institutional action?

[PamPenguin]

If I apply to medical school (please don't judge whether you think it's appropriate for me to apply/attend... we all do things we're not proud of) do I need to check off that I have been the recipient of "institutional action"?

Here's the story. I was brought into the Deans office for a conduct non-academic violation (misrepresenting my credentials, I know not good) during a graduate program and I withdrew immediately after. There was no official school hearing, suspension, or dismissal, only a meeting with the Dean when I admitted I did something wrong. Technically it was a "voluntary" withdrawal because I chose to not go on to proceedings but the dean suggested that I leave before I get dismissed in a hearing. I don't know if being called in to talk to a Dean counts as "institutional action", but in the handbook meeting with the dean has to happen if you're accused of something, and they see if they want to call a hearing to determine the outcome. I could see being called into to talk to the Dean about a violation an "institutional action" but that would also mean that anyone accused of anything (even if they're actually innocent) also received an institutional action.

Here is the question from AMCAS:
"Were you ever the recipient of any institutional action by any college or medical school for unacceptable academic performance or conduct violation, even though such action may not have interrupted your enrollment or required you to withdraw? You must answer "Yes" even if the action does not appear on or has been deleted or expunged from your official transcripts due to institutional policy or personal petition."

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[Ismet]

Yes. You were the recipient of a conduct violation from your institution. Also, if you make it to an interview, you will absolutely be asked why you withdrew from the graduate program. And you'd dig yourself into an even deeper hole by lying about it.

Sure we've all done things we're not proud of, but this goes quite a bit farther than a mistake. The institutional actions I've seen (of applicants who received an interview at my medical school) were all one or two instances of alcohol or marijuana use, perhaps a noise violation or something. Things like cheating, academic dishonesty, or misrepresentation almost never make it through.

 

[GorolikesDeezNutz]

Lol don't answer yes. How will they actually know?

This is like the cops vs lawyers man. The cops will try to get what ever they can out of you even if they don't have access to it by pretending they do.
If its not on your records, don't say it. The schools decision to release any information not on your transcript etc, that you have not requested to be sent out, is a criminal offense.

 

[PamPenguin]

GorolikesDN--I want to be truthful because lying is what got me into trouble in the first place!

Thank you Ismet for your expert opinion. Can you be more exact about in what way I "received" a conduct violation? (I assume you have to receive something to be a recipient of a conduct violation, like a written warning, reprimand, or other official document).
I may have violated a code of conduct, but the only thing I received is a request to talk to the dean, as the policies of the school go. Does this count? It's not that I don't trust you, but I just want the most accurate information so I can make a decision whether to do all the work of composing a decent application in the future.

 

[tskbdmnd]

Lawyers exist bro. I hear they offer due diligence advice and work for a price.

 

[GBCrzzyy]

IMO, I would answer 'no' just because they didn't actually do anything to you. having to go talk to the dean isn't really an action and you took care of it yourself by withdrawing so they did not have to formally file any action against you. That's just what I would do. I think if they asked you why you withdrew from the program or anything at all, definitely don't lie about the situation but to me, it doesn't seem like it qualifies as an IA since they didn't force you to withdraw.

What exactly do you mean by "misrepresenting your credentials"?

 

[Goro]

Metta, you came back! And still giving the same *****ic answers too.

So you like that banhammer scar in the middle of your forehead...just under the single eye??

Lol don't answer yes. How will they actually know?

This is like the cops vs lawyers man. The cops will try to get what ever they can out of you even if they don't have access to it by pretending they do.
If its not on your records, don't say it. The schools decision to release any information not on your transcript etc, that you have not requested to be sent out, is a criminal offense.

 

[Goro]

Concur. Pam, this is something you have to explain and take it on the chin for. This doesn't look good. If you matriculated into a program, there will be evidence for it as well.

Yes. You were the recipient of a conduct violation from your institution. Also, if you make it to an interview, you will absolutely be asked why you withdrew from the graduate program. And you'd dig yourself into an even deeper hole by lying about it.

Sure we've all done things we're not proud of, but this goes quite a bit farther than a mistake. The institutional actions I've seen (of applicants who received an interview at my medical school) were all one or two instances of alcohol or marijuana use, perhaps a noise violation or something. Things like cheating, academic dishonesty, or misrepresentation almost never make it through.

 

[sparklingwater]

Well, here is an analogous situation: A professor suspects you cheated on a test. He offers to let you withdraw from the class, getting a "W", or go before a disciplinary committee and be judged innocent or guilty. In this case, most would agree that the "W" does not constitute an institutional action. However, a W is a common occurrence. Withdrawing from a graduate program is less common, but I still know many that left nursing/pharmacy/etc. school because they realized they wanted to become a doctor. Not finishing a graduate program is frowned upon, but definitely not a death sentence.

If you list your situation, you are 95% not going to get into medical school. Therefore, rather than asking for advice on an anonymous forum, I would 100% confirm you have an IA before listing it.

1) Contact a lawyer for advice
2) Contact your school for your disciplinary record and determine whether you have an IA

If you have an IA, list it. If you do not, don't list it. But be certain you are correct.

 

[philosonista]

Sparkling water is right.

People are on commenting on it as if the ethics of the situation determines whether or not you formally have an IA.

The only answer to that question is to go the the disciplinary office of the school at which this happened and ask to see your disciplinary record. If you have something on there, then the application asks that you report it. You have *full* legals rights to view your record.

 

[tskbdmnd]

I wouldn't put it past a person on this website to convince you to put that on an application so that adcoms have an easier time screening you out for nonos. I'm not sure about the morality of not fessing up to such a conduct violation. Lawyers work for you in exchange for money.

 

[PamPenguin]

Thank you so much for your awesome replies. I will contact my grad school to see if I was the "recipient of institutional action" according to their policies. I thought I was going to need to do that but wanted to see if the true answer was more obvious.