If a DO student applied to an MD school as an OMS1....

[RejectedMD]

Would that MD school ever find out he/she was at a DO school? At the time of application (june 1st) the student would not be enrolled at the DO school technically and if granted acceptance during the school year, the student would just drop out.

Is there anything technically wrong that could result in future expulsion? Would the DO student have to disclose his "gap year" plans? Is there any way the MD school could find out?

Just wondering...

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[RejectedMD]

THIS SHOULD NOT TURN INTO AN MD VS. DO THREAD.

Just a curious thought and wondering if anyone could give objective input on the exact policies involved in the application process.

 

[Serous Demilune]

Would that MD school ever find out he/she was at a DO school? At the time of application (june 1st) the student would not be enrolled at the DO school technically and if granted acceptance during the school year, the student would just drop out.

Is there anything technically wrong that could result in future expulsion? Would the DO student have to disclose his "gap year" plans? Is there any way the MD school could find out?

Just wondering...

Don't do this.
According to this thread
forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/can-one-apply-to-an-md-school-after-being-a-student-at-a-do-school.960357/
it can be done, but you really don't want to be looking over your shoulder your whole life hoping nobody finds out.
They are merging MD and DO residencies, and by the time you are applying for the match you'll likely be on par with MD students at many programs. Just stay where you are, do well, and graduate.

 

[seminoma]

MD applications ask if you've ever been in a medical program before. You would have to lie. Lying is bad.

 

[ACSurgeon]

Would that MD school ever find out he/she was at a DO school? At the time of application (june 1st) the student would not be enrolled at the DO school technically and if granted acceptance during the school year, the student would just drop out.

Is there anything technically wrong that could result in future expulsion? Would the DO student have to disclose his "gap year" plans? Is there any way the MD school could find out?

Just wondering...

I think a safer approach is to defer for one year at the osteopathic school if possible. That way you reapply and don't lose your DO option. Not sure this is completely kosher but certainly better than interviewing for MD programs while attending a DO program and just hoping they don't find out.

Finally, when you reapply you might have to disclose that you've applied the previous cycle.

 

[Psai]

Interviewer: "So what are you doing in your gap year?"
You: "Medical school"
awkward silence

 

[Promethean]

Why on Earth would you want to do this? What would it accomplish for you? Are the expenses and the headaches of applying again really justified by what you would accomplish? Not to mention what this says about you...

You have a seat. That puts you ahead of a great many other students. What you are talking about doing is camping a seat that another student could have had and that you apparently don't really want, just so that you aren't left out in the cold if your scheme fails. It makes you sound immature, self-centered, and profoundly ungrateful.

Don't be that guy. You are better than that, or no school would have given you a shot.

 

[Mr. Mojo Risin]

MD applications ask if you've ever been in a medical program before. You would have to lie. Lying is bad.

Not to mention the fact that OP would also have to send in all transcripts before matriculating, which would include up to a year's worth of medical school grades. Awkward... Obviously this is all a huge IF. Either that or lie again... which is stupid. Lies built upon lies don't have good endings.

 

[Mr. Mojo Risin]

A lot of deferrals are contingent on not applying elsewhere

So granting a deferral involves some sort of signed binding contract between the school and the accepted applicant?

 

[Promethean]

So granting a deferral involves some sort of signed binging contract between the school and the accepted applicant?

Typically. They are agreeing to hold a seat for you in the next class. They are due some guarantee of your intentions in the interim.

No one likes to be jerked around, least of all schools which have people clamoring for seats. If you flake out on a deferral, you aren't just screwing with their numbers, but you are potentially wasting an opportunity for them to offer a spot to someone who would make better use of it.

 

[Mr. Mojo Risin]

Typically. They are agreeing to hold a seat for you in the next class. They are due some guarantee of your intentions in the interim.

No one likes to be jerked around, least of all schools which have people clamoring for seats. If you flake out on a deferral, you aren't just screwing with their numbers, but you are potentially wasting an opportunity for them to offer a spot to someone who would make better use of it.

I see. Makes sense. Other than being seen as a douche, what sort of legal consequences could one face for doing so?

If you look here, UW states "there is usually one deferred applicant each year who ultimately chooses to withdraw and not attend medical school at all." They later state "Acceptance of a deferral does require you to withdraw acceptances that you may have received from other schools, i.e., you may not have a deferral from the UW School of Medicine and Public Health and another school. You may, however, apply to other schools the following year even though you hold a deferral from the UW School of Medicine and Public Health (although we hope that you don't)." Seems pretty benign at this particular school. Clearly they need a good reason for why the applicant wants a deferral in the first place, which OP does not even come close to having. Unless OP somehow gets into some prestigious research program for academic enrichment or something. I'm gonna go with no on that one, too.

 

[Promethean]

I see. Makes sense. Other than being seen as a douche, what sort of legal consequences could one face for doing so?

The specifics of any contract will depend upon the terms agreed to by the parties. I've signed a lot of contracts lately that included financial penalties for default or violation of terms (non-compete agreements for staffing agencies, mostly.) In reality, most of those clauses are just there as a deterrent. Just because a wronged party may have a contractual right to recover damages, does not mean that they will certainly exercise their rights. In practice, I imagine that very little specific would happen if someone violated the terms of a deferral agreement, unless they did so in a truly obnoxious way. Still, why go there? We are becoming professionals. No time like the present to exhibit virtues of integrity and faithfulness to one's commitments.

 

[Mr. Mojo Risin]

The specifics of any contract will depend upon the terms agreed to by the parties. I've signed a lot of contracts lately that included financial penalties for default or violation of terms (non-compete agreements for staffing agencies, mostly.) In reality, most of those clauses are just there as a deterrent. Just because a wronged party may have a contractual right to recover damages, does not mean that they will certainly exercise their rights. In practice, I imagine that very little specific would happen if someone violated the terms of a deferral agreement, unless they did so in a truly obnoxious way. Still, why go there? We are becoming professionals. No time like the present to exhibit virtues of integrity and faithfulness to one's commitments.

True. Given OP's intentions, I agree. There are circumstances in which you could (or should) request a legitimate deferral, but the one stated here is certainly not legitimate.

 

[RejectedMD]

Why on Earth would you want to do this? What would it accomplish for you? Are the expenses and the headaches of applying again really justified by what you would accomplish? Not to mention what this says about you...

You have a seat. That puts you ahead of a great many other students. What you are talking about doing is camping a seat that another student could have had and that you apparently don't really want, just so that you aren't left out in the cold if your scheme fails. It makes you sound immature, self-centered, and profoundly ungrateful.

Don't be that guy. You are better than that, or no school would have given you a shot.

sigh, I guess this thread was inevitably going to turn into this. Like I said in my original post, I wasn't asking for a moral lesson or begging for approval from more "mature" or "grateful" future colleagues than me. Just some objective input on what could tangibly cost me my career (there being some system used to check past medical enrollment or something?)

MD applications ask if you've ever been in a medical program before. You would have to lie. Lying is bad.

Wouldn't the answer to that question technically be "no" because at the time of the application I would be another month and a half away from matriculation into the school as an OMS1?

 

[Roxas]

sigh, I guess this thread was inevitably going to turn into this. Like I said in my original post, I wasn't asking for a moral lesson or begging for approval from more "mature" or "grateful" future colleagues than me. Just some objective input on what could tangibly cost me my career (there being some system used to check past medical enrollment or something?)



Wouldn't the answer to that question technically be "no" because at the time of the application I would be another month and a half away from matriculation into the school as an OMS1?

Don't get upset because people weren't willing to tell you exactly what you wanted to hear.

 

[darklabel]

Would that MD school ever find out he/she was at a DO school? At the time of application (june 1st) the student would not be enrolled at the DO school technically and if granted acceptance during the school year, the student would just drop out.

Is there anything technically wrong that could result in future expulsion? Would the DO student have to disclose his "gap year" plans? Is there any way the MD school could find out?

Just wondering...

If you took out loans to pay for first year then yes, they will find out. My financial aid office gives everyone a sheet with all their current loans each year including undergrad and graduate loans.

If you paid by cash, then you have to hope they never check student clearing house. It's unlikely to come up, but it will suck living your whole life until the day you retire knowing that your degree can be stripped from you if someone found out.

 

[xffan624]

sigh, I guess this thread was inevitably going to turn into this. Like I said in my original post, I wasn't asking for a moral lesson or begging for approval from more "mature" or "grateful" future colleagues than me. Just some objective input on what could tangibly cost me my career (there being some system used to check past medical enrollment or something?)



Wouldn't the answer to that question technically be "no" because at the time of the application I would be another month and a half away from matriculation into the school as an OMS1?

Ignoring the ethical implications of this. You will have submit ALL your transcripts prior to attendance at any accepted medical school. You will have matriculated prior to receiving any acceptances (Oct 15 is earliest possible date) and possibly to receiving any interviews (no guarantee you will receive an interview early in cycle). Not submitting ALL your transcripts to your accepted school IS FRAUD and can be discovered. See posts about student clearinghouse and not submitting transcripts in AMCAS.

What's the worst that could happen? Institutions talk, things don't happen in a bubble. Committing fraud in an application process could be grounds for you losing your seat at your current school in addition to any accepted school.

 

[Microshaft]

"give him an inch, and he will want a foot."

 

[seminoma]

sigh, I guess this thread was inevitably going to turn into this. Like I said in my original post, I wasn't asking for a moral lesson or begging for approval from more "mature" or "grateful" future colleagues than me. Just some objective input on what could tangibly cost me my career (there being some system used to check past medical enrollment or something?)



Wouldn't the answer to that question technically be "no" because at the time of the application I would be another month and a half away from matriculation into the school as an OMS1?

See below; emphasis mine.

When entering coursework, you must include information and corresponding grades for every course in which you have ever enrolled at any U.S., U.S. Territorial, or Canadian post-secondary institution, regardless of whether you earned credit. This includes, but is not limited to, withdrawals, repeats, failures, incompletes, and future coursework. Courses removed from your transcripts or GPA as a result of academic bankruptcy, forgiveness, or similar institutional policies must also be included.

In general "technically not lying" is going to be viewed as unprofessional and will be enough for action to be taken.

 

[seminoma]

Typically. They are agreeing to hold a seat for you in the next class. They are due some guarantee of your intentions in the interim.

No one likes to be jerked around, least of all schools which have people clamoring for seats. If you flake out on a deferral, you aren't just screwing with their numbers, but you are potentially wasting an opportunity for them to offer a spot to someone who would make better use of it.

Agreed, either that or both parties should be allowed to "change their mind". In that case the school should be allowed to reserve the right to rescind the deferred acceptance without cause anytime before matriculation.

 

[RejectedMD]

See below; emphasis mine.

When entering coursework, you must include information and corresponding grades for every course in which you have ever enrolled at any U.S., U.S. Territorial, or Canadian post-secondary institution, regardless of whether you earned credit. This includes, but is not limited to, withdrawals, repeats, failures, incompletes, and future coursework. Courses removed from your transcripts or GPA as a result of academic bankruptcy, forgiveness, or similar institutional policies must also be included.

In general "technically not lying" is going to be viewed as unprofessional and will be enough for action to be taken.

This is exactly what I was looking for. So it would definitely be grounds for expulsion and basically career suicide. Thank you!

 

[DrEnderW]

So I understand your talking about the whole not telling anyone play, but if you did do it legitimately or they did find out, there are some concerns. Many schools are going to require a USMLE Step 1 score (you won't have this yet), a letter from your dean, and faculty letters from your current school. If you did all that, most schools have between zero and a couple spots even available. Additionally, many schools say LCME transfers only. In other words, you likely wouldn't have it work out and your deans who will then be writing your residency letters, etc will know you cant stand their program. It's a huge gamble if it is even possible.