Is it possible to someone to effectively learn medicine using only books/internet?

[House.0]

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I'm wondering if someone didn't go to medical school if they could still become good at diagnosing and treating disease as effective as people who did go to medical school by reading all the books and taking all the tests (maybe using practice USMLE tests from First Aid etc.) that med students take. Maybe the reason for doing this would be to have your own opinion about your own sicknesses or a family member's.

obviously the big different would be the hands on aspect, which admittedly is a big part of medicine, and they probably could not become surgeons, but could they still diagnose and theoretically know how to treat diseases?

 

[HomeSkool]

No. They'd be very good at thinking of insane one-in-a-million diagnoses and have no actual ability to do anything useful. Such a person would be incredibly dangerous.

Medical licensing boards have high standards, and for good reason.

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[House.0]

No. They'd be very good at thinking of insane one-in-a-million diagnoses and have no actual ability to do anything useful. Such a person would be incredibly dangerous.

Medical licensing boards have high requirements, and for good reason.

so is the difference in the patient interaction? what if they passed the USMLE (if they were allowed to take it which I know they probably aren't, but in theory)

 

[HomeSkool]

so is the difference in the patient interaction?

Patient interaction, formal and informal instruction by subject-matter experts, continuous learning and practice opportunities, regular licensing and continuing education requirements, exposure to and understanding of the inner workings of the medical establishment, and development of the ability to think critically and discern between similar-appearing problems, among other things.

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[Lucca]

would u want an MS2 running a service at your local hospital?

 

[House.0]

would u want an MS2 running a service at your local hospital?

true, lol

 

[onyxbell]

I swear there is a WebMD joke buried somewhere in this.

On a more serious note, there is SO much more to a doctor's responsibility beside from diagnosis and treatment. There is simply no easy way to capture the emotional role a doctor performs in support the patient & relatives, as well as other essential qualities like leadership in coordinating between other specialists, technicians, RNs etc.

 

[House.0]

I swear there is a WebMD joke buried somewhere in this.

On a more serious note, there is SO much more to a doctor's responsibility beside from diagnosis and treatment. There is simply no easy way to capture the emotional role a doctor performs in support the patient & relatives, as well as other essential qualities like leadership in coordinating between other specialists, technicians, RNs etc.

What I am more getting at is like a "self" diagnosis type thing; ability to recognize your own symptoms and knowledge of lab tests (if able to do) and already know what you have before seeing a licensed doctor.

or even ability to correct doctor's mistakes, which we know they make a lOT of

 

[Med Ed]

so is the difference in the patient interaction? what if they passed the USMLE (if they were allowed to take it which I know they probably aren't, but in theory)

When patients start arriving with multiple choice answers on them, we'll talk.

 

[jm192]

Think about the process you have to go through.

You have to go through 4 years of undergrad. You have to learn Cellular Biology, General and Organic Chemistry, Biochemistry.
You have to do lab classes.
You have frequent tests to prove you're mastering concepts as you go.

Medical school:
2 years of classes. Frequent tests to make sure you're mastering material.
Gross anatomy lab where you dissect a human body.
Other people: where you interact, exchange information and solidify a knowledge base.

2 years of wards--where you again have exams to solidify the knowledge base.
Real world experience with living breathing human beings where you see how the medicines impact their lives.
Learning from interns, residents, fellows, attendings--who are all a step or two removed from your experience level--which helps in the way the information is delivered.

3+ years of residency, possibly a fellowship where you're now responsible for patients and their lives.

It's one thing to read in a book everything that goes along with a small bowel obstruction. It's another to take care of a few hundred of them between medical school, residency, etc.

Somewhere along the way, you learn about keeping current on literature/research.

 

[TypeADissection]

...they probably could not become surgeons...

There. Fixed that one statement for ya free of charge. Cheers.

 

[Goro]

I'm wondering if someone didn't go to medical school if they could still become good at diagnosing and treating disease as effective as people who did go to medical school by reading all the books and taking all the tests (maybe using practice USMLE tests from First Aid etc.) that med students take. Maybe the reason for doing this would be to have your own opinion about your own sicknesses or a family member's.

obviously the big different would be the hands on aspect, which admittedly is a big part of medicine, and they probably could not become surgeons, but could they still diagnose and theoretically know how to treat diseases?

Nope. You won't learn what's important, what's semi-important, mildly important or merely interesting, but not important.

 

[HomeSkool]

What I am more getting at is like a "self" diagnosis type thing; ability to recognize your own symptoms and knowledge of lab tests (if able to do)

Rule #1 of medicine: never, ever diagnose yourself. Regardless of what you've really got, you'll think it's cancer every time.

and already know what you have before seeing a licensed doctor.

I just love it when patients tell me how to do my job!

or even ability to correct doctor's mistakes, which we know they make a lOT of

Not nearly as many as the half-assed University of Google crowd.

Your questions are becoming increasingly presumptuous.

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[House.0]

Rule #1 of medicine: never, ever diagnose yourself. Regardless of what you've really got, you'll think it's cancer every time.

but WedMD said...

(there you go @onyxbell )

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

What I am more getting at is like a "self" diagnosis type thing; ability to recognize your own symptoms and knowledge of lab tests (if able to do) and already know what you have before seeing a licensed doctor.

or even ability to correct doctor's mistakes, which we know they make a lOT of

“Self diagnosis” is why so many doctors are frustrated with patients who come in thinking they can dictate their own medical care because of something they learned from google university.


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[aldol16]

I suppose using only books and the internet, you could learn the pre-clinical material pretty well. That's basically what we end up doing anyway, since most of our lectures are recorded (and some of the lecturers are atrocious so we learn from the syllabi and the internet anyway). But passing Step 1 doesn't make you a doctor. You might understand the fundamental science underlying diseases and what certain diseases look like, but again, that doesn't make you a doctor. There's a reason people go to doctors instead of WebMD (although many people frustratingly do both).

 

[gyngyn]

No.

 

[Tenk]

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

First 2 years? Absolutely. Actually being able to do anything clinically relevant? It’s a laughable no.

 

[Robin-jay]

Its like asking someone who had orgo 1 and 2 to start running novel chemistry reactions in a laboratory. Be funny to watch.

 

[CherryRedDracul]

I'm wondering if someone didn't go to medical school if they could still become good at diagnosing and treating disease as effective as people who did go to medical school by reading all the books and taking all the tests (maybe using practice USMLE tests from First Aid etc.) that med students take. Maybe the reason for doing this would be to have your own opinion about your own sicknesses or a family member's.

obviously the big different would be the hands on aspect, which admittedly is a big part of medicine, and they probably could not become surgeons, but could they still diagnose and theoretically know how to treat diseases?

 

[non-trad++]

No.

Yes, as a hobby...

 

[gyngyn]

Yes, as a hobby...

hob·by1
ˈhäbē/
noun

1. 1.
   an activity done regularly in one's leisure time for pleasure.

 

[non-trad++]

hob·by1
ˈhäbē/
noun

1. 1.
   an activity done regularly in one's leisure time for pleasure.

Correct. Self-taught medicine practiced regularly in one’s leisure time for pleasure.... on himself... as a hobby.

 

[LizzyM]

And to quote William Osler who had such a way with words, "To study medicine without books is to sail an uncharted sea. To study medicine by books alone is to never go to sea at all. "

 

[Robin-jay]

And to quote William Osler who had such a way with words, "To study medicine without books is to sail an uncharted sea. To study medicine by books alone is to never go to sea at all. "

Or the more simplified version: "You can learn about swimming for 50 years, but won't know how to do it until you jump in."

 

[BadHorse]

“Self diagnosis” is why so many doctors are frustrated with patients who come in thinking they can dictate their own medical care because of something they learned from google university.


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I actually kind of like it, when a patient comes in with ideas about what's going on with them it shows they're engaged in their health and interested, a lot of the times it generates great conversations and (rarely) they come in with the right diagnosis or their ideas lead you in the right direction sooner than you might've. That said, it's crazy frustrating when a patient still thinks he knows better than you even after an evidence based discussion.

The internet isn't going anywhere, we dinosaurs need to adapt 🙂

 

[Spectar]

Nobody would hire this person since they don't know the billing codes....