired of studying, pick up a basketball, go for a run, watch some TV, go out to eat, find a bf/gf. The fact that you have time to waste on SDN but don't have time to go out and meet anyone outside of your horrible med school friends is stupid. (Although, I don't disagree, most of my colleagues are frequently heard on the phone complaining how much this exam is SOO difficult and they're SOO stressed. The key to having non-med school friends is for med school'ers to quit boring the world and shut up about med school stress is so vastly superior to the world's problems.)
Instead of posting 1,000+ posts, go out and do something that makes you happy!
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Aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a toatl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe.
Worrying about accuracy is a waste of time. No spell check in forum. Not going to worry. Don't want to get depressed about mispelling.
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A cause you can rally against for your precious spelling and grammar which will be so handy in the future... (Paraphrased incase you don't want to follow the link)
".. high school students will be able to use ''text-speak'' -- the mobile phone text message language beloved of teenagers -- in national exams this year.
Text-speak, a second language for thousands of teens, uses abbreviated words and phrases such as ''txt'' for ''text'', ''lol'' for ''laughing out loud'' or ''lots of love,'' and ''CU'' for ''see you.''
The move has already divided students and educators who fear it could damage the English language..."
Source (Chicago SunTimes): http://www.suntimes.com/news/world/133878,CST-NWS-nz13.article
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I have no clue what you just wrote, and it gave me a headache to boot.🙄 The goal of language is communication. If everyone else cannot understand what you are writing, it is the tower of babel all over again.
I gotta agree with polska on this one. A lot of "depressed" med students are just lame has-been over achievers that could be doing a lot better if they (like a prev. poster) weren't so worried about..."if id dont ace this test i wont get honors then I wont get AOA then I'll be to stressed to do well on Step 1 then I wont get a great residency then I wont be the uber-bestest radiologist in the whole world like my mom thinks I can be....". Go out and have fun. Hang with friends DONT TALK ABOUT MEDICAL SCHOOL! Chill the hell out. Take things in stride and repeat after me...F*CK IT. Thats right. Some attending gives you a bad grade...F*ck him/her, you're still a good person, you'll be okay, you're still gonna earn 6 figures and have a cool job. Get some perspective or you're gonna drive yourselves batsh*t for real when god forbid, something that actually matters goes wrong in your life.
For the real depressed people feel free to get on Prozac. To head off some responses, I know depression is a real illness, I also know that like a lot of illnesses (someone mentioned diabetes?) it can be self inflicted. SO eatright, get some exercise and take a load off or you're gonna be at an increased risk of both.
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Exactly what I'm trying to get at.. Its like med students seem not to be able to deal with things going wrong. Even if you don't get that coveted rad onc spot, was that the only reason you wanted to be in med school? or was it to help people? Passing, having friends, and treating your career as a job will still allow you to stay sane, quit buggin everyone with your problems, and fulfill your main focus.. HELPING PEOPLE!
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If that was your primary point, then you didn't express it well originally. Also, if these threads bother you, don't participate. Go whine about the whiny people elsewhere because no one is being helped by your participation here.
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i agree that depression is a major illness. and i can also see how the doldrums of medschool can really get you down...
countless lectures, never feeling caught up, tired sometimes, burnt out, lack of the partying and fun you had in undergrad..
i understand these things can get you down, but there are ways to pick yourself up like some previous posters said. saying f*** it sometimes is incredibly liberating and brings back your sanity.
seriously you guys, chilling out about grades or attendings and such doesn't make any of you underachievers, stupid, worthless, etc...it just enables you to look at your world from another place, a bigger place, one that is not in a little corner of the library in a little medical school. think of the BIG picture.
just a thought
countless lectures, never feeling caught up, tired sometimes, burnt out, lack of the partying and fun you had in undergrad..
i understand these things can get you down, but there are ways to pick yourself up like some previous posters said. saying f*** it sometimes is incredibly liberating and brings back your sanity.
seriously you guys, chilling out about grades or attendings and such doesn't make any of you underachievers, stupid, worthless, etc...it just enables you to look at your world from another place, a bigger place, one that is not in a little corner of the library in a little medical school. think of the BIG picture.
just a thought
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I've had more than a few (not all!) pretty exceptional doctors personally talk to me about how their educational experience was pure hell (particularly as they went further along) and they would never repeat it. There is something "special" about med education, and I could see how people could get depressed by the stress. I've heard med school described as a gentle introduction to residency ... seems almost like a kind of boot camp that lasts for years. I'll get to experience it for myself starting next fall.
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People like others to be in awe and acknowledge their sacrifices instead of just being fine with their sacrifices. I can't see myself, no matter how unhappy I would get, spending the rest of my life telling everyone how hard I had it, and how tough I had it, and they should pity me for sacrificing my life to help others.
It used to be that mom and dad would give you external gratification. Some docs seem like they haven't grown out of it and want the students/general public to see what a good girl/boy they are.
If you love what you're doing or where you are headed, it should be pretty easy to keep your head up.
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Dude, I agree that there are a million douchebags in medical school who are depressed because they don't know how to chill out and quit freaking out about making 100's on everything. But there are also a lot of medstudents who are depressed about being stuck with these ******s 24/7.
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In fairness, I should point out that there certainly doctors I have talked to who enjoyed med school and I've even heard some people say it's very manageable.
I agree that a love of medicine, science, and a goal are a huge help. At the same time, I could see how an unexpected challenge or unusually unpleasant experience could jolt someone off track and require some encouragement.
I hestitate to ascribe motivations or causes (particularly deviant or negative ones) as you seem to be suggesting. In my former life, I managed, hired, and fired people, so my performance depended to some extent on being able to read the motivations, capabilities, and aspirations of others. I learned that motivations are not always obvious, logical, consistent, or even conscious.
{plug on}I picked the school I'm going to next year (Baylor) because school had an educational program that appealed to me; it's near a huge med center that has a respected cancer center, and the students there seemed competent, hardworking, socially engaging, and happy. I'm looking forward to it. {plug off}
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Have you been living in the dark ages for the past 20 years and missed all the new information indicating that mental illnesses are largely caused by biological factors? All this cr@p about external gratification and perfectionism isn't the key. As a future doctor, you should take a more scientific approach to human disease.
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Why don't you start right now by HELPING PEOPLE who are having issues in school? You will undoubtedly work with doctors who may have problems in addition to the patients who need your help. And guess what? You will rarely be able to help them by blaming them. Teamwork requires that you pick up the slack a little when others cannot. The main goal is just as you said, to help others.
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we'd prob all be a lot happier if we were getting more sex
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Yessir
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many.
Med Educ. 2005 Jun;39(6):594-604. Stress and depression among medical students: a cross-sectional study. Dahlin M, Joneborg N, Runeson B.
"The prevalence of depressive symptoms among students was 12.9%, significantly higher than in the general population, and was 16.1% among female students versus 8.1% among males"
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J Affect Disord. 1986 Jul-Aug;11(1):91-6. Depression among medical students. Zoccolillo M, Murphy GE, Wetzel RD.
"The incidence of major depression or probable major depression by DSM-III criteria during the first two years of medical school was 12%. The lifetime prevalence was 15%, three times greater than the rate in the general population."
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BMJ. 2006 Sep 30;333(7570):682. Experiences of belittlement and harassment and their correlates among medical students in the United States: longitudinal survey. Frank E, Carrera JS, Stratton T, Bickel J, Nora LM.
"Among seniors, 42% (581/1387) reported having experienced harassment and 84% (1166/1393) belittlement during medical school."........"They did differ significantly by chosen specialty and were significantly more likely to be stressed, depressed, and suicidal, to drink alcohol or to binge drink, and to state that their faculty did not care about medical students. They were also significantly less likely to be glad they trained to become a doctor."
yale is actually pretty good compared to some other places, at least in the preclinical years. third and fourth year, its probably similar as elsewhere.
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i never get depressed. i get pissed. i punch the air and go crazy. and then I settle down and watch tv.
