just wondering...what would you premeds do?

[PelicanMan]

Ok Kirk

I have gotten this response before even at an interview.

For me its simple why I don't want to be all of those other professions. While some of the professions help people not all of those professions save lives. I want to save lives. In response to the professions that do save lives. I love science and have a special talent for it. I wouldn't want to be nurse because if you are a nurse you have to take orders from people above you. I want to be the decision maker in helping someone to live better. Nurses are not the decision makers in health care, the doctor makes the decision and the doctor makes the diagnoses and the doctor is responsible if something goes wrong. If I have a special talent for science I believe that I should use this talent. Wasted talent is a sad thing. So as you can see my reason has not changed except maybe I should have said "save lives" instead of help people. Now I don't care if you have different reasons and I know many people do, but for me money has never ever been an issue. Like I said I would be a doctor if it payed 30,000. If you actually look at the history of medicine, doctors use to treat patients for free, it was a privelage. Just because it was the past doesn't mean that it is archiac and stupid. I am just happy that I have found my lifes goal at such an early age.

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[Hallm_7]

I don't think these numbers saying that docs will make 50% less by the time we are practicing are correct. The decline in the early 90s was primarily due to managed care being introduced on a larger scale, and I don't think managed care can continue its growth rate indefintely. Especially since so much attention has been given to the evils of HMOs and other such organizations in the last few years.

Read this story from the AMA website I found.

<a href="http://www.ama-assn.org/sci-pubs/amnews/pick_02/prl20121.htm#rbar_add" target="_blank">http://www.ama-assn.org/sci-pubs/amnews/pick_02/prl20121.htm#rbar_add</a>

Notice this quote in the story. "Some specialists have seen double-digit percentage income increases during the past two years."

I don't think we have to worry about the average doc making less than 120,000-150,000 a year. In fact, if this story is correct it will probably go up. We'll still be making 4 or 5 times what the average person makes in a year.

Also, remember the old saying "The rich get richer?" If someone makes $150,000/year (and that will be low for most docs), they can invest in real estate, stock market, or other businesses to supply more annual salary. Money will make money.

 

[Kirk]

Pelicanman- For you I guess the secondary factor is the power associated with the position. You want to be in charge, you want to make the decisions. That?s fine, there is nothing wrong with that. I think that someone who wants power is no better or worse then someone who seeks money as a secondary motivation. Everyone has different goals in life.

But, on the other hand, after you pay back your loans, you will donate all of your income above $30,000 to charities (medical of course), right? Since you would be a Dr for $30,000.

 

[pwrpfgrl]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by PelicanMan:
• I am not bullshi@ting when I say that I would want to be a doctor if they made 30,000 dollars a year. I really would. Now I may be very idealistic but for me becoming a doctor isn't getting a job, its doing something I love and want to do.
•••••I'm not sure how many people posting here have held full time, salaried positions, but let me tell you, that even if you think money doesn't matter now, when you begin working, it will. I work in a research lab, and since i only graduated a few years ago, i really don't make very much. this doesn't bother me (i don't think my experience/understanding warrants a very high salary) but then I look at my boss. She has a BA and about 10 years experience and doesn't understand the MOST basic elements of the science behind our work. yet, she makes about $80,000/yr. Now, maybe i'm just venting, but this makes me very bitter. if i understand my job, and KNOW i can do my boss's job better than she can (i'm actually training her next week!!), shouldn't i be making as much as she is? After working for a little while, i've noticed i've been sucked in to this salary issue, even though i never really cared much about money before. I guess because in our world, the salary you make is generally equated with your "worth" in the profession, people put a lot of emphasis on money even if they are not matieralistic (sp?) in general.

I guess for me it's less an issue of the dollar sum as it is acknowledgement of the education, training, and skill someone posseses. That said, i would still be a doctor as long as i can reasonably pay off loans, mortgage, and go on vacation once a year. (and finally pay off these $#!@ credit card bills!!)

ahhh, thanks for letting me vent, that's just my $.02

 

[Lavndrrose]

Kirk,

As PelicanMan explained, nurses don't have the autonomy nor the education and training to diagnose patients. Enough said...

I think most of us can agree with some of the reasons you listed for going into medicine. However, the original question was IF we would still do it. I take it your answer would be NO? Okay I'm fine with that. Like I said...those like yourself may like medicine, but when this career becomes unappealing...talented students like yourself who are more money-driven than service- to- society- driven will head out in another direction. That's okay...there's nothing wrong with wanting a better life. But don't continue to discredit those who would still devote their services to medicine, regardless of the monetary rewards!!

What is wrong with having a genuine belief that you can help others in medicine? I KNOW what I want to do with the rest of my life and having a job that gets by with the satisfaction that I can save lives is rewarding enough. Honestly, when it comes to the point where I can no longer financially support my parents, then maybe I'll think of picking up a second job(I've done it before). But this is just me...you're NOT me....

 

[PelicanMan]

Kirk,

I guess you are right. The lab thing by the way. I would be pissed too. I had a similar situation kinda. I was working at this lab my sophmore year trying to get research experience. We had this conference and the PI of the lab didn't understand a really really basic immunological principle. I was like are you f88king kidding me. The PI asked the presenter to explain it to him. I was laughing on the inside.

 

[PelicanMan]

Actually thinking about it Kirk, I change my mind.

Its not that the nurse thing is no good becuase of the power. Nurses do what doctors tell them to do and thus are not involved in finding out what is wrong with the person. I think if you think about it hard, and I know there are many exceptions the doctor is the one who actually helps more than the nurses. The doctor decides what procedure to do, so If you are a doctor you can help more than a nurse can if you choose the right procedure etc.

 

[reesie0726]

My primary reason for going into medicine was also to help people. Now I really do not think that salaries are going to decrease by 50% but if they did, I would think twice before going into medicine. I feel you have to be realistic. I will have 200k of debt from med school plus my undergrad loans. I want to be a primary care physician in an urban community. I have to make enough to survive decently. There's not only educational debt but the overhead and malpractice insurance. Without the decrease in salary some areas are suffering in shortages like ob/gyn or other specialties because of the rise in malpractice costs especially rural areas like southern texas. At 50k a year, I would not be able to pay off my loans, support my practice and support myself. If it ever got that bad, I would not go into medicine. I think I would choose another profession that I thought I would be happy with. Because it is not fair to ask doctors to work at unreasonable wages where they can not make a decent living. It is different being an accountant making 50k and a doctor making 50k. Doctors have much more expenses.

 

[chocolate_queen_md]

Ok my turn
Who wants to be a millionaire?

not at the cost of my happiness

I recently left the telecommunications field making a doctors salary with my certifications alone (no degree). It was nice while it last but with all fields the table/economy will eventually turn. I never imagined the telecom market to be in the state it is in today but I?m very glad it happened. I was never challenged by the field and I was getting bored with sitting on my ass flying to nice destination reading a training book for another 10000 salary increase and no intellectual challenge. I have always had a passion for medicine but making the fast money I saw others make in my field was my easy way out. Now years later I am pursuing my true destiny. Dont get me wrong I have enjoyed the money however u can?t buy happiness and it only can pacify u for so long. So take it from someone who spent 7 years away from school for the love of money do what u makes u happy and u will be better off. If MD were making half of what they were making now and some Fam Prac (my future specialty) I know make half of what I was making before I left my job to pursue my dream I would still do it.

 

[Kimya]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by PelicanMan:
•Actually thinking about it Kirk, I change my mind.

Its not that the nurse thing is no good becuase of the power. Nurses do what doctors tell them to do and thus are not involved in finding out what is wrong with the person. I think if you think about it hard, and I know there are many exceptions the doctor is the one who actually helps more than the nurses. The doctor decides what procedure to do, so If you are a doctor you can help more than a nurse can if you choose the right procedure etc.•••••I saw this and just can't agree with it. Nurses don't just "do what the doctor says to do" they are monitoring and assessing the patient and need to be able to notify the doctor when a change in the plan is needed. They are the first line in triaging the patient. Without the nurses there is no one to carry out procedures/medications that are ordered, and no one to be monitoring if something is going wrong. I don't think it's productive to say which is more essential to the care of a patient. All are essential components of providing the care to the patient.

That said, what a doctor and what a nurse do are of course very different. The doctor has a lot more responsibility in diagnosis and treatment plan for the patient. However, doctor's don't work in a vaccuum either. They are working for someone, and don't have carte blanche to do whatever they want to. They have to answer to the hospital, insurance companies, and unfortunately lawsuits if they get sued. Everyone has someone to answer to, unless of course you're a dictator of some country!

I think the key is, what do you do best and how do you think your skills will help patients the most?

With regards to salaries, I think everyone has brought up good points about the salaries. I think if salaries continue to drop they are going to have to provide more incentives for student loan payoffs. Medical school is becoming extremely expensive, and the payoffs are becoming more and more difficult to justify with salary drops and changes in autonomy.