Lame Tour

[mafunk]

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I just 'toured' a D.O. school. I had to drive 2.5 hours to get there, which the admin staff knew. While I appreciate that this particular school is generous enough to offer tours to aspiring applicants, I wish that staff had been a little friendlier and more informative.

Here is what my tour consisted of:

Original tour guide (an admin counselor) cancelled last minute so another admin counselor was in her place. The young girl sauntered in to the waiting room and with a straight face mumbled something like, 'ready'. She didn't address me by name, smile, say welcome, or do anything else to make me feel like I was anything other than a nuisance.

Then we 'toured' the campus for 20 minutes, during which time she was only able to answer one of my questions. When I asked her of the schools mission statement, she didn't know. When I asked about residency match rate, usmle pass rate, clinical rotation locations, etc, she either didn't know and/or told me that it was basically 'top secret' information reserved only for people once they were accepted or invited to interview.

At the end of 20 minutes the tour was over. She didn't try to engage me in any conversation, couldn't answer my questions, and behaved in a generally apathetic manner.

What a total waste of my time. Or maybe not, the one very important thing I learned is that I will not apply to that particular school.

Later today I'm touring another school. So far my communications with said school have been extremely positive, so I anticipate the same for the interview.

Interestingly, the first school I toured has a reputation for being unfriendly during interviews and had a generic mission statement. The second school I'm touring has a reputation for being very warm during interviews and places a strong emphasis on community service in their mission statement.

 

[timaq]

Why don't you just come out and say which schools you're referring too? Otherwise that whole post is useless.

 

[mafunk]

Why don't you just come out and say which schools you're referring too? Otherwise that whole post is useless.

I purposely did not provide a name or location as I do not wish to bad mouth a particular school. The post was not to provide warning/or advice... just venting.

 

[UBCvan]

could you message me the name of school? 👍

 

[FrkyBgStok]

personally, i am not sure what you expected. remember that this is application season so they are probably incredibly swamped. they also probably have many students trying to get their name known or would even like a pre-interview interview or some other dirty admission stunt, and if you say people don't do that, you are young and naive.

they also probably thought, "you will get a comprehensive tour if you get an interview so why are we wasting our time?" you are an "aspiring applicant." the schools aren't going to expect you to tour every school you apply to so you are basically saying, "not sure if you guys are worth my $100 (primary portion and secondary), prove to me your crappy school is."

i don't know my employer's mission statement. all of the rest of the details you asked for could either be found on a website (which you are portraying that you didn't look in to) or is information one wouldn't expect anyone to memorize.

personally, i believe you should be grateful they let you see the campus at all. this is all stuff that you would have been told/shown on the interview day. and if you didn't make it to the interview day, than the point is moot.

 

[TriagePreMed]

I purposely did not provide a name or location as I do not wish to bad mouth a particular school. The post was not to provide warning/or advice... just venting.

If you want to vent, get a myspace or a live journal account. This thread is useless for everyone else. Thanks for wasting our time reading this.

 

[tbone1234]

personally, i am not sure what you expected. remember that this is application season so they are probably incredibly swamped. they also probably have many students trying to get their name known or would even like a pre-interview interview or some other dirty admission stunt, and if you say people don't do that, you are young and naive.

they also probably thought, "you will get a comprehensive tour if you get an interview so why are we wasting our time?" you are an "aspiring applicant." the schools aren't going to expect you to tour every school you apply to so you are basically saying, "not sure if you guys are worth my $100 (primary portion and secondary), prove to me your crappy school is."

i don't know my employer's mission statement. all of the rest of the details you asked for could either be found on a website (which you are portraying that you didn't look in to) or is information one wouldn't expect anyone to memorize.

personally, i believe you should be grateful they let you see the campus at all. this is all stuff that you would have been told/shown on the interview day. and if you didn't make it to the interview day, than the point is moot.

👍

 

[mafunk]

If you want to vent, get a myspace or a live journal account. This thread is useless for everyone else. Thanks for wasting our time reading this.

I respect your opinion, however I've read numerous threads here that were venting, discussing, etc... I do believe it is relevant to bring up touring experiences, good ones, bad ones and how they relate to mission statements, etc. And I do believe that it is valid not to name the actual schools so as not to bad mouth anyone specifically.

To the poster who wrote...'what did you expect'.... Well, I expect that IF one offers students tours they provide a meaningful tour. If one is too busy to provide tours, then don't. I expect a school to be able to intelligently discuss things like their mission statement, residency situation, clinical rotations, etc.

BTW - I did tour the second school and it was very impressive. In addition to a generic tour, I learned intimate details about the history of the school and it's relationship within the medical community, the 'meat' behind their mission statement, the passions of their admissions staff, specifics on residency matches, specifics on clinical rotation sites, and much more. Beyond numbers, I learned what they absolutely do not want in an applicant, and what they highly value in a student.

The lesson learned for me is that going on tour, if it is offered, helps one decide where to apply and where not to apply. Basically it helps you identify good matches and not so good matches in a concrete and tangible way that transcends reading books, forums, etc.

 

[mafunk]

they also probably thought, "you will get a comprehensive tour if you get an interview so why are we wasting our time?" you are an "aspiring applicant." the schools aren't going to expect you to tour every school you apply to so you are basically saying, "not sure if you guys are worth my $100 (primary portion and secondary), prove to me your crappy school is."

i don't know my employer's mission statement. all of the rest of the details you asked for could either be found on a website (which you are portraying that you didn't look in to) or is information one wouldn't expect anyone to memorize.

personally, i believe you should be grateful they let you see the campus at all. this is all stuff that you would have been told/shown on the interview day. and if you didn't make it to the interview day, than the point is moot.

I understand why you feel this way. To help you understand my viewpoint.

1. If the school is too swamped to give a meaningful tour or if it is an nuisance to do so then they should not advertise on their website inviting people to tour. What terrible PR to invite people to your school, then to act like they are an inconvenience when they actually take you up on your offer. Another school I'm applying to doesn't do tours until your invited for an interview. I respect that.

2. Other than the mission statement, none of the things I asked were on their website. Nor could I find the details in other places online. I asked about the mission statement to see what she would say/emphasize. I wanted to see first hand what the working philosophy of the school was, and the extent to which staff can communicate said mission/philosophy is an indicator of how much (or little) a school truly walks their talk.

3. In terms of saying to them, "not sure your crappy school is worth $100..." I think this is an unfair statement. This school invites people to tour... so it is not at all presumptuous to take them up on their offer and to arrive with questions that have not been answered on their website or via other research. It would be far more presumptuous to show up not knowing anything about the school or not having looked on their website.

4. In terms of memorization... Yes, as a representative/recruiter/sales person for the school I would expect a competent admissions person to know the school's mission statement, if not verbatim, at least the jest of it. The other information was not answered because it was 'top secret' and reserved only for people who interview. In my opinion, schools should share information about clinical rotations and residency matches as it is important information when deciding where to apply and to hide said information seems almost deceitful

 

[doingit9]

If I could have I would have visited EVERY SINGLE school that I applied to. This was not an option for me however due to money. But touring allows you to see the school in a relaxed context so you can determine if this school is truly a good fit for you and vice versa. If I figured out before hand that I didn't fit well with a school, why would I waste time and money applying there? I agree with the OP in being critical of schools he/she is applying to. Hell, you are going to be there for 4 years for medical school as well as be a living representative of that school for the rest of your career...

 

[CopToEM]

they also probably thought, "you will get a comprehensive tour if you get an interview so why are we wasting our time?" you are an "aspiring applicant." the schools aren't going to expect you to tour every school you apply to so you are basically saying, "not sure if you guys are worth my $100 (primary portion and secondary), prove to me your crappy school is."

That's easy to say if you have the money to throw an application at a school you haven't seen in person only to later find out you're not interested because of an experience like this. For those of us, likely including the OP, who cannot afford to blindly apply to schools we haven't seen in person... these tours are very important. Interview tours are only offered after you've already doled out the fees obviously.

IMO, if they're not passionate about giving privately scheduled tours, don't give them... problem solved.

 

[Colbare]

They get literally thousands and thousands of applications from people who would love to attend their school without a comprehensive tour beforehand. They don't need to sell themselves to every interested pre-med.

 

[willen101383]

I agree with posters on both sides of this issue. They are swamped and miserable. MISERABLE. Imagine having to sort through 6500+ apps......and dealing with premeds coming in asking for tours. They likely arent tour guides as their primary duties in the admissions office. But on the same token if they advertise that they do tours....they should expect people to take them up on that offer.

As far as tours go....try to get a tour from a MS1 or 2. The admissions people are going to give you a canned speech and tour. I havent given many tours...but when I have I give them a private private tour and give them the lowdown on the good, bad, and ugly.

Most admissions tours are going to be wastes of time.

 

[drctother]

They get literally thousands and thousands of applications from people who would love to attend their school without a comprehensive tour beforehand. They don't need to sell themselves to every interested pre-med.

Not to mention the OP seems to be asking the top annoying pre-med style questions. Are you really expecting the tour guide have match rates memorized to the exact %? And to off the top of their head know all the rotation sites?

They are meant to give you a tour so you can see the facilities
The interview (should you deserve one) is when they give you the cold hard figures.

As said, you are a pre-med they dont have to do ****. There is always another 1000 pre-meds who would glady take your potential spot without a tour. I get it your frustrated but I doubt very very much the tour represents the school

Now are you going to tell people what school? That would turn this thread into a potentially useful thread because students of that school can comment and pre-meds who also toured there can chip in too

 

[fiznat]

Like others have said: schools don't need to "sell themselves" to you. If you get an interview they will give you a detailed tour, answer all questions, and probably feed you lunch. I can't imagine most schools have the time or energy to waste on you just because you decided to make a phone call and have a passing interest in applying. Honestly you should feel lucky someone took the time out of their day to give you a personal tour around their facility. A lot of places won't even do that. ...And the mission statement? Give me a break.

I know it sucks, but this is how it is. The schools have the power in this relationship, and it is up to you to make application decisions based on whatever information you can personally collect on your own. Maybe someday down the road when you are successful and wealthy you can turn the tables when the school comes to you looking for alumni donations. But until that day....

 

[iceman132]

She probably should have been more polite

HOWEVER, you ask some pretty specific questions (She's not a text book) I'd be pretty annoyed if I did a tour at my undergrad and they asked me specific statistics.

 

[mafunk]

It would have been more of a waste of time if they simply told you to come back another day. You're going to write off an entire school based on your interaction with one person who went out of their way to show you around?

Not quite. This school was already at the bottom of my lists. The apathetic guide, top secret attitude just confirmed the negative things I've heard about the school. The school is like a ugly girl who cops an attitude cause she thinks she is hot. Why go after an ugly girl with a crap attitude when you can go after a prettier girl with a nice attitude?

 

[Bacchus]

Not quite. This school was already at the bottom of my lists. The apathetic guide, top secret attitude just confirmed the negative things I've heard about the school. The school is like a ugly girl who cops an attitude cause she thinks she is hot. Why go after an ugly girl with a crap attitude when you can go after a prettier girl with a nice attitude?

Why go after the guy who makes fun of the girl?

 

[kcin]

Entitled op is entitled. Wah wah wah

 

[costales]

Not sure if I'd complain to Consumer Reports or the Better Business Bureau. At this point I'd settle for an apology and a free discount coupon. 😀

 

[drctother]

Why go after the guy who makes fun of the girl?

👍