Institutional Action... Should I even bother applying?

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meeninit

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Hey,

I got put on disciplinary probation at school for falsifying a parking permit. I am a first year pharmacy student (4th year overall) and was hoping to apply to medical school Summer of 2018... is it game over?

Thanks
 
How does one 'falsify' a parking permit, if you dont mind me asking. And that sounds like the dumbest reason to be given IA, why didnt they just fine you and call it a day.

To answer your question, I think you're fine. I've seen people here get II's with an IA, although a handful of schools require you get a lor explaining why you got one, Temple is one that comes to mind.
 
RudyRude said:
How does one 'falsify' a parking permit, if you dont mind me asking. And that sounds like the dumbest reason to be given IA, why didnt they just fine you an call it a day.

To answer your question, I think you're fine. I've seen people here get II's with an IA, although a handful of schools require you get a lor explaining why you got one, Temple is one that comes to mind.
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Scanned an old one, altered the date of expiration, then printed a new one... considered theft by my university.

I got fined $150 already.
 
meeninit said:
Scanned an old one, altered the date of expiration, then printed a new one... considered theft by my university.

I got fined $150 already.
Click to expand...

Jeez, I can't believe the parking attendant went through the effort of checking your permit, taking the effort to fine you, then report you. And I still cant believe that warrants IA... especially when they already fined you..

As I said though, I've seen people here get II's with IA, it doesn't count you out, just be able to explain yourself, dont make excuses.
 
RudyRude said:
Jeez, I can't believe the parking attendant went through the effort of checking your permit, taking the effort to fine you, then report you. And I still cant believe that warrants IA... especially when they already fined you..

As I said though, I've seen people here get II's with IA, it doesn't count you out, just be able to explain yourself, dont make excuses.
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I really hope so. Thanks
 
Does anyone else have any input? I will appreciate it.
 
Why not just finish pharmacy school and work as a pharmacist? It makes no sense to get your PharmD, don't use it at all, and then apply to medical school immediately afterwards.
 
Lost in Translation said:
There are worse things to get an IA for.
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There are worse things, but not that many. This is one of the more severe ones. This kind of thing can't be chalked up to "stupid things many college students do". This is willful attempt to defraud.

RudyRude said:
Jeez, I can't believe the parking attendant went through the effort of checking your permit, taking the effort to fine you, then report you. And I still cant believe that warrants IA... especially when they already fined you..

As I said though, I've seen people here get II's with IA, it doesn't count you out, just be able to explain yourself, dont make excuses.
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You can't believe the parking attendant did their job? They are following a pretty simple algorithm. The OP went through the effort to make a fake pass. This isn't something that can be a he said she said or a degree issue. They willfully tried to pull one over on the school by faking credentials. Yes, it is over something as stupid as parking, which is a reflection of poor judgement on the OP's part more than anything. As an adcom I see this just below academic dishonesty and well above your typical alcohol citation.

Regarding chances for medical school, not zero, but significantly dampened by this. Any IA is going to harm you, but something like this will be deadly at many schools. The same advice applies with everyone, but for you especially, very wide school net, backup plan and make sure that there are no avoidable gaps in your application because if you give them any other excuse, your application is out.
 
mimelim said:
There are worse things, but not that many. This is one of the more severe ones. This kind of thing can't be chalked up to "stupid things many college students do". This is willful attempt to defraud.



You can't believe the parking attendant did their job? They are following a pretty simple algorithm. The OP went through the effort to make a fake pass. This isn't something that can be a he said she said or a degree issue. They willfully tried to pull one over on the school by faking credentials. Yes, it is over something as stupid as parking, which is a reflection of poor judgement on the OP's part more than anything. As an adcom I see this just below academic dishonesty and well above your typical alcohol citation.

Regarding chances for medical school, not zero, but significantly dampened by this. Any IA is going to harm you, but something like this will be deadly at many schools. The same advice applies with everyone, but for you especially, very wide school net, backup plan and make sure that there are no avoidable gaps in your application because if you give them any other excuse, your application is out.
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There goes my dreams. Thanks for being straightforward.
 
meeninit said:
Hey,

I got put on disciplinary probation at school for falsifying a parking permit. I am a first year pharmacy student (4th year overall) and was hoping to apply to medical school Summer of 2018... is it game over?

Thanks
Click to expand...
meeninit said:
Scanned an old one, altered the date of expiration, then printed a new one... considered theft by my university.

I got fined $150 already.
Click to expand...
mimelim said:
This is willful attempt to defraud.

Regarding chances for medical school, not zero, but significantly dampened by this. Any IA is going to harm you, but something like this will be deadly at many schools.
Click to expand...
+1 to mimelim's comments .

IMO, any chance will be many years down the road, after many years of exemplary behavior, with a sterling application, and an insightful explanatory essay in the provided space about the IA.

If this is recent and at your current institution, I wouldn't be surprised if you were asked to meet with your current dean to discuss the issue.
 
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Catalystik said:
+1.

IMO, any chance will be many years down the road, after many years of exemplary behavior, with a sterling application, and an insightful explanatory essay in the provided space about the IA.

If this is recent and at your current institution, I wouldn't be surprised if you were asked to meet with your current dean to discuss the issue.
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Yes, I spoke to the Dean. My new plan is to not apply to medical school until 2022 or so after working 3-4 years.... Hopefully then it'll only be a minor blemish.
 
It's never going to be a minor blemish. However if you prove yourself an exeplory human being in that time and show you've grown as a person it shouldn't hold you back.
 
Wow, this is most unfortunate. It's one of those things that are penny wise, but (VERY) pound foolish. Such a small amount of money in the grand scheme of things over something silly like parking. I used to live in a city where the train tickets needed to be purchased on the honor system. Rarely would anyone check them, but in the car it was listed that it would be a misdemeanor if you get caught. They take it very seriously. Sorry this happened to you OP, I hope things work out for you in the future!
 
Why in the world would you want to get an MD if you have a Pharmacist license?
 
Tired said:
Hyperbole at it's finest.
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How many IAs have you seen on applications? Out of the dozen or so that I've seen maybe one or two were worse. Obviously part of it is selection bias since the really bad IAs don't make it to the general adcoms desk because they are screened out, but most people know to not even bother applying with bad IAs in the first place.

My point was, of all the things that people get IAs for in college, this will be seen as a bigger problem than most.
 
Indeed. With the hordes of applicants who don't have IA's like this, why should a med school take a risk on the OP.

I suggest years of exemplary behavior, with positions of responsibility to prove it. And own this, OP.


mimelim said:
How many IAs have you seen on applications? Out of the dozen or so that I've seen maybe one or two were worse. Obviously part of it is selection bias since the really bad IAs don't make it to the general adcoms desk because they are screened out, but most people know to not even bother applying with bad IAs in the first place.

My point was, of all the things that people get IAs for in college, this will be seen as a bigger problem than most.
Click to expand...
 
RudyRude said:
Jeez, I can't believe the parking attendant went through the effort of checking your permit, taking the effort to fine you, then report you. And I still cant believe that warrants IA... especially when they already fined you..

As I said though, I've seen people here get II's with IA, it doesn't count you out, just be able to explain yourself, dont make excuses.
Click to expand...

Parking attendants take their job seriously. At my high school the parking attendant lady would run after cars 🤣🤣
 
mimelim said:
You can't believe the parking attendant did their job?
Click to expand...


Honestly? Yes, it surprises me. Most parking enforcement I see just slowly walk/drive by a car to see if they have current permits, then keep walking. Thus attendant specifically saw the permit, but decided to check it anyways to see if it was legit. In any case, I dont think it should have warranted IA, a hefty fine a most.
 
RudyRude said:
Honestly? Yes, it surprises me. Most parking enforcement I see just slowly walk/drive by a car to see if they have current permits, then keep walking. Thus attendant specifically saw the permit, but decided to check it anyways to see if it was legit. In any case, I dont think it should have warranted IA, a hefty fine a most.
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At my school they pay those SOBs by commission so you bet they are busting their @$$ and writing up every single thing.
 
I had an IA for alcohol. Worked out fine. Then again, less severe, and I'm not sure how many schools haven't extended me an II because of that lol. I also do not think this is that big of a deal, but I would obviously trust the senior members of this board more than my own judgment on this matter. Good luck with whatever you choose OP!
 
Goro said:
Indeed. With the hordes of applicants who don't have IA's like this, why should a med school take a risk on the OP.

I suggest years of exemplary behavior, with positions of responsibility to prove it. And own this, OP.
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Thanks Goro... my new plan is to try to keep my 4.0 in pharmacy school for as long as I can, getting a good MCAT, publishing a couple of papers in the lab I work in and work as a pharmacist for 2 years after graduation and/or complete a SMP to show that I'm actually serious and dedicated.

Everything was working well until this happened. It's quite difficult to put myself back into my shoes and see what I was thinking when I did this because of hindsight bias and that sort of stuff. But it did happen and I hope that I'm not going to be painted as Billy the Kid for the rest of my life.

Question: do conduct violations appear on employer background checks? If this is the case, I'll have to even reconsider my pharmacist career path (community vs hospital).
 
meeninit said:
Question: do conduct violations appear on employer background checks? If this is the case, I'll have to even reconsider my pharmacist career path (community vs hospital).
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No, you should be fine in this regard. The only way I could see this happening is if the school took legal action against you (i.e., whatever you did warranted the police being called and you were arrested or something like that).
 
Everything was working well until this happened.
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Famous last words.

I have a friend who is in the app process right now and was cited for "public intoxication" two weeks ago. Over 21, but fell (broke her shoe) coming out of a popular off-campus bar, and a cop saw it and hauled her in. She is mortified. She has an otherwise "goody two shoes" background, top stats, and now fears that this will blow up in her face. Hired an atty, got the charges dropped, but now the school is making a big deal, and removed her from an important internship she had.

The adcoms on this forum can't remind college students enough to be careful.
 
Tired said:
I understand your point, and as you know I have nothing to do with medical school whatsoever. Just marveling at the dramatization of an incident that, in the actual real world, is minor and somewhat amusing.

I could also point out that it is a "major offense" only because people like you and @gyngyn (who review applications and set standards for entry) consider it so. Personally I would not, but my opinion is irrelevant.

But then that inevitably leads to a comment like, "If you're willing to forge a parking pass, you'll probably forge oxy scripts and set up an illegal drug ring." This is followed by serious internet nodding and "+1" comments from assorted junior medical students. Follow that with "helpful" comments on the need to seek counseling, "redeem" himself with years of service to the underprivileged, head-shaving and alms-giving, etc.

So yes, I understand. Saved a few bucks on parking, chances at med school shot, OP is a bad person. [/thread]
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:bow::bow::bow:

The real crime is here is the exorbitant amount of money that universities charge for parking on campus...it's damn near extortion! :sendoff:
 
Affiche said:
:bow::bow::bow:

The real crime is here is the exorbitant amount of money that universities charge for parking on campus...it's damn near extortion! :sendoff:
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I agree that the cost is crazy high. The univs would argue that the money is used to build parking structures and provide security and more blue phones.
 
meeninit said:
It's $400/year... and I don't qualify for a pass because I live less than 1.5 miles away from the campus.
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Holy hell...I remember having to pay $75 for one and considering that exorbitant.
 
I know some cops ticket here even when you have a parking pass if the pass is turned backwards. Makes no sense.
 
I wonder if the OP could possibly go military.
 
md-2020 said:
$1k per year at my UG.

Guess what I did? Shelled out the cash for a real one.
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A sanctimonious attitude will not help the OP's situation. While I would have tried to find alternatives such as carpooling, riding a bike, etc. if I were in OP's situation, I do not know the full story behind the OP's behavior. Maybe the OP felt (s)he had no other option due to a tough financial situation. Maybe the OP just didn't feel like paying it. Who knows? What's important here is that the OP has come to us for advice over what to do with his/her life, not judgement.
 
I'd be more worried about explaining your decision-making trend of jumping from pharm to med and convincing adcoms that you are devoted to this career choice.
 
RudyRude said:
Jeez, I can't believe the parking attendant went through the effort of checking your permit, taking the effort to fine you, then report you. And I still cant believe that warrants IA... especially when they already fined you..

As I said though, I've seen people here get II's with IA, it doesn't count you out, just be able to explain yourself, dont make excuses.
Click to expand...
Parking permits cost $500 at my school, trust me they go through the effort.

But why is it an IA? They should have made you pay for the permit and ticket for that day.
 
lalex said:
Parking permits cost $500 at my school, trust me they go through the effort.

But why is it an IA? They should have made you pay for the permit and ticket for that day.
Click to expand...

I suppose it may be an IA because the OP's university has an honor code that forbids this type of normative violation.
 
lalex said:
Parking permits cost $500 at my school, trust me they go through the effort.

But why is it an IA? They should have made you pay for the permit and ticket for that day.
Click to expand...
Seems pointless to argue with any specific school's policy on IAs, no? Regardless, I can see the logic behind classifying this as theft although I would consider it an overreaction.
 
lalex said:
But why is it an IA? They should have made you pay for the permit and ticket for that day.
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Lying, cheating and stealing are all IA's.
Stealing a pencil from the bookstore can be an IA. It is not the value of the item, it is the nature of the offense.
 
gyngyn said:
Lying, cheating and stealing are all IA's.
Stealing a pencil from the bookstore can be an IA. It is not the value of the item, it is the nature of the offense.
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True, true.
 
Pagan FutureDoc said:
Holy hell...I remember having to pay $75 for one and considering that exorbitant.
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Some schools are in very busy areas. Even though my school charges 500, they only permit commuters (that live far) and seniors who live on campus (barely any) to get permits.

But I think my school charges so much because you need a residential permit to park off campus so it's like you're only choice.
 
meeninit said:
It's $400/year... and I don't qualify for a pass because I live less than 1.5 miles away from the campus.
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Would you want a doctor that doesn't want to follow the rules taking care of your health?
 
leonardoson said:
Would you want a doctor that doesn't want to follow the rules taking care of your health?
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Actually, yeah, I probably would. There are a lot of dumb rules and bureaucracy in this world.

In any case, I don't think your judgment is really helpful. OP knows that they've made a mistake and is looking for advice on how to move forward.
 
leonardoson said:
Would you want a doctor that doesn't want to follow the rules taking care of your health?
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Honestly, if the extent of their rule breaking is trying to get out of a parking fee, I wouldn't care. Most doctors and med students I know have made their fair share of bad decisions when younger - just never got caught. They've turned out to be reasonably well adjusted individuals who act ethically.
 
hyderali91 said:
Honestly, if the extent of their rule breaking is trying to get out of a parking fee, I wouldn't care. Most doctors and med students I know have made their fair share of bad decisions when younger - just never got caught. They've turned out to be reasonably well adjusted individuals who act ethically.
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True. We get emails from our school forbidding us from using file sharing and downloading media from the school network. They threaten us with an honor code violation. The solution is simple... Do it from your home or anywhere else that's not on the school's network.
 
Planes2Doc said:
True. We get emails from our school forbidding us from using file sharing and downloading media from the school network. They threaten us with an honor code violation. The solution is simple... Do it from your home or anywhere else that's not on the school's network.
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Lmao I can just see the next SDN thread

''I got an IA for using youtube to MP3, is it even worth applying?''
''You're done for at MD. Start a non-profit for getting affordable music to the poor and apply DO in six years''
 
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