Interview Feedback?

[krazydoc]

Hi, guys,

Have you all been getting any sort of feedback after interviews (phone calls, letters, emails, etc)?

I received very positive verbal feedback from a PD at an outstanding program which I would like to attend, but am not sure how much stock to put into it...

Also, do programs make their rank list by the same date that we must?

- Krazydoc

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[almost done]

I agree, it's very difficult to know how seriously to consider some of these phone calls/emails/letters/smoke signals, etc. I think some places tend to be very aggressive in their recruitment. Thus, receiving positive feedback is great, because they're certainly not going after everyone they interview. Nonetheless, I'm sure they recruit more people than they have spots for, so getting a phone call is by no means a guarantee. It just means you've made it past another cut-off. On the other hand, I would guess that some programs tend to play more by the rules, and are not as aggressive. But that doesn't mean they are not as interested. The trouble is telling which program does what.

Either way, I plan to tell my top choice program that they are my top choice. Then I'll tell my next few choices that they are one of my top choices.

Lastly, I heard a rumor that the programs submit their rank lists a few days before we do. But I have no idea if that's really true.

 

[Big Lebowski]

Hi, guys,

Have you all been getting any sort of feedback after interviews (phone calls, letters, emails, etc)?

I received very positive verbal feedback from a PD at an outstanding program which I would like to attend, but am not sure how much stock to put into it...

Also, do programs make their rank list by the same date that we must?

- Krazydoc

When I interviewed, all the programs I interviewed called close to the time of submission of the rank list. I think this was also true of all my classmates. I'm guessing it is standard, at least for those applicants the program is planning on ranking. However, some programs appeared to show more enthusiasm than others and a couple told me where I was on their rank list (eg. "if you rank us first, you will have a spot here"). This all occurred before the rank list was do for the applicants, so I'm guessing that the programs finalize before the applicant does, but I'm not sure.

 

[krazydoc]

When I interviewed, all the programs I interviewed called close to the time of submission of the rank list.

For those of you who told your top choice that they are indeed your top choice, have you heard any feedback? And if so, what was it like?

Also, any other interview feedback from anyone else?

 

[whopper]

I interviewed at around 12 programs.
All of them offered very good experiences except for one where one of the interviewers acted histrionic, as if he wanted to start a fight (literally, I'm not joking). I think the guy was just trying to see how I'd react as if it was some type of test, but since the guy never told me it was a test or apologized for his behavior, I held it against that program. I felt like bringing it up to the program director who after this guy told me he wanted me to join their program, but I just figured I wasn't going there.

Of the rest where they were nice to me I could tell one of them was not interested or at least semi interested. The rest acted as if they were very interested.

1 of the programs sent me a few emails and letters, telling me I was heavily favored and suggesting that I go to the program.

The program director of one program told me he was considering offering me a contract before the match though it didn't happen. They told me if I didn't get a contract I would be placed very highly on their match list. I was told this during the last 15 minutes of my interview there.

Of the rest of my interviews about 3 of them told me I'd be placed very highly on their match list and so long as I placed them highly on theirs, I'd probably get in.

Strangely though, the one I got into--which I placed #1--well they didn't tell me too much though I did have many residents as friends in this program. I guess the director doesn't want to give any impressions away. I was told after I got in that I was very highly placed but I wasn't given any indications.

 

[pnazzam]

For those of you who received feedback after or during interviews, how did that pan out? For example, I received great unsolicited feedback from my top program (one where I did an away) and great solicited feedback from my second ranked program (i.e., after I told them that I was ranking them very highly). The PD's from both these programs told me they were extremely impressed with my application and ranked me very highly on their lists - but I got into neither. They're tough programs to match into, so I can't hold a big grudge, but it was a little surprising when I opened my letter (certainly not disappointing though). Alas, I'm super-happy where I am going, so it all worked out, but it's a little disheartening to get such great feedback from my top two and then not match at either... particularly when the feedback is unsolicited. Match is complicated, I know, so I can't hold anything against anyone... just wish that I didn't feel so strung along. Like I said, though, I couldn't be much happier going where I'm going now.

 

[ahsa]

I got unsolicited feedback from my 1st choice from the PD and chair, also did an away there, and matched there (UCSD). Also, got unsolicited feedback, phone calls and letters stating I was in their "matchable rank" from Brown, Harvard Longwood, Stanford and NYU. These were all in my top five - didn't hear anything from my bottom 3 or the places that I didn't rank

 

[meisteckhart]

For those of you who received feedback after or during interviews, how did that pan out? For example, I received great unsolicited feedback from my top program (one where I did an away) and great solicited feedback from my second ranked program (i.e., after I told them that I was ranking them very highly). The PD's from both these programs told me they were extremely impressed with my application and ranked me very highly on their lists - but I got into neither. They're tough programs to match into, so I can't hold a big grudge, but it was a little surprising when I opened my letter (certainly not disappointing though). Alas, I'm super-happy where I am going, so it all worked out, but it's a little disheartening to get such great feedback from my top two and then not match at either... particularly when the feedback is unsolicited. Match is complicated, I know, so I can't hold anything against anyone... just wish that I didn't feel so strung along. Like I said, though, I couldn't be much happier going where I'm going now.

I think there is a lot more that goes into this "feedback" stuff than we are going to know. I actually got solicited positive feedback from NYU which was my first choice and I matched there. However, I know some people got unsolicited feedback from them. For about a minute I wondered if maybe they went low on their list and I wasn't really ranked that highly, or if they just didn't contact me because they already knew I was interested. Then I realized that it doesn't really matter. I'm happy and I'm at a great program for me and that's all I care about. I also got unsolicited feedback from MGH, Columbia, Brown, UIC, Harvard Longwood, and some others, but I guess I'll never know what that meant. If you're happy with your match, consider yourself lucky. I know plenty of people, psych applicants included, who aren't.

 

[alina_s]

I got very positive feedback during interviews at the two programs I ranked first and second- both made it sound as though it were my choice to come there or not. However, many schools sent responses to the thank-you cards that I had sent, but I head absolutely nothing from either school after the interviews. This gave me the impression that they weren't as interested in me as they had appeared during the interviews, and I got into my third-choice school. Maybe this just means that I should have been more aggressive about contacting the schools? Who knows. I was feeling a little ambivalent about those two programs and I'm quite happy with my third choice.

 

[pnazzam]

Thanks! I was just a bit curious about the politics of residency recruitment. I couldn't be happier to have matched where I did, and I know I'm among the very lucky to have matched at such a terrific place.

Good luck to everyone.

 

[Doctor Wyldstyle]

I really thought my interview went poorly. I was late (by an hour) and I had an unusual loss of words for one of the questions. However, I recovered and attempted to show why I was interested in the program and explained my ties to the area and the institution. In other words, I sincerely painted a picture how I was a good fit for the program (I only do this with sincere, truthful comments). Some residents knew me and I was connected in some for to others at that program which I think helps alot.

It's my opinion program directors share a common fear of ranking an appilicant high on their list after meeting them once, perhaps twice and then relying only on their application/letters of recommendation. Then, the horror is finding out the skeletons in the closet later. Anyhow, if applicant A and B were equal, I'd take the input from staff/residents who know that working with that applicant is very positive and very conducive to the team.

Anyhow, to answer the original posters question, I sent thank you letters the next day. Received an email a few days later reiterating the interview highlights and that I would be ranked, and welcomed if I did match. They did also give the generic (but probably truthful) statement of an increase in applicants at that program.

It seems most people who got their first choice got some feedback. If you got your top 3 choice without feedback, please post! I'm curious.

 

[carolyn]

I matched at my #1 choice last year with no feedback from the program despite my emailing the PD and stating "You are #1 on my rank list." I was freaking out that the PD hadn't received the email so I even emailed a second time ("I'm not sure if you received my previous email because my email has been acting funny, but....") Still, no response. Imagine my surprise when I opened my match day letter.

 

[xenium]

I received very good feedback from my #1 choice (UCLA), which is where I ended up matching. I agree with the other posters on here that generally it is indeed hard to know how to interpret feedback, b/c of so many factors.. but at least for me, my PD's word was solid.

 

[Poety]

bump

 

[maranatha]

Bump

RustNeverSleeps got me interested in this now....

 

[drmistga]

I am not sure I am seeing the logic here either way in the match system.

1.Applicants telling programs they are going to rank them number one for example. This inherently would not make a program see a candidate as more desireable as far as being a good resident and if the candidate really did rank them number 1 then with the match the best thing for the residency program would still be to rank who THEIR number 1 truly was based on their apps/interviews even if that person showed no interest. As the match goes-it would try to put the program's number 1 into a slot of theirs if their number 1 ranked them accordingly and on their end it worked out. Now even if that candidate they wanted first matched somewhere else because the student ranked somewhere else higher-the slot would be open for the guy that emailed saying he ranked them number 1 and the program would still get the guy who showed interest but atleast they had a shot at getting their number 1-it is a no lose situation in the match for both parties really-it is built to have a shot at your number 1 without risking not matching at slots you knew you were getting in at(although hard to know but you know what I mean.)

The flipside-a program tells a student they are ranking them number 1-now will this make a student want to go to their program more? no-as I am sure you understand the match again is built to not take into account playing with likehoods of getting in-so the program ranks student number 1 and tells him-but the student wants to go to another program say. Say the student thinks he has less of a chance to go to harvard and more of a chance at yale since yale told him he was number 1. So the student should still rank harvard number 1 even if there is no chance of getting in or a slim chance. If the student happens to match at harvard it was maximum use of the match. If he doesnt then he matches at yale since they ranked him 1. Now if the student used this logic that people are talking about-and he heard yale ranked him number 1 so he ranks them number 1 thinking that will assure him a spot there-that is just not true-he has equal chances of matching at yale whether he ranks them 1 or 2 (providing he doesnt get into his first choice).

So basically for both parties it does neither no good to rank anyone other than who they really want on their list disregarding interest of both parties.

Now maybe letting a program know would break a tie between 2 equally qualified applicants based on the notion that a program would lke to have people who want to be there however this is still really faulty since a students interest of a program is built into their rank list. So if 2 equal students were there-and they both had great interest in the program but only one of them told the school about the interest and the other did not although had equal interest. And the school picked the person who showed more interest it is a disatvantage since the student who showed interest may only have ranked them number 2(although very interested another program was a bit more desirable but he was not lying saying he was interested) and say student 2 who was interested did not say anything and ranked them number 1. Then ranking the first student number 1 does no better either way. In one case say the first student does not match into their first so ends up with the spot-ok they got student 1.

Say student 1 matches at his number one-they do not get the student and they get student 2.

Say they rank student 2 number 1 and student one still ranks them second and number 1 gets his first choice-program gets student 2.


Either way if nobody said anything to anyone-the outcome would be the same if they just ranked acccordingly to they wanted. The interest of an applkicant is built into how high they rank a program and it does not good for a program to rank anyone other than the candidate they want.

 

[i61164]

Wow. That was a really hard post to read, but I got the gist of it and I agree. Lets make a pact not to tell programs where we are ranking them. If they want us, they will rank us. Period. If you want to show interest in the program, you can do that during the interview. Anyway, the more effort you put into love letters that you send to your number 1 choice, the more painful it will be if you don't match there.

 

[drmistga]

Ya haha I thought that after I read it myself that nobody will no what the heck I was saying or not bother reading it-it was one of those things that is clear in my head but freakin hard to put down in words-anyway I personally do not care if one shows interest and I do actually think some PD's and students believe that this info is helpful and put some weight on it-so it does have its place but these people just do not understand or are not aware of how to use the match properly. To be honest half of the people in my class are unaware of how to use the match to their advantage. I have seen countless people tell me they are ranking a program number one because they think its their best shot even though that is not where they liked the best-I think their naivity helps those who do know.

Ya sorry about the crappy ass explanation!

 

[RustNeverSleeps]

Another question I have about feedback people are getting...Programs are telling people that are in a position to match, yet most/many programs are still interviewing applicants. Does that mean that applicants who are scheduled to interview at "feedback-prone" schools are at a disadvantage because the top spots are given away?

 

[drmistga]

Think about it-if a program has 6 slots-do you think they only send out 6 feedback letters showing interest in an applicant. They have to market their program and secure people for spots with quality applicants-if a person is interviewing at a school they are likely pretty quality or they would not be there-they probably give feed back to 3 or 4 timse the number of spot (ie 24 people) since statistics would be that not all of those would rank the school anyway.

 

[Doc Samson]

Thinking about the match in a rational way is probably a mistake, since you completely eliminate the vanity factor.

Some applicants want to say that they matched at their #1 choice, so will rank a program they will feel most able to match at rather than the "best" program (thus prompting programs to call/mail soothing applicants' egos).

Some programs want to say that they only had to go X places down their ranklist to fill the program, so will rank applicants that they feel will be ranking them highly (thus prompting applicants to call/mail voicing "You're my #1 choice).

It's all quite silly at the end of the day. My advice is to pick your #1 program, rank it #1, tell them they're #1, and tell everyone else that you're ranking them highly (if you are in fact ranking them).

 

[PsychMD2100]

Nicely stated, Doc Samson

 

[lloyd braun]

Yes, Doc Samson. I admit I had never thought of it that way--especially the part about students wanting to say they ranked at their #1 spot. It seems silly, but I imagine people rank programs just this way all the time, unfortunately.

 

[Chewbacca Jung]

I've interviewed at a few places where most of the applicants ranked the program as either their 1st or 2nd choice. This seemed to make quite a cohesive bunch at each of these places. Granted these aren't the top-10-raved-about-cv-builder programs, but it sure makes a difference when the residents all choose to go there. So along with the vanity-factor, do consider the happiness factor as well (because I know med-school is great at beating it out of us-- just remember life can be beautiful).

 

[maranatha]

So along with the vanity-factor, do consider the happiness factor as well (because I know med-school is great at beating it out of us-- just remember life can be beautiful).

Very wise words, coming from a Wookie.

 

[sga430]

Thinking about the match in a rational way is probably a mistake, since you completely eliminate the vanity factor.

Some applicants want to say that they matched at their #1 choice, so will rank a program they will feel most able to match at rather than the "best" program (thus prompting programs to call/mail soothing applicants' egos).

Some programs want to say that they only had to go X places down their ranklist to fill the program, so will rank applicants that they feel will be ranking them highly (thus prompting applicants to call/mail voicing "You're my #1 choice).

It's all quite silly at the end of the day. My advice is to pick your #1 program, rank it #1, tell them they're #1, and tell everyone else that you're ranking them highly (if you are in fact ranking them).

great advice! residency is four years of ur life. would rather have the chance of being are ur dream residency or be at a crappy one where u can say u ranked them #1. my advice is if u must tell others u ranked at ur top pick then lie. if u r so vain it matters i think u can sacrifice ur honesty and still be possibly in ur dream residency. i still dont understand why someone wont rank them how u like them.

 

[jocg27]

great advice! residency is four years of ur life. would rather have the chance of being are ur dream residency or be at a crappy one where u can say u ranked them #1. my advice is if u must tell others u ranked at ur top pick then lie. if u r so vain it matters i think u can sacrifice ur honesty and still be possibly in ur dream residency. i still dont understand why someone wont rank them how u like them.

I don't understand it either...Are there really still people who don't get this?

 

[midnightblue]

I agree.

 

[pluginchugin]

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE INTERVIEW FEEDBACK?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

someone pleeeeeeease fix it!!!!! i need it sooooooo bad!

 

[Chimed]

WHAT HAPPENED TO THE INTERVIEW FEEDBACK?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

someone pleeeeeeease fix it!!!!! i need it sooooooo bad!

Hah?

 

[daru1]

My number 1 - Nothing so far
My number 2 - An e-mail and a letter
My number 3 - Nothing so far
My number 4 - A letter
I've gotten 2 more letters and an e-mail from the remaining 5 interviews I went on.

Hope that helps. (And no, I'm not revealing my ROL just yet

 

[charlottecorday]

I sent an email to the PD saying, sent a written thank you note, and then called. I spoke to a secretary who was nebulous and discouraging.

This school was my #1 choice. I mean, I was ready to cancel the rest of my interviews. But luckily I kept interviewing, and found a fabulous program which is just right for my needs and concerns. No, it's not a famous place, but I already went to a famous school, and it's not all it's cracked up to be. I thought by the time you got to residency you were done with designer labels and name dropping.

 

[psychattending]

Thinking about the match in a rational way is probably a mistake, since you completely eliminate the vanity factor.

Some applicants want to say that they matched at their #1 choice, so will rank a program they will feel most able to match at rather than the "best" program (thus prompting programs to call/mail soothing applicants' egos).

Some programs want to say that they only had to go X places down their ranklist to fill the program, so will rank applicants that they feel will be ranking them highly (thus prompting applicants to call/mail voicing "You're my #1 choice).

It's all quite silly at the end of the day. My advice is to pick your #1 program, rank it #1, tell them they're #1, and tell everyone else that you're ranking them highly (if you are in fact ranking them).

I would agree with Doc Samson. Tell the program in which you are interested that they are #1. If you want you can tell the others they are highly ranked or you tell them nothing. Us, PDs, know what highly ranked means.

From my end, I send emails only to the very top applicants. When I do so, I'm not trying to recruit them but am trying to determine if they really want to come to my program. Knowing which of these will be ranking me #1, helps me figure out how to do the rest of my list as I try to balance academic credentials with social needs (e.g. people with spouses or with specific needs).