I'm so torn about Tom Cruise...

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worriedwell

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Part of an article that was on msn...

May 23, 2005

Has Tom Cruise received a medical degree in his spare time? The megastar is openly questioning the treatment Brooke Shields received for her crippling postpartum depression, a struggle she details in her new memoir, "Down Came the Rain."

Tom, sticking close to Scientology's anti-psychiatry party line, believes Shields, despite experiencing what she has described as suicidal thoughts, should have avoided taking the anti-depressant drug Paxil following the birth of her daughter, Rowan, in 2003.

"These drugs are dangerous. I have actually helped people come off," Cruise proselytizes, er, says, in an interview with Access Hollywood set to air Thursday (via the New York Daily News). "When you talk about postpartum, you can take people today, women, and what you do is you use vitamins."

According to Dr. Tom, "There is a hormonal thing that is going on, scientifically, you can prove that. But when you talk about emotional, chemical imbalances in people, there is no science behind that. You can use vitamins to help a woman through those things."



Now, I happen to love this guy's movies...like I'm a fanatic about them. But I've known about his involvement in scientology for some time and now he goes this far...it hurts me like a dagger through my tender heart. Any thoughts? Can I still watch his movies? I don't know if I can identify with him as the ultimate protagonist in ass kicking movies anymore. Where has my top gun gone?

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Yeah, these "vitamins" that he is talking about are probably some of the ones given out exclusively by the scientology cult. They are used for everything from depression to work-out supplements, and I don't know anybody who knows what is in them.

Scientology is one of the most widely known cult's and because of it's secrecy on how it keeps people within the system not that many people believe that it is all that bad. I personally don't watch his movies. I can't separate my feelings. I tried once and sat thru the movie going...how can he be involved in something as crazy as that? Doesn't he realize what he is doing to himself?

A cult that prides itself on the fact that you are born with these horrible memories of past lives and thru "sessions" you can clarify your mind and move towards a higher knowledge of yourself. Of course these sessions can cost hundreds of dollars each and to reach the ultimate state of "clear" you can end up spending thousands of dollars. I highly doubt that evil aliens did all of this to us. I mean a church that actually charges you money to be able to belong? An organization that TIME and 20/20 both call it a cult?

It sickens me and honestly I feel sorry for those people who are looking for happiness and found themselves lured into that world. I mean if you look at christianity, islam, buddism, or any other major religion you can find out what their beliefs are by doing simple searches for info. You can't find that out about scientology. You can find out how wonderful it is...with the purchase of a book.

You can find what being "clear" can do for you: A Clear is a person who no longer has his own reactive mind and therefore suffers none of the ill effects that the reactive mind can cause.

That is from their website!!! Wow, when can I become clear so I won't have to reap the consequences of thinking for myself!! The whole website reads like an ad on TV for a new and improved diet drug...grrr. It really just makes meill.
 
Sorry, but since becoming aware of Scientology's anti-psychiatry/mental health positions (including their puppet organizations like the Concerned Citizens for Human Rights and Narcanon), I have refused to support the products of celebrity Scientologists who use their positions of celebrity to advance their misguided agenda. Unfortunately, this agenda seems to crop up in some shape or form in far too many of the interviews these celebrities give, and some of them have no reservations about offering these views in front of legislative bodies.

The only exception I've made in recent years was when a colleague of mine brought over an old DVD of "Battlefield Earth." I highly recommend this to anyone who loves movies made so badly that they are unintentionally hillarious, or to someone curious about the "talents" of Scientology's founder, L. Ron Hubbard. Among the best parts- the villians are called "Psychlos" (get it?).
 
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I once saw something quoting Tom Cruise regarding those with mental illness. He had stated all these people need "are a walk and a good meal".

I suggest trying this method with all your acute psychotic patients, manic patients, etc.... see how far it gets you.
 
Hi Guys,
I LOVE thread so far.
What is the deal with Travolta allegedly "not being able to work till he became scientologist".

sasaada :luck:
 
i get the impression that a lot of these scientology advocates are those who have/had some form of mental illness/anguish that was mild or amenable to the type of "therapy" provided in scientology. I feel like Tom Cruise generalizes his success to all of psychiatry because he got in tune with scientology, his life got straightened out and now he is on board.

i'm not ready to villify everything scientology does, because who knows, maybe they have some good points, but its just so ridiculous to think that no psychiatric medications are acceptable to these people. there are gray areas, but come on Tom, don't you know L. Ron Hubbard blamed his psychiatrists for failing him and then took it out on them by creating an entire religion that villified them. psychiatry is far from perfect and we need to be humble enough to understand that...but that extremism of scientology just makes these people look like stupid flaky desperate actors.
 
worriedwell said:
psychiatry is far from perfect and we need to be humble enough to understand that...but that extremism of scientology just makes these people look like stupid flaky desperate actors.

Actually, they were already stupid flaky desperate actors...scientology just allows them to blame psychiatry for it.
:laugh:
 
OldPsychDoc said:
Actually, they were already stupid flaky desperate actors...scientology just allows them to blame psychiatry for it.
:laugh:

Why do people listen to the opinions of celebrities in the first place?

That, IMO, is madness.
 
Scientology is scary man... I bought one of their books to check it out and passed on my phone number for some meeting they were having.. Anyway they called me everyday for a month trying to schedule me for a meeting, video viewing, 'how awful people feel better' seminar or some sort. When I refused the woman who was calling, they had a guy call to harrass me. Sheesh! Crazed people!
 
For those who missed Cruise's disturbing interview, here is one of the few articles I found:

http://news.webindia123.com/news/showdetails.asp?id=84018&cat=Entertainment

Tom Cruise slams psychiatry as pseudo-science!
Washington | May 27, 2005 4:40:48 PM IST

Hollywood heart throb Tom Cruise has slammed psychiatrists, whom he blames for a drug-fuelled crisis in children.

The actor was diagnosed with dyslexia when he was just seven, and doctors suggested he should take drugs to control his learning problems.

Memories of that part of his childhood fuelled Cruise to seek alternative ways of overcoming his dyslexia - a problem that led him to the Church of Scientology's educational programmes.

Becoming a scientologist in 1984 made the actor look closely at the controversial religion's anti-psychiatry stance, and he has since become a firm believer that the science and the medicating of children is wrong.

"I'm going right after psychiatry and these false labels and this pseudo-science," Cruise was quoted by Access Hollywood as saying.

"I was diagnosed as dyslexic; I had a lot of energy as a child. They wanted to put me on drugs... Never did; my mother said no, absolutely not, no way and I'm thankful.

Am I making people aware of it by discussing it openly and saying what a fraud psychiatry is? You bet I am. I feel a responsibility because I care," he added.

The actor also maintains that poor results in education in America can be blamed on mind-altering drugs that are given to children.

"SAT (exam) scores have gone right down the toilet. The parents are blaming the teachers, the teachers are blaming the parents and the psychs are putting everyone on drugs," he said. (ANI)
 
Well,

Tom has a history of multiple unsuccesful personal relationships.
Could it be tracked down or at least related to his childhood or does his impulsivity and high energy level are necessary for his excellent carreer so far and stabilizing that would make him less suitable for demanding movies he is making.
Any producers that like scientology,besides actors like Tom or John (Travolta)?

Sasaada
 
Why do people listen to the opinions of celebrities in the first place?
That, IMO, is madness.

This is a good question, and a fairly pertinent observation, although I wouldn't characterize it as "madness" proper (from a "true" psychiatric diagnostic perspective!). It's more of a social-cultural phenomenon of our times.

IMO, in a larger sense, I guess, psychiatry, as a medical specialty, or even as a general field of scientific inquiry, has continued to "struggle" in a sense (historically speaking) to better define its own boundaries, own self-image, definition, scope of inquiry, etc. It is also linked somehow to the social and cultural, it seems, more than any other specialties of medicine or any other fields of scientific inquiry. It is so linked to human consciousness itself, to language, and to a lot of other things we don't really know too much about at this point, in spite of tremendous advances both in the "hard core" sciences and in the "softer" social sciences, in the last few decades, that it is hard at times to really define itself, especially on the edges of knowledge, and of its real-life applications.

Let us not forget that even now, a vast majority of the presumably relatively educated public still confuses "psychology" with "psychiatry". Culturally speaking, information-dominance (including a degree of "public education") itself is much larger and has a much broader reach in the realm of entertainment and advertising vs. hard-core science info, or "social sciences" (like history, anthropology, philosophy, or even education) info. Also, people do not, in general, with limited exceptions, take role models or even have a chance to learn too much from academic educators, versus other popular "educators" (which are, again, mostly in the business of entertainnment/advertising rather than true education). This is the state of things. I do not know if it's good or bad; it's just the way things are.

Personally, as a physician, I naturally value good quality public education, especially about public health issues, (including psychiatric or general "mental health" ones), and I wish it were more largely accessible somehow, but I also realize that there are a lot of practical limits to this. At this time, even the potential current and truely valuable psychiatric knowledge applications in the larger domain of public health info dissemination in general are fairly sketchy. There are literally only a handful of Public Health academic depts. across the world which even study or apply Psychiatric/Mental Health issues in a truely useful interdisciplinary fashion the way Infectious diseases have dominated the academic field of Public health for much of the 20th century (with good cause, of course, considering the potential benefits, application benefit vs. cost ratio, and urgency of morbidity/mortality stats!). Sure, the WHO itself or other potentially interested national organisms are recognizing this, since they are often trying to integrate "mental health" more and more in the domain of public education/public health...but again...there are practical limitations to this. Schizophrenia or Affective disorders/disturbances are not going to go away very soon. I won't even go into substance abuse disorders and their repercussions on the human brains, quality of life, or even larger social and economical repercussions, often quite violent or irreversible.

I would never fault my colleagues from all over the world who are dedicated and vaillant trench-workers battling these monsters on a daily basis, nor our colleagues from academia, or other organizations who might be interested in broadening the public education aspect. But Psychiatry remains, at this time a fairly costly, artisanal/local, often inefficient, and relatively primitive effort in its educational or even preventive/treatment outreach. That's how it is. It will get better...slowly. I sure do wish though that the American Psychiatric Association would use a bit better the current information technologies towards public educational advances. IMHO, I think they could do better with what they've got as of now, than what they've been doing so far. I sure wish they would work in a more cooperative fashion with other disciplines that are also interested in good quality public education as well, that they wouldn't become TOO entrenched in their insularism. Even this entrenchment is probably "good" to a certain extent because it DOES defines certain boundaries and self-definitions of the discipline that DO need better defining. Psychiatrists are really INTO "boundaries" a lot, as you well can see! But this should be, IMHO, balanced a bit more with OUTREACH, especially in this "global info" era. Psychiatry is about communication too, about clarification, about quality education...all fields of human knowledge and activity well worth supporting, and outreaching to. Academia also, IMHO, COULD do better than they have 'til now. Personally, I would tend to favor any effort towards improving in a more general and possibly standardized fashion across the board, the educational quality of residencies themselves (which is still very variable at this time. I know ACGME IS trying, but it's not yet enough, I also know.) It wouldn't hurt if Psychiatrists-in training themselves would have some improved access (other than sheer individual/personal effort or motivation/interest) to learning more about the history and definition of the field, including maybe some potentially rather obscure and complicated elements about the "philosophy of psychiatry", the "philosophy of science", and also about the public education/public health interface, etc. It IS hard, though, to maintain an efficient, ethical or judicious balance between healthy boundaries and potentially less-than-adequate or even potentially "risky"/too "fuzzy" interdisciplinarity. But we could do better, maybe. How do we reward our educators, I wonder? It's tough in these times to have acces to hi-quality education, at most levels, even within the specialty itself, never mind about the general public level!

For whoever is interested, there was a fairly complex article in one of the more recent APA "green" journals about the "philosophy of psychiatry", by Dr. Kenneth Kendler, "Towards a Philosophical Structure of Psychiatry" http://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/cgi/content/full/162/3/433

Here is the introduction:

"This article, which seeks to sketch a coherent conceptual and philosophical framework for psychiatry, confronts two major questions: how do mind and brain interrelate, and how can we integrate the multiple explanatory perspectives of psychiatric illness? Eight propositions are proposed and defended: 1) psychiatry is irrevocably grounded in mental, first-person experiences; 2) Cartesian substance dualism is false; 3) epiphenomenalism is false; 4) both brainmind and mindbrain causality are real; 5) psychiatric disorders are etiologically complex, and no more "spirochete-like" discoveries will be made that explain their origins in simple terms; 6) explanatory pluralism is preferable to monistic explanatory approaches, especially biological reductionism; 7) psychiatry must move beyond a prescientific "battle of paradigms" to embrace complexity and support empirically rigorous and pluralistic explanatory models; 8) psychiatry should strive for "patchy reductionism" with the goal of "piecemeal integration" in trying to explain complex etiological pathways to illness bit by bit. "
 
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