Infantry Officer versus Med School?

[q123]

Hey guys, i'm thinking of doing something other than medicine. The plan would be to serve 4yrs as an army officer(for fun and experiences), and then go into mba and banking. Of course it would still be possible to go to med school, but that would be stupid, it would mean i just wasted 4yrs. While for mba, those 4yrs in the military count as legitimate work experience.
On the other hand if i go to med school, then i would most likely still do hpsp(internship+4years as a military doctor), and then go on to civilian residency and try to be a doctor.

I think being a doctor is more fun than being a banker, but the process of becoming a dr is not fun at all. I'm afraid that 4yrs in med school is like 4yrs in prison. I really like to play sports and i'm afraid i won't have time for that or else i'll fail out of school. Also drugs like adderall are not a solution to me, because they have side effects that i consider to be too dangerous. In the army i would have a regular salary and no midterms/finals/step1,2,3, and a 4wk vacation, but i can be sent to iraq for 15months. I wonder if army allows more freedom to travel/play sports(tennis,skiing) whenever you're not deployed, or being in a university setting(med school) still is a less stressful environment?

Also some other factors to consider: i am older than your average premed(4yrs older). I am russian, and i would prefer to work in russia eventually. That's possible as a banker and impossible as a doctor, but location is not an absolute necessity for me. If my parents find out that i want to abort my plans to go into medicine and instead go to iraq, they will tell me "are you trying to give us a heart attack", and they will be very persistant in trying to make me feel guilty. They will also suggest that if i want to be an officer, i can do that after getting my medical degree. The problem with that is that if i go to med school, serve 4yrs, then residency, i'll be 40yo by the time i start my career... With mba, i could start my career at 30-32.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Bacchus]

Going into combat is not "fun." That's disrespectful to all miltary personnel. If this post is "for real" I may answer, but until then, no. This is disgusting. 👎

 

[nlax30]

Have you done any sort of shadowing/work or other experiences where you've been exposed to health care to try and see if you really do want to be a physician?

In my mind, it all comes down to a simple question......but one that can be extremely hard to make and is very involved..... do you want to be a doctor?

If you're not sure then you better start talking to physicians, other students, do some shadowing/volunteering/etc... and figure it out. Don't do it just b/c family wants you to, you don't want to suffer through 4 yrs of med school, and then residency only to regret it or to drop out and have the debt..... and vice versa.

Good luck though! Personally, and luckily for me since I'm a little indecisive, I couldn't picture myself doing anything else as a career so I'm in for the long haul.

 

[nlax30]

Going into combat is not "fun." That's disrespectful to all miltary personnel. If this post is "for real" I may answer, but until then, no. This is disgusting. 👎

Umm....where did he say that going into combat would be "fun"?

 

[q123]

Umm....where did he say that going into combat would be "fun"?

exactly. there is a very good chance to be deployed for 15months, and even if you dont go into combat, it is a bit like prison... but that's part of the job. but i'd like to compare the lifestyle of an infantry officer when not deployed compared to that of a med student. army has an infantry base in Visenza, Italy but there is no guarantee to get it. But it would be sweet.

 

[armybound]

I've never served, but I've always wanted to. Growing up in that environment has shown me a lot of the country and the world and I've had experiences that most kids our age have never even imagined.

If you're willing to put in the time and go through the risk, I think it will be a very personally rewarding experience. Medical school will always be there when you get back.

 

[Drogba]

exactly. there is a very good chance to be deployed for 15months, and even if you dont go into combat, it is a bit like prison... but that's part of the job. but i'd like to compare the lifestyle of an infantry officer when not deployed compared to that of a med student. army has an infantry base in Visenza, Italy but there is no guarantee to get it. But it would be sweet.

Oh lord... going into the Army for the lifestyle? Are you willing to kill or be killed? I wouldn't go into the armed forces looking for a good time. If you are making life decisions based on what you perceive is "fun" or "not fun" maybe neither experience is really up your alley. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you've thought this through and are just expressing yourself poorly... although it really doesn't sound like you have.

 

[q123]

Have you done any sort of shadowing/work or other experiences where you've been exposed to health care to try and see if you really do want to be a physician?

In my mind, it all comes down to a simple question......but one that can be extremely hard to make and is very involved..... do you want to be a doctor?

If you're not sure then you better start talking to physicians, other students, do some shadowing/volunteering/etc... and figure it out. Don't do it just b/c family wants you to, you don't want to suffer through 4 yrs of med school, and then residency only to regret it or to drop out and have the debt..... and vice versa.

Good luck though! Personally, and luckily for me since I'm a little indecisive, I couldn't picture myself doing anything else as a career so I'm in for the long haul.

Yes, i've shadowed and I liked it. And dont get me wrong I'm about to finish my ugrad and I'll take mcat(and hopefully do very well this spring) before making any decisions. But to become a doctor(and a specialist) you need to spend 4yrs at the top of your class(barely passing is not encouraged) and take step1,2,3. then additional 9years of military+residency are not as bad, at least you're getting to do your job. But you still get pimped by your superiors and dont have the money/time to travel, read leisurely literature, and enjoy life. So I would sacrifice 13 additional years to become a doctor. And i am already 24.
p.s. my parents couldnt picture me doing anything else. but as for me, i am very interested in sports and women. getting paid to cut people would be cool though.

 

[Drogba]

Yes, i've shadowed and I liked it. And dont get me wrong I'm about to finish my ugrad and I'll take mcat(and hopefully do very well this spring) before making any decisions. But to become a doctor(and a specialist) you need to spend 4yrs at the top of your class(barely passing is not encouraged) and take step1,2,3. then additional 9years of military+residency are not as bad, at least you're getting to do your job. But you still get pimped by your superiors and dont have the money/time to travel, read leisurely literature, and enjoy life. So I would sacrifice 13 additional years to become a doctor. And i am already 24.
p.s. my parents couldnt picture me doing anything else. but as for me, i am very interested in sports and women. getting paid to cut people would be cool though.

OK. Troll and/or crazy person. Lets end this thread quietly...

 

[Doctor]

Hey guys, i'm thinking of doing something other than medicine. The plan would be to serve 4yrs as an army officer(for fun and experiences), and then go into mba and banking. Of course it would still be possible to go to med school, but that would be stupid, it would mean i just wasted 4yrs. While for mba, those 4yrs in the military count as legitimate work experience.
On the other hand if i go to med school, then i would most likely still do hpsp(internship+4years as a military doctor), and then go on to civilian residency and try to be a doctor.

I think being a doctor is more fun than being a banker, but the process of becoming a dr is not fun at all. I'm afraid that 4yrs in med school is like 4yrs in prison. I really like to play sports and i'm afraid i won't have time for that or else i'll fail out of school. Also drugs like adderall are not a solution to me, because they have side effects that i consider to be too dangerous. In the army i would have a regular salary and no midterms/finals/step1,2,3, and a 4wk vacation, but i can be sent to iraq for 15months. I wonder if army allows more freedom to travel/play sports(tennis,skiing) whenever you're not deployed, or being in a university setting(med school) still is a less stressful environment?

Also some other factors to consider: i am older than your average premed(4yrs older). I am russian, and i would prefer to work in russia eventually. That's possible as a banker and impossible as a doctor, but location is not an absolute necessity for me. If my parents find out that i want to abort my plans to go into medicine and instead go to iraq, they will tell me "are you trying to give us a heart attack", and they will be very persistant in trying to make me feel guilty. They will also suggest that if i want to be an officer, i can do that after getting my medical degree. The problem with that is that if i go to med school, serve 4yrs, then residency, i'll be 40yo by the time i start my career... With mba, i could start my career at 30-32.

How does this sentence fit the rest of your post, and what are these side effects of Adderall you feel are "too dangerous" for you? Is Adderall really more dangerous than Iraq?

 

[q123]

I've never served, but I've always wanted to. Growing up in that environment has shown me a lot of the country and the world and I've had experiences that most kids our age have never even imagined.

If you're willing to put in the time and go through the risk, I think it will be a very personally rewarding experience. Medical school will always be there when you get back.

Your last sentence seems so encouraging but it's false. When there is such a program as HPSP, it is completely illogical to go in the army before going to med school. So if i go in the army, then unless i become completely disillusioned in my other career plans(mba that is), i will forget about med school. Btw, i havent taken any courses other than premed+math.

But yeah, I like to take risks and I love to travel.

 

[q123]

OK. Troll and/or crazy person. Lets end this thread quietly...

i will not reply to you any further.

 

[armybound]

Your last sentence seems so encouraging but it's false. When there is such a program as HPSP, it is completely illogical to go in the army before going to med school. So if i go in the army, then unless i become completely disillusioned in my other career plans(mba that is), i will forget about med school. Btw, i havent taken any courses other than premed+math.

But yeah, I like to take risks and I love to travel.

It's not false at all. Unless your own interests change. There are plenty of people who serve before going to medical school. Look at Panda Bear.

 

[Bacchus]

Umm....where did he say that going into combat would be "fun"?

"The plan would be to serve 4yrs as an army officer(for fun and experiences)."

Right there.

 

[Drogba]

i will not reply to you any further.

You didn't reply to me in the first place, but thats fine.

 

[q123]

How does this sentence fit the rest of your post, and what are these side effects of Adderall you feel are "too dangerous" for you? Is Adderall really more dangerous than Iraq?

I inserted this sentence to characterize my personality. There is no doubt that a lot of students in med school "have ADHD". If I am faced with a choice to get bad grades(and end up in a specialty that i dislike) or to get addicted to adderall, i'll choose the former. If I spend even 2yrs taking a pill every day so i could sit in the library 24hrs/day instead of going out and going to the gym, my health will be 100% unsatisfactory. In Iraq, there is only a small chance to get killed or crippled. Small meaning <10%.

 

[chancer]

hey dude,

go in the army and be an officer...you deserve that just for asking the question...Now...LET ME SEE YOUR WAR FACE...douche

no..in all honestly, who cares what your parents think. it's your life. throw away the day planner and just go with it.

 

[q123]

"The plan would be to serve 4yrs as an army officer(for fun and experiences)."

Right there.

what did you get on mcat, genius? no need to reply further.

 

[Bacchus]

what did you get on mcat, genius? no need to reply further.

You asked me a question and I answered you. I haven't taken the MCAT. My point still is that this person is not in touch with reality thinking the army or any armed force will be "fun."

 

[q123]

no..in all honestly, who cares what your parenst think. it's your life. throw away the day planner and just go with it.

it may seem illogical but their argument would be "doctor is a good profession", "infantry officer(especially with iraq and all) is not so good". i agree with that. of course they dont take into account that med student !=doctor and that army luitenant!=career officer.

 

[nlax30]

"The plan would be to serve 4yrs as an army officer(for fun and experiences)."

Right there.

I've known lots of people who joined the military for fun and experience......

Unless I'm missing something it doesn't say that going into combat would be fun, he actually acknowledged that part of serving as a negative in his 1st post.

Not trying to be smart about it but sometimes people on here, me included, tend to jump to conclusions pretty quickly and/or will put words into someone's mouth. I'll give someone the benefit of the doubt unless they are outright ridiculous.

 

[Bacchus]

I've known lots of people who joined the military for fun and experience......

Unless I'm missing something it doesn't say that going into combat would be fun, he actually acknowledged that part of serving as a negative in his 1st post.

Not trying to be smart about it but sometimes people on here, me included, tend to jump to conclusions pretty quickly and/or will put words into someone's mouth. I'll give someone the benefit of the doubt unless they are outright ridiculous.

I just feel that he's viewing the whole process as fun. Serving as an infantryman does not appear to be a fun situation to me. If he would have written more genuinely (to serve or country, protect liberties, spread Democracy🙄) I wouldn't have been so short fused. I can understand that there is time for fun, but overall when in the heat of combat I don't see the fun in being in that situation. Granted the perks of travelling, a salary, etc will allow fun to be had. Although the comparison can be made between the military and medicine (their both mental and physically testing).

Edit: Overall, I think life of a medical student would be a better choice.

 

[q123]

It's not false at all. Unless your own interests change. There are plenty of people who serve before going to medical school. Look at Panda Bear.

I havent read too much about Panda Bear, I just know that he did serve and then became a doctor. But in that case, doing hpsp would be much more suitable for me. If i serve 4yrs and then just go to a civilian med school, i will be $200k in loans(not to mention the risk of serving in a combat specialty) and i will start my career as a Dr at the same age as if I had done hpsp. Of course i could serve 4yrs and then do USUHS, but then i would have to be a career officer and I wouldnt be able to travel to europe and to russia untill retirement. Thats why the only realistic plan would be to do mba.

 

[elderjack21]

Ti znaish, mozhno rabotat v rossi vrachom. V moskve ochin bolshaya mezhdunarodnia bolniza. Tam rabotaut vse...ya tam bil odnazhdi. Ochen horoshi facilities.

Ya sechas v amerikanskoi armi. Bil v Irake i Afghanistane, bil interesno, no ya ne skazal bi "fun."

Udachi!

 

[jochi1543]

Ti znaish, mozhno rabotat v rossi vrachom. V moskve ochin bolshaya mezhdunarodnia bolniza. Tam rabotaut vse...ya tam bil odnazhdi. Ochen horoshi facilities.

Ya sechas v amerikanskoi armi. Bil v Irake i Afghanistane, bil interesno, no ya ne skazal bi "fun."

Udachi!

...i iskat' obed v musornom bake.

 

[jochi1543]

How timely, I just got an e-mail from an old friend who said he's in the desert "again." I think last time he was deployed was about 2.5 years ago. And he's 50, married, with 2 children! Doesn't sound like much "fun" to me.

 

[nlax30]

I just feel that he's viewing the whole process as fun. Serving as an infantryman does not appear to be a fun situation to me. If he would have written more genuinely (to serve or country, protect liberties, spread Democracy🙄) I wouldn't have been so short fused. I can understand that there is time for fun, but overall when in the heat of combat I don't see the fun in being in that situation. Granted the perks of travelling, a salary, etc will allow fun to be had. Although the comparison can be made between the military and medicine (their both mental and physically testing), I don't think the options and "side-effects" of the military have been weighed enough.

I agree, he does have a lot of thinking to do and probably has an idealized view of military. Though on the other hand, pretty much every pre-med has an idealized view of med school and/or life as a physician.

Do you have family or good friends in the military? A lot of times they do find it "fun", I get similiar looks from non-medical friends when I say that I would honestly have fun working as a doctor. And of course I look at accountant/business friends the same way when they say that they have fun doing x..... all about perspective.

I've got an old buddy who's doing some sort of special forces work over in Iraqi and from talking with his family he's apparently having "fun", not for me but to each his own.

 

[jochi1543]

I havent read too much about Panda Bear, I just know that he did serve and then became a doctor. But in that case, doing hpsp would be much more suitable for me. If i serve 4yrs and then just go to a civilian med school, i will be $200k in loans(not to mention the risk of serving in a combat specialty) and i will start my career as a Dr at the same age as if I had done hpsp. Of course i could serve 4yrs and then do USUHS, but then i would have to be a career officer and I wouldnt be able to travel to europe and to russia untill retirement. Thats why the only realistic plan would be to do mba.

I'm sure you could still travel to Europe/Russia there.


Let me just mention...I shadowed a forensic pathologist (medical examiner) once, and he signed a contract with the Air Force to have his med tuition paid for - they covered the tuition, books, and living expenses in return for like 4 years of service. As a pathologist, he ended up doing some pretty cool stuff - he spent a lot of time in Kosovo digging out mass graves. Doesn't sound like that bad of a deal to me if you are already interested in the military thing.

 

[q123]

Ti znaish, mozhno rabotat v rossi vrachom. V moskve ochin bolshaya mezhdunarodnia bolniza. Tam rabotaut vse...ya tam bil odnazhdi. Ochen horoshi facilities.

Ya sechas v amerikanskoi armi. Bil v Irake i Afghanistane, bil interesno, no ya ne skazal bi "fun."

Udachi!

spasibo.
no ja soglasen s jochi1543! uvi, chast' privlekatel'nosti etoi professii eto to chto mozhno imet' svoi office v kalifornii gde vse tebja uvazhaut. i zarplata s kotoroi mozhno imet' letnii domik v grecii i t.d. ja immel vvidu chto 4 goda v armii vozmozhno bolee interesno chem provesti te zhe 4goda v med shkole ili 4goda kak consulting analyst. Kstati, ja ne bil v rossii s 1995 i bous' chto esli uchit'sa na vracha, to tak i ne budu do 2020.

 

[jochi1543]

spasibo.
no ja soglasen s jochi1543! uvi, chast' privlekatel'nosti etoi professii eto to chto mozhno imet' svoi office v kalifornii gde vse tebja uvazhaut. i zarplata s kotoroi mozhno imet' letnii domik v grecii i t.d. ja immel vvidu chto 4 goda v armii vozmozhno bolee interesno chem provesti te zhe 4goda v med shkole ili 4goda kak consulting analyst. Kstati, ja ne bil v rossii s 1995 i bous' chto esli uchit'sa na vracha, to tak i ne budu do 2020.

Da, na menya otets tozhe davil, treboval chtoby ya vernulas' v Moskvu i uchilas' na vracha tam (on hochet, chtoby ya zhila blizhe k nemu, a ne v Kanade). No oni zhe nachinayut medical school srazu posle sredney shkoly! K tomu zhe ya ne nastol'ko horosho uzhe govoryu po-russki - mne trudno pisat' nauchnyi tekst na russkom yazyke, k primeru. Kto hochet idti uchitsa na vracha s 17-18-letnimi pridurkami v takom vozraste? Hehe.

 

[Drogba]

I agree, he does have a lot of thinking to do and probably has an idealized view of military. Though on the other hand, pretty much every pre-med has an idealized view of med school and/or life as a physician.

Do you have family or good friends in the military? A lot of times they do find it "fun", I get similiar looks from non-medical friends when I say that I would honestly have fun working as a doctor. And of course I look at accountant/business friends the same way when they say that they have fun doing x..... all about perspective.

I've got an old buddy who's doing some sort of special forces work over in Iraqi and from talking with his family he's apparently having "fun", not for me but to each his own.

You have to be a real idealist to willingly (ie not constrained by economic circumstances) join the military in the first place thats for sure... I can't imagine anyone wanting to sign up given the current political climate and the ongoing tragedy in Iraq.

 

[nlax30]

You have to be a real idealist to willingly (ie not constrained by economic circumstances) join the military in the first place thats for sure... I can't imagine anyone wanting to sign up given the current political climate and the ongoing tragedy in Iraq.

I definitely couldn't do it..... but that's not being fair to the many people who do join, to say that they either do it because of economic reasons or b/c they just have an unrealistic view of what happens.

Even for medicine, so in today's climate of healthcare and increasingly litigious society are we just going into medicine b/c of unrealistic expectations?

 

[Enthalpy430]

I really like to play sports and i'm afraid i won't have time for that or else i'll fail out of school.

I wonder if army allows more freedom to travel/play sports(tennis,skiing) whenever you're not deployed, or being in a university setting(med school) still is a less stressful environment?

I sort of doubt you'll have any more time to play sports when you get shipped off to Iraq than you would in med school. That being said, it really doesn't sound like you're enjoying what you're doing now. So, you should do something else. If you think that's going to be in the military, then do what you think is right. That sort of life sure as hell isn't for me, but I'm not you.

what did you get on mcat, genius? no need to reply further.

Just curious, but what did you get on yours?

 

[Old Grunt]

Hey guys, i'm thinking of doing something other than medicine. The plan would be to serve 4yrs as an army officer(for fun and experiences), and then go into mba and banking. Of course it would still be possible to go to med school, but that would be stupid, it would mean i just wasted 4yrs. While for mba, those 4yrs in the military count as legitimate work experience.
On the other hand if i go to med school, then i would most likely still do hpsp(internship+4years as a military doctor), and then go on to civilian residency and try to be a doctor.

I think being a doctor is more fun than being a banker, but the process of becoming a dr is not fun at all. I'm afraid that 4yrs in med school is like 4yrs in prison. I really like to play sports and i'm afraid i won't have time for that or else i'll fail out of school. Also drugs like adderall are not a solution to me, because they have side effects that i consider to be too dangerous. In the army i would have a regular salary and no midterms/finals/step1,2,3, and a 4wk vacation, but i can be sent to iraq for 15months. I wonder if army allows more freedom to travel/play sports(tennis,skiing) whenever you're not deployed, or being in a university setting(med school) still is a less stressful environment?

Also some other factors to consider: i am older than your average premed(4yrs older). I am russian, and i would prefer to work in russia eventually. That's possible as a banker and impossible as a doctor, but location is not an absolute necessity for me. If my parents find out that i want to abort my plans to go into medicine and instead go to iraq, they will tell me "are you trying to give us a heart attack", and they will be very persistant in trying to make me feel guilty. They will also suggest that if i want to be an officer, i can do that after getting my medical degree. The problem with that is that if i go to med school, serve 4yrs, then residency, i'll be 40yo by the time i start my career... With mba, i could start my career at 30-32.

I served for four years in the Army as an Infantry officer. Of that time, almost thirty months of it were spend as a platoon leader (rifle and reconnaissance), I decided to go to med school after my tour in Afghanistan.

If you don't want to go into medicine, then you shouldn't. You definately shouldn't do it because your parents want you to do it. In the end, you have to make that walk on your own. I always tell people not to join the military unless they are passionate about serving (as opposed to doing it for the money). It sounds like you are.

Honestly, this is not a decision to be made on an internet forum. It requires some soul searching and research. You should understand that your obligation to the Army will be eight years (including the IRR) and that many of my friends have done multiple tours and left the Army with the intent of starting a new life, only to be forced back into active duty. Unfortunately, I don't think we will be out of Iraq or Afghanistan anytime soon.

You do have some options if you want to do the military and medicine. As you noted, the HPSP is one (be aware that the more money you take from the Army means you owe them more time). Many of my friends did two years as infantry officers, took the MCAT, and were released to go to medical school on the basis that they would return to active duty as an officer.

Vet the advice given here carefully. Many people on here have a skewed version of military service and combat duty.

That being said, I loved being a soldier and an infantryman. It's something I am glad I did, but wouldn't necessarily want to do again (if that makes sense).

If you do end up doing to Infantry route, I'd be happy to share advice on IOBC, Ranger School, Airborne School, Air Assault Schools, or the Infantry Leader's Mortar Course with you (I completed all of them, and you will be expected to complete them too as an Infantry Officer, especially Airborne and Ranger). Just PM me.

Finally, if you do end up going in the military and deploy to Afghanistan, don't tell the Afghans that you are Russian.

Good luck.

 

[Old Grunt]

exactly. there is a very good chance to be deployed for 15months, and even if you dont go into combat, it is a bit like prison... but that's part of the job. but i'd like to compare the lifestyle of an infantry officer when not deployed compared to that of a med student. army has an infantry base in Visenza, Italy but there is no guarantee to get it. But it would be sweet.

It's pretty tough to pull the 173rd (In Vicenza). Even if you are there, you most likely will spend most of your time deployed. It's an airborne unit and rapidly deployable.

You won't be considered for Vicenza unless you can complete Ranger School. Statitically, only half of the people that try that are able to finish.

Your best bet, is to get a good duty assignment (i.e. Hawaii where I was stationed), complete Ranger School, and then wait for one of your Infantry Officer buddies to crap out of Ranger School and trade him for it.

It happens all the time, but you'll have a hard time doing it if your duty assignment is Ft. Hood Texas or Ft. Riley Kansas. So when you are picking duty stations, put Vicenza first, but put other good tradible options 2nd and third.

 

[jochi1543]

Finally, if you do end up going in the military and deploy to Afghanistan, don't tell the Afghans that you are Russian.

It'd probably be difficult - if anything, they'd want to use your language skills, since your average Afghani is more likely to speak some Russian than English.

 

[Drogba]

I definitely couldn't do it..... but that's not being fair to the many people who do join, to say that they either do it because of economic reasons or b/c they just have an unrealistic view of what happens.

Even for medicine, so in today's climate of healthcare and increasingly litigious society are we just going into medicine b/c of unrealistic expectations?

In my opinion there is no comparison. Its one thing to get in to medicine in a climate of malpractice, bureaucracy and possible decreasing compensation and its another thing to put yourself in the position to kill or be killed. When and if we become disillusioned as doctors it will be a long the lines of "what did I waste my time doing?" or "am I really making a difference thats significant?" Disillusionment in the military will probably be more a long the lines of "I've killed people", "I trusted my life in the hands of whatever administration happens to be in power now and for whatever reason they decided we should go to war" or a bullet in the head.

I don't mean to demean anyones involvement in our armed services, as it takes great courage in many cases to serve, although no one can possibly know what they are getting in to from the get go.

 

[Old Grunt]

You asked me a question and I answered you. I haven't taken the MCAT. My point still is that this person is not in touch with reality thinking the army or any armed force will be "fun."

That's kind of a silly statement.

I had a blast when I was in the Army. Often times life was great. Sometimes it sucked. Even in combat it was generally 95% boredom and 5% sheer terror. As a bachlor LT, I lived on the beach on the North Shore of Hawaii and generally spent my weekends at Waimea Bay or Sunset Beach watching Kelly Slater rip it up (when a swell was in). Gotta admit, I had a pretty good time doing that.

Many people enjoy serving and wouldn't want to do anything else. If it was a complete suck-fest, then no one would do it.

Med School will be fun at times and sometimes it will suck as well. Nothing in life is black or white.

 

[Old Grunt]

It'd probably be difficult - if anything, they'd want to use your language skills, since your average Afghani is more likely to speak some Russian than English.

You'd actually be surprised. Don't forget that Pakistan shares a border with the country and had a large British influence over it. If you can speak English in Afghanistan, you could make more money (on a mulitple of 10) than a doctor. One of my duties was to run an English language school for the children in our local village.

That being said, the Afghans hate the Russians. Of course, they also generally hate Pakis, Arabs, and anyone else not Afghan.

 

[Old Grunt]

You have to be a real idealist to willingly (ie not constrained by economic circumstances) join the military in the first place thats for sure... I can't imagine anyone wanting to sign up given the current political climate and the ongoing tragedy in Iraq.

It's pretty annoying when people insist of attaching political motivations to military service.

It's annoying when conservatives do it ("The entire military is Republican and supports George Bush!") and it's annoying when liberals do it ("Why would anyone want to sign up and serve under Bush!")

Generally in both cases, neither person has spent a day in uniform. If they had, they would know that politics generally factors very little into people's service. Most jr. enlisted don't really give a damn either way. It is completely un-important how someone votes when the **** hits the fan (I would also say the same about someone's sexual orientation, but the Army doesn't care what I think about that).

What ever happened to simply serving your country to serve your country and be a part of something bigger than yourself?

It's fine that so many people on here "can't imagine themselves doing blah, blah, blah". It's an all volunteer Army, no one is making you sign up. That doesn't mean you speak for every other American.

 

[Re3iRtH]

Oh lord... going into the Army for the lifestyle? Are you willing to kill or be killed? I wouldn't go into the armed forces looking for a good time. If you are making life decisions based on what you perceive is "fun" or "not fun" maybe neither experience is really up your alley. I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you've thought this through and are just expressing yourself poorly... although it really doesn't sound like you have.

I guess his idea of a good time and experience is different from yours.
People are going to have different perspectives than you.

 

[Perrotfish]

I just feel that he's viewing the whole process as fun. Serving as an infantryman does not appear to be a fun situation to me.

Yeah, well, that's one of the many reasons you're not doing it. Maybe intersting would have been a better word that fun, but the chance to be genuinely excited by your work is one of the reasons that people join the military. The chance to incorporate athletics and outdoor activities into your job is another. This is also one of the reasons a lot of people go into medicine: because the idea of a life of grey cubicle fabric makes them feel sick.

To the OP: If you make this decision based on the response from an internet forum you are, no question, an idiot. That being said we might be able to refer you to some good resources.

Good required reading from the Marine Corps Reading list: "One Bullet Away", "Making The Corps", "Rifleman Dodd", and "Fields of Fire" and the first four books that most officer candidates end up reading

"Generation Kill" and "Fiasco" are also good reads about Iraq, from reporters, if you want to know what you're getting into.

armyocs.com is your reference site for their officer candidate school. Similitar sites exist for all other services (marineocs.com, etc).

Also look on the military medicine boards here to see if you want to try HPSP scholarship. Not necessarily a good financial deal, but maybe a good compromise.

If you don't mind me asking, why the Army specifically? You should know that they've been taking in a pretty low quality of recruits lately (older, criminal records, poor English skills), and as an officer you're going to end up responsible for their actions. I'm not talking about the average, of course, but the extremes of what they'll accept are getting pretty low. In a platoon of 40 you're going to get someone in the bottom 5%, and your career will hinge on his decisions. In contrast the Marines, Navy, and Airforce have all been making recruiting targets without adjusting their standards downwards.

Finally be aware that you don't get your choice of service as an officer. You can get through OCS, bcome an officer, and then spend 4 years in the asscrack of Georgia as an adjunct or a supply officer regardless of how badly you wanted that infantry spot.

 

[q123]

Da, na menya otets tozhe davil, treboval chtoby ya vernulas' v Moskvu i uchilas' na vracha tam (on hochet, chtoby ya zhila blizhe k nemu, a ne v Kanade). No oni zhe nachinayut medical school srazu posle sredney shkoly! K tomu zhe ya ne nastol'ko horosho uzhe govoryu po-russki - mne trudno pisat' nauchnyi tekst na russkom yazyke, k primeru. Kto hochet idti uchitsa na vracha s 17-18-letnimi pridurkami v takom vozraste? Hehe.

a u menia naoborot roditeli v ny i hotiat chto bi ja bil v ny. soglasen chto systema obrazovania tam sovsem drugaja, poetomu eto ne realistichno.

 

[jochi1543]

You'd actually be surprised. Don't forget that Pakistan shares a border with the country and had a large British influence over it. If you can speak English in Afghanistan, you could make more money (on a mulitple of 10) than a doctor. One of my duties was to run an English language school for the children in our local village.

That being said, the Afghans hate the Russians. Of course, they also generally hate Pakis, Arabs, and anyone else not Afghan.

Really? There's a couple of Afghanis on my boxing team, and while most of them have horrendous English (despite currently living in Canada), they are fluent in Russian - and none of them have ever lived in Russia.

 

[Old Grunt]

Really? There's a couple of Afghanis on my boxing team, and while most of them have horrendous English (despite currently living in Canada), they are fluent in Russian - and none of them have ever lived in Russia.

I would speculate that they were close to the Soviets and fled the country after the Taliban took over. That could be completely wrong, but it would be my guess.

I was out in the country. The Russians didn't spend a lot of time chatting up the Afghans there. They mostly spent their time shooting at them and chasing them with tanks and were universally hated. It might have been different in Kabul and other cities. You should ask them how they ended up in Canada.

On that note, one of the funniest things I experienced in Afghanistan was getting introduced to this old Muhajadeen. He was famous for "killing more Russians than Chernobyl", and that's exactly how the Afghans introduced him.

 

[nlax30]

In my opinion there is no comparison. Its one thing to get in to medicine in a climate of malpractice, bureaucracy and possible decreasing compensation and its another thing to put yourself in the position to kill or be killed. When and if we become disillusioned as doctors it will be a long the lines of "what did I waste my time doing?" or "am I really making a difference thats significant?" Disillusionment in the military will probably be more a long the lines of "I've killed people", "I trusted my life in the hands of whatever administration happens to be in power now and for whatever reason they decided we should go to war" or a bullet in the head.

Different outcomes maybe, but same thought process. What someone weighs as being ok on the risk/reward scale, another person won't. Sure, in medicine you aren't likely to get shot at, but what about getting sued and possibly losing everything, or being so stressed out about getting sued that it impacts your health (happened to an orthopod I knew).

I'll bet you that if you ask people in the military, they'll say that they aren't thinking about it from point of whether or not they should put themselves in the position to be killed..... I hope no one goes in thinking, "...this'll be a good chance to put my life on the line."

 

[Drogba]

It's pretty annoying when people insist of attaching political motivations to military service.

It's annoying when conservatives do it ("The entire military is Republican and supports George Bush!") and it's annoying when liberals do it ("Why would anyone want to sign up and serve under Bush!")

What I was saying is you are placing your life in the hands of a political party. Whether you consider that or not its the truth. I never suggested anything else you mentioned above and I totally respect your decision to serve. You are willing to kill people though and you are willing to be killed because the person in power today decided it whatever military intervention we are in is worth your dying and killing. The military is not an apolitical organization no matter which way you cut it. Doesn't it matter to you why you are fighting or if the person sending you to your possible death is trustworthy?

Generally in both cases, neither person has spent a day in uniform. If they had, they would know that politics generally factors very little into people's service. Most jr. enlisted don't really give a damn either way. It is completely un-important how someone votes when the **** hits the fan (I would also say the same about someone's sexual orientation, but the Army doesn't care what I think about that).

You are right I've never served in any military organization. I know a couple of people that have served in the US and in other militaries (Israeli) and have seen combat, though I have not discussed the matter with them at great length, nor would I pretend that this is a surrogate for the experience itself.

The psychology of the Army is nothing something I will claim to understand, but when **** hits the fan I would imagine nothing in the world matters except surviving. That doesn't mean nothing in the world matters.

What ever happened to simply serving your country to serve your country and be a part of something bigger than yourself?

It's fine that so many people on here "can't imagine themselves doing blah, blah, blah". It's an all volunteer Army, no one is making you sign up. That doesn't mean you speak for every other American.

There is nothing simple about it as far as I can see. If you enjoyed your time then fine. If you think you are a better person for what you did in the military and what you were subjected to fine. I don't see how you can say its not important to consider the reasons for fighting, though. What does it mean to "serve your country"? Does it mean to kill when told to kill and to die for whatever reason the temporary administration deems worthy? This type of blind "patriotism" is very dangerous in my opinion and I can point to various historical occasions that prove this beyond a shadow of a doubt.

I can understand if this is an emotionally charged topic for you but I expect you've had these conversations before and I trust that I haven't rubbed you the wrong way. I respect you and what you've been through. Please don't interpret my words as an attack on who you are.

 

[jochi1543]

You should ask them how they ended up in Canada.

Refugees.

 

[Drogba]

Different outcomes maybe, but same thought process. What someone weighs as being ok on the risk/reward scale, another person won't. Sure, in medicine you aren't likely to get shot at, but what about getting sued and possibly losing everything, or being so stressed out about getting sued that it impacts your health (happened to an orthopod I knew).

I'll bet you that if you ask people in the military, they'll say that they aren't thinking about it from point of whether or not they should put themselves in the position to be killed..... I hope no one goes in thinking, "...this'll be a good chance to put my life on the line."

I'm much more concerned with the part of being the one doing the killing, so I disagree with what you are saying wholeheartedly. I don't think risking killing (or being killed) and then being disillusioned to what you've is the same as any disillusionment you can face as a doctor. If you are ok with killing someone though then thats a different story.

 

[q123]

I served for four years in the Army as an Infantry officer. Of that time, almost thirty months of it were spend as a platoon leader (rifle and reconnaissance), I decided to go to med school after my tour in Afghanistan.

If you don't want to go into medicine, then you shouldn't. You definately shouldn't do it because your parents want you to do it. In the end, you have to make that walk on your own. I always tell people not to join the military unless they are passionate about serving (as opposed to doing it for the money). It sounds like you are.

Honestly, this is not a decision to be made on an internet forum. It requires some soul searching and research. You should understand that your obligation to the Army will be eight years (including the IRR) and that many of my friends have done multiple tours and left the Army with the intent of starting a new life, only to be forced back into active duty. Unfortunately, I don't think we will be out of Iraq or Afghanistan anytime soon.

You do have some options if you want to do the military and medicine. As you noted, the HPSP is one (be aware that the more money you take from the Army means you owe them more time). Many of my friends did two years as infantry officers, took the MCAT, and were released to go to medical school on the basis that they would return to active duty as an officer.

Vet the advice given here carefully. Many people on here have a skewed version of military service and combat duty.

That being said, I loved being a soldier and an infantryman. It's something I am glad I did, but wouldn't necessarily want to do again (if that makes sense).

If you do end up doing to Infantry route, I'd be happy to share advice on IOBC, Ranger School, Airborne School, Air Assault Schools, or the Infantry Leader's Mortar Course with you (I completed all of them, and you will be expected to complete them too as an Infantry Officer, especially Airborne and Ranger). Just PM me.

Finally, if you do end up going in the military and deploy to Afghanistan, don't tell the Afghans that you are Russian.

Good luck.

Thank you for the response! I think I am kind of interested in both career plans that I've proposed. I plan to take mcat in May and after that I would spend several days to decide whether to apply to med school or to ocs. I will certainly make the decision on my own, but I am always collecting pertinent info.
How does being released after 2yrs work? Were those people allowed to go into hpsp or into usuhs? It's unlikely I would do that, but sounds like a great option.
Right now I am most interested to know how does the process of becoming an officer work? I.e. if i come to see a recruiter(in May), how long does it take to fill out all the paperwork, tests, and to go to OCS? And do you fill out dream duty stations while in OCS?