How much do veterinary proceedures cost the clinic?

[Trematode]

I was talking to a friend (who is not a pet owner) about the cost of taking your animal to the vet. They could not believe an exam was $60 and when I told them that a dog spay can run over $300 at this particular clinic, they freaked out. I tried to Google the cost of labour, materials, etc. for spay/neuter but could not find anything. I just wanted to see if someone had a list of a website that compared the cost to the clinic to what they charge the client. I have seen how much hard work that goes into surgical procedures, but I still wonder what it is actually costing the vet clinic. I do realize that prices vary from place to place. Thank you. 🙂.

Edited to add: Darn. Typo in the title! Sorry.

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[philomycus]

It's not just the supplies and labor of the vet. It's gotta pay for the techs, the electricity, the disposal fees of sharps, the laundry detergent, the student loans eating the vet alive to put food on her/his own table.... this is just the beginning.

 

[chickenlittle]

Yeah, it's hard to itemize exact costs. For the most part, it typically breaks down something like this:

20-25% doctor pay
20-25% support staff pay
20-25% products/materials/etc
20-25% overhead (rent, licenses, maintenance, equipment fees, etc)
0-15% profit to owner

Hope that helps.

So, in your $300 spay....
$60-70 to the doctor who performs the surgery
$60-70 to the receptionist who schedules the appointment, the receptionist who checks the pet in, the techs who draw the bloodwork and place the catheter, the tech who monitors anesthesia, and the tech who recovers the pet, the tech who makes up meds and goes over discharge instructions, and the receptionist who checks out the pet
$60-70 for the cartridges to run bloodwork (as well as the syringe and blood sample tubes), the IV catheter (plus another syringe, flush, and tape), the injectable premeds (another syringe), the induction agent (another 2 syringes - one for induction and one for flush), the cap & mask for the doctor & tech, the surgical scrub used on the patient as well as the doctor's hands, the surgery gloves/gown, the suture, the scalpel blade, the isoflurane, the oxygen, the post-op pain injection (and syringe), etc
$60-70 to general clinic funds for maintaining the surgery instruments, maintaining the autoclave, maintaining the bloodwork machines, maintaining the anesthesia machine & monitoring equipment, keeping the electricity on, etc.

 

[HelloNello]

I think people also forget that our care isn't always covered by insurance (I know there are forms you can submit, but most of our clients don't do that). If you went to a doctor and paid $300 for care you wouldn't blink an eye, but spending it on pets seems so outrageous?

People buy $300 dollar phones and $2000 dollar computers, eat out every night, drive luxury cars and then freak out about having to pay $60 dollars to have their pet looked at by a professional individual who spent 4 years getting educated and going hundreds of thousands into debt?

I feel like this is something that most people in the vet community deal with on a daily basis and I just don't get why it is so outrageous to spend money on your animals. If you cant/do not want to pay for healthcare for your pets then don't own them.

Ultimately veterinary clinics and hospitals are businesses and have to make a profit. There are a lot of costs associated with running a quality facility. As caring as most veterinarian are they have to make a living and keep food on their tables.

JMO, but I think people need to suck it up. It isn't really a clients business to know what the clinics pay for vaccines, meds, and supplies because they don't understand all the other costs associated with running a successful practice.

 

[bbeventer]

People buy $300 dollar phones and $2000 dollar computers, eat out every night, drive luxury cars and then freak out about having to pay $60 dollars to have their pet looked at by a professional individual who spent 4 years getting educated and going hundreds of thousands into debt?

I feel like this is something that most people in the vet community deal with on a daily basis and I just don't get why it is so outrageous to spend money on your animals. If you cant/do not want to pay for healthcare for your pets then don't own them.

👍 Next time someone goes to see a vet and complains about a bill they should examine their raw doctor's bill before their insurance gets a hold of it, they may become slightly more appreciative.

 

[kakurubird]

I think it's also easy for clients who don't know much about vet med (or medicine in general) to not realize just how much goes into something like a spay, especially because the client isn't there seeing every step along the way, whereas when you go to the doctor, you kind of have to see much of what is done to you. It seems really easy to just not be aware of how many syringes and other materials are used, plus the number of different drugs, etc. and all the machines and such. I'm sure chickenlittle's breakdown would be eye-opening to many people.

 

[lareinesoleil]

I think people also forget that our care isn't always covered by insurance (I know there are forms you can submit, but most of our clients don't do that). If you went to a doctor and paid $300 for care you wouldn't blink an eye, but spending it on pets seems so outrageous?

People buy $300 dollar phones and $2000 dollar computers, eat out every night, drive luxury cars and then freak out about having to pay $60 dollars to have their pet looked at by a professional individual who spent 4 years getting educated and going hundreds of thousands into debt?

I feel like this is something that most people in the vet community deal with on a daily basis and I just don't get why it is so outrageous to spend money on your animals. If you cant/do not want to pay for healthcare for your pets then don't own them.

Ultimately veterinary clinics and hospitals are businesses and have to make a profit. There are a lot of costs associated with running a quality facility. As caring as most veterinarian are they have to make a living and keep food on their tables.

JMO, but I think people need to suck it up. It isn't really a clients business to know what the clinics pay for vaccines, meds, and supplies because they don't understand all the other costs associated with running a successful practice.

+1. Actually, +1000.

 

[Trematode]

👍 Next time someone goes to see a vet and complains about a bill they should examine their raw doctor's bill before their insurance gets a hold of it, they may become slightly more appreciative.

I live north of the US. People here do not see a real doctor bill. I did know someone without health insurance. He complained that a cleaning at the dentist was $118 and meds for his sore throat was $70 (one pill a day). He opted for the $20 meds (four pills a day).

I have been volunteering on and off at clinics for about 5 years now. I know this happens very frequently, but I witnessed my first irresponsible client the other night. Client brings in an adopted puppy with a fish hook in its mouth. She had a friend who worked at another clinic, but agreed to an exam ($60) anyway. She told the receptionist that she did not have the money for any other procedures. Anyway, we could not get the fish hook out and the dog was turning purple. She could not afford sedation. She flipped out about the $60 exam fee, came up with a ton of excuses about why she had no money, and could not understand why she had to pay money when the vet could not fix her dog.
I told my friend about the incident because it was eye-opening to me, and his response was "$60 for an exam fee?! You cannot tell me that they are NOT overcharging people!" Tried to explain that it is unreasonable to expect a vet to work for free and the cost of materials, which lead us to talking about the price of surgery (which he thought was expensive), the costs associated with starting up a clinic, cost of education, etc. It did not get through. I thought there would be a list or an article or something that outlines the cost or the vets have a way to respond to questions like that. I found an editorial that hit the nail right on the head but it was supposedly from the early 1900s. You are probably right. It may not be any of my business.

I told my friend that if he saw a spay, he would realize why it is so "expensive". I went as far as to look up the cost of a human hysterectomy in the US (closest thing I could compare to a spay) which is 4x-20x the cost of a spay depending on the bells and whistles.

Thank you for your responses. 🙂.

 

[Marsala]

I think that it's also important to note, however, that some vets go completely overboard. My example (ahem):

I woke up and saw that my pug had irritation/a scratch/something wrong with her eye. Made an appointment (not my regular vet-she was off that day, so the clinic owner) and we went in, she stained the cornea and looked at it, very obvious corneal ulcer. 5 minutes, tops. = $180. If I bought the meds online, they would have been about $40. That's a lot of profit, in my opinion.

 

[jmo1012]

I think that it's also important to note, however, that some vets go completely overboard. My example (ahem):

I woke up and saw that my pug had irritation/a scratch/something wrong with her eye. Made an appointment (not my regular vet-she was off that day, so the clinic owner) and we went in, she stained the cornea and looked at it, very obvious corneal ulcer. 5 minutes, tops. = $180. If I bought the meds online, they would have been about $40. That's a lot of profit, in my opinion.

perhaps next time you should just order your meds online then since you seem to have a good handle on what is/is not appropriate for an ophthalmic problem without any formal veterinary school training or equipment. hopefully you won't pick the wrong med and cause serious harm to your pet.


anyway, what i wanted to post was a link to a hospital i stumbled upon recently that has a very interesting and unique design-the surgery suite has a glass wall in the lobby so clients can watch what goes on! http://www.animalarts.biz/architect...ard-winning/polo-springs-veterinary-hospital/ not sure how i feel about it overall, but it definitely has its advantages and disadvantages.

 

[dyachei]

perhaps next time you should just order your meds online then since you seem to have a good handle on what is/is not appropriate for an ophthalmic problem without any formal veterinary school training or equipment. hopefully you won't pick the wrong med and cause serious harm to your pet.


anyway, what i wanted to post was a link to a hospital i stumbled upon recently that has a very interesting and unique design-the surgery suite has a glass wall in the lobby so clients can watch what goes on! http://www.animalarts.biz/architect...ard-winning/polo-springs-veterinary-hospital/ not sure how i feel about it overall, but it definitely has its advantages and disadvantages.

A lot of newer hospitals are adopting that model - it allows clients to view the surgical suite before having their pet undergo anesthesia. Most of them have blinds that they close during the actual procedures.

 

[jmo1012]

A lot of newer hospitals are adopting that model - it allows clients to view the surgical suite before having their pet undergo anesthesia. Most of them have blinds that they close during the actual procedures.

ahhh that would make a lot more sense!

 

[Marsala]

perhaps next time you should just order your meds online then since you seem to have a good handle on what is/is not appropriate for an ophthalmic problem without any formal veterinary school training or equipment. hopefully you won't pick the wrong med and cause serious harm to your pet.


anyway, what i wanted to post was a link to a hospital i stumbled upon recently that has a very interesting and unique design-the surgery suite has a glass wall in the lobby so clients can watch what goes on! http://www.animalarts.biz/architect...ard-winning/polo-springs-veterinary-hospital/ not sure how i feel about it overall, but it definitely has its advantages and disadvantages.

I didn't say that I had the training, thanks for the snark. But to me, $180 is a lot for 5 min.

 

[squeegee]

I think that it's also important to note, however, that some vets go completely overboard. My example (ahem):

I woke up and saw that my pug had irritation/a scratch/something wrong with her eye. Made an appointment (not my regular vet-she was off that day, so the clinic owner) and we went in, she stained the cornea and looked at it, very obvious corneal ulcer. 5 minutes, tops. = $180. If I bought the meds online, they would have been about $40. That's a lot of profit, in my opinion.

i think the breakdown of the prices are also important- like how much of that was the exam fee? fluorescein stain costs, and so does the ophthalmoscope used to visualize the ulcer, and the doctor/assistant/receptionist time....

 

[Marsala]

i think the breakdown of the prices are also important- like how much of that was the exam fee? fluorescein stain costs, and so does the ophthalmoscope used to visualize the ulcer, and the doctor/assistant/receptionist time....

The exam fee she charged was $80 (she charged a special fee for the eye exam), and $30 for the stain, $70 for meds. She didn't use the opthalmoscope, she just looked at it with her naked eye. No assistant, I held the dog.

 

[dyachei]

The exam fee she charged was $80 (she charged a special fee for the eye exam), and $30 for the stain, $70 for meds. She didn't use the opthalmoscope, she just looked at it with her naked eye. No assistant, I held the dog.

Another pertinent question is what the cost of living is in your area - a lot of times in higher cost of living areas, office visits are more expensive (as in most vet clinics in the area). Did she use a black light to look at the stain?

$30 for the stain is cheaper than what we charge.

Also, at least in this state, you can demand a written prescription instead of filling it there and go to any pharmacy.

 

[Marsala]

Another pertinent question is what the cost of living is in your area - a lot of times in higher cost of living areas, office visits are more expensive (as in most vet clinics in the area). Did she use a black light to look at the stain?

$30 for the stain is cheaper than what we charge.

Also, at least in this state, you can demand a written prescription instead of filling it there and go to any pharmacy.

No black light. Nothing except the naked eye. This part of the country has a very reasonable cost of living, especially when compared to major cities. I'll ask for a script next time (there won't be a next time with that particular vet). So that people don't jump my case and think I'm siding with the people who believe in free veterinary care: The vet I normally see charges very reasonably (works in the same clinic). I have no problem paying for vet care. My point was just simply that $180 is a lot of money. I have yet to perfect the art of farting dollar bills.😀

Also to add: I don't have a smart phone (or any sort of $300 phone), cable, or a decent car (it's the $200 wonder car). Seems like I have to CMA.

 

[jtom]

It can be very surprising at some of the clinics how much they charge for services. The clinic I work at we are known for being cheap compared to the competition but several of the other clinics have very expensive brand new facilities and have more curb appeal. Alot of clients are willing to pay top dollar at those clinics because of the appearance which they believe means a much higher standard of care. And I am not saying the standard of care isnt better but I think most of the extra charges is being used for the building and appearance.

At my clinic all services cost the same regardless of the doctor.

 

[LetItSnow]

anyway, what i wanted to post was a link to a hospital i stumbled upon recently that has a very interesting and unique design-the surgery suite has a glass wall in the lobby so clients can watch what goes on!

I think letting clients 'behind the scenes' is becoming more common, and certainly how I'd like to practice if it is an option when I'm an associate (and it WILL be an option when I'm an owner).

I was just at one facility that has a separate dental room (two tables, shared radiology between the tables), a very large operating suite, and a large general treatment area. And by large, I mean huger-than-you're-imagining. They also have a 'green room' of sorts for clients whose animals are undergoing treatment. The clients are welcome to come and go from the green room into the treatment/dental/surgical areas as they wish in order to observe the care their animal is receiving.

JMO, but I think people need to suck it up. It isn't really a clients business to know what the clinics pay for vaccines, meds, and supplies because they don't understand all the other costs associated with running a successful practice.

I think that speaking INSIDE the industry I agree with you. But part of our industry problem is that we project that attitude outwardly, too. "Quit complaining, you don't need to know what I'm doing, just trust me." That won't wash with many/most clients. If we want to survive as an industry, we have to (among many other changes) start educating our clients about the cost associated with providing care for their animals. We can't just say "suck it up" because that won't work.

It IS their business to know why it costs what it does, because they're the ones footing the bill. If I were a client and asked why something cost what it did and the vet gave me a flippant answer like 'suck it up, it's none of your business' .... they wouldn't get any return visits from me.

Even doing free clinics where the client isn't paying much, you'd still be surprised how suspicious some of them are toward medical care in general. I've had people refuse rabies vaccinations because of fear. I've had people react suspiciously to deworming treatment. I've had people outright say "I don't want you to draw blood because I don't think you can really tell much from it." In ever case the only response we have is education.

So. Long rant, but my advice is to soften your attitude toward people who complain about their cost. Understand that they DON'T understand why it's so much, so from their perspective it's reasonable to be upset. The best resolution is simply education and building relationship.

 

[dyachei]

No black light. Nothing except the naked eye. This part of the country has a very reasonable cost of living, especially when compared to major cities. I'll ask for a script next time (there won't be a next time with that particular vet). So that people don't jump my case and think I'm siding with the people who believe in free veterinary care: The vet I normally see charges very reasonably (works in the same clinic). I have no problem paying for vet care. My point was just simply that $180 is a lot of money. I have yet to perfect the art of farting dollar bills.😀

Also to add: I don't have a smart phone (or any sort of $300 phone), cable, or a decent car (it's the $200 wonder car). Seems like I have to CMA.

At the clinic I work at, for the exact same thing (which I saw today, btw), we would charge about $130 depending on the work up, of course. That is for a simple uncomplicated ulcer.

I guess I would be concerned that there is a high discrepancy between doctors at the same clinic - it should be standard at the clinic.

 

[orca2011]

I think the cost of vet care is something people are always going to complain about, unfortunately. I currently work at a clinic part of a humane society, so we offer discounted rates (an exam is $44, vacc $21 or $31 depending on the type and most meds are $15). We even have a 20% discount if your income falls within a certain range or if you're part of our Animeals program. Either way, we still have people complain to us about prices on a daily basis. And part of it definitely has to deal with our location (it's in a city that has just been ranked like the poorest in the US based on size) but part of it is just people not willing to pay that money. And somehow many of these people think it's okay to continue buying/adopting animals when they can't even afford the care of one...

 

[alliecat44]

No black light. Nothing except the naked eye. This part of the country has a very reasonable cost of living, especially when compared to major cities. I'll ask for a script next time (there won't be a next time with that particular vet). So that people don't jump my case and think I'm siding with the people who believe in free veterinary care: The vet I normally see charges very reasonably (works in the same clinic). I have no problem paying for vet care. My point was just simply that $180 is a lot of money. I have yet to perfect the art of farting dollar bills.😀

Also to add: I don't have a smart phone (or any sort of $300 phone), cable, or a decent car (it's the $200 wonder car). Seems like I have to CMA.

So just curious--when you see the other vet at this practice on an emergency basis, is the office visit the same price ($80)?

Listening to the breakdown, I actually think it's very reasonable. You paid $80 for an exam, $30 for diagnostics and $70 for medications.

Eye medications can be very pricey and most clinics mark them up very little because the cost to the clinic itself is so high.

I wouldn't lump in the cost of meds with your "I paid $180 for five minutes" issue. .I would say that you paid $110 for an examination and a diagnosis--which took such little time due to the veterinarian's knowledge and professional experience.

Quite honestly, the vet saved you money by not doing a Schirmer tear test or checking intraocular pressures--both of which could certainly have reasonably been done in that situation with that presenting complaint. With the exam fee you're also paying for her knowledge in determining which tests SHOULDN'T be done in your particular case. (Depends on breed, age, location of ulcer, eyelid/orbit comformation, etc.)

 

[Marsala]

So just curious--when you see the other vet at this practice on an emergency basis, is the office visit the same price ($80)?

Listening to the breakdown, I actually think it's very reasonable. You paid $80 for an exam, $30 for diagnostics and $70 for medications.I would say that you paid $110 for an examination and a diagnosis--which took such little time due to the veterinarian's knowledge and professional experience.

Eye medications can be very pricey and most clinics don't mark them up hardly at all because the cost to the clinic itself is so high.

I wouldn't lump in the cost of meds with your "I paid $180 for five minutes" issue.

Quite honestly, the vet saved you money by not doing a Schirmer tear test or checking intraocular pressures--both of which could certainly have reasonably been done in that situation with that presenting complaint. With the exam fee you're also paying for her knowledge in determining which tests SHOULDN'T be done in your particular case. (Depends on breed, age, location of ulcer, eyelid/orbit comformation, etc.)

It wasn't an emergency visit. I called and scheduled the first available regular appointment. If I go to the local teaching hospital for an emergency visit (after hours), the office call is $60. If I had known that this particular vet was going to charge an $80 office visit, I would have driven an hour to the clinic that I work at for the discount. Lesson learned.

 

[squeegee]

No black light. Nothing except the naked eye. This part of the country has a very reasonable cost of living, especially when compared to major cities. I'll ask for a script next time (there won't be a next time with that particular vet). So that people don't jump my case and think I'm siding with the people who believe in free veterinary care: The vet I normally see charges very reasonably (works in the same clinic). I have no problem paying for vet care. My point was just simply that $180 is a lot of money. I have yet to perfect the art of farting dollar bills.😀

Also to add: I don't have a smart phone (or any sort of $300 phone), cable, or a decent car (it's the $200 wonder car). Seems like I have to CMA.

since you said that the person you saw today was the clinic owner, and probably is the one who's in charge of pricing/etc., is it possible the other vet you usually see is actually undercharging you?

 

[alliecat44]

It wasn't an emergency visit. I called and scheduled the first available regular appointment. If I go to the local teaching hospital for an emergency visit (after hours), the office call is $60. If I had known that this particular vet was going to charge an $80 office visit, I would have driven an hour to the clinic that I work at for the discount. Lesson learned.

So two hours of your time spent driving (roundtrip) + gas is worth less than $20 (difference in exam prices)? Just trying to pinpoint the issue...

 

[breenie]

Knowing where Marsala is from, $80 seems a bit high for an exam fee.

Meds and the rest sound reasonable though.

 

[Marsala]

So two hours of your time spent driving (roundtrip) + gas is worth less than $20 (difference in exam prices)? Just trying to pinpoint the issue...

I didn't want to have to call my advisor and ask for the time off, coupled with the fact that Wondercar doesn't like driving so much. I try to drive as little as possible so that Wondercar behaves and doesn't snap another axle and such. If I waited until the next time I worked, it would have been way more than a $20 difference. But, eyeballs are important = don't wait until next shift.

Squeegee, the other vet probably gives me a break of some sort, as I do give her quite a bit of business. I suppose she figures she will get it out of me over the long-term instead of all at once, lol.

I appreciate everyone who has replied politely. I was just voicing that I am a broke-ass student trying to do the best I can for my dog, and that I think monetary denominations over $100 = a lot of money. I am not claiming to be an expert (although I can recognize that squinting & discoloration = eye problem), diminishing the education or value of time of veterinarians, or anything else. I would be really excited if someone handed me $100. I think there are some people who wouldn't be as excited, as it is 'only' $100. It's just a function of where one is at in life, I think.

 

[Marsala]

Knowing where Marsala is from, $80 seems a bit high for an exam fee.

Meds and the rest sound reasonable though.

Breenie, it was on the east side, which to me also makes a difference.

 

[alliecat44]

I think monetary denominations over $100 = a lot of money.

👍

Hey, I totally agree with this statement, having over $250,000 in student loans to pay off! I'm living even more cheaply as an intern than I did as a student (which is saying something).

I am not/was not trying to be argumentative, but you phrased your original issue as "some vets go completely overboard and here's an example"--NOT "hey this is a lot of money for a poor college student" (which is certainly something all of us can relate to).

Just FYI.

I'm glad your dog is feeling better, FWIW. I wouldn't have been able to pay the $180 as I don't have that much in my checking account ATM! 🙂

 

[Trematode]

I am holding out on getting a dog because I know how much it costs for routine things and emergencies. I just cannot bring myself to use bank money (which is for cost of living and tuition while I am in school) on an animal at this point in my life when my future is so uncertain. I have never owned a dog (funny that I want to be a vet) and have been tempted for years to just go out and get myself one. Not until I am in a more stable living situation (I have no idea where I will be in 6 months time) and I can start seeing away out of my debt. I don't know how you guys do it, but applause to you for making it work. 👍.

It still bothers me though that the shelter WILL LET A GIRL WHO HAS NO MONEY ADOPT A PUPPY. When it comes time for that puppy to be spayed, I do not even want to know how she is going to do it. Maybe her friend (that was giving her dewormer/flea preventative) can sneak her in to be fixed (or so I hope). People suck. That is the end of my rant about people. I have to get used to it because it is only going to get worse!

 

[Marsala]

I'm glad your dog is feeling better, FWIW. I wouldn't have been able to pay the $180 as I don't have that much in my checking account ATM! 🙂

Thanks! (I don't have $180 left right now either. Let's hear it for getting paid once a month!)

 

[breenie]

To play a little bit of devil's advocate...

I understand a client being galled by 5 minutes of time with a veterinarian and getting a $180 bill. I think we have a responsibility to educate our clients and impart some perceived value onto them. Maybe the vet should have spent a little more time chatting with Marsala and giving a better impression of a more thorough exam to make the money spent feel more worthwhile.

Not saying she did a bad job or anything, but I DO think we have a duty to make our clients feel like our services are worth the fees (within reason, some people are just cheap).

 

[dyachei]

To play a little bit of devil's advocate...

I understand a client being galled by 5 minutes of time with a veterinarian and getting a $180 bill. I think we have a responsibility to educate our clients and impart some perceived value onto them. Maybe the vet should have spent a little more time chatting with Marsala and giving a better impression of a more thorough exam to make the money spent feel more worthwhile.

Not saying she did a bad job or anything, but I DO think we have a duty to make our clients feel like our services are worth the fees (within reason, some people are just cheap).

Agree. Personally, when clients balk at prices, I typically explain what we do and why. Education is the best tool for explaining value.

 

[alliecat44]

Agreed. This is an excellent example of perceived value.

 

[Minnerbelle]

I think that speaking INSIDE the industry I agree with you. But part of our industry problem is that we project that attitude outwardly, too. "Quit complaining, you don't need to know what I'm doing, just trust me." That won't wash with many/most clients. If we want to survive as an industry, we have to (among many other changes) start educating our clients about the cost associated with providing care for their animals. We can't just say "suck it up" because that won't work.

It IS their business to know why it costs what it does, because they're the ones footing the bill. If I were a client and asked why something cost what it did and the vet gave me a flippant answer like 'suck it up, it's none of your business' .... they wouldn't get any return visits from me.

I think we have a responsibility to educate our clients and impart some perceived value onto them. Maybe the vet should have spent a little more time chatting with Marsala and giving a better impression of a more thorough exam to make the money spent feel more worthwhile.

👍👍👍 To both comments. Esp in vet med, where different clinics will undercharge for certain services for whatever reason and there can be pretty big differences in price for what a client perceives to be "the same service," I don't think it's reasonable to expect our clients to be 100% trusting of our fee schedules. Clients shouldn't be expected to know what a reasonable cost is for all procedures (don't we all hate the client that calls around and price shops for every procedure?). So unless a client is really dumb and a likely victim of scams, the only way for clients to turn over a large sum of money for a service they don't know the price of is through trust. And that trust has got to be EARNED. I've def known a few vets who took that for granted, and got clients really upset about the bill due to lack of communication/trust building.

 

[bbeventer]

To play a little bit of devil's advocate...

I understand a client being galled by 5 minutes of time with a veterinarian and getting a $180 bill. I think we have a responsibility to educate our clients and impart some perceived value onto them. Maybe the vet should have spent a little more time chatting with Marsala and giving a better impression of a more thorough exam to make the money spent feel more worthwhile.

Not saying she did a bad job or anything, but I DO think we have a duty to make our clients feel like our services are worth the fees (within reason, some people are just cheap).

👍 Personally, when I go in with a complaint it gives me warm fuzzys when a vet takes the time to look over my whole animal and then the problem. Makes me feel like they are not trying to get me in and out, that they care for the welfare of my animal, and that my money wasn't totally wasted on a neosporin diagnosis.

 

[SilverSpyderGT]

Also, comparing a spay to any other abdominal procedure is comparing apples to oranges. Many clinics treat spays/neuters as loss leaders intended to get new clients in the door and help control overpopulation, whereas going into an abdomen to do anything other than remove two normal ovaries and a normal uterus in a healthy dog/cat is going to be disproportionately more expensive than a "routine" spay.

NB: No spay is ever truly "routine."

 

[HelloNello]

So. Long rant, but my advice is to soften your attitude toward people who complain about their cost. Understand that they DON'T understand why it's so much, so from their perspective it's reasonable to be upset. The best resolution is simply education and building relationship.

I've definitely been told I have an abrasive personality, so I apologize for coming off harsh in terms of clients who complain about cost. I agree education is 100% important for helping people understand why they are getting charged what they are getting charged. It is definitely their business to understand what treatments they are receiving and why they are receiving them. However, my issue is with individuals who complain about cost because they don't value the doctor's time or knowledge. That frustrates me beyond belief. For instance:

Individual A has appointment at 10:20 and has to wait until 10:25 to be seen by a doctor. Upon receiving his/her bill, individual A asks for a 5% discount because they had to wait five minutes.

Or the person who shows up 20 minutes last to a 20 minute appointment. Complains about waiting until the next appointment is done. Asks every question under the sun and takes up 90 minutes of the doctors time and then asks for a "senior" discount?

This all being said I still would be uncomfortable telling a client I pay $60 dollars to the lab to send out bloodwork, yet I charge them $260. I'm not uncomfortable because it is unethical, but I am uncomfortable because I don't think they would understand. A lot of clients I interact with think it is wrong that we charge them more than we have to pay. In a perfect world explaining why we hike up the cost so much would help clients to understand better, but I just don't think it would sit well with some people.

I feel like I am getting a reputation for being long-winded on here...sorry SDN world for posting epic essays about my feelings/beliefs!

I have yet to perfect the art of farting dollar bills

If you figure this out please share the secret because I could definitely use money!

 

[Marsala]

If you figure this out please share the secret because I could definitely use money!

I will let you know, and then I'll park myself on a beach in the Caribbean with a can of beans.

 

[LetItSnow]

I've definitely been told I have an abrasive personality, so I apologize for coming off harsh in terms of clients who complain about cost.

No need to apologize! I think we ALL share the same frustration, and I don't think there's anything at all wrong with a little behind-the-scenes commiserating. I only think that when it comes time to put on our 'game face' we need to be understanding and go for an educational approach. As irritating as it is, I sorta "get" why clients don't have a clue how much our services are worth; and in large part that's OUR fault.

However, my issue is with individuals who complain about cost because they don't value the doctor's time or knowledge.

How would they know how much to value the doctor's time? What would cause them to believe that time/knowledge should be valued at the cost being set? If you accept that most people think our degrees are cheaply obtained in 2-year programs and are nowhere near the depth of an MD program - then it starts to make sense why they question the typical exam price.

This all being said I still would be uncomfortable telling a client I pay $60 dollars to the lab to send out bloodwork, yet I charge them $260.

I reread your post a little while ago and realized that when you talked about sharing the cost, you meant the specific/exact cost of a particular component (like, how much it cost you to send out a lab test or something). I don't think that level of detail is probably necessary, and may be counterproductive for exactly the reason you mentioned (it might raise their level of frustration to see a mark-up, rather than help educate them about the value the veterinarian is providing).

You'll have to forgive me... it's been a particularly stressful weekend with a kinda ugly set of back-to-back tests this week.... that I'm doing a remarkable job of ignoring at the moment. 😉

 

[HelloNello]

How would they know how much to value the doctor's time? What would cause them to believe that time/knowledge should be valued at the cost being set? If you accept that most people think our degrees are cheaply obtained in 2-year programs and are nowhere near the depth of an MD program - then it starts to make sense why they question the typical exam price.

That is a really good point. I guess this is where education becomes especially important. I have always believed education is one of the most important responsibilities of a vet.

You'll have to forgive me... it's been a particularly stressful weekend with a kinda ugly set of back-to-back tests this week.... that I'm doing a remarkable job of ignoring at the moment. 😉

Haha. Goodluck on those tests.

 

[Bearby]

I didn't say that I had the training, thanks for the snark. But to me, $180 is a lot for 5 min.

Yes, $180 is a lot. However, I would like to put this into perspective by using my experiences at human doctors offices.

I was having severe back pain a few years ago, like I couldn't walk by the end of the day every day. I went to urgent care (which, yes, is a little bit more expensive but the exam fee is usually <$80) and used my insurance. I did receive an invoice at the end of my visit stating the total for my exam. I saw the doctor for a total of 1 minute, she didn't even touch my back, and ran out the door. The total cost of that encounter was almost $200. I didn't have any diagnostics or medications given to me at that clinic. I have since been back to that same urgent care clinic and the cost of the exam is significantly lower, so I don't really understand.

On a separate occasion, I was sent to see a doctor under workman's comp because I was bit by a cat. Before heading to the doctor's office I scrubbed and flushed the wounds with surgical scrub and one of the vets wrapped me. When I arrived at the doctor's office, the nurse took off the bandages I had on, the doctor looked at said "looks like you did a good job, we'll rewrap them" and left so that the nurse could put on crappy bandages that I had to redo as soon as I got home. Again, about a minute with the doctor. This lovely experience cost a whopping $500. I have a lot to rant about with this situation but I'll leave it at that and it's probably buried in the rant thread somewhere if you're really interested in why workman's comp sucks.

Anyway, point being, everyone overcharges because everyone has to make a living. Vets get the worst of it because people don't use insurance to cover their pets' medical costs.

Someone said that the cost of a human hysterectomy is 5-20x the cost of an animal spay...that's actually really low. The cost is usually between 15k-20k for the same procedure that we do in dogs and cats to be done to a human. You can usually get a print out from a human hospital with an itemized invoice to show your clients that you're not ripping them off.

Well I should get back to studying now

 

[libster06]

Knowing where Marsala is from, $80 seems a bit high for an exam fee.

Meds and the rest sound reasonable though.

Right. I would be less than pleased if I got charged $80 for an office visit. No, I do not think that, under a regular exam circumstance, is a fair, justifiable charge.

Meds, and diagnostics are fair (eye meds ARE potentially very expensive), however I will stand by my statement that $80 to see the doctor is ridiculous and kind of friggin pretentious.

I will also agree with Marsala and say that I would not go back to a doctor who charges that much for an exam fee. There are perfectly good vets who charge $50 and $60 fees.

 

[Minnerbelle]

I will also agree with Marsala and say that I would not go back to a doctor who charges that much for an exam fee. There are perfectly good vets who charge $50 and $60 fees.

And as a consumer, you have every right not to go back. But it sounds like the usual exam fee is lower at this clinic, and the $80 was for an office visit + "eye exam." And if you personally feel it's unreasonable to charge extra for the "eye exam," that's your prerogative. But I don't think it's wrong for the clinic to charge it. The clinic prob could have done a better job of communicating so that Marsala wasn't taken off guard with the extra fee. It sounds like what upset her most was the discrepancy between what she'd expected (that the eye exam would be included in the office visit) and what she got.

 

[libster06]

And as a consumer, you have every right not to go back. But it sounds like the usual exam fee is lower at this clinic, and the $80 was for an office visit + "eye exam." And if you personally feel it's unreasonable to charge extra for the "eye exam," that's your prerogative. But I don't think it's wrong for the clinic to charge it.

I just don't understand why they would tack on an additional "eye exam" fee. The OP was coming in FOR an eye exam... therefore ringing up an extraextra charge for it does not even make sense?? Unless the OP brought their dog in for a completely different issue, and then proceeded to do the whole "break out the laundry list of what else they wanted done now that they're there", in which case I can totally (and often do) see charges being racked up for time/manpower/brainpower spent on issues that were not planned for originally. Otherwise, no, I don't see how charging an eye exam fee is necessary or justified.

 

[StartingoverVet]

I just don't understand why they would tack on an additional "eye exam" fee. The OP was coming in FOR an eye exam... therefore ringing up an extraextra charge for it does not even make sense?? Unless the OP brought their dog in for a completely different issue, and then proceeded to do the whole "break out the laundry list of what else they wanted done now that they're there", in which case I can totally (and often do) see charges being racked up for time/manpower/brainpower spent on issues that were not planned for originally. Otherwise, no, I don't see how charging an eye exam fee is necessary or justified.

a regular exam gets charged a regular fee. It has the usual expertise and instruments required.

An eye exam requires more expertise and often needs more specialist instruments. So you charge more.

My $0.02.

Not saying you necessarily have a specialist, but perhaps you do . More schooling = more costs = higher fee. Or more experience = higher fee.

 

[libster06]

a regular exam gets charged a regular fee. It has the usual expertise and instruments required.

An eye exam requires more expertise and often needs more specialist instruments. So you charge more.

My $0.02.

Not saying you necessarily have a specialist, but perhaps you do . More schooling = more costs = higher fee. Or more experience = higher fee.

....again pretense!

Yeayeayea, well they're takin a risk with that kinda space cash nonsense... what do I look like a bank?! 😛

 

[bunnity]

A clinic I worked at had a regular exam fee. They also had one day a week where a particular doctor would do cardiac exam / workups. This doctor had taken a TON of CE (expensive) about cardiac issues and all the cases and diagnostics were consulted on by an actual cardiologist from another practice. So these cardiac exams did have their own, higher exam fee because there were multiple doctors with specialized education involved.

This is a little different from the OP's situation but they may have something similar at that practice, and whoever made the invoice just punched "eye exam" into the computer invoice without thinking about it too much.

That said, as a vet or tech, you should run the price of something by the client before doing anything. And as a client, it is also YOUR job to say "I have financial limitations. Can we talk about money before we do anything?"

 

[cowgirla]

I just don't understand why they would tack on an additional "eye exam" fee. The OP was coming in FOR an eye exam... therefore ringing up an extraextra charge for it does not even make sense?? Unless the OP brought their dog in for a completely different issue, and then proceeded to do the whole "break out the laundry list of what else they wanted done now that they're there", in which case I can totally (and often do) see charges being racked up for time/manpower/brainpower spent on issues that were not planned for originally. Otherwise, no, I don't see how charging an eye exam fee is necessary or justified.

The eye exam probably covers the cost of the fluoroscein stain (or whatever was used) and any special equipment needed. I know at my clinic EACH fluoroscein stain strip was ~15.00. We charged for those separately but I'm sure some clinics just have them under an "eye exam" fee.

 

[Trilt]

The eye exam probably covers the cost of the fluoroscein stain (or whatever was used) and any special equipment needed. I know at my clinic EACH fluoroscein stain strip was ~15.00. We charged for those separately but I'm sure some clinics just have them under an "eye exam" fee.

She said that was charged for separately earlier:

The exam fee she charged was $80 (she charged a special fee for the eye exam), and $30 for the stain, $70 for meds. She didn't use the opthalmoscope, she just looked at it with her naked eye. No assistant, I held the dog.