Is it worth it to try? Very low GPA non-trad

[101flushots]

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Hello. I have a very low GPA (1.9 STEM, 2.7 overall), and it took me 6.5 years to finish college with a marketing degree. I’m now in my late 20s and have been successful at a Fortune 500 company over the last several years. I’ve been promoted several times and lead a team of 6 people that’s responsible for about 100 million dollars in revenue. I’ve grown up and am a different person than I was in college.

I lack 3 core pre requisites - Organic 2, Biochem, and Physics 2. I also lack the MCAT. I always wanted to go to med school back in college. It was always the dream. That’s why I’ve taken most of the pre reqs. I just decided to call it quits after getting such poor grades. But now, after several years, I’m finding the motivation and confidence to maybe try again.

Before I put the money and effort into taking the remaining pre-reqs and the MCAT, I’m trying to decide if it’s even worth it with my GPA. There’s no way I can get above a 3.0, and I’ve heard that’s the auto cut-off for many schools. I would hate to spend two years of time and money just to get auto screened out.

Is there a chance for me if I receive all A’s for the 3 remaining classes and do well on the MCAT? Or should I just forget about it? I would truly love nothing more than to go to medical school. I’ve always wanted to be a physician.

My grades in the completed core pre reqs are below. I’ve included the number of times I took the class and the grades each time. Thank you.

Biology 1 taken 1 time - C
Biology 2 taken 1 time - B+
Gen Chem 1 taken 4 times - D, D, D, B
Gen Chem 2 taken 2 times - F, B
Physics 1 taken 2 times - F, B+
Organic 1 dropped once and taken again - B-

Some other STEM courses:

College Algebra taken 1 time - B
Precalculus taken 1 time - A
Euclidian Geometry taken 1 time - D
Calculus 1 taken 1 time - C
Cell Biology taken 1 time - C
Dropped Genetics
Dropped A&P
Introduction to Organic taken 1 time - D
Fundamentals of bio - A
Ecology - A

 

[phytomed17]

Well, even looking at the difference in your grades -- what changed between you getting a D in chem to then a B? Or from an F to a B+ in physics 1? Ask yourself and reflect back to what changed between those times taking the classes. Medical Schools like to see growth, and it would also make for a killer admissions essay.

But ultimately... if it is your dream, I say chase it.
You may look into programs that allow you to reset your GPA and start from scratch. Or you can look into transferring credit; say you took all those classes at X college... if you transfer those class credits to Y college, the credit will transfer over (if passed), but the grade will not be... While yes, medical school will still ask for transcripts from all schools, but you could at least have a decent GPA from one institution. You would just have to take classes and do well. You will just have to look at your options.

As far as prereqs, I honestly would take more than just the 3 to see if you can prove to admissions that you can get As and that you simply weren't in the proper mindset before. For example, a C in bio is not great. Medical schools like to see a majority of As and maybe few Bs. It would also be beneficial for MCAT preparation to retake some classes or complete a postbacc MCAP prep program.

But don't give up. If you want it, go for it. You just may have to fight a little harder than most.

 

[deleted1001426]

I don’t want to rain on your parade or be the reason why you give up on your dream but I’ll try to be as honest as possible. Obviously applying after completing the remaining prereqs would be a colossal waste of time and money. You’d likely still have a sub 2.0 bcpm which would cause you to be auto screened out of most schools and insta rejected from the others solely based off of a lack of consistent academic performance (3 As isn’t going to be enough, even if it’s coupled with a respectable mcat). the only chance you have is likely through some form of a post bac, whether that be an smp or some kind of career changer masters program. The problem is I’m not sure with your current gpa that you’d even be accepted to one. Depending on how long you’re willing to stretch out your journey for maybe you can take some classes part time at a cc or local 4 year university and if you do well then apply into a post bac with linkage to a med school.

honestly it sounds like you’re living a pretty sweet life now and are really successful in your given field. What is if about medicine that you find so enticing? Maybe there is a way for you to fulfill the urge which prompted you interest in medicine without going to medical school

 

[phytomed17]

honestly it sounds like you’re living a pretty sweet life now and are really successful in your given field. What is if about medicine that you find so enticing? Maybe there is a way for you to fulfill the urge which prompted you interest in medicine without going to medical school

Going off of this, you could also look at PA school. Though you still would have to retake some classes and improve your resume, PA programs are not near as competitive as MD programs. You could also try starting with your CNA and go the nursing route. As Ak09 said, there are likely other ways to get into and have exposure to the medical field without going to medical school.

 

[deleted1001426]

Going off of this, you could also look at PA school. Though you still would have to retake some classes and improve your resume, PA programs are not near as competitive as MD programs. You could also try starting with your CNA and go the nursing route. As Ak09 said, there are likely other ways to get into and have exposure to the medical field without going to medical school.

Unfortunately, while PA schools have average matriculant gpas which are significantly lower than that of us medical schools, most of them from what I’ve seen/heard about from friends going that route have hard cutoffs at a 3.0

 

[101flushots]

I don’t want to rain on your parade or be the reason why you give up on your dream but I’ll try to be as honest as possible. Obviously applying after completing the remaining prereqs would be a colossal waste of time and money. You’d likely still have a sub 2.0 bcpm which would cause you to be auto screened out of most schools and insta rejected from the others solely based off of a lack of consistent academic performance (3 As isn’t going to be enough, even if it’s coupled with a respectable mcat). the only chance you have is likely through some form of a post bac, whether that be an smp or some kind of career changer masters program. The problem is I’m not sure with your current gpa that you’d even be accepted to one. Depending on how long you’re willing to stretch out your journey for maybe you can take some classes part time at a cc or local 4 year university and if you do well then apply into a post bac with linkage to a med school.

honestly it sounds like you’re living a pretty sweet life now and are really successful in your given field. What is if about medicine that you find so enticing? Maybe there is a way for you to fulfill the urge which prompted you interest in medicine without going to medical school

Thanks for being honest. I’m drawn to medicine because of the perfect combination of work environment, overall meaning and contribution to society, and intellectual nature. I’m not optimistic about being able to find another career that gets these right like medicine and keeps me at or improves on my current income level. But I’m all ears.

Work environment: In my current role (and all other corporate roles in the world), I sit in a cubicle staring at a laptop screen 50 hours a week. My vision and body pay the price. In medicine it’s different. You are walking around, interacting with people, working with your hands. I face the pressure of pleasing a boss who is a single human with the power to completely ruin my life if they please. If they make a dumb decision, I pay the price. If they want a yellow square on the PowerPoint instead of a blue square like I used, I pay the price. It’s trivial and I have to mind-read. This single person can literally fire me just because they feel like it. In medicine, at least after residency, there’s no single person who can cause you to lose your entire livelihood. If you’re five minutes late to see a patient, sure that’s not ideal, but you aren’t going to get pulled into an office and made to feel like you may not be able to put food on the table in another week.

Meaning: As a physician, you are directly helping people. I know patients can sometimes be a pain and regulations are annoying, but every job has its annoying components. Overall, you are contributing to society in a big way as a physician. In corporate roles, sure you’re trying to help the business, its customers and employees, but it doesn’t feel like it because it’s not direct. Like I mentioned, I sit in a cubicle and look at a screen for 50 hours a week. There’s just no satisfaction there. I don’t feel like I’m doing anything for humanity.

Intellectual nature: The human body is incredible and fascinating. Science in general is very cool. The extent of intellectual exercises in my current role is opening Excel and thinking of how to write a formula that helps read the data. I just can’t see this being my career for the next 30+ years.

 

[101flushots]

Going off of this, you could also look at PA school. Though you still would have to retake some classes and improve your resume, PA programs are not near as competitive as MD programs. You could also try starting with your CNA and go the nursing route. As Ak09 said, there are likely other ways to get into and have exposure to the medical field without going to medical school.

I currently make what I believe what PAs make, and am debt free. PA schools actually state hard cut offs of 3.0 GPAs on their websites. Additionally, I don’t see being able to meet the clinical experience requirements.

 

[101flushots]

Well, even looking at the difference in your grades -- what changed between you getting a D in chem to then a B? Or from an F to a B+ in physics 1? Ask yourself and reflect back to what changed between those times taking the classes. Medical Schools like to see growth, and it would also make for a killer admissions essay.

But ultimately... if it is your dream, I say chase it.
You may look into programs that allow you to reset your GPA and start from scratch. Or you can look into transferring credit; say you took all those classes at X college... if you transfer those class credits to Y college, the credit will transfer over (if passed), but the grade will not be... While yes, medical school will still ask for transcripts from all schools, but you could at least have a decent GPA from one institution. You would just have to take classes and do well. You will just have to look at your options.

As far as prereqs, I honestly would take more than just the 3 to see if you can prove to admissions that you can get As and that you simply weren't in the proper mindset before. For example, a C in bio is not great. Medical schools like to see a majority of As and maybe few Bs. It would also be beneficial for MCAT preparation to retake some classes or complete a postbacc MCAP prep program.

But don't give up. If you want it, go for it. You just may have to fight a little harder than most.

Could you tell me more about the programs that allow you to reset your GPA? I hate that I have to live with these mistakes from a decade ago. If I had known in my youth how much my college GPA would affect my dream down the road I would have been different. I didn’t even want to go to college then but was essentially forced to. If I could just start my GPA from scratch at this point I would do anything to be able to do that. Anything. I’m so full of regret from the past it’s very hard to live with.
Time is somewhat important, however.As it stands, if I took one class per semester at night which is all I can do with my work schedule, I stand to complete those three remaining courses at age 31. Then I still have the MCAT and applying.

 

[deleted1001426]

Thanks for being honest. I’m drawn to medicine because of the perfect combination of work environment, overall meaning and contribution to society, and intellectual nature. I’m not optimistic about being able to find another career that gets these right like medicine and keeps me at or improves on my current income level. But I’m all ears.

Work environment: In my current role (and all other corporate roles in the world), I sit in a cubicle staring at a laptop screen 50 hours a week. My vision and body pay the price. In medicine it’s different. You are walking around, interacting with people, working with your hands. I face the pressure of pleasing a boss who is a single human with the power to completely ruin my life if they please. If they make a dumb decision, I pay the price. If they want a yellow square on the PowerPoint instead of a blue square like I used, I pay the price. It’s trivial and I have to mind-read. This single person can literally fire me just because they feel like it. In medicine, at least after residency, there’s no single person who can cause you to lose your entire livelihood. If you’re five minutes late to see a patient, sure that’s not ideal, but you aren’t going to get pulled into an office and made to feel like you may not be able to put food on the table in another week.

Meaning: As a physician, you are directly helping people. I know patients can sometimes be a pain and regulations are annoying, but every job has its annoying components. Overall, you are contributing to society in a big way as a physician. In corporate roles, sure you’re trying to help the business, its customers and employees, but it doesn’t feel like it because it’s not direct. Like I mentioned, I sit in a cubicle and look at a screen for 50 hours a week. There’s just no satisfaction there. I don’t feel like I’m doing anything for humanity.

Intellectual nature: The human body is incredible and fascinating. Science in general is very cool. The extent of intellectual exercises in my current role is opening Excel and thinking of how to write a formula that helps read the data. I just can’t see this being my career for the next 30+ years.

Just some food for thought but to quote one of my mentors “yesterday I was a physician and today I am a cog in a wheel of beurocratic bs , being micromanaged by executives with less clinical education than my scribe, who care little about science based medicine or patient wellbeing and are more concerned with press ganey scores or profit than providing good, comprehensive care.” So I think much about what you dislike about your corporate work environment won’t change by entering medicine but said mentor might just be jaded so who knows, ask some physicians and see if they have a different perspective.

I think If you do go forward with your plan to enter medicine you just need to acknowledge that this isn’t going to be a quick process and your current plan of getting As in 3 classes and then taking the mcat isn’t going to work. Even if you do well on the mcat (which likely won’t happen anytime In the near future given your performance in the prereqs) a 1.9 sgpa is an app killer if I’ve ever seen one . Right now you’re looking at a few years of consistent academic success before you’ll even be in the position to apply for a post bac with linkage, 1-2 years in that and only then (if you do well there) will you be in a position to apply.
if you’re serious about this then take a look at goros guide for reinvention. It should have most of the info you need.

Good luck!

 

[deleted1001426]

PA schools actually state hard cut offs of 3.0 GPAs on their websites. Additionally, I don’t see being able to meet the clinical experience requirements.

the problem that youre going to run into is that many medical schools will screen presecondary (or in certain cases post secondary) for those same gpa cutoffs. In addition, while PA schools do require more direct, hands on clinical experience you will also need an abundance of clinical/nonclinical volunteering prior to submission of your app for MD/DO

 

[101flushots]

the problem that youre going to run into is that many medical schools will screen presecondary (or in certain cases post secondary) for those same gpa cutoffs. In addition, while PA schools do require more direct, hands on clinical experience you will also need an abundance of clinical/nonclinical volunteering prior to submission of your app for MD/DO

This is specifically what I wanted to learn more about - the auto-screening based on GPA. Is there any list of schools that have hard cut offs? Do we know to what extent schools auto-screen?

 

[deleted1001426]

This is specifically what I wanted to learn more about - the auto-screening based on GPA. Is there any list of schools that have hard cut offs? Do we know to what extent schools auto-screen?

i believe schools typically state if they have hard cutoffs on msar, some will hard screen, others will screen for certain stats and then "holistically" review applicants who are close. I still wouldnt advise applying with a sub 2.0 sgpa, even if you compile a list of schools which dont screen its highly unlikely to yield an A or even an interview. maybe @Goro @LizzyM @Med Ed @gyngyncould provide more input.

 

[gyngyn]

Second career non-trads will get a bit of a break if there is a sharp demarcation between their old and new scores. In this case, a sustained period of academic excellence in undergraduate level sciences (prior to application) will be necessary.

 

[Goro]

Hello. I have a very low GPA (1.9 STEM, 2.7 overall), and it took me 6.5 years to finish college with a marketing degree. I’m now in my late 20s and have been successful at a Fortune 500 company over the last several years. I’ve been promoted several times and lead a team of 6 people that’s responsible for about 100 million dollars in revenue. I’ve grown up and am a different person than I was in college.

I lack 3 core pre requisites - Organic 2, Biochem, and Physics 2. I also lack the MCAT. I always wanted to go to med school back in college. It was always the dream. That’s why I’ve taken most of the pre reqs. I just decided to call it quits after getting such poor grades. But now, after several years, I’m finding the motivation and confidence to maybe try again.

Before I put the money and effort into taking the remaining pre-reqs and the MCAT, I’m trying to decide if it’s even worth it with my GPA. There’s no way I can get above a 3.0, and I’ve heard that’s the auto cut-off for many schools. I would hate to spend two years of time and money just to get auto screened out.

Is there a chance for me if I receive all A’s for the 3 remaining classes and do well on the MCAT? Or should I just forget about it? I would truly love nothing more than to go to medical school. I’ve always wanted to be a physician.

My grades in the completed core pre reqs are below. I’ve included the number of times I took the class and the grades each time. Thank you.

Biology 1 taken 1 time - C
Biology 2 taken 1 time - B+
Gen Chem 1 taken 4 times - D, D, D, B
Gen Chem 2 taken 2 times - F, B
Physics 1 taken 2 times - F, B+
Organic 1 dropped once and taken again - B-

Some other STEM courses:

College Algebra taken 1 time - B
Precalculus taken 1 time - A
Euclidian Geometry taken 1 time - D
Calculus 1 taken 1 time - C
Cell Biology taken 1 time - C
Dropped Genetics
Dropped A&P
Introduction to Organic taken 1 time - D
Fundamentals of bio - A
Ecology - A

There are med schools that reward reinvention.

Read my post on reinvention for premeds.

 

[phytomed17]

Could you tell me more about the programs that allow you to reset your GPA? I hate that I have to live with these mistakes from a decade ago. If I had known in my youth how much my college GPA would affect my dream down the road I would have been different. I didn’t even want to go to college then but was essentially forced to. If I could just start my GPA from scratch at this point I would do anything to be able to do that. Anything. I’m so full of regret from the past it’s very hard to live with.
Time is somewhat important, however.As it stands, if I took one class per semester at night which is all I can do with my work schedule, I stand to complete those three remaining courses at age 31. Then I still have the MCAT and applying.

Well, with restarting your GPA... I meant like starting from scratch. Meaning taking ALL the classes over again, not just the 3 remaining ones.

 

[101flushots]

i believe schools typically state if they have hard cutoffs on msar, some will hard screen, others will screen for certain stats and then "holistically" review applicants who are close. I still wouldnt advise applying with a sub 2.0 sgpa, even if you compile a list of schools which dont screen its highly unlikely to yield an A or even an interview. maybe @Goro @LizzyM @Med Ed @gyngyncould provide more input.

I have spot-checked schools on MSAR and cannot find any that mention hard cutoffs. If you have any more specific information about auto screening and/or hard cutoffs, I am all ears.

 

[101flushots]

Second career non-trads will get a bit of a break if there is a sharp demarcation between their old and new scores. In this case, a sustained period of academic excellence in undergraduate level sciences (prior to application) will be necessary.

Thank you for the information. In your opinion, how many science credits of sustained academic excellence would be necessary to help offset the damage done by my grades mentioned above? Also, if second career non-trads can sometimes get a break, that means they arent being auto screened out. Is that presumption correct? Thanks again.

 

[gyngyn]

Thank you for the information. In your opinion, how many science credits of sustained academic excellence would be necessary to help offset the damage done by my grades mentioned above? Also, if second career non-trads can sometimes get a break, that means they arent being auto screened out. Is that presumption correct? Thanks again.

At my school, that would mean the equivalent of a year's full time course work (visible in the primary).
We don't have an electronic screen. Others do. DO schools seem to be more forthcoming with their hard cut-offs.

 

[Doctoscope]

At my school, that would mean the equivalent of a year's full time course work (visible in the primary).
We don't have an electronic screen. Others do. DO schools seem to be more forthcoming with their hard cut-offs.

Curious, how many units is considered to be equivalent to a year’s FT coursework? Is it around 30?

 

[deleted1001426]

Curious, how many units is considered to be equivalent to a year’s FT coursework? Is it around 30?

whatever the unit equivalent of 8 courses is

 

[LeaveNoTrace]

Yeah, I've seen 30+ credits of 3.7 or better for MD or 3.5+ for DO recommended. As for MCAT, 508+ for DO and 513+ for MD. Ideally you'd do a bit better than that because your GPA is so low. Good luck; you are not out of the woods at all but you are not doomed.