I got an A- in Freshwater Ecology

[Destalchemy]

Every stereotype exists for a reason but usually gets used when nothing else left to say on the topic 🙂 time to move on to other threads lol

I personally wouldn't want a classmate that grew up a sheltered life under his helicopter parents. Does your child know that you're engaging in multiple day arguments with adcoms, med school faculty etc on their behalf?

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[Belphegor]

Imagine having a parent that is obsessed with your grades, still salty over an A- from freshman year, and probably won’t be satisfied if you get in somewhere that is not a UC.






Sent from my iPhone using SDN

 

[HopeP]

This is getting too salty, can we get back to freshwater please..

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

Imagine having a parent that is obsessed with your grades, still salty over an A- from freshman year, and probably won’t be satisfied if you get in somewhere that is not a UC.






Sent from my iPhone using SDN

Who said I was salty about freshman A- grade? I said that as a joke. I was willing to spend 1/2M on BSMD program at a school which doesn't believe in ranks, but he wants to challenge himself and took traditional path and thriving. I am not obsessed about UCs and I actually told him not to worry about SJW UCs and find a fit for his interests and we will fully pay for whichever school he wants to go to.

 

[HopeP]

I personally wouldn't want a classmate that grew up a sheltered life under his helicopter parents. Does your child know that you're engaging in multiple day arguments with adcoms, med school faculty etc on their behalf?

Good suggestion to have that checkbox, "I don't want a classmate that grew up a sheltered life under his helicopter parents", in application process!

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

I personally wouldn't want a classmate that grew up a sheltered life under his helicopter parents. Does your child know that you're engaging in multiple day arguments with adcoms, med school faculty etc on their behalf?

I am not engaging on my child's behalf, it's for my own knowledge. I am not disrespectful to any adcoms or faculty or any premeds. Yes, my child knows I am on SDN and doesn't bother him. He is having great time with good group of friends. I only provide the info I think is useful for him and let him decide.

 

[Future_Bone_Docta]

All kidding aside, honestly, we prefer to see a 3.98 over a 4.0. Perfectionists don't do well in medical school. Please don't be a grade grubber. Take the A- and be well.

Not trying to step on toes, just curious, lets say you have a 3.5 student in the midst of GPA repair (where every grade counts) takes part in these same actions. Do you think that would that be a different story?

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

Not trying to step on toes, just curious, lets say you have a 3.5 student in the midst of GPA repair (where every grade counts) takes part in these same actions. Do you think that would that be a different story?

How would faculty know your GPA? So for them you may be a grade grubber!

 

[gyngyn]

@gyngyn those are interesting statistics, CA provides ~53% of western region applicants, ~12% of total applicants. So it may be oversupplied and overqualified pool that seems creating CA instate over-competitive. Next 2 states, TX and NY, are not even close to CA.
Is there a list of total medical spots for each state?

Sadly, I have had to add them up from the MSAR when I needed them.

 

[HopeP]

Sadly, I have had to add them up from the MSAR when I needed them.

understood, will do.

 

[Future_Bone_Docta]

How would faculty know your GPA? So for them you may be a grade grubber!

I am not so much asking from an analytical perspective, as I am the opinion of an admissions committee member's personal opinion.

 

[scared_of_med]

bro you are aware that the AMCAS app will standardize your transcript grades so that an A- = A (4.0) right? It's literally a non-issue.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

bro you are aware that the AMCAS app will standardize your transcript grades so that an A- = A (4.0) right? It's literally a non-issue.

What? AMCAS uses minus grades if your school uses them. An A- gets assigned a 3.7.

 

[scared_of_med]

What? AMCAS uses minus grades if your school uses them. An A- gets assigned a 3.7.

I stand corrected, this only applies for A+. I was under the impression that the same applied for A-.
From AMCAS: "AMCAS counts all plus (+) and minus (–) grades, even if your school does not. For example, at some schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.3 or 7 (e.g., 3.3 or 3.7 GPA); at other schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.5 (e.g., 3.5 GPA). Please note that AMCAS assigns the same weight (4.0) to grades of A+ and A"

Sounds kinda bull**** that A- hurt you while A+ do not give you any benefit. Glad my UG did not do this

 

[deleted1001426]

I stand corrected, this only applies for A+. I was under the impression that the same applied for A-.
From AMCAS: "AMCAS counts all plus (+) and minus (–) grades, even if your school does not. For example, at some schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.3 or 7 (e.g., 3.3 or 3.7 GPA); at other schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.5 (e.g., 3.5 GPA). Please note that AMCAS assigns the same weight (4.0) to grades of A+ and A"

Sounds kinda bull**** that A- hurt you while A+ do not give you any benefit. Glad my UG did not do this

Amcas needs to standardize gpas so they can be used as an objective means of comparison.
Most schools which utilize A+,A,A- use a gpa scale which goes to 4.33. Others will use a standard of A+=4.0, A=3.75 etc. This is why amcas standardizes all grading as it would be ridiculous to expect someone from school x which has a max gpa of 4.0 to be expected to compete on a numeric level with someone from school y which has a max gpa of 4.33.

 

[HopeP]

Amcas needs to standardize gpas so they can be used as an objective means of comparison.

I thought it is standardized as per AMCAS Section 4
It states
AMCAS GPA: AMCAS will convert most standard undergraduate transcript grades to AMCAS grades based on conversion information provided by the institutions. The AMCAS GPA provides the medical schools with a standard way to compare each applicant's background. The BCPM GPA is comprised of Biology, Chemistry, Physics, and Mathematics courses. All other coursework will be calculated in the AO (All Other) GPA.

Accordingly, GPA among UGs are not standardized but AMCAS GPA is. Am I missing something here?

 

[deleted1001426]

I thought it is standardized as per AMCAS Section 4
It states
AMCAS GPA: AMCAS will convert most standard undergraduate transcript grades to AMCAS grades based on conversion information provided by the institutions. The AMCAS GPA provides the medical schools with a standard way to compare each applicant's background. The BCPM GPA is comprised of Biology, Chemistry, Physics, and Mathematics courses. All other coursework will be calculated in the AO (All Other) GPA.

Accordingly, GPA among UGs are not standardized but AMCAS GPA is. Am I missing something here?

"AMCAS counts all plus (+) and minus (–) grades, even if your school does not. For example, at some schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.3 or 7 (e.g., 3.3 or 3.7 GPA); at other schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.5 (e.g., 3.5 GPA). Please note that AMCAS assigns the same weight (4.0) to grades of A+ and A"

thats the point, your undergrad gpa and that of someone at a different school aren't standardized as schools may have variable means of calculating gpa/different scales. AMCAS attempts to negative much of this variability. Page 3 of the amcas grade conversion guide might prove helpful if you want to take a look at it. It basically details how they deal with variable grading schemes

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

I stand corrected, this only applies for A+. I was under the impression that the same applied for A-.
From AMCAS: "AMCAS counts all plus (+) and minus (–) grades, even if your school does not. For example, at some schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.3 or 7 (e.g., 3.3 or 3.7 GPA); at other schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.5 (e.g., 3.5 GPA). Please note that AMCAS assigns the same weight (4.0) to grades of A+ and A"

Sounds kinda bull**** that A- hurt you while A+ do not give you any benefit. Glad my UG did not do this

May be they eliminated A+ because adcoms don't want perfectionists 🙂 on serious note, I believe not many schools give A+s. Seems like its more common in law schools.

 

[Goro]

ANy stats? All the cases I know, none of them got UC interviews during last 4 years.

The plural of anecdotes is not data.

@gyngyn those are interesting statistics, CA provides ~53% of western region applicants, ~12% of total applicants. So it may be oversupplied and overqualified pool that seems creating CA instate over-competitive. Next 2 states, TX and NY, are not even close to CA.

Indeed. This is why my school (west of St Louis) can capture many MD-caliber candidates. They don't want to go to Albany or Drexel.

 

[HopeP]

@Ak09 thanks for educating me, that makes sense now and that guide certainly clarifies all doubts.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

May be they eliminated A+ because adcoms don't want perfectionists 🙂 on serious note, I believe not many schools give A+s. Seems like its more common in law schools.

Some of my schools gave A+s. Was kind of disappointing that they didn’t do anything for my amcas gpa since mine wasn’t great.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

[/QUOTE]
I am aware of that.

Some of my schools gave A+s. Was kind of disappointing that they didn’t do anything for my amcas gpa since mine wasn’t great.

how many schools did you attend? I agree if school is giving A+ they should consider but let med schools know that candidates school has different scale but then it may be too much given the number of applications school get now a days.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I am aware of that.

how many schools did you attend? I agree if school is giving A+ they should consider but let med schools know that candidates school has different scale but then it may be too much given the number of applications school get now a days.

11

 

[Sleepingdoc]

I'm in complete shock right now. How the HELL. So frustrated just need to vent
EDIT: I got a 93.5 after going to her office and fixing her answer key!

Great, what does the rest of this board want to do for you????

 

[DNAJB6]

We see only the latter and while we do interview and admit the 4.0s, when we see a 3.98, someone will inevitably say with a wink, "well, at least we know they aren't perfect." (and that's considered a good thing).

As a deeply flawed future applicant, I'm happy that medical schools don't like perfection... 😛 🙂

 

[KnightDoc]

I am aware of that.

how many schools did you attend? I agree if school is giving A+ they should consider but let med schools know that candidates school has different scale but then it may be too much given the number of applications school get now a days.

No, you're missing the point. If they did that, it would give candidates whose schools offer an A+ an unfair advantage over those that don't.

Use your kid as an example. Assume his school doesn't do A+s while my school does. My maximum AMCAS GPA is 4.3 while his is 4.0. We both get that one A-. His GPA is 3.9 and mine is 4.2 because I get all A+s (the highest possible grade) while he can't get any, even though we both received the highest grade possible. Are we equal??? Is it fair if we're not?

Maybe I get a few Bs along with my A+s, while his lowest grade is that one A-. Now we both have 3.9s. Are we equal? Are our 3.9s really the same? You'd be screaming louder than anyone (and your son would be calmly explaining his position to the adcom, without arguing 🙂) if my 4.0 (with a few Bs) was considered better than his 3.9 (everything else being equal, of course!), and I was accepted while he wasn't.

EQUALIZING GPAs means standardizing so everyone is judged on the same scale. If A+ is the highest grade, A+=A, if they are each the highest possible grade. Nothing else to consider, and has nothing to do with how many applications are being reviewed. The whole point is to create one AMCAS scale rather than letting med schools know that different UGs have different scales in order to give the grade grubbers who grub the A+s a little extra edge! 🙂

 

[HopeP]

EQUALIZING GPAs means standardizing so everyone is judged on the same scale.

In other words look from AMCAS GPA point of view, not from UG side.
AMCAS 4.0 = UG A+,A, Alpha, whatever
3.7 = A-, Beta, whatever
and so forth.
to elaborate further let's say a state school A- is 3.67 GPA. However that applicant from AMCAS point of view is still 3.7.
Same school B+ is 3.33 GPA, but from AMCAS point of view is still 3.30.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

No, you're missing the point. If they did that, it would give candidates whose schools offer an A+ an unfair advantage over those that don't.

Use your kid as an example. Assume his school doesn't do A+s while my school does. My maximum AMCAS GPA is 4.3 while his is 4.0. We both get that one A-. His GPA is 3.9 and mine is 4.2 because I get all A+s (the highest possible grade) while he can't get any, even though we both received the highest grade possible. Are we equal??? If it fair if we're not?

Maybe I get a few Bs along with my A+s, while his lowest grade is that one A-. Now we both have 3.9s. Are we equal? Are our 3.9s really the same? You'd be screaming louder than anyone (and your son would be calmly explaining his position to the adcom, without arguing 🙂) if my 4.0 (with a few Bs) was considered better than his 3.9 (everything else being equal, of course!), and I was accepted while he wasn't.

EQUALIZING GPAs means standardizing so everyone is judged on the same scale. If A+ is the highest grade, A+=A, if they are each the highest possible grade. Nothing else to consider, and has nothing to do with how many applications are being reviewed. The whole point is to create one AMCAS scale rather than letting med schools know that different UGs have different scales in order to give the grade grubbers who grub the A+s a little extra edge! 🙂

Still can't get over me or my son? You had similar tirade couple of months back. Anyway, as I said before I am not worried about you my son and I will be very happy if your A+s beat my son's As and get you into your first choice school. I am specifically reponding to AMCAS treating A+=A but they consider all other +s and -s. What about schools which don't give +s and -s or how do they equalize grade inflation vs grade deflation? So I would rather AMCAS report as is and let schools decide.

 

[Aktak]

I stand corrected, this only applies for A+. I was under the impression that the same applied for A-.
From AMCAS: "AMCAS counts all plus (+) and minus (–) grades, even if your school does not. For example, at some schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.3 or 7 (e.g., 3.3 or 3.7 GPA); at other schools, a plus or minus counts as 0.5 (e.g., 3.5 GPA). Please note that AMCAS assigns the same weight (4.0) to grades of A+ and A"

Sounds kinda bull**** that A- hurt you while A+ do not give you any benefit. Glad my UG did not do this

Totally agree! Have so many A+’s! Would’ve offset that B in underwater basketweaving.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Still can't get over me or my son? You had similar tirade couple of months back. Anyway, as I said before I am not worried about you my son and I will be very happy if your A+s beat my son's As and get you into your first choice school. I am specifically reponding to AMCAS treating A+=A but they consider all other +s and -s. What about schools which don't give +s and -s or how do they equalize grade inflation vs grade deflation? So I would rather AMCAS report as is and let schools decide. You can disagree or you can fallback on your standard mockery.

Um, it’s not mockery. It’s the actual reason. It’s not perfect because schools do things differently, but it is an earnest attempt to standardize things and not give unfair advantages to certain applicants who happened to go to a school with A+ grades.

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

Um, it’s not mockery. It’s the actual reason. It’s not perfect because schools do things differently, but it is an earnest attempt to standardize things and not give unfair advantages to certain applicants who happened to go to a school with A+ grades.

I didn't imply AMCAS process is mockery, but tendency of the particular member. I believe only few schools give A+s and few schools don't use +s and -s. so how do we balance between all these variations is what I was trying to debate. Aren't the kids who go to school which give straight letter grades at huge disadvantage? I am least bothered about what my son will gain or lose in this scenario since I know 3.9 is enough even for stats ****** schools like WashU and Vandy.

 

[deleted1001426]

. Aren't the kids who go to school which give straight letter grades at huge disadvantage? I am least bothered about what my son will gain or lose in this scenario since I know 3.9 is enough even for stats ****** schools like WashU and Vandy.

ok im going to explain this once and then I'm done. Amcas policy of counting A+ as equivalent to an A in the worst case has a net neutral effect on applications. Heres is a little example
Jimmy goes to school x which has a grading scheme of A+=4.33, A=4.0 etc. He gets all A+s and now has a 4.3 gpa. This 4.33 GPA isn't n a 4.0 scale, its on a 4.33 scale, thus all it signifies is that jimmy received all possible grade points and is equivalent to that of tommy 's gpa at school y which does not use A+s and operates on a 4.0 scale if tommy gets straight As.

On the other hand if Jimmy goes to a school which has a grading scheme of 97-100=A+=4.0,, 94-96 = A=3.77 and receives 95s throughout of undergrad he now has a 3.7 gpa. That same 95 at tommys school would be a 4.0, thus this is where amcas steps in and attempts to standardize grgades to a certain extent. In both cases no one is adversely impacted by this.

tldr: a 4.33/4.33 is equivalent to that of a 4.0/4.0 and a 3.7/4.33 is =/= to a 3.7/4.0. Stop focusing solely on the first number


As for those at schools which do not do + or- amcas has a separate policy for calculating their gpas so go read the amcas gpa conversion chart if youre curious. But typically going to schools which do not give +\- grades inflates, rather than deflates students gpas(at least for those who consistently score in the a/a- range)

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

ok im going to explain this once and then I'm done. Amcas policy of counting A+ as equivalent to an A in the worst case has a net neutral effect on applications. Heres is a little example
Jimmy goes to school x which has a grading scheme of A+=4.33, A=4.0 etc. He gets all A+s and now has a 4.3 gpa. This 4.33 GPA isn't n a 4.0 scale, its on a 4.33 scale, thus all it signifies is that jimmy received all possible grade points and is equivalent to that of tommy 's gpa at school y which does not use A+s and operates on a 4.0 scale if tommy gets straight As.

On the other hand if Jimmy goes to a school which has a grading scheme of 97-100=A+=4.0,, 94-96 = A=3.77 and receives 95s throughout of undergrad he now has a 3.7 gpa. That same 95 at tommys school would be a 4.0, thus this is where amcas steps in and attempts to standardize grgades to a certain extent. In both cases no one is adversely impacted by this.

tldr: a 4.33/4.33 is equivalent to that of a 4.0/4.0 and a 3.7/4.33 is =/= to a 3.7/4.0. Stop focusing solely on the first number


As for those at schools which do not do + or- amcas has a separate policy for calculating their gpas so go read the amcas gpa conversion chart if youre curious. But typically going to schools which do not give +\- grades inflates, rather than deflates students gpas(at least for those who consistently score in the a/a- range)

Thanks for the explanation. Kudos to Jimmy and Tommy 🙂

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I didn't imply AMCAS process is mockery, but tendency of the particular member. I believe only few schools give A+s and few schools don't use +s and -s. so how do we balance between all these variations is what I was trying to debate. Aren't the kids who go to school which give straight letter grades at huge disadvantage? I am least bothered about what my son will gain or lose in this scenario since I know 3.9 is enough even for stats ****** schools like WashU and Vandy.

Not really. In schools that give you straight letter grades, AMCAS just keeps As at 4, Bs at 3, etc. So if your school gives you an A for 90-100, that means someone with a 90 at a school that gives only straight letter grades will have a higher AMCAS GPA than someone whose school gives A- for 90-93 or whatever.

 

[Aktak]

The problems would be even worse. My school allows teachers to determine whether +/-‘s will be used at all. Some colleges within the U dictate +/-‘s. Some leave it to departments. Most leave it to teachers. So, we’ve got some classes (say, biochem) in which one teacher gives the + and the other section of the same class does not. Here you can have a transcript filled with As and A+s but have done better in the A classes than the A+ ones.

When you think about it, though, if you got an A-, A, or A+, who really cares? You did well in the class.

 

[HopeP]

Not really. In schools that give you straight letter grades, AMCAS just keeps As at 4, Bs at 3, etc. So if your school gives you an A for 90-100, that means someone with a 90 at a school that gives only straight letter grades will have a higher AMCAS GPA than someone whose school gives A- for 90-93 or whatever.

In that case some one ended up at 92.96 feels pinch between A- and A, sprint to professor office, oh no, circled back to grade grubbing.🙂

 

[Cherry1997]

As someone who got an A- in a porn class as well as Bs in chem and then has gone on to receive interviews from every top20 I applied to (except Hopkins) and even an acceptance from NYU already, I really don’t think they care that much. From my interviews I can say what they do care about is you pursuing your passions and doing something interesting. Never was I asked about my B in chem or W in neuroscience but I was always asked about my work applying for grants to help undocumented immigrants gain access to trauma counselors or about the tutoring program for URMs in STEM I helped to pilot. Med school adcoms seem to be more about meeting thresholds versus being perfect. Instead use that time studying to get a 100% to get involved in the community with a cause you care about or do research in something that your excited about or go volunteer at a hospital or literally anything else than worry about an A- . I’m obviously not an expert but that has just been my experience going through the cycle

 

[Goro]

As someone who got an A- in a porn class as well as Bs in chem and then has gone on to receive interviews from every top20 I applied to (except Hopkins) and even an acceptance from NYU already, I really don’t think they care that much. From my interviews I can say what they do care about is you pursuing your passions and doing something interesting. Never was I asked about my B in chem or W in neuroscience but I was always asked about my work applying for grants to help undocumented immigrants gain access to trauma counselors or about the tutoring program for URMs in STEM I helped to pilot. Med school adcoms seem to be more about meeting thresholds versus being perfect. Instead use that time studying to get a 100% to get involved in the community with a cause you care about or do research in something that your excited about or go volunteer at a hospital or literally anything else than worry about an A- . I’m obviously not an expert but that has just been my experience going through the cycle

Porn class? ?????

 

[Aktak]

Porn class? ?????

Wondered who was gonna bite on that first. Hard pass.

 

[Cherry1997]

Porn class? ?????

Hahah yes truly called “pornography.” It was a higher level history class that I thought would be easy A all about how porn has evolved over the centuries. Wasn’t an easy A but was definitely interesting watching the frat boys in the back of the class react to us watching porn in class lol

 

[Goro]

Hahah yes truly called “pornography.” It was a higher level history class that I thought would be easy A all about how porn has evolved over the centuries. Wasn’t an easy A but was definitely interesting watching the frat boys in the back of the class react to us watching porn in class lol

I went to the wrong college!!!!

The SJWs didn't have strokes over this???

 

[Aktak]

I went to the wrong college!!!!

The SJWs didn't have strokes over this???

Pretty sure SJWs are why this class exists.

But more importantly, how does one grade grub... “Hey, Prof. I think you’ve just been looking at this from a different angle.”

 

[deleted1001426]

Hahah yes truly called “pornography.” It was a higher level history class that I thought would be easy A all about how porn has evolved over the centuries. Wasn’t an easy A but was definitely interesting watching the frat boys in the back of the class react to us watching porn in class lol

Doesn’t matter how easy the class was I don’t think I could take this. Can’t imagine anything more uncomfortable than sitting in a class watching porn while the professor attempts to describe the artistic angles and why they chose doggy over reverse cowgirl

 

[LizzyM]

I went to the wrong college!!!!

The SJWs didn't have strokes over this???

Knowing your love of puns, I'm not going to touch this but I can't let it go unremarked.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Doesn’t matter how easy the class was I don’t think I could take this. Can’t imagine anything more uncomfortable than sitting in a class watching porn while the professor attempts to describe the artistic angles and why they chose doggy over reverse cowgirl

Yeah I mean aside from my objections to porn in general, why in the world would you want to watch it with a bunch of other people in class listening to someone give a running commentary?

 

[deleted1001426]

Yeah I mean aside from my objections to porn in general, why in the world would you want to watch it with a bunch of other people in class listening to someone give a running commentary?

As we all know, nothing improves pornography quite like sitting in a room surrounded by your peers while some PhD gives blow-by-blow (pun intended) commentary in the background and you attempt to frantically write down notes on the juxtaposition of.. well I’ll leave the rest to your imagination

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

As we all know, nothing improves pornography quite like sitting in a room surrounded by your peers while some PhD gives blow-by-blow (pun intended) commentary in the background

Lol okay let’s not make me close this thread. Although I think it’s just about run its course anyway.

 

[Goro]

Knowing your love of puns, I'm not going to touch this but I can't let it go unremarked.

Imagine what the Prince of Punnery could do with it???!!!

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

Doesn’t matter how easy the class was I don’t think I could take this. Can’t imagine anything more uncomfortable than sitting in a class watching porn while the professor attempts to describe the artistic angles and why they chose doggy over reverse cowgirl

As a parent I am staying out of this conversation 🙂

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Okay, I think this thread has run its course and is going way off topic. Closing.