HPSP Questions

[icer0ller]

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Is anyone here considering the HPSP? I have some general questions and was hoping someone had good resources I could read through. I have looked through the Military Medicine forum, but some of the information there seems a bit dated.

Some of my questions:
1- Do you always get to pick your residency specialization? For example if you want to do Pediatrics but the army decides it needs more IM docs, does that play a role?
2- Is there a list of all the hospitals where you'd potentially do a residency? Is there a risk of being sent to a war/war zone?
3- Would this be a good option if I was hoping to do research while a resident? It seems like most military hospitals are quite large and may be good academic centers as well? Are military residences accredited by AOA or LCME?
4- What's the best way to decide if military medicine is really for you? Is it accurate to say that you're "military first, doctor second"?
5- Is it to late to apply to the military programs?

I've been looking for a book or some un-biased websites regarding the military medicine option but haven't had much luck yet. I'd greatly appreciate any help, or advice. Thank you!

 

[NontradCA]

Use the search function.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/military-hpsp.945979/

Also look at the bottom of this thread you made it says "similar threads", this comes up in the new thread function prior to making a thread.

 

[medickdb]

1. Yes, but it depends on the needs of the branch. While one doesn't force you into a residency you don't want to do, you may not get your pick. If peds is full for whatever reason, you could be used as a general medical officer (GMO). Military match is done first. If you get matched to a military residency program, you HAVE to take it. Otherwise, you can get a deferral to do a civilian residency, but it's not guaranteed.
2. There are lists for the various branches. The ones I've found are outdated. There's ALWAYS a risk of being sent to war. It's the military.
3. Military residences are ACGME accredited.
4. First, you need to decide if the military itself is right for you. Talk to a military physician if you can. A recruiter may be able to help you out with that.
5. It's not too late, but I think you'll be scrambling to get everything in on time. I believe everything has to be done by mid March in order to meet the deadlines.

You can apply for HPSP this Fall, too. They have three year scholarships as well as the four year ones. You owe year for year after residency unless your residency is more than four years in which case more years may be added to the commitment. You can also choose to join after you graduate medical school through FAP.

 

[icer0ller]

1. Yes, but it depends on the needs of the branch. While one doesn't force you into a residency you don't want to do, you may not get your pick. If peds is full for whatever reason, you could be used as a general medical officer (GMO). Military match is done first. If you get matched to a military residency program, you HAVE to take it. Otherwise, you can get a deferral to do a civilian residency, but it's not guaranteed.
2. There are lists for the various branches. The ones I've found are outdated. There's ALWAYS a risk of being sent to war. It's the military.
3. Military residences are ACGME accredited.
4. First, you need to decide if the military itself is right for you. Talk to a military physician if you can. A recruiter may be able to help you out with that.
5. It's not too late, but I think you'll be scrambling to get everything in on time. I believe everything has to be done by mid March in order to meet the deadlines.

You can apply for HPSP this Fall, too. They have three year scholarships as well as the four year ones. You owe year for year after residency unless your residency is more than four years in which case more years may be added to the commitment. You can also choose to join after you graduate medical school through FAP.

Thanks for the reply. Can you please clarify what you mean by #1?
Regarding #2 - if I don't want to be put in the position of being possibly shot at, is this the wrong option for me? I'd be happy to serve my country, but I don't think on the front lines is where I would be at my best.
Thanks again. Do you have a source for the march deadline? I can't seem to find out much info.

 

[medickdb]

When it comes time to apply for residency, you apply to the military match first. It opens before the civilian match. If you get a military residency spot, you have to take it. If you don't, you can try your luck in the civilian match. Your respective branch has to grant you a deferment though (i.e. Allow you to do the civilian residency). The powers that be can say no though. If you don't match, you are made into a general medical officer (GMO) in a transitional year. You can reapply to the match the following year.

You won't be on the front line necessarily, but in these wars we are fighting, the front line isn't always clearly defined. As a doctor, you may be stationed at a forward operating base (FOB) which do get shot at and mortared. You can also be attacked in transport. You could be placed somewhere safer, but there's no guarantee. You go where you are told to go.

As for the March deadline, I'm just going off of what I think my recruiter said. I would contact a recruiter yourself to be sure. Otherwise, the next cycle is usually around August.

 

[icer0ller]

When it comes time to apply for residency, you apply to the military match first. It opens before the civilian match. If you get a military residency spot, you have to take it. If you don't, you can try your luck in the civilian match. Your respective branch has to grant you a deferment though (i.e. Allow you to do the civilian residency). The powers that be can say no though. If you don't match, you are made into a general medical officer (GMO) in a transitional year. You can reapply to the match the following year.

You won't be on the front line necessarily, but in these wars we are fighting, the front line isn't always clearly defined. As a doctor, you may be stationed at a forward operating base (FOB) which do get shot at and mortared. You can also be attacked in transport. You could be placed somewhere safer, but there's no guarantee. You go where you are told to go.

As for the March deadline, I'm just going off of what I think my recruiter said. I would contact a recruiter yourself to be sure. Otherwise, the next cycle is usually around August.

Thanks, I appreciate it. Good point on the wars -- I will have to think about that.

For the application process, what sort of letters of recommendation do we need? Are these the same as the ones used for applying to med. schools? Thanks again.

 

[medickdb]

Thanks, I appreciate it. Good point on the wars -- I will have to think about that.

For the application process, what sort of letters of recommendation do we need? Are these the same as the ones used for applying to med. schools? Thanks again.

Depends on your recruiter. My fiancee did Air Force HPSP. She said her recruiter just took the ones she used for medical school. My Air Force recruiter wanted the letters slightly reformatted, but I also used the same letters.

 

[GopherFan14]

For the navy I had to get completely new letters.

If you wouldn't enter the military under normal circumstances you probably shouldn't do it for a scholarship. Just my thoughts from working closely with the military medicine community for the last 5 years as a contractor.

 

[stlrams22]

Is anyone here considering the HPSP? I have some general questions and was hoping someone had good resources I could read through. I have looked through the Military Medicine forum, but some of the information there seems a bit dated.

Some of my questions:
1- Do you always get to pick your residency specialization? For example if you want to do Pediatrics but the army decides it needs more IM docs, does that play a role?
2- Is there a list of all the hospitals where you'd potentially do a residency? Is there a risk of being sent to a war/war zone?
3- Would this be a good option if I was hoping to do research while a resident? It seems like most military hospitals are quite large and may be good academic centers as well? Are military residences accredited by AOA or LCME?
4- What's the best way to decide if military medicine is really for you? Is it accurate to say that you're "military first, doctor second"?
5- Is it to late to apply to the military programs?

I've been looking for a book or some un-biased websites regarding the military medicine option but haven't had much luck yet. I'd greatly appreciate any help, or advice. Thank you!

I suggest only pursuing the military if you are interested, not for the money. There is a chance your residency could be limited in options and you don't get to pick where you live. Then there is the burden of repayment. I thought hard about applying, but decided this option wasn't for me.

 

[68quebec]

once u r a military, deployment is not an option anymore. if you want to be a military doc, then be prepared for downrange order at anytime while you are paying back as an officer.

 

[JPickos9989]

For the navy I had to get completely new letters.

If you wouldn't enter the military under normal circumstances you probably shouldn't do it for a scholarship. Just my thoughts from working closely with the military medicine community for the last 5 years as a contractor.

Slightly off topic, but how did the navy HPSP application process work for you? I was in contact with a Navy FM doc who put me in contact with his neighbor who is a recruiter for the navy HPSP. She got a bunch of my info over the phone and said I would get an email in the next few days with how to proceed but I have yet to receive one. Two weeks later. Should I make contact again? I've got nothing to be opposed about with the military option and would greatly appreciate the peace of mind financially in school. I've had to work 30+ hours a week 5 out of my 6 years of UG including third shift work.

 

[GopherFan14]

Umm.. The Navy process has been frustrating. But that is mostly do to MEPS at this point. I would definitely make contact again if you are interested. My recruiter seems really on top of things but the process takes forever. I started it back in November and I'm still waiting.

 

[icer0ller]

Thanks for the replies. I do have one more question: what would be the absolute longest one of these military programs could keep you in. Assuming they pay for 4 years of your medical school, and then you do 4 years in a military residency, would you then work full-time as an officer for 4 years or is there the possibility that you could be called back for longer? If so, how long? Thank you!

 

[medickdb]

Thanks for the replies. I do have one more question: what would be the absolute longest one of these military programs could keep you in. Assuming they pay for 4 years of your medical school, and then you do 4 years in a military residency, would you then work full-time as an officer for 4 years or is there the possibility that you could be called back for longer? If so, how long? Thank you!

Yes, full time, active duty for four years in that case. After that, you're inactive reserve for at least four years meaning they can reactivate you if needed. That doesn't happen often though, but it can.

 

[Eremba]

I applied for and received the Army HPSP. I got all my application materials in and had my physical assessment done in October....received notification December 22nd. My recruiter is fantastic. I got to talk to a current Army physician and the process was completely smooth and fast!

What I was told (and read in my contract) in regards to years payback if your residency is 5 years and they paid 4 years of school you payback 5 years. If your residency is 3 but they paid all 4 years of school you owe 4 years. If you have 4 year residency and 4 years of school pd you owe 4 years.

 

[medickdb]

I applied for and received the Army HPSP. I got all my application materials in and had my physical assessment done in October....received notification December 22nd. My recruiter is fantastic. I got to talk to a current Army physician and the process was completely smooth and fast!

What I was told (and read in my contract) in regards to years payback if your residency is 5 years and they paid 4 years of school you payback 5 years. If your residency is 3 but they paid all 4 years of school you owe 4 years. If you have 4 year residency and 4 years of school pd you owe 4 years.

Yep. I was told the same for the Air Force. Unfortunately, my recruiter has been dragging his feet the entire time.

 

[icer0ller]

Yes, full time, active duty for four years in that case. After that, you're inactive reserve for at least four years meaning they can reactivate you if needed. That doesn't happen often though, but it can.

Thanks for the reply. So inactive reserve is at least 4 years, but how long could it potentially be?

How is the match compared to the civilian match? If I am interested in Internal Medicine or Psych, for example, would those be harder, easier, or the same to get into with the military compared to the civilian match? Could I be forced into a specialty I don't want to go in? I read somewhere that you can choose either location or specialty -- is that true? Thanks again

 

[medickdb]

Thanks for the reply. So inactive reserve is at least 4 years, but how long could it potentially be?

How is the match compared to the civilian match? If I am interested in Internal Medicine or Psych, for example, would those be harder, easier, or the same to get into with the military compared to the civilian match? Could I be forced into a specialty I don't want to go in? I read somewhere that you can choose either location or specialty -- is that true? Thanks again

I think it's usually four years. You should ask a recruiter for the specifics relative to which branch you choose. I believe the Air Force is four years.

Everything also depends on the situation. Say you're almost done with your commitment and another war breaks out. Your service branch has the ability to hold you over for longer.

The military match works similarly to civilian. You rank your picks within your chosen specialty. For instance, you can rank it as such:

Internal Medicine:
1. Lackland Air Force Base (San Antonio, TX)
2. Civilian Deferment
3. Wright-Patterson Air Force Base (Dayton, OH)
....

Getting certain specialties in the civilian world can be hard. Getting one through the military can be even more difficult. It depends on the specialty. The two you listed, IM and Psych, are generally less competitive.

You would not be forced into a specialty you do not wish to enter. However, like I said, you can do a transitional year (your first year after medical school) and then try again, or your branch can make you into a general medical officer. For instance, the Air Force has Flight Surgeons whose main job is to make sure all of their assigned flight crews are fit for duty.

I think what was meant by the location or specialty is that certain specialties can be only found at certain locations.

Don't take anything anyone tells you for fact. READ the materials you are required to sign. ASK questions. If you aren't satisfied with the answers, ask for clarification or to speak with someone who could possibly answer your question better.

 

[icer0ller]

I think it's usually four years. You should ask a recruiter for the specifics relative to which branch you choose. I believe the Air Force is four years.

Everything also depends on the situation. Say you're almost done with your commitment and another war breaks out. Your service branch has the ability to hold you over for longer.

The military match works similarly to civilian. You rank your picks within your chosen specialty. For instance, you can rank it as such:

Internal Medicine:
1. Lackland Air Force Base (San Antonio, TX)
2. Civilian Deferment
3. Wright-Patterson Air Force Base (Dayton, OH)
....

Getting certain specialties in the civilian world can be hard. Getting one through the military can be even more difficult. It depends on the specialty. The two you listed, IM and Psych, are generally less competitive.

You would not be forced into a specialty you do not wish to enter. However, like I said, you can do a transitional year (your first year after medical school) and then try again, or your branch can make you into a general medical officer. For instance, the Air Force has Flight Surgeons whose main job is to make sure all of their assigned flight crews are fit for duty.

I think what was meant by the location or specialty is that certain specialties can be only found at certain locations.

Don't take anything anyone tells you for fact. READ the materials you are required to sign. ASK questions. If you aren't satisfied with the answers, ask for clarification or to speak with someone who could possibly answer your question better.

Thank you for the info. So you only rank options for your chosen specialty? Are you then assured of getting your specialty choice or a civilian deferment?

Would you say going into IM or Psych in a military match is less competitive than a regular match? Do you by chance know of any sites where I can view military match data?

I was also wondering if you could please elaborate on this: "Say you're almost done with your commitment and another war breaks out. Your service branch has the ability to hold you over for longer."

Thanks again!

 

[medickdb]

That's how match works. You can't really apply for IM residencies and psych residencies. It's one or the other. You have to pick a specialty. This is true both for the military and civilian match.

As I've said like three times now, you are NOT assured if getting your chosen specialty. But, that true in the civilian world, too. That may be ok though because you can do that transitional year and apply again. Though again, no guarantees.

Those two specialties are probably just as competitve. Things like surgery may be more competitve than if you avoid the military altogether.

I do not know of any sites newer than 10 years or so. Even then, every branch is different. Army needs a different number of IM docs than Navy does, etc.

I mean exactly that. Say your contracted time is almost up. You did your four years of active duty. They can make you stay longer if we're fighting another war. They can also activate you again in those reserve years and hold you for longer for the same reason. Basically, even though you've done your time, they can call you back as long as you retain your commission.

 

[Donkk]

Is anyone here considering the HPSP? I have some general questions and was hoping someone had good resources I could read through. I have looked through the Military Medicine forum, but some of the information there seems a bit dated.

Some of my questions:
1- Do you always get to pick your residency specialization? For example if you want to do Pediatrics but the army decides it needs more IM docs, does that play a role?
2- Is there a list of all the hospitals where you'd potentially do a residency? Is there a risk of being sent to a war/war zone?
3- Would this be a good option if I was hoping to do research while a resident? It seems like most military hospitals are quite large and may be good academic centers as well? Are military residences accredited by AOA or LCME?
4- What's the best way to decide if military medicine is really for you? Is it accurate to say that you're "military first, doctor second"?
5- Is it to late to apply to the military programs?

I've been looking for a book or some un-biased websites regarding the military medicine option but haven't had much luck yet. I'd greatly appreciate any help, or advice. Thank you!

In regards to number 1. Primary care pediatricians also got deployed with many of us Army guys to take care of children of the opposition and the troops. Just to clarify that anyone has the potential to go over, so not to design your career around this.

 

[icer0ller]

That's how match works. You can't really apply for IM residencies and psych residencies. It's one or the other. You have to pick a specialty. This is true both for the military and civilian match.

As I've said like three times now, you are NOT assured if getting your chosen specialty. But, that true in the civilian world, too. That may be ok though because you can do that transitional year and apply again. Though again, no guarantees.

Those two specialties are probably just as competitve. Things like surgery may be more competitve than if you avoid the military altogether.

I do not know of any sites newer than 10 years or so. Even then, every branch is different. Army needs a different number of IM docs than Navy does, etc.

I mean exactly that. Say your contracted time is almost up. You did your four years of active duty. They can make you stay longer if we're fighting another war. They can also activate you again in those reserve years and hold you for longer for the same reason. Basically, even though you've done your time, they can call you back as long as you retain your commission.

Thanks for the input. So when you apply for the civilian match, say you choose dermatology. Does this mean you'd either get a dermatology residency or not match? Would you say the chance of getting your chosen specialty is approximately equal to the chance in the civilian match?

How much longer could they potentially call you back for after those 4 years? What does "as long as you retain your commission" mean?

Is it OK to discuss HPSP with any medical schools you've been accepted to, or do schools generally frown on students going the HPSP route? Thanks again.

In regards to number 1. Primary care pediatricians also got deployed with many of us Army guys to take care of children of the opposition and the troops. Just to clarify that anyone has the potential to go over, so not to design your career around this.

Thanks for the reply. Were the doctors out with the soldiers or primarily at bases? And they also took care of the children of enemy troops? And what do you mean by not designing my career around that? Thanks again! (and thank you for your service!)

 

[medickdb]

Thanks for the input. So when you apply for the civilian match, say you choose dermatology. Does this mean you'd either get a dermatology residency or not match? Would you say the chance of getting your chosen specialty is approximately equal to the chance in the civilian match?

How much longer could they potentially call you back for after those 4 years? What does "as long as you retain your commission" mean?

Is it OK to discuss HPSP with any medical schools you've been accepted to, or do schools generally frown on students going the HPSP route? Thanks again.


Thanks for the reply. Were the doctors out with the soldiers or primarily at bases? And they also took care of the children of enemy troops? And what do you mean by not designing my career around that? Thanks again! (and thank you for your service!)

Yes.

No, your chances for certain specialties are less. The military has to let you defer first. If it does let you, then you're competing with others (civilians, others granted deferrals, etc.) on the same playing field. Basically, there's an unknown hurdle to get the chance if you go HPSP.

The military also doesn't really need much of certain specialties. Therefore, if your heart is set on something it doesn't need, it's very likely you won't get it. Derm is one of the most competitive specialties, military or not. Something like that would be extremely competitive with the military because how many skin doctors does it need for soldiers and their defendants? Obviously, this means you are more limited.

As I said, you'd have to ask a recruiter about that. Four years reserve status is typical. But, I don't know what every branch requires. Things like this can change at any time, too.

As an officer, you have a commission. A commission is basically a contract you create with the country, most often endorsed by the President. After your contract runs out, you have to resign your commission (i.e. status as an officer) in order to separate.

Schools don't care about whether or not you are HPSP. They care about getting the money when it comes time to pay tuition.

Edit: I recommend you continue to do your own research. Contact a recruiter and ask questions. Ask to speak to someone else if you need better answers. READ everything before you sign.

Also, a good documentary that gives you a glimpse into what it can be like is called Baghdad ER.

 

[icer0ller]

Yes.

No, your chances for certain specialties are less. The military has to let you defer first. If it does let you, then you're competing with others (civilians, others granted deferrals, etc.) on the same playing field. Basically, there's an unknown hurdle to get the chance if you go HPSP.

The military also doesn't really need much of certain specialties. Therefore, if your heart is set on something it doesn't need, it's very likely you won't get it. Derm is one of the most competitive specialties, military or not. Something like that would be extremely competitive with the military because how many skin doctors does it need for soldiers and their defendants? Obviously, this means you are more limited.

As I said, you'd have to ask a recruiter about that. Four years reserve status is typical. But, I don't know what every branch requires. Things like this can change at any time, too.

As an officer, you have a commission. A commission is basically a contract you create with the country, most often endorsed by the President. After your contract runs out, you have to resign your commission (i.e. status as an officer) in order to separate.

Schools don't care about whether or not you are HPSP. They care about getting the money when it comes time to pay tuition.

Edit: I recommend you continue to do your own research. Contact a recruiter and ask questions. Ask to speak to someone else if you need better answers. READ everything before you sign.

Also, a good documentary that gives you a glimpse into what it can be like is called Baghdad ER.

Thank you for the information. I will definitely look into Baghdad ER. I've read online that when considering these programs, you should first ask yourself, "is the military right for you?" It sounds like you are in this program -- if you don't mind my asking, how did you go about deciding?

Are most able to get into residencies immediately after medical school, or are they more commonly ordered to do a GMO (year-long?) tour and then re-apply for residencies?

One last question -- is it allowed to apply to multiple HPSP programs at once, such as the Air Force, Navy, and Army? If so, is it advisable to inform each branch that you're applying to multiple programs?

 

[medickdb]

Thank you for the information. I will definitely look into Baghdad ER. I've read online that when considering these programs, you should first ask yourself, "is the military right for you?" It sounds like you are in this program -- if you don't mind my asking, how did you go about deciding?

Are most able to get into residencies immediately after medical school, or are they more commonly ordered to do a GMO (year-long?) tour and then re-apply for residencies?

One last question -- is it allowed to apply to multiple HPSP programs at once, such as the Air Force, Navy, and Army? If so, is it advisable to inform each branch that you're applying to multiple programs?

I'm not in it yet. I applied for the Air Force HPSP. But, my fiancee has already gone through medical school on the Air Force HPSP herself. She's a second year resident.

Most residencies are after medical school. You have your intern year (first year after medical school) in medicine or surgery, depending on what specialty into which you matched. If you haven't matched into your specialty, you do what is called a transitional year which is pretty much synonymous with "intern year." In that case, you can reapply to the match or do a GMO tour if you still don't match.

You can apply to every branch if you so desire. I would not inform the respective branches that you are doing so. It's not that there's a problem with it, but some recruiters will try to convince you that you don't need to waste your time applying to the other branches. They have an incentive to recruit you, mostly in the form of a bonus. When considering a branch, think about where you might end up though. Often, you have little choice, but, for instance, do you mind the possibility of serving on a ship? If you do, the Navy may not be for you. The Army has the largest medical corps.

Some recruiters are great, others not so much. Keep in mind that they usually don't know much about the medical corps of their respective branch. For instance, my recruiter did HVAC (heating and air conditioning) before becoming a recruiter. Recruiters are usually technical sergeants or master sergeants.

 

[Donkk]

Thanks for the input. So when you apply for the civilian match, say you choose dermatology. Does this mean you'd either get a dermatology residency or not match? Would you say the chance of getting your chosen specialty is approximately equal to the chance in the civilian match?

How much longer could they potentially call you back for after those 4 years? What does "as long as you retain your commission" mean?

Is it OK to discuss HPSP with any medical schools you've been accepted to, or do schools generally frown on students going the HPSP route? Thanks again.


Thanks for the reply. Were the doctors out with the soldiers or primarily at bases? And they also took care of the children of enemy troops? And what do you mean by not designing my career around that? Thanks again! (and thank you for your service!)

Doctors are usually in the rear yes but, there are exceptions to every rule. The U.S. military ( also Canadian, British, Australian, etc, etc.) always takes care of children and adults in war zones, both opposition and civilian, if they are transported to the rear. Yes this is ethically responsible, but the more powerful message this sends to people in these areas is that if they surrender, they will be taken care of by us. This is a compelling motivator for those that want out of the situation or are in true need of medical care. By don't design your career around not getting shipped out, I mean don't choose a field to practice because you think it has a low chance of going to a war zone. Imagine choosing a specialty you hate to stay in the U.S. and still end up getting deployed to a war zone, double suck.