I'm considering not reapplying if I don't get in this year.

[softmed]

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I have pretty good reasons. My main ones are that I received an interview from almost every college I applied to and I've been waitlisted at about half them. My MCAT is also going to hit three-four years old and I would need to retake that which means restudying for it.

There's a time to give up, and I think that time might be after getting 9 interviews and rejections from every single one. Perhaps I'm just a big weirdo and people find me creepy. Who knows? But I've just spent probably $4,000 on 11 schools (including travel/hotel expenses) and I can't see myself spending that amount of money again. I'd have to go through this process spending $1000s while waiting on four (perhaps up to six) waitlists.

The worst part? I'm already a reapplicant. I've heard stories of people reapplying three or four times, but I don't know what their situations were. I doubt they got as many interviews as I have. Each one of those were a chance to get in, but none have resulted in anything so far. I'm waiting to see if I get accepted to two schools right now. I'm hoping that one will be an acceptance (my lone DO interview) and I'm obviously hoping for an acceptance from the MD school I'm waiting on, but expecting a waitlist (or worse).

I know I really want to be a doctor, but again, maybe there is something wrong with me that I do poorly in interviews. My application is not so strong that I can blame it on schools assuming I don't want to go there. Apparently it is strong enough that I'm a serious candidate though. And eventually I'm just going to look bad if I keep reapplying, getting interviews, then getting rejected. Some of the schools I've applied to interviewed me several years ago. Are they really going to invite me back for a third time? I think if I don't get in, I've exhausted my tries.

Anyone else have an opinion?

P.S. Sorry that this whole thing sounds like I'm feeling sorry for myself. I don't mean to come off that way--I'm just trying to explain my situation and be realistic about expectations. And I know that I could end up getting in off the waitlists, but I'm not holding by breath.

 

[rockymhs]

I really don't understand why you are not getting accepted.

You are probably a very competitive applicant by looking at the number of interviews you received.

Maybe it is your interview style that is causing schools to waitlist you rather than accepting you.

I personally think that you will get into one of your remaining schools that you interviewed at, so hold tight and be positive.

If you don't get in, it is your choice to quit and find a new life or to stick with it.

Good luck.

 

[Pedie Packs]

Do you want us to convince you otherwise?
Ok, I'll go first.
It sounds like your passion is medicine. You are just running into the interview hurdle. That is something you are going to have to get over.... with so many interviews, you have practice as well. What's the matter? Push through it. If you want to be a physician bad enough, you will do it.
You don't really have any concrete reasons for not reapplying, except wasted money on apps. You gotta realize the app money is merely an investment in the pursuit of a dream. Your earning potential as a physician will more than compensate for all these expenses one day.
Sounds like you are blindsided and bruised by the interview process... take a step back and look at the big picture.
Hell, you might even get in off a WL.
Good luck

 

[Pedie Packs]

Ok, now I see that you are a troll...

Mission accomplished, you made me waste time writing you a useful post. *****.

 

[Catalystik]

I'm sorry to hear you've had to endure two stressful application cycles. I hope you get good news from one of the schools you're waiting on. If not, a few months of "time off" from the crap shoot might change your perspective about whether it's all really worth it. Or not. I hope you have friends and family helping to support you through these last few months.

 

[Catalystik]

Ok, now I see that you are a troll...

Where did you get that idea? Am I missing something?

 

[softmed]

Ok, now I see that you are a troll...

Mission accomplished, you made me waste time writing you a useful post. *****.

Why don't you go through my past posts if you think I'm a troll? I have never trolled on these forums and you guys seem to have a very loose definition of it.

But in hindsight I probably should have put the question about St. George's in this topic. I guess I didn't because I thought it was too dense already.

 

[FIREitUP]

softmed: i hear ya bro. I'm sure you'll get off of a waitlist come summer time.

 

[illegallysmooth]

Don't lose faith quite yet. You have a VERY good shot at the DO school and also a good shot of getting off a waitlist. Every year a bunch of students at any given school must turn down acceptance --> waitlists move.

Out of curiosity, what is your volunteer and/or clinical experience like?

 

[Pedie Packs]

Why don't you go through my past posts if you think I'm a troll? I have never trolled on these forums and you guys seem to have a very loose definition of it.

Sorry, but your other thread seemed really sarcastic (about sgu, just since your question was pretty much a well known fact). I'm not one to call people out normally.... I was just pissed that I felt for your situation, wrote you a respectful post, and you came off as trolling.

My apologies if you are actually serious.

 

[softmed]

Don't lose faith quite yet. You have a VERY good shot at the DO school and also a good shot of getting off a waitlist. Every year a bunch of students at any given school must turn down acceptance --> waitlists move.

Out of curiosity, what is your volunteer and/or clinical experience like?

Pretty crappy. My volunteer experience is like ~200 hours +. It's all clinical though. I didn't put any shadowing experience down on my apps.

I guess maybe that stuff could be a contributing factor to my poor response after interview, but I doubt it could be the entire story.

 

[BlueElmo]

Hmmm, it's probably your interviewing skills. If you do repply, make sure to brush up and/or change your interviewing skills.

 

[softmed]

Hmmm, it's probably your interviewing skills. If you do repply, make sure to brush up and/or change your interviewing skills.

That's what I thought, but I've had interviewers tell me I'm a great fit for the school. Four schools told me this. So unless they're lying... But these were also schools with more than one interviewer, and it always seems like one interviewer loves me and the other isn't impressed.

 

[Pedie Packs]

Call up the schools in the spring and ask why you were WL. That would be a good place to start if you don't get in.

If you are on so many WL though, I have a feeling you will get in.

 

[BlueElmo]

That's what I thought, but I've had interviewers tell me I'm a great fit for the school. Stony Brook, Drexel (rejected), Upstate and Albany all told me this. So unless they're lying. But these were also schools with more than one interviewer, and it always seems like one interviewer loves me and the other isn't impressed.

Well then I don't understand how you can get so many interview invites but then get waitlisted/rejected. You're obviously good on paper that's why you got so many invites, but then you failed to advance from there. It has to be your interviewing skills, IMO. But then I could be wrong, you could try calling up and asking those schools who've rejected you.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

That's what I thought, but I've had interviewers tell me I'm a great fit for the school. Stony Brook, Drexel (rejected), Upstate and Albany all told me this. So unless they're lying. But these were also schools with more than one interviewer, and it always seems like one interviewer loves me and the other isn't impressed.

Not to be offensive but the last time we spoke you basically declared that your too good for DO schools and were really egotistic.

That being said maybe the schools your applying too might be too much of reach.. What are your stats?

 

[softmed]

Not to be offensive but the last time we spoke you basically declared that your too good for DO schools and were really egotistic.

That being said maybe the schools your applying too might be too much of reach.. What are your stats?

I'm not a big fan of a DO philosophy that somehow disease can be cured by manipulating bones. And yes, that is their core, "holistic" philosophy even though they don't really follow it anymore. It's completely contrary to germ theory. But I'm willing to look past that if it means I can be a physician.

EDIT: And I'm not saying this to get into a debate about DO, DO philosophy, and whatever. I've already had that discussion in another topic. I know that DOs and MDs agree on treatments 99.999% of the time.

Obviously I wouldn't have applied and interviewed at a DO school if I thought I was too good for it. I'm too good for Ross University (as 99.9999% of all applicants are), therefore I didn't apply to it.

 

[illegallysmooth]

Due to lack of experience with DOs, I think DO schools may get the impression you're using that as a back-up. Even so, you might still get in because your stats are very good.

Interview problems seem to be the most logical explanation. Or perhaps these schools are so focused on your undergrad they put you on the WL istead of accepting, despite your stellar grad grades. I still think you will get in somewhere this cycle.

And, I'd like to add, I know the OP in real life and he is not a troll. 😛

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

I'm not a big fan of a DO philosophy that somehow disease can be cured by manipulating bones. And yes, that is their core, "holistic" philosophy even though they don't really follow it anymore. It's completely contrary to germ theory. But I'm willing to look past that if it means I can be a physician.

Obviously I wouldn't have applied and interviewed at a DO school if I thought I was too good for it. I'm too good for Ross University (as 99.9999% of all applicants are), therefore I didn't apply to it.

Core philosophy is to help people through thick and through. That is the core philosophy of every health care field. While yes DO's use OMM(bearly) it does have helpful properties. I mean think in the context of the time, would you prefer the some manipulation or a mercury soaked inoculation?
Realistically both fields are old, and they do adapt to the change of technology. If DO didnt change and refused drug care right now i'd agree. But I really dont find the big difference between MD education and DO education sorry.

The reality of the matter is that you believe that DO's are vodoo doctors whom have no idea of medicine. I will agree OMM is at this point no longer necessary but it is a historical tenant of the DO's. I'd be like saying that MD's can no longer use another form of ancient medicine because its no longer as useful.

Sigh you see the end result is that your egotistic but your trying to be nice but the reason DO schools didnt accept you. Is because they probably figured out that this is a second choice for you. That is the problem your vibe is not comforting and its easy to tell your egotism and emotional complexes. If I can read you from just a response. Then interviewers can probably read into your very soul and attitudes.

 

[flip26]

Pretty crappy. My volunteer experience is like ~200 hours +. It's all clinical though. I didn't put any shadowing experience down on my apps.

I guess maybe that stuff could be a contributing factor to my poor response after interview, but I doubt it could be the entire story.

Did you not have any shadowing, or just didn't put it down?

Either way, this is a problem.

Sounds to me like you are shooting yourself in the foot. As a reapplicant, you should have really built up your ECs.

And as someone else above me noted, you really give off an offputting vibe in your posts...if we can sense that through your writing, I can only imagine how it comes across to interviewers.

 

[illegallysmooth]

Core philosophy is to help people through thick and through. That is the core philosophy of every health care field. While yes DO's use OMM(bearly) it does have helpful properties. I mean think in the context of the time, would you prefer the some manipulation or a mercury soaked inoculation?
Realistically both fields are old, and they do adapt to the change of technology. If DO didnt change and refused drug care right now i'd agree. But I really dont find the big difference between MD education and DO education sorry.

The reality of the matter is that you believe that DO's are vodoo doctors whom have no idea of medicine. I will agree OMM is at this point no longer necessary but it is a historical tenant of the DO's. I'd be like saying that MD's can no longer use another form of ancient medicine because its no longer as useful.

Sigh you see the end result is that your egotistic but your trying to be nice but the reason DO schools didnt accept you. Is because they probably figured out that this is a second choice for you. That is the problem your vibe is not comforting and its easy to tell your egotism and emotional complexes. If I can read you from just a response. Then interviewers can probably read into your very soul and attitudes.

If this is the real meaning you absorbed from what he said, you are in need of some reading comprehension assistance.

And grammar, while you're at it.

He wasn't trying to provoke a DO vs. MD argument here. DO wasn't his first choice. That's not egotistical. It's a personal preference.

 

[casillas]

Considering you got so many interviews, i would guess that you look really good on paper. My suggestion (assuming you don't get in this year, which is way too early to conclude) would be to reapply but between now and interviews get a job in a place where you interact with people a lot. Like a waiter or bartender or cashier at a supermarket. A job which you work with a group of people (who you have to interact with) and at the same time a bunch of strangers. This will help you with any social skills that may be lacking.

Or perhaps the passion you showed on paper for medicine didn't translate well in person?!

You should also call up all schools that rejected you and ask for a sincere opinion as to why you were rejected.

Whatever the case you need to find out if medicine is what you want to do with your life no matter what, and if it is then do whatever it takes to get to the goal.

 

[softmed]

If DO didnt change and refused drug care right now i'd agree. But I really dont find the big difference between MD education and DO education sorry.

I really didn't want to start this. 99.999% of their training is the same or equal. I'm not saying they're voodoo doctors (see homeopaths/naturopaths/witch doctors/etc) but I am saying that I do not like the philosophy as much as MD. Which yes, IS old and barely used, but it's still at the core of the profession (which is why they stress the osteo part so much in title and school names).

Sigh you see the end result is that your egotistic but your trying to be nice but the reason DO schools didnt accept you.

The reason DO schools didn't accept me is because I only applied to one and I'm still waiting to see if it did accept me. I'm thinking it will.

 

[mfrizzo3]

Ok......have a nice life.

 

[softmed]

Did you not have any shadowing, or just didn't put it down?

Either way, this is a problem.

Sounds to me like you are shooting yourself in the foot. As a reapplicant, you should have really built up your ECs.

And as someone else above me noted, you really give off an offputting vibe in your posts...if we can sense that through your writing, I can only imagine how it comes across to interviewers.

I had a little bit of shadowing. I did stuff as a reapplicant (grad school, research, etc) that I thought were more important. I did get a bit more volunteer experience as well.

Also, what do you mean by off putting? Conceited? Arrogant? Or am I just a poor writer?

My suggestion (assuming you don't get in this year, which is way too early to conclude) would be to reapply but between now and interviews get a job in a place where you interact with people a lot. Like a waiter or bartender or cashier at a supermarket. A job which you work with a group of people (who you have to interact with) and at the same time a bunch of strangers.

I have a ton of experience as a cashier and I always work in groups at lab. In interviews it seems like I'm the one that tries to talk and make friends with people. At the very least I try to make conversation with almost every person there. I think talking to my peers and talking to an interviewer are two very different things though. When I get to the interviews I tend to be much more nervous and forget to say things.

But the lack of shadowing on the applications might raise a red flag. I can't see myself not getting in just because of that, but maybe I'm wrong. I know it's pretty important, but truthfully I didn't even realize you could put it on the application. I thought it was more of a thing you talk about in interviews.

 

[MedBoundForSure]

the fact that your 200+ hours of volunteering is all clinical is actually a poor selling point. If you do decide to reapply do some other volunteer things like read to children, help at a violence shelter or something to that regard. Which gets me thinking, what leadership experience did you list?
Also, I think the schools you listed work late into the cycle and have a lot of WL movement so hang in there!

 

[CaliSurferDoc]

Do you have any red flags?

 

[softmed]

Do you have any red flags?

No. Unless crappy ECs/volunteer work is a redflag.

 

[FutureScaresMe]

What's your GPA/MCAT? While, yes, you are receiving a lot of interviews, numbers still come into play when schools make a final decision.

 

[LuciusVorenus]

It couldn't have been anything you have on paper since they interviewed you...
Maybe it was something someone said in a LOR and when they interviewed you they were trying to see if the LOR had any truth to it and for some reason they thought it did :/

I know it's a stretch but really what else could it be...

just call the schools and ask is all I can think of

 

[Ok2Panic]

Have you tried contacting schools you interviewed at but then were rejected from (either in this cycle or a previous cycle) to find out what happened? I'm sure a bunch of them won' tell you anything, but maybe at least a few will, and you've got nothing to lose.

 

[softmed]

It couldn't have been anything you have on paper since they interviewed you...
Maybe it was something someone said in a LOR and when they interviewed you they were trying to see if the LOR had any truth to it and for some reason they thought it did :/

I know it's a stretch but really what else could it be...

just call the schools and ask is all I can think of

That was a concern of mine. I thought about getting my LORs sent to a place that would allow me to see what professors wrote. I used the same ones both years, so it's certainly possible that someone wrote something bad about me, but I never got any unusual questions in the interview, so I doubt it.

 

[softmed]

Have you tried contacting schools you interviewed at but then were rejected from (either in this cycle or a previous cycle) to find out what happened? I'm sure a bunch of them won' tell you anything, but maybe at least a few will, and you've got nothing to lose.

After this cycle I'll probably do it, but what makes it difficult is that I won't be rejected until probably late August. I guess I'll have to do it in June.

 

[LuciusVorenus]

That was a concern of mine. I thought about getting my LORs sent to a place that would allow me to see what professors wrote. I used the same ones both years, so it's certainly possible that someone wrote something bad about me, but I never got any unusual questions in the interview, so I doubt it.

Well if it was your LORs then you just got ripped off a little bit and that's not a reason to quit since it was nothing you did. Get new LORs and apply to schools you haven't applied to before if you can, including DOs (residency is what really matters anyways 🙂 ).

 

[CaliGirl14]

boohoo 🙁

 

[softmed]

Well if it was your LORs then you just got ripped off a little bit and that's not a reason to quit since it was nothing you did. Get new LORs and apply to schools you haven't applied to before if you can, including DOs (residency is what really matters anyways 🙂 ).

I think you have a good point there. But since my LORs are a secret, do you think schools would let me know that some of them are not so good if I asked them?

 

[MrCheetah]

I have pretty good reasons. My main ones are that I received an interview from almost every college I applied to and I've been waitlisted at about half them. My MCAT is also going to hit three-four years old and I would need to retake that which means restudying for it.

There's a time to give up, and I think that time might be after getting 9 interviews and rejections from every single one. Perhaps I'm just a big weirdo and people find me creepy. Who knows? But I've just spent probably $4,000 on 11 schools (including travel/hotel expenses) and I can't see myself spending that amount of money again. I'd have to go through this process spending $1000s while waiting on four (perhaps up to six) waitlists.

The worst part? I'm already a reapplicant. I've heard stories of people reapplying three or four times, but I don't know what their situations were. I doubt they got as many interviews as I have. Each one of those were a chance to get in, but none have resulted in anything so far. I'm waiting to see if I get accepted to two schools right now. I'm hoping that one will be an acceptance (my lone DO interview) and I'm obviously hoping for an acceptance from the MD school I'm waiting on, but expecting a waitlist (or worse).

I know I really want to be a doctor, but again, maybe there is something wrong with me that I do poorly in interviews. My application is not so strong that I can blame it on schools assuming I don't want to go there. Apparently it is strong enough that I'm a serious candidate though. And eventually I'm just going to look bad if I keep reapplying, getting interviews, then getting rejected. Some of the schools I've applied to interviewed me several years ago. Are they really going to invite me back for a third time? I think if I don't get in, I've exhausted my tries.

Anyone else have an opinion?

P.S. Sorry that this whole thing sounds like I'm feeling sorry for myself. I don't mean to come off that way--I'm just trying to explain my situation and be realistic about expectations. And I know that I could end up getting in off the waitlists, but I'm not holding by breath.

It sounds like you just, and I say this candidly, suck at interviewing. Send LORs to all of the schools, hopefully one pulls through for you this year.

 

[morning]

You don't sound unsociable to me...I think it's difficult to tell something like that from an internet thread. I think your problem is:

1. You only applied to 11 schools.

2. You didn't significantly improve yourself from one cycle to the next.

You gotta remember that no matter how stellar your qualifications are, you're competing with thousands of other people who are basically equivalent to you. Losing after 9 interviews IS unusually bad, though.

 

[Morsetlis]

Statistically, applicants have a 33% chance of getting accepted to a specific school after interviewing with that specific school. There's a 97.6% chance of getting at least 1 acceptance after interviewing with 9 schools. From your specific situation, I would say that you are NOT an average applicant, and that there IS a red flag somewhere.

 

[LuciusVorenus]

I think you have a good point there. But since my LORs are a secret, do you think schools would let me know that some of them are not so good if I asked them?

I've HEARD that they might, but I don't think they will specify exactly which letter it was (maybe just give a hint or something). Is there a way you can read your letters after the application season is over :/

 

[softmed]

You don't sound unsociable to me...I think it's difficult to tell something like that from an internet thread. I think your problem is:

1. You only applied to 11 schools.

2. You didn't significantly improve yourself from one cycle to the next.

You gotta remember that no matter how stellar your qualifications are, you're competing with thousands of other people who are basically equivalent to you. Losing after 9 interviews IS unusually bad, though.

I don't really want to get into specifics, but I DID improve my application quite a bit. In my first year I had 3 interviews, in this year I had 9. If I hadn't improved my application significant I wouldn't have gotten any more interviews the second time around. And yes, schools that ignored me the first time gave me interviews this time. The schools that gave me interviews last time gave me another interview.

I did not, however, improve my community service or clinical experience that much.

 

[softmed]

It sounds like you just, and I say this candidly, suck at interviewing. Send LORs to all of the schools, hopefully one pulls through for you this year.

You mean letters of interest/intent? Some of the schools don't accept them. Remember I still haven't heard from two schools. I guess it's too early for me to be worrying about this, but it's a serious fear.

 

[LawNonTrad]

There's a 97.6% chance of getting at least 1 acceptance after interviewing with 9 schools.

Do you have a link to an online probability calculator for things like this? It's been awhile since I've had a stats class but don't they call this a "union" or whatever? Maybe I'm way off, but either way, a link or a brief explanation on how to calculate this would be phenomenal. I've searched and searched Google but can't find one. Thanks.

 

[BlueElmo]

You mean letters of interest/intent? Some of the schools don't accept them. Remember I still haven't heard from two schools. I guess it's too early for me to be worrying about this, but it's a serious fear.

Still plenty of time. I think you have a good chance of getting accepted to at least one.

 

[Morsetlis]

Do you have a link to an online probability calculator for things like this? It's been awhile since I've had a stats class but don't they call this a "union" or whatever? Maybe I'm way off, but either way, a link or a brief explanation on how to calculate this would be phenomenal. I've searched and searched Google but can't find one. Thanks.

1 - (1 - .33)^9

1 - .33 is the probability of getting rejected post-interview for any one specific school.
(1 - .33)^9 is the probability of getting rejected post-interview for all 9 schools
1 - (1 - .33)^9 is the probability of not getting rejected post-interview for all 9 schools, also known as the probability of getting accepted at at least 1 school

 

[JJMrK]

With 9 interviews, chances are very good that you will get in off of a WL/at a school you haven't heard from yet. If you don't, you probably have a problem with the interviews. Have you done any mock interviews to get feedback?

 

[faith2]

Yeah i agree where did the troll thing come from? Anyway OP only you know what you have to do. I am suprised about the amount of interviews and not one acceptance, but that tells you it has to be your interview skills. If you really want to do medicine yeah it sucks but you will khave to retake the MCAT, and work on those skills. I would not give up if I were you, this is a hurdle you need to cross.Good luck
GO ARMY!!!!!!!!!!
ACCEPTED 2014 UCF

Where did you get that idea? Am I missing something?

 

[softmed]

Yeah, again for those saying it must be my interviewing style, I had decent interviews.

So going back to letters of intent, letters of interest--the problem is that my number one choice doesn't even accept letters of intent. They rank you and that's the end. So if I were going to send a letter of intent, it would be to a place I don't want to go to as much. But I don't want to pass up an opportunity to get in from something like that. I also don't really know what school to send one to (I can't do it to all four since that's a bit dishonest, and if I was somehow caught it would screw me for that school).

 

[MedBoundForSure]

this is going to sound harsh but you problem seems to be that you are juat clueless about the process in general. How are you a reapplicant and don't know to contact the schools you were previously rejected from? How do you not know to send letters of intent or interest to schools you interviewed at but have not heard from? Letters of interest are by no means dishonest they are just a way of saying hey! I'm still here! You say you have not improved volunteering since reapplying a really hope that means you kept going with the experiences you had and not that you just have not done anything in a year because the later just looks BAD... Like you only did it to get accepted and don't otherwise care. Lastly, you only applied to 11 schools? You should know by now to apply more broadly.

I have a feeling your interviews didn't go as well as you think. What are your reasons for wanting to be a doctor? Choosing xyz school? Doing a certain ec?

schools seem to look at gpa and mcat most for interview invites while skimming ecs then give ecs and the essence of your being a harder look once you're at the interview. If you have nothing to really offer they will either pass you up or give you a big maybe...WL

I'm sorry but you don't seem like a proactive resourceful person, but then again I only know you from what you posted so forgive me I'm wrong.

 

[flip26]

this is going to sound harsh but you problem seems to be that you are juat clueless about the process in general. How are you a reapplicant and don't know to contact the schools you were previously rejected from? How do you not know to send letters of intent or interest to schools you interviewed at but have not heard from? Letters of interest are by no means dishonest they are just a way of saying hey! I'm still here! You say you have not improved volunteering since reapplying a really hope that means you kept going with the experiences you had and not that you just have not done anything in a year because the later just looks BAD... Like you only did it to get accepted and don't otherwise care. Lastly, you only applied to 11 schools? You should know by now to apply more broadly.

I have a feeling your interviews didn't go as well as you think. What are your reasons for wanting to be a doctor? Choosing xyz school? Doing a certain ec?

schools seem to look at gpa and mcat most for interview invites while skimming ecs then give ecs and the essence of your being a harder look once you're at the interview. If you have nothing to really offer they will either pass you up or give you a big maybe...WL

I'm sorry but you don't seem like a proactive resourceful person, but then again I only know you from what you posted so forgive me I'm wrong.

This says what I sense better than what I posted earlier (when I noted an "offputting" vibe in your posts)...it does seem like something is missing here - you lack a proactive, positive, salesman like approach to this process - and as a reapplicant, it seems like you have repeated the same mistakes you made in the first unsuccessful cycle...like not listing shadowing, even though you had some...and not sending letters of interest or intent...why shoot yourself in the foot?

And the title of the thread is offputting, defeatist...to be successful in this game, you have to work hard and put your best foot forward.

Good luck.