Is it advisable to quit my master's thesis before I start med school?

[ravupadh]

Hello there. So I am in a peculiar situation that I will try to explain. I was accepted into New Jersey Medical School in September and will start classes in August 2013. However, when I received the acceptance letter, it stated that I must finish my Master's degree at the UMDNJ graduate school by June 30th. The key thing here is the med school doesn't care if I do a non-thesis or thesis Master's, just as long as I finish the degree by June 30th. I have been working on my thesis since November 2011 and almost certainly do not see myself finishing it by June 30th. There have been many reasons why that's the case. For one thing I am the only person in the lab because my PI unfortunately lost funding right as I started research in his lab and thus had to let everyone else go. Also, there are almost always equipment/autoclave problems and it never gets fixed because of funding issues. Coursework got in the way too and I wasn't able to work on the thesis weeks at a time. My PI and I also have very different schedules and one time I didn't see him for a month. But most importantly, I haven't even been able start working on my research proposal or set up a thesis committee yet, let alone the actual thesis dissertation. As a result of all of these factors, progress on my thesis project is oftentimes very slow. Taking that into account, would it be advisable for me to quit my thesis right now so that I can finish my Master's degree by June 30th as it states on the acceptance letter?

The main obstacle I see with this is telling my PI. I told him I would do a thesis the first day I started and he even wrote a recommendation letter for me when I applied. I don't want there to be any hard feelings between him and me but I am on a very tight deadline which I had no idea of before I received my acceptance letter. I was under the assumption that I would be able to continue working on my Master's thesis while I was in med school because both the graduate school and med school are part of UMDNJ. However if I continue working on my thesis right now there is a good chance I would not be able to finish by June 30th (especially because I don't have an approved proposal/committee) and that could hinder my acceptance. However if I go for the non-thesis route I would still get credit for research done in my PI's lab in the form of a research rotation and would just make up for the lost credits in courses. Keep in mind that I didn't receive any monetary support/stipends while doing thesis research. Also, while the research topic is interesting (molecular effects of antibiotics on E.coli) I have gotten quite bored of it because of the repetitive experiments. It isn't cutting edge research and actually the thesis has caused me to stray away further from research itself. I actually wanted to do an MD/PhD before I started the thesis.

Now about my career goals just to give you some perspective. I am most definitely not going to do an MD/PhD and the most I would do in med school is an MD with thesis option. Also, for long term career goals, I don't envision myself primarily working as a physician scientist in research. In other words in an optimal lifestyle I would like to spend 50% of my time on research (clinical or basic) and 50% on seeing patients. However I do not want to spend most of my time in the lab. Taking that into account will doing a non-thesis Master's really hurt me? And how do I approach my PI about this matter?

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[ravupadh]

bump

 

[Arbor Vitae]

bump, currently in same predicament

 

[lovesfall]

It sounds like you don't have a whole lot of choice. If you really think your odds of finishing by the end of June are slim, are you willing to let your med school acceptance hinge on completing it? I wouldn't. I've had this discussion with one of my PIs too (not the one supervising my MS, but one who I worked for). It would be nice in the future, if you want to go into research, to be able to have a publication derived from your thesis project. However, there are so many other opportunities for first authorships that I don't think it's anything to fret too much about. I would recommend talking to your PI about your med school acceptance, their stipulations for completion of your degree, and what your best plan is. If it's as hopeless as you seem to think it is, I bet the PI will agree that maybe dropping the thesis option is a good bet. That being said, there is no reason (that you stated, anyway) why you wouldn't be able to continue to work on the research or be involved in the lab even if you pursued a non-thesis degree. That might help make your PI feel better (as he would still have some help), would put you on track towards getting done in time, and would help keep your relationship positive as you transition into your next role. At the very least, I would offer to stick around the lab and keep working on things as needed until someone else can be brought in and trained to take over. I don't think you need to worry too much, though. If your PI knew of your plans and was supportive (and didn't know about the rules either), it might be a little bit disappointing but hopefully nothing to hold against you. Good luck!

FWIW, I am "finishing my thesis" now as well and it too is going super slowly so I definitely feel your pain!

 

[CrimsonKing]

Either go balls to the wall and get your thesis finished, or request a deferment from the medical school to give you an extra year before you start.

 

[ravupadh]

It sounds like you don't have a whole lot of choice. If you really think your odds of finishing by the end of June are slim, are you willing to let your med school acceptance hinge on completing it? I wouldn't. I've had this discussion with one of my PIs too (not the one supervising my MS, but one who I worked for). It would be nice in the future, if you want to go into research, to be able to have a publication derived from your thesis project. However, there are so many other opportunities for first authorships that I don't think it's anything to fret too much about. I would recommend talking to your PI about your med school acceptance, their stipulations for completion of your degree, and what your best plan is. If it's as hopeless as you seem to think it is, I bet the PI will agree that maybe dropping the thesis option is a good bet. That being said, there is no reason (that you stated, anyway) why you wouldn't be able to continue to work on the research or be involved in the lab even if you pursued a non-thesis degree. That might help make your PI feel better (as he would still have some help), would put you on track towards getting done in time, and would help keep your relationship positive as you transition into your next role. At the very least, I would offer to stick around the lab and keep working on things as needed until someone else can be brought in and trained to take over. I don't think you need to worry too much, though. If your PI knew of your plans and was supportive (and didn't know about the rules either), it might be a little bit disappointing but hopefully nothing to hold against you. Good luck!

FWIW, I am "finishing my thesis" now as well and it too is going super slowly so I definitely feel your pain!

Thanks for the response! I actually have authorship on a publication from undergrad so I'm not too worried about that. But yes I think I can stick around temporarily for a month or two until he can find a replacement. I actually directly approached him about doing a thesis though so I'm not even sure he would want a replacement. But in any case I didn't really need that much training for the project since most of the techniques I had learned in undergrad so hopefully he won't be at too much of a loss.

 

[Arbor Vitae]

My dilemma is that everything will be done but the writing and formal review/formatting. I'm hoping schools will allow me to finish this the next summer because I'd hate to defer just for a couple months of work.

 

[ravupadh]

My dilemma is that everything will be done but the writing and formal review/formatting. I'm hoping schools will allow me to finish this the next summer because I'd hate to defer just for a couple months of work.

Hmm so you already have a proposal and a commitee set up? Honestly I think you should be able to finish way before you start med school. In any case I would contact the med school directly and ask them if they will allow you to work on the thesis while in medical school. If the graduate school and med school are affiliated like mine I don't see them having a problem with it.

 

[Miss Alyssa]

My dilemma is that everything will be done but the writing and formal review/formatting. I'm hoping schools will allow me to finish this the next summer because I'd hate to defer just for a couple months of work.

I only skimmed the OP (too long). But a student in my med class finished her masters work off in the summer after 1st year. This might be an option for you guys depending on the requirements of both your med school and the school you're doing your masters at. For example, since then my school has made research mandatory in the summer after 1st year.

 

[Arbor Vitae]

Hmm so you already have a proposal and a commitee set up? Honestly I think you should be able to finish way before you start med school. In any case I would contact the med school directly and ask them if they will allow you to work on the thesis while in medical school. If the graduate school and med school are affiliated like mine I don't see them having a problem with it.

Yes, I've already done proposal. My research will take me up until summer and I can defend in the beginning of June. It's possible I could finish, but there is a chance I could still be writing or having to deal with the official review process. My friend just took months to go through getting her written thesis reviewed, edited, and formatted with the university even though she defended in June.

 

[ravupadh]

Yes, I've already done proposal. My research will take me up until summer and I can defend in the beginning of June. It's possible I could finish, but there is a chance I could still be writing or having to deal with the official review process. My friend just took months to go through getting her written thesis reviewed, edited, and formatted with the university even though she defended in June.

Oh wow. Yeah I'm not even done with a proposal so I know I wouldn't be able to finish by the end of June. It's a really dragged out process. Like I said, I would talk to the medical school about doing research while your a medical student. What did your acceptance letter say about completion of the Master's degree, etc.?

 

[Arbor Vitae]

Oh wow. Yeah I'm not even done with a proposal so I know I wouldn't be able to finish by the end of June. It's a really dragged out process. Like I said, I would talk to the medical school about doing research while your a medical student. What did your acceptance letter say about completion of the Master's degree, etc.?

Both schools I've been accepted to say they require you to finish your degree, but I feel like this isn't a strict rule depending on the case. In my case, I would only be writing and dealing with paperwork, which could easily be finished next summer if I'm not finished by matriculation. The main thing for me is I don't want to start medical all burned out from a Master's degree. I'd like at least a few weeks break to move and refresh before med school starts. I'm going to have to work nonstop until August if I want to finish by matriculation.

 

[hallowmann]

You want me to be completely honest, and this advice may depend on your PI's personality, but I think you should just talk to your PI. Be straight forward, say you're in this predicament and you really want to finish your thesis, but at the same time can't let it jeopardize your matriculation into medical school. Ask him what he thinks your options are and whether you can work something out with him. I've found that when you are honest and straightforward with people, and are also asking them for advice/help they are usually more than happy to accommodate you or at least are very understanding.

Being straightforward with your PI is probably the best thing you can do. You'd be surprised what a motivated PI would be able to do in terms of speeding up the process. In addition, you might even be able to postpone thesis completion for the next summer or even just drop the thesis. Ask for help man. Work with your PI and UMDNJ, and I'm sure you'll be able to work something out.

 

[Mako555]

if i were you i would do whatever it takes to start medical school this fall. this is the most important thing for you right now. getting a masters with a thesis is not going to help you more than starting your MD career one year earlier. tell your PI as nicely as you can. just explain your situation. if he/she blames you or holds it against you, than he/she isnt a nice person.

 

[ravupadh]

if i were you i would do whatever it takes to start medical school this fall. this is the most important thing for you right now. getting a masters with a thesis is not going to help you more than starting your MD career one year earlier. tell your PI as nicely as you can. just explain your situation. if he/she blames you or holds it against you, than he/she isnt a nice person.

Was that for me or MuAgonist? Lol sorry for the confusion

 

[VictorAlpha]

either go balls to the wall and get your thesis finished, or request a deferment from the medical school to give you an extra year before you start.

+1

 

[Gut Shot]

Hello there. So I am in a peculiar situation that I will try to explain. I was accepted into New Jersey Medical School in September and will start classes in August 2013. However, when I received the acceptance letter, it stated that I must finish my Master's degree at the UMDNJ graduate school by June 30th. The key thing here is the med school doesn't care if I do a non-thesis or thesis Master's, just as long as I finish the degree by June 30th. I have been working on my thesis since November 2011 and almost certainly do not see myself finishing it by June 30th. There have been many reasons why that's the case. For one thing I am the only person in the lab because my PI unfortunately lost funding right as I started research in his lab and thus had to let everyone else go. Also, there are almost always equipment/autoclave problems and it never gets fixed because of funding issues. Coursework got in the way too and I wasn't able to work on the thesis weeks at a time. My PI and I also have very different schedules and one time I didn't see him for a month. But most importantly, I haven't even been able start working on my research proposal or set up a thesis committee yet, let alone the actual thesis dissertation. As a result of all of these factors, progress on my thesis project is oftentimes very slow. Taking that into account, would it be advisable for me to quit my thesis right now so that I can finish my Master's degree by June 30th as it states on the acceptance letter?

The main obstacle I see with this is telling my PI. I told him I would do a thesis the first day I started and he even wrote a recommendation letter for me when I applied. I don't want there to be any hard feelings between him and me but I am on a very tight deadline which I had no idea of before I received my acceptance letter. I was under the assumption that I would be able to continue working on my Master's thesis while I was in med school because both the graduate school and med school are part of UMDNJ. However if I continue working on my thesis right now there is a good chance I would not be able to finish by June 30th (especially because I don't have an approved proposal/committee) and that could hinder my acceptance. However if I go for the non-thesis route I would still get credit for research done in my PI's lab in the form of a research rotation and would just make up for the lost credits in courses. Keep in mind that I didn't receive any monetary support/stipends while doing thesis research. Also, while the research topic is interesting (molecular effects of antibiotics on E.coli) I have gotten quite bored of it because of the repetitive experiments. It isn't cutting edge research and actually the thesis has caused me to stray away further from research itself. I actually wanted to do an MD/PhD before I started the thesis.

Now about my career goals just to give you some perspective. I am most definitely not going to do an MD/PhD and the most I would do in med school is an MD with thesis option. Also, for long term career goals, I don't envision myself primarily working as a physician scientist in research. In other words in an optimal lifestyle I would like to spend 50% of my time on research (clinical or basic) and 50% on seeing patients. However I do not want to spend most of my time in the lab. Taking that into account will doing a non-thesis Master's really hurt me? And how do I approach my PI about this matter?

Two things.

1. By the time you finish residency/fellowship, nobody is going to give two flips that you got a Master's degree. Thesis, non-thesis, doesn't matter. It's just going to be this thing you did before starting med school, so don't give it more importance than it deserves.

2. The medical school that accepted you has given you an exact date to finish your Master's program, and as a rule medical school's do not like ugly surprises. You need to pick up the phone, call admissions, explain your situation, and see what they say. If the rule is strict then your only option is to go non-thesis. If the rule is flexible then you have room to maneuver.

Seriously, call admissions and be up front with them. They will appreciate it a helluva lot more now than on June 29.

 

[austinap]

Late to the party here.

Screw what the letter says, call someone at the med school. Most of them will be pretty understanding that grad school doesn't quite run on the same timelines as undergrad and med school. In my case, I was actively working in my lab until early July of the summer during which I started med school, and didn't submit a thesis until about mid July. My degree wasn't actually granted until December of my first year of med school. I'm actually surprised that they stipulated you complete you degree by such an early date. Get them on the phone, talk to someone in person, and explain your predicament. There's a good chance they'll make it work.

 

[ravupadh]

Two things.

1. By the time you finish residency/fellowship, nobody is going to give two flips that you got a Master's degree. Thesis, non-thesis, doesn't matter. It's just going to be this thing you did before starting med school, so don't give it more importance than it deserves.

2. The medical school that accepted you has given you an exact date to finish your Master's program, and as a rule medical school's do not like ugly surprises. You need to pick up the phone, call admissions, explain your situation, and see what they say. If the rule is strict then your only option is to go non-thesis. If the rule is flexible then you have room to maneuver.

Seriously, call admissions and be up front with them. They will appreciate it a helluva lot more now than on June 29.

Thanks for the response. The thing is I wouldn't want to be working on my Master's thesis while I'm a medical student even if they gave me an extension past June 30th. I know that medical school will be tough enough and having to deal with the thesis process ontop of that might set the stage for a disaster. Optimally it would be nice if I could finish the thesis before I start in August but with research you of course never know what's going to happen. And as I said I'm not as interested in the topic as I thought I would be because of the reasons I gave above. I'll call the admissions office just to ask them if the June 30th deadline is strict, but even if they say no I will probably still drop the thesis because of what I stated before and because of what you yourself stated in your first point. Like I said I would like to do research 50% of the time while I see patients 50% of the time in an optimal medical career. I just have to figure out how to approach my PI about this since he did write me a recommendation letter and was expecting me to do a thesis since I began. I will probably e-mail him first so that there's no chance for a verbal confrontation. I would be gracious in the e-mail and ask if he would like to meet in person to discuss this further, even though I'm 90% bent on quitting the thesis.