How much of a difference is there between a 3.9 and 4.0 in the eyes of an ADCOM?

[pioneer22]

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any other thoughts on if Computer Science degrees are considered engineering in the eyes of adcoms? @LizzyM @Goro ?

 

[LizzyM]

any other thoughts on if Computer Science degrees are considered engineering in the eyes of adcoms? @LizzyM @Goro ?

In what school does it reside? (College of Arts & Sciences, Engineering, etc)

 

[pioneer22]

In what school does it reside? (College of Arts & Sciences, Engineering, etc)

Almost all schools have CS in the engineering schools; some offer a Arts and Sciences CS major also, with the same classes though

 

[LizzyM]

Almost all schools have CS in the engineering schools; some offer a Arts and Sciences CS major also, with the same classes though

Why does it matter? Is this about calling something BCPM or not? Some adcoms really like engineering majors and cut them some slack but I've most often seen that for biomedical engineers, electrical engineers, etc. Not so much for computer science. Rather rare degree among applicants IIRC.

 

[pioneer22]

Why does it matter? Is this about calling something BCPM or not? Some adcoms really like engineering majors and cut them some slack but I've most often seen that for biomedical engineers, electrical engineers, etc. Not so much for computer science. Rather rare degree among applicants IIRC.

I guess I'm asking if you see a Computer Science major, do you give them slack like you would give an engineering major, since they have very similar rigors to the undergrad programs?

 

[Goro]

any other thoughts on if Computer Science degrees are considered engineering in the eyes of adcoms? @LizzyM @Goro ?

To tell the truth, I don't care. Haven't thought about it. Just do well.

 

[Goro]

I guess I'm asking if you see a Computer Science major, do you give them slack like you would give an engineering major, since they have very similar rigors to the undergrad programs?

I also don't give anyone any slack. I expect you to do well. In my own experience, I've seen engineering students struggle with med school.

 

[begoood95]

I also don't give anyone any slack. I expect you to do well. In my own experience, I've seen engineering students struggle with med school.

Yup. We all know engineering is not actually science 😉

I always give my engineering friends crap for this. They hate it. It's hilarious.

 

[LizzyM]

Some adcom members will cut some slack to some applicants who have the word ENGINEERING in their major. Some will not. I've never seen anyone cut any slack for being a Computer Science major. Life is unfair.

 

[JimmyJimJim]

Yup. We all know engineering is not actually science 😉

I always give my engineering friends crap for this. They hate it. It's hilarious.

I don't find that very funny at all, though I guess that's what you're after.

 

[begoood95]

I don't find that very funny at all, though I guess that's what you're after.

Just ruffling some feathers, friend. You gotta be able to laugh at yourself sometimes! Too much seriousness will drive us to insanity, especially in our pre-med realm.

 

[JimmyJimJim]

I also don't give anyone any slack. I expect you to do well. In my own experience, I've seen engineering students struggle with med school.

I'm surprised that you've seen engineers struggle with med school. Would you say that relates to many of them being non-traditional applicants who are pursuing medicine after years in engineering and their stint outside of the academic sphere made them lose their academic edge?

 

[JimmyJimJim]

Just ruffling some feathers, friend. You gotta be able to laugh at yourself sometimes! Too much seriousness will drive us to insanity, especially in our pre-med realm.

Well ruffled sir, most well ruffled indeed.

 

[begoood95]

I'm surprised that you've seen engineers struggle with med school. Would you say that relates to many of them being non-traditional applicants who are pursuing medicine after years in engineering and their stint outside of the academic sphere made them lose their academic edge?

A majority of applicants are traditional, so, probably, "many of them" are not non-traditional.

Warning, I'm about to make some sweeping generalizations, but -- at least in my experience -- engineering majors have a certain "attitude" (not necessarily bad). I think this certain "composure," on occasion, doesn't mesh well with the sort of "attitude" you need in medicine or in medical school. Again, I'm sure many (probably a majority) of engineering students excel in medical school. Still, I can see how others struggle.

 

[Goro]

I'm surprised that you've seen engineers struggle with med school. Would you say that relates to many of them being non-traditional applicants who are pursuing medicine after years in engineering and their stint outside of the academic sphere made them lose their academic edge?

No, I think it's do to they way they were trained.

I had one ex-engineer who was performing at the bottom of his Class. As course coordinator, I regularly called him to see what was going on. He kept saying over and over, "As an engineer, I was trained this way..."

He finally shut up when my Pathology colleague pointed out "Your days as an engineer ended the day you put on that white coat".

 

[mwsapphire]

No, I think it's do to they way they were trained.

I had one ex-engineer who was performing at the bottom of his Class. As course coordinator, I regularly called him to see what was going on. He kept saying over and over, "As an engineer, I was trained this way..."

He finally shut up when my Pathology colleague pointed out "Your days as an engineer ended the day you put on that white coat".

So is that engineers are trained to not care about grades as much/raw numbers don't matter as much? Is that it?
I have a few engineering classmates and they don't care about GPA the way pre-meds do, but is that the reason they don't perform well in med school?
That's so weird. I never thought engineering students would struggle once they get to med school.

 

[JimmyJimJim]

No, I think it's do to they way they were trained.

I had one ex-engineer who was performing at the bottom of his Class. As course coordinator, I regularly called him to see what was going on. He kept saying over and over, "As an engineer, I was trained this way..."

He finally shut up when my Pathology colleague pointed out "Your days as an engineer ended the day you put on that white coat".

I wonder what he was referring to specifically, I'd like to avoid making the same mistakes.

 

[JimmyJimJim]

A majority of applicants are traditional, so, probably, "many of them" are not non-traditional.

Warning, I'm about to make some sweeping generalizations, but -- at least in my experience -- engineering majors have a certain "attitude" (not necessarily bad). I think this certain "composure," on occasion, doesn't mesh well with the sort of "attitude" you need in medicine or in medical school. Again, I'm sure many (probably a majority) of engineering students excel in medical school. Still, I can see how others struggle.

An arrogance? Definitely something to avoid if that's what you mean. Though, I don't have much to be arrogant about so I may be in the clear on that one.

 

[begoood95]

An arrogance? Definitely something to avoid if that's what you mean. Though, I don't have much to be arrogant about so I may be in the clear on that one.

I don't know if I'd go so far as to say "arrogance," but I guess that could be one potential explanation. I think @Goro was referring to the dependence on a type of "formulaic" thinking bred into (again, some, not all) engineers. A scientist proper might be more of an independent thinker, creating, testing and evaluating hypotheses, and a master of critical analyses. The case could be made that an engineer (again, sweeping generalizations, so don't take anything personally!) is usually concerned with only the outcome of her or his engineering product, and rarely questions the theoretical basis behind them.

As such, in the world of medicine (in the pathology, etiology, progression, and etc. of disease), formulaic thinking doesn't get you as far, and therefore, engineers (or anyone for that matter) with such a mode of thought can be disadvantaged, and would have to change their perspective to be as successful as others.

 

[JimmyJimJim]

I don't know if I'd go so far as to say "arrogance," but I guess that could be one potential explanation. I think @Goro was referring to the dependence on a type of "formulaic" thinking bred into (again, some, not all) engineers. A scientist proper might be more of an independent thinker, creating, testing and evaluating hypotheses, and a master of critical analyses. The case could be made that an engineer (again, sweeping generalizations, so don't take anything personally!) is usually concerned with only the outcome of her or his engineering product, and rarely questions the theoretical basis behind them.

As such, in the world of medicine (in the pathology, etiology, progression, and etc. of disease), formulaic thinking doesn't get you as far, and therefore, engineers (or anyone for that matter) with such a mode of thought can be disadvantaged, and would have to change their perspective to be as successful as others.

I see, the difference between critical reasoning and formulaic thinking. Also, the desire for the end-goal as opposed to worrying about the minutia in regards to how to get there.

Thanks for pointing this out, I'll have to be mindful of that. Thanks also for including the caveats about this not applying to all engineers, I'm just a little testy because this semester decided to pull my poor GPA into a dark alley, squeeze its spine like an accordion and play a polka on it with brass knuckles.

 

[Goro]

So is that engineers are trained to not care about grades as much/raw numbers don't matter as much? Is that it?
I have a few engineering classmates and they don't care about GPA the way pre-meds do, but is that the reason they don't perform well in med school?
That's so weird. I never thought engineering students would struggle once they get to med school.

Not being familiar with the curriculum of engineering schools, I haven't a clue.

 

[CommyO]

Not being familiar with the curriculum of engineering schools, I haven't a clue.

Basically a lot of math and physics & chem based courses that describe mechanics, fluids, and energy. IMO engineers are naturally smarter than premeds but premeds tend to outwork them. Maybe they're used to not working as hard which leads to doing subpar in med school idk

 

[Aerus]

Some adcom members will cut some slack to some applicants who have the word ENGINEERING in their major. Some will not. I've never seen anyone cut any slack for being a Computer Science major. Life is unfair.

I think that's pretty fair. Computer Science isn't known for its harsh rigor compared to fields like Chemical and Electrical Engineering. At my school, the GPAs of CS majors are quite high, comparable to the Biology majors.

 

[JimmyJimJim]

Basically a lot of math and physics & chem based courses that describe mechanics, fluids, and energy. IMO engineers are naturally smarter than premeds but premeds tend to outwork them. Maybe they're used to not working as hard which leads to doing subpar in med school idk

The classes are tough, but I wouldn't go so far as to say engineering majors are smarter than other majors. I just enjoy making things and spelling things with my grades.

 

[Dr_Grabow]

Closer to 3.7. I'll focus on getting as good a score on the MCAT as possible over the next few months. Thanks for the words of encouragement.

My undergraduate was in chemical engineering. I am so thankful that I chose engineering over the typical pre-med majors. Engineering teaches you how to think and problem solve. Excellent choice.

 

[mwsapphire]

My undergraduate was in chemical engineering. I am so thankful that I chose engineering over the typical pre-med majors. Engineering teaches you how to think and problem solve. Excellent choice.

But not designed to have a strong gpa ( only a handful of classes Bio majors take will be curve to below-a-C average, but many engineering classes are, but that's just hearsay.)
I feel like your GPA can really suffer if you do engineering, it a risk you would need to calculate.

 

[FindMeOnTheLinks]

0.1

 

[Dr_Grabow]

But not designed to have a strong gpa ( only a handful of classes Bio majors take will be curve to below-a-C average, but many engineering classes are, but that's just hearsay.)
I feel like your GPA can really suffer if you do engineering, it a risk you would need to calculate.

By strong GPA, do you mean one in which the classes have not been curved? If you're saying that engineering is curved more severely and therefore is not as rigorous, then this is an interesting point that you bring to the conversation. It was explained to me by the leaders of my program that they would rather ensure that the tests were difficult enough by preventing the average from being over 75% and then curve them up, rather than having them not be sufficiently challenging. Thus, I would argue that the two are incomparable.

If you are claiming that it is easier to obtain an engineering degree due to this curving, then that is fine. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. But, from the time of our first chemical engineering specific course to graduation, over two-thirds of our entering class did not finish / dropped out of the program. So, engineering is by no means an easy way out.

 

[wanderingorion]

Well, we could have a ball with this, but I dont want to screw around , especially with inexperienced readers. In fact, I think I will just withdraw

What is with SDN and their damn puns?? It's disgusting!

 

[mwsapphire]

By strong GPA, do you mean one in which the classes have not been curved? If you're saying that engineering is curved more severely and therefore is not as rigorous, then this is an interesting point that you bring to the conversation. It was explained to me by the leaders of my program that they would rather ensure that the tests were difficult enough by preventing the average from being over 75% and then curve them up, rather than having them not be sufficiently challenging. Thus, I would argue that the two are incomparable.

If you are claiming that it is easier to obtain an engineering degree due to this curving, then that is fine. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. But, from the time of our first chemical engineering specific course to graduation, over two-thirds of our entering class did not finish / dropped out of the program. So, engineering is by no means an easy way out.

Nooo I meant the opposite!
Sorry, my wording was very weird.
I meant that in most bio classes, average grade is a C or higher
In engineering, even with a scale the average grade is often below a C
Engineering is very,very hard and makes it hard to get a high GPA!

 

[enchantediris]

I don't know if I'd go so far as to say "arrogance," but I guess that could be one potential explanation. I think @Goro was referring to the dependence on a type of "formulaic" thinking bred into (again, some, not all) engineers. A scientist proper might be more of an independent thinker, creating, testing and evaluating hypotheses, and a master of critical analyses. The case could be made that an engineer (again, sweeping generalizations, so don't take anything personally!) is usually concerned with only the outcome of her or his engineering product, and rarely questions the theoretical basis behind them.

As such, in the world of medicine (in the pathology, etiology, progression, and etc. of disease), formulaic thinking doesn't get you as far, and therefore, engineers (or anyone for that matter) with such a mode of thought can be disadvantaged, and would have to change their perspective to be as successful as others.

Strangely enough, I think that students in typical premed majors like bio, chem, biochem, etc. are more likely to depend on formulaic thinking than engineers – especially when it comes to any type of calculation. It's a lot harder to get through engineering by solely relying on memorization, unlike in many other science majors. However, a lot of engineers I know were borderline unbearable their freshman year (because they loved patting themselves on their back for having the "hardest major"), so I also liked making fun of them 😛

 

[gonnif]

What is with SDN and their damn puns?? It's disgusting!

I once tried 10 puns to be funny, but not one pun intended.

 

[Lucca]

closing troll thread