Is it Over For Ortho?

[bad_bunny]

Hi, I'm a M4 who recently did not match into ENT. Spent a research year in ENT while doing a dual degree MBA. I was falling out of love with ENT by the time I applied in September, but felt compelled to apply considering that I wouldn't be competitive in any other specialty that I liked (mostly surgical-subspecialties) if I scrounged up an application last minute. Regardless, I ended up not matching to ENT.

I had an ortho elective in November and LOVED it. I could see myself doing this the rest of my life. I regret not pulling out of the match for ENT.

I could reapply for ENT, and faculty here said they would do their best to help me improve my application over the next 6 months. However, there is a big part of me that wants to chuck ENT and try for Ortho... I just don't know if its realistic to do in 6 months. Step 1 score is 253, Step 2 score is 255. 16 Publications, none are ortho. Don't have great relationships with any of the faculty, but would be willing to commit the next year in the ortho department.

Is it unrealistic to expect myself to scrounge up enough ortho pubs and build LOR's in the next 6 months? Also, does the fact that I didn't match into a different specialty already exclude me from the possibility of an Ortho match? Appreciate any brutally honest advice...

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[operaman]

Sorry to hear about the ENT match. I do think it may be somewhat unrealistic though I think your first order of business is to figure out why you didn’t match ENT to begin with. What red flag do you have? It sounds like you had a very strong application based solely on the numbers so I’m not understanding why you didn’t match. Even before we start thinking about changing gears, whatever red flag kept you from ENT is potentially still one that can keep you from Ortho or any other competitive field.

 

[bad_bunny]

Sorry to hear about the ENT match. I do think it may be somewhat unrealistic though I think your first order of business is to figure out why you didn’t match ENT to begin with. What red flag do you have? It sounds like you had a very strong application based solely on the numbers so I’m not understanding why you didn’t match. Even before we start thinking about changing gears, whatever red flag kept you from ENT is potentially still one that can keep you from Ortho or any other competitive field.

Thanks for your reply.

From meeting with the head of the department, it was my LOR. He said that there was one specific letter that was "not great". He was kind enough to identify who wrote that letter, and told me I should be okay if I ask for someone else to write the letter next time. He was also kind enough to say that he would push for me next year.

So, for me, that chalks up why I didn't match... that being said, can you elaborate on your thoughts of me thinking about ortho?

 

[operaman]

Thanks for your reply.

From meeting with the head of the department, it was my LOR. He said that there was one specific letter that was "not great". He was kind enough to identify who wrote that letter, and told me I should be okay if I ask for someone else to write the letter next time. He was also kind enough to say that he would push for me next year.

So, for me, that chalks up why I didn't match... that being said, can you elaborate on your thoughts of me thinking about ortho?

Hmmmm that’s definitely odd. I’ve read a lot of meh letters but never yet seen one so bad it would prevent someone from matching. Approx how many interviews did you get? That would tell you how big a role the letter really played or if there were something else. Any clinical grade problems? Marginal pass in surgery clerkship or something? From a CV perspective you have more pubs than many junior ENT faculty members so it’s definitely not that keeping you out!

Your Ortho app is essentially the same as your ENT app but minus the 16 pubs in the field. Any other red flags just get magnified in comparison. You also have to overcome the perspective that Ortho is your second choice after a failed ent match and that you’ll be a subpar resident who doesn’t really want to be there.

I think your best bet is to start making connections in the Ortho dept and maybe even ask your closest ent mentors to help facilitate it. This may also mean another research year mainly to forge connections with faculty who will vouch for you. In the end, your home program is going to be your best shot because you’ll have time to convince them you’re the real deal.

 

[Potatus]

Thanks for your reply.

From meeting with the head of the department, it was my LOR. He said that there was one specific letter that was "not great". He was kind enough to identify who wrote that letter, and told me I should be okay if I ask for someone else to write the letter next time. He was also kind enough to say that he would push for me next year.

So, for me, that chalks up why I didn't match... that being said, can you elaborate on your thoughts of me thinking about ortho?

Sorry to hear about the ENT troubles, the idea that someone went ahead and wrote you a “not great” letter instead of just saying no is quite bothersome! Is it important to have an LOR from an attending in the same specialty youre shooting for, or just a really quality LOR regardless of specialty?

 

[frenchyn]

I don’t have much to add, but take what the ENT faculty said w caution. So many people got burned with those empty promises including myself this match cycle. No matter it is ENT or ortho, it is worthwhile to dual apply something less competitive. You don’t want to go unmatched again and end up in SOAP.

 

[order66.exe]

Sorry to hear about the ENT match. I do think it may be somewhat unrealistic though I think your first order of business is to figure out why you didn’t match ENT to begin with. What red flag do you have? It sounds like you had a very strong application based solely on the numbers so I’m not understanding why you didn’t match. Even before we start thinking about changing gears, whatever red flag kept you from ENT is potentially still one that can keep you from Ortho or any other competitive field.

So many people go unmatched in ENT (32% of US MD seniors this year) it doesn’t take much to be dumped. OP was probably just an average interviewer so was probably just in the middle of the rank list.

I think you can try for it OP but I would focus on your home ortho program and set your expectations very low. I would also find a specialty that you can tolerate (gas or rad or IM or whatever) that is less competitive and dual apply.