LECOM-Bradenton vs VCOM vs Nova

[IAmTheCheese]

I know similar threads have been posted before, and I have already read several of them. That said, I am trying to make a decision about which school to attend and I would like to hear people's opinions about which school they like better and why. I will list some of the pros and cons of the schools below:


LECOM-Bradenton

Pros:

-Tuition is only ~$30,000/year
-Located in Bradenton, FL. Nice weather, not too crowded, not too much crime or traffic.
-Moderate cost of living (higher than VCOM, lower than Nova)
-Curriculum is almost all PBL. This means I would have more control over how I spend my time (i.e. I wouldn't have to be in class from 8-5 every day and still have to go home and study)

Cons:

-Students are not able to dissect; they use prosected cadavers only
-It sounds like most students do their rotations at smaller community hospitals rather than larger teaching hospitals
-No patient simulators (i.e. robots), although they do have standardized patients.
-Not much in the way of facilities, for example, they have no gym.
-Dress code; guys have to wear a shirt and tie on campus
-The administration didn't seem as friendly as they did at VCOM or Nova. I have been told they have a "fear and threatening" style of encouragement.


VCOM

Pros:

-Tuition is less than Nova at ~$40,000/year
-Cost of living in Blacksburg is probably lower than it is in Florida
-Had patient simulators
-Affiliated with Virginia Tech, can use all their facilities
-People all seemed very friendly

Cons:

-Have an attendance policy that is enforced; would probably have to be in class 8-5 every day
-Not sure, but it sounds like students at VCOM also do rotations at smaller community hospitals
-Facilities at VCOM seemed lacking; tiny library, no real cafeteria, small OMM rooms, the rooms with patient simulators were still being painted.
-Dress code; have to wear a collared shirt and slacks
-Blacksburg seems kind of rural; other than Virginia Tech, there doesn't seem to be much there


Nova

Pros:

-Ft Lauderdale is a beautiful place; lots of stuff to do
-Had patient simulators
-Able to do dissections, but also have prosected cadavers
-Great facilities, best I've seen so far
-Dress code; students can wear scrubs to class
-People all seemed very friendly
-Students can do rotations at bigger hospitals, see a wider spectrum of pathology
-Attend school with students from other health professions
-Lots of stuff to do in Ft Lauderdale


Cons:

-Tuition is $45,000/year
-Cost of living in Ft Lauderdale is probably higher than Bradenton or Blacksburg
-Have an attendance policy; may not be enforced as strictly as at VCOM
-Probably more crime and traffic near Ft Lauderdale


That's my take on the schools so far. Would people please post their opinions?

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[FutureDrB]

I can't provide any opinions, since I haven't applied yet. However, each of these schools are on my "apply list", so I very much appreciate the insight...several things on here I did not know. I'll be interested to see if others agree/disagree with your analysis.

 

[Mbeas]

You have the most Pro's and least Con's for Nova. The choice seems obvious to me.

 

[scotchtapetest]

I know similar threads have been posted before, and I have already read several of them. That said, I am trying to make a decision about which school to attend and I would like to hear people's opinions about which school they like better and why. I will list some of the pros and cons of the schools below:


LECOM-Bradenton


VCOM


Nova


That's my take on the schools so far. Would people please post their opinions?

I've worked with 2-3 students/residents from each school and based on my n=6 I would say:

VCOM > Nova >> LECOM-B

DISCLAIMER: My n=6 has a significant selection/regional bias!

However, Virginia Tech just got a new allopathic school which means POSSIBLY competition for rotation sites but I'm not familiar with the details. So you would have to ask current VCOM students for updates.

 

[Druggernaut]

First of all, you need to decide if PBL is for you. If you're not on board, forget about Bradenton.

I passed on my Nova acceptance chiefly on the cost of attendance. It was almost $100,000 more than LECOM over 4 years. Plus, they've had huge tuition hikes (11% last year, if I'm not mistaken). I loved the location and the campus, but I was a little leery of their "mandatory" attendance policy. The consensus is that mandatory lectures make for a very stressful medical school experience, and even if you can probably get away without going, you never know if they'll crack down and enforce it, or decide to use your lack of attendance against you down the road. Plus, it's been said the first year basic sciences aren't taught by people under the umbrella of the school of medicine, and are of questionable quality. This puts your COMLEX/USMLE at risk. However, they have some of the best clinical rotations among osteopathic programs.

I can't speak to VCOM, as I didn't apply there or research it. The Virginia Tech affiliation sounds great, but the lecture attendance policy as you've outlined it sounds like a dealbreaker to me.

I think I'd attend LECOM-Bradenton over just about any DO program. Cheap, what seems like a great location, good performance on the board exams, few lectures. The rotations aren't ideal though, and you have to be excited about PBL. PBL's definately time consuming (lots of textbook reading, unlike most lecture-based schools), but at least you can structure your time as you please. I consider cadaver prosection to be plus, since you don't have to waste hours picking through fat and the body is dissected in a way that you'll actually be able to see what you're supposed to see.

People complain about the policies of LECOM, and I think you have to assess your personality to see how you'll do. If you're looking for a traditional university style learning environment, you'll be disappointed. If you're looking to get through school with a solid knowledge base and minimal debt, you'll be okay. You will have to shrug off some seemingly pointless rules, even if Bradenton is regarded as the least authoritarian of the branches.

 

[IAmTheCheese]

I've worked with 2-3 students/residents from each school and based on my n=6 I would say:

VCOM > Nova >> LECOM-B

DISCLAIMER: My n=6 has a significant selection/regional bias!

However, Virginia Tech just got a new allopathic school which means POSSIBLY competition for rotation sites but I'm not familiar with the details. So you would have to ask current VCOM students for updates.

I'm curious, why do why do you say VCOM is better than Nova? Please let me know.

 

[scotchtapetest]

I'm curious, why do why do you say VCOM is better than Nova? Please let me know.

I wouldn't necessarily put VCOM that much higher than Nova especially since VCOM has the new allopathic school which MAY create issues with rotations (or alternatively may prove to be more helpful).

As I said, based on my very biased n=6 of students/residents that I've worked with in rotations from those three schools, I was more impressed by VCOM grads/students over Nova grads/students and definitely over LECOM-B grads/students.

 

[gators21]

I wouldn't necessarily put VCOM that much higher than Nova especially since VCOM has the new allopathic school which MAY create issues with rotations (or alternatively may prove to be more helpful).

As I said, based on my very biased n=6 of students/residents that I've worked with in rotations from those three schools, I was more impressed by VCOM grads/students over Nova grads/students and definitely over LECOM-B grads/students.

So based off what 2 people from a school, your gonna judge the entire school? Just curious but your a med student right? What year are you? What school you attend?
The truth is things like patient simulators are completely useless and only impressive to applicants. All the other things like big campus, gym, big cafeteria are all good for a pamphlet. When you actually get there your gonna shoot yourself if you picked a school for that.
Go to the school you feel most comfortable. Remember you are there to become a doctor. I chose between NOVA and lecom b and I chose lecom. There is no doubt that Nova offers the better (More prestigous) rotations. But i hate lectures. Pbl fit my learning style. Hell, of all the residents I worked with, everyone told me its up to me not the school. The board pass rates speak for themselves. The cost is also a major plus. South florida is extremely expensive, plus tuition at nova is rediculous. With looming cuts to ALL reimbursments, there is not way i was paying that much.
I don't know anything about vcom.

 

[scotchtapetest]

So based off what 2 people from a school, your gonna judge the entire school? Just curious but your a med student right? What year are you? What school you attend?
The truth is things like patient simulators are completely useless and only impressive to applicants. All the other things like big campus, gym, big cafeteria are all good for a pamphlet. When you actually get there your gonna shoot yourself if you picked a school for that.
Go to the school you feel most comfortable. Remember you are there to become a doctor. I chose between NOVA and lecom b and I chose lecom. There is no doubt that Nova offers the better (More prestigous) rotations. But i hate lectures. Pbl fit my learning style. Hell, of all the residents I worked with, everyone told me its up to me not the school. The board pass rates speak for themselves. The cost is also a major plus. South florida is extremely expensive, plus tuition at nova is rediculous. With looming cuts to ALL reimbursments, there is not way i was paying that much.
I don't know anything about vcom.

OMS-IV; UNE-COM!

Agree with the bolded part of your response.

Again, I mentioned multiple times that my sample is very biased! BUT I do feel that when you see the same "deficiencies" from the students/residents from a given school you can form an anecdotal opinion (and it is MY OPINION as mentioned multiple times).

Also, if you don't think 1 student makes a difference, if a program has had 1 resident from your school who wasn't up to par, for the next 3 classes they will not even look at applications from your school. This is more true for academic programs.

Once you get to applying to residency you will realize how much your school actually matters and how much connections are a factor in getting interviews.

However, all three schools will provide you with a good education and I wouldn't call any of them a "bad" school, but I still stand by my original ranking which is totally based on my opinion, if it makes any difference!

 

[gators21]

OMS-IV; UNE-COM!

Agree with the bolded part of your response.

Again, I mentioned multiple times that my sample is very biased! BUT I do feel that when you see the same "deficiencies" from the students/residents from a given school you can form an anecdotal opinion (and it is MY OPINION as mentioned multiple times).

Also, if you don't think 1 student makes a difference, if a program has had 1 resident from your school who wasn't up to par, for the next 3 classes they will not even look at applications from your school. This is more true for academic programs.

Once you get to applying to residency you will realize how much your school actually matters and how much connections are a factor in getting interviews.

However, all three schools will provide you with a good education and I wouldn't call any of them a "bad" school, but I still stand by my original ranking which is totally based on my opinion, if it makes any difference!

I completely understand you opinion. I was just curious about our rep with other schools. No worries!
You are definately right about the rep though, especially with all these new schools opening up. More students than ever, same number of good rotations.
One other thing I would like to add. Lecom is definately for the self motivated. If you are someone who wants things outlined, structured, being told what to study, THIS IS NOT the place for you. We do not have powerpoints, lecture handouts, or even a schedule of test subjects. If you feel like you lack in a certain subject its up to you to do the research and learn.

 

[illegallysmooth]

PBL is going to be the biggest factor that separates LECOM-B from the others, at least during the pre-clinical years. I think the fact we use prosected cadavers goes hand-in-hand with that. I could dig around in the cadavers all day if I wanted to -- IF I WANTED TO. When you dissect, you have to spend many hours dissecting, THEN go home and STUDY it all. I saw only an advantage in using the prosected cadavers. They were dissected in layers, going along with whatever we were learning about, I just didn't have to spend hours and hours cutting through fat and fascia, hoping I didn't accidentally cut whatever structure I needed to identify. My friends at other schools spent 8 hrs in the lab dissecting, then went home and stayed up studying until 1am. Not me, I need my beauty sleep.

Another note - don't always assume that a bigger hospital = more variety of pathology. I've heard from multiple residents that sometimes the smaller hospitals in more rural areas are treating patients with less access to health care and end up being sicker and having complications that you don't see often. Additionally, many people have told me they got the most hands-on experience in smaller facilities without residents in the way. You + a surgery attending = lots of hands-on experience in the OR.

At LECOM-B we had one day of working with simulation robots. If I had the opportunity to do more, I wouldn't. I'd rather go to the clinic and see real patients. Simulation robots are one of those things that seems really cool when you're interviewing and touring the school, but is it really going to make a difference in your education? For me, no. There are plenty of real people around.

Lastly, I just want to tell you that I think I'm getting an extraordinary education at LECOM, and the residents I've spoken with have said they are impressed with the way LECOM students are able to function on the wards from the beginning of 3rd year. This is due to PBL. We study the anatomy of the heart alongside the histology, physiology, pathology, pharmacology, biochemistry, cardiac exam, etc, and it's all in the context of a patient case, which we have to present to our classmates and facilitator. For me, that leads to a deeper understanding of all those processes and a better level of preparedness to walk into an ER and work up a patient with chest pain and present it to the attending. However, if you're not an independent learner, you'll only want to do the bare minimum to pass and you won't learn as much. I know people like this and I don't think they're going to do well in the future. They probably should have chosen a lecture-based school. If you ARE independent and take an investigative attitude, you'll excel. That's why LECOM-B's board scores have been so impressive.

If you have any specific questions, feel free to PM me.

 

[hokie13]

Hey I go to Virginia Tech so if you have any questions about Blacksburg or the surrounding area let me know

I'm also an EMT so I have been in the ER at Montgomery Regional countless times and there are almost always VCOM students there. I also volunteered at the free clinic and there were VCOM students and Radford nursing students working in there too. You're right about cost of living... not too high here. Also, if you like the outdoors this area is beautiful and there are lots of places to hike, etc. The community is amazing around here. If you're interested in international medicine VCOM is also great for that. I've gotten emails about being a standardized patient and speaking Spanish to VCOM students, and I have friends at VCOM who have been on medical mission trips and love it. I can't answer too many questions about VCOM but I know a lotttt about Blacksburg.

I'm obviously not going to tell you to go to VCOM since I don't know much for the other two. It's hard for me to say, but like someone above said it sounds like you had more pros than cons for Nova. I think everyone is going to tell you differently where to go and you have to think about what kind of personality you have and where you would excel the most.

Be happy you have so many choices!!! I hope when I apply I will too! Best of luck to you.

 

[VA1986]

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[IAmTheCheese]

You have the most Pro's and least Con's for Nova. The choice seems obvious to me.

Yeah, I kind of liked Nova the best based on my interview there, however it is also the most expensive school, and I am debating whether or not it is worth it to spend another $10,000-$20,000 a year to go to Nova. Nova would probably be ~$80,000 more than LECOM after four years, and that's not even considering interest.

I told the doctor I have been shadowing where I was interviewing, and she suggested that I go with the cheapest school, which would be LECOM. That said, other people have told me not to make the decision based on money.

What's your opinion?

 

[JESSFALLING]

Yeah, I kind of liked Nova the best based on my interview there, however it is also the most expensive school, and I am debating whether or not it is worth it to spend another $10,000-$20,000 a year to go to Nova. Nova would probably be ~$80,000 more than LECOM after four years, and that's not even considering interest.

I told the doctor I have been shadowing where I was interviewing, and she suggested that I go with the cheapest school, which would be LECOM. That said, other people have told me not to make the decision based on money.

What's your opinion?

An additional 100k in debt is going to equal about an extra $1,000 per month to your loan payment. How will that impact your quality of life over the years?

 

[CiproFloxaFlame]

I told the doctor I have been shadowing where I was interviewing, and she suggested that I go with the cheapest school, which would be LECOM. That said, other people have told me not to make the decision based on money.

Another thing to keep in mind: cost of living. Living in Ft Lauderdale or Bradenton will be a lot more expensive than rural Virginia. The lower tuition at LECOM could be offset quite a bit by the extra living costs.

 

[thisland]

Lastly, I just want to tell you that I think I'm getting an extraordinary education at LECOM, and the residents I've spoken with have said they are impressed with the way LECOM students are able to function on the wards from the beginning of 3rd year. This is due to PBL. We study the anatomy of the heart alongside the histology, physiology, pathology, pharmacology, biochemistry, cardiac exam, etc, and it's all in the context of a patient case, which we have to present to our classmates and facilitator. For me, that leads to a deeper understanding of all those processes and a better level of preparedness to walk into an ER and work up a patient with chest pain and present it to the attending. However, if you're not an independent learner, you'll only want to do the bare minimum to pass and you won't learn as much. I know people like this and I don't think they're going to do well in the future. They probably should have chosen a lecture-based school. If you ARE independent and take an investigative attitude, you'll excel. That's why LECOM-B's board scores have been so impressive.

I completely agree with this. I think the PBL/lecture difference is probably the most important factor, more than the difference in tuition. I'm an M1 at Nova, and I really like it - I didn't apply to the other two schools, so I can't give any opinions about them. I know personally, I would probably not learn as much in a PBL curriculum, even if I did well during the preclinical years. If you have any specific questions, I'd be glad to answer what I can based off one semester.

 

[IAmTheCheese]

I completely agree with this. I think the PBL/lecture difference is probably the most important factor, more than the difference in tuition. I'm an M1 at Nova, and I really like it - I didn't apply to the other two schools, so I can't give any opinions about them. I know personally, I would probably not learn as much in a PBL curriculum, even if I did well during the preclinical years. If you have any specific questions, I'd be glad to answer what I can based off one semester.

I am curious why you say you would not learn as much in a PBL curriculum. It seems like the students at LECOM get pretty good board scores, which suggests that they are learning the basic sciences pretty well. I do recall when I interviewed at Nova that the dean said that you need lecture for volume, which suggests that PBL students may get exposed to a smaller volume of material. That said, I generally absorb material better when I am actively studying it rather than simply listening to a lecture or reviewing powerpoints or notes that other people have written.

I think the big thing that Nova has going for it is the strength of its clinical rotations. I am hoping that if I can get quality training and experience during my clinical years I will be more likely to be able to get into a competitive residency program. I don't know exactly what the board scores are for Nova, although when I interviewed there one of the interviewers said the first-time pass rate was in the 80-90% range, which would be significantly lower than LECOM. This concerns me a little, because I have heard that one of the most important factors in matching is your board scores.

Since you are currently a student at Nova, would you tell me what you like about it and what you don't like? Also, what made you choose Nova? Please let me know.

 

[eimaise]

VCOM

Pros:

-Tuition is less than Nova at ~$40,000/year
-Cost of living in Blacksburg is probably lower than it is in Florida
-Had patient simulators
-Affiliated with Virginia Tech, can use all their facilities
-People all seemed very friendly

Cons:

-Have an attendance policy that is enforced; would probably have to be in class 8-5 every day
-Not sure, but it sounds like students at VCOM also do rotations at smaller community hospitals
-Facilities at VCOM seemed lacking; tiny library, no real cafeteria, small OMM rooms, the rooms with patient simulators were still being painted.
-Dress code; have to wear a collared shirt and slacks
-Blacksburg seems kind of rural; other than Virginia Tech, there doesn't seem to be much there

I am in my first year at VCOM and I can tell you that it is a wonderful place. I also got accepted to LECOM-B and LECOM-E but chose VCOM for a number of factors.

To address your pros and cons

Tuition is fairly normal for medical school. US private school average for 2008 was 37,800 -- which is basically VCOM's tuition.

The cost of living is low in the area. You can live in Christiansburg (5 to 10 minutes down the road from VCOM) for $850 a month (includes all utiltiies) in a 1300 sf appartment.

The patient simulators are cool, I suppose. We haven't used them yet. I can imagine them being useful for learning unusual heart sounds. Not sure.

The Virginia Tech affiliation is GREAT. We get all the feel of a small school with the big school connection. The VCOM buildings are a short walk to campus and they have tons of options there. Great study locations, huge university library, great work-out facilities. Free Hokie football tickets.

Everyone here (mostly) is extremely helpful and friendly. Our teachers are overwhelmingly committed to helping you succeed. The staff is extremely friendly.


As relates to your cons:

1. The attendance policy is really not that bad. It's worth your while. I haven't heard anybody complain about "having to go to class." It was not enforced for the first 3 months of this school year and still everyone came. If you focus on the lectures and take notes, you will do quite well in school here. Class is not from 8-5 each day. It is usually 8-12 with PPC-OMM labs 2 hours a week in the afternoon, and gross anatomy lab usually 4-8 hours a week (in the afternoons).

2. We do our 3rd and 4th year rotations in both big and small hospitals. Carilion Roanoake Memorial is the main big hospital (40 minutes north from VCOM). But you will rotate through small places MANDATORILY because VCOM requires a rural rotation. From what I have heard from 3rd and 4th years, they actually preferred their surgery rotations in smaller towns because they got to perform a lot of procedures as opposed to the folks who did their surgery rotations in larger hospitals which had surgical residents (who of course did the majority of the procedures). This is anecdotal, but it was refreshing and interesting to me.

3. The facilities are fine (for me). There's always room for everyone to eat. We all bring our lunches anyways (remember, that $5 sandwhich will cost you $1,000 dollars in 10 years when you're paying for it from borrowed money! Lol). The "tiny" library is not really a library. It's basically all the textbooks from every class. Very useful. You can just use the books as a reference if you prefer. Study room is small but stays quiet. You learn to adapt. Plus, Virginia Tech is 2 minutes away and has every possible place you could ever want to study. The small OMM rooms were designed that way intentionally. It's really quite nice. Instead of having 200 students in one room, we get focussed attention in small group rooms at a ratio of 8:1 (students:faculty). The OMM teacher for lab is teaching from a separate room which is live fed to your room on flat panel televisions. The bottom line is that you learn the procedures and have ample opportunity to practice. There are weekly optional OMM meetings with faculty and upperclassmen to practice OMM if you would like. The rooms with the sim people are "still being painted" because they are currently being renovated. The building has been completed and in use for several years.

4. Not sure what the big deal is about a dress code. Professional dress is the norm for... professionals. Maybe this isn't a big deal for me because I worked in the professional world before I came here. We often wear scrubs to class when lab is right after. Also, it's kind of nice to bump into your dean in the hall and look really sharp rather than wearing a hoodie and jeans. It's just one of those things about life. Plus, once you get out on rotations and become a doc, you will be wearing professional dress every day.

5. Blacksburg is rural. I love it that way. It's peaceful, serene, and there is actually quite a lot to do, especially if you love the outdoors. Let me be honest with you: you won't have that much time to "do things." Beyond exercising, hanging out with friends, going out to eat, going to the mall, going on an occasional hike, you will be on your butt studying for 6 hours a day. It's a ton of information and you have to stay on top of it seven days a week.



I will add a few more things:

1. Usually 2 exams every week. This is wonderful in my opinion because instead of having one week with 7 exams, you will have them all spread out with more time to study for each one. It helps you stay on top of the material and keep working faithfully on your material if you are getting fizzled out.

2. Very nice atmosphere in the school. They are just really chill. I had a totally opposite experience in my interview days at the two LECOMs.

3. Missions focused. This is a nice factor. Great opportunities for international rotations at established VCOM clinics in Latin America and Appalachia. Short term trips are a good way to get your feet wet in year one or two. For folks like my wife and I who are aiming on going into Christian medical missions, it's kind of a neat opportunity to go with classmates and faculty.

4. I have never seen such camaraderie in a class before. Everyone helps everyone else out. No cut-throat. There are constant study guides, student-made quizzes, and other internet resources posted on the student Facebook page.

Hope this helps.

 

[thisland]

I am curious why you say you would not learn as much in a PBL curriculum. It seems like the students at LECOM get pretty good board scores, which suggests that they are learning the basic sciences pretty well. I do recall when I interviewed at Nova that the dean said that you need lecture for volume, which suggests that PBL students may get exposed to a smaller volume of material. That said, I generally absorb material better when I am actively studying it rather than simply listening to a lecture or reviewing powerpoints or notes that other people have written.

I think the big thing that Nova has going for it is the strength of its clinical rotations. I am hoping that if I can get quality training and experience during my clinical years I will be more likely to be able to get into a competitive residency program. I don't know exactly what the board scores are for Nova, although when I interviewed there one of the interviewers said the first-time pass rate was in the 80-90% range, which would be significantly lower than LECOM. This concerns me a little, because I have heard that one of the most important factors in matching is your board scores.

Since you are currently a student at Nova, would you tell me what you like about it and what you don't like? Also, what made you choose Nova? Please let me know.

Sorry, finals week. When I said I wouldn't learn as much in a PBL curriculum, it was a personal statement - I probably wouldn't go as in depth to the topics as I should, because I'd be able to get away with not doing so, and then I wouldn't learn as much as I should. For different people, it's probably better suited for their style and they might learn better in that curriculum. I do pick up information from lectures, but I learn the most when I'm going over notes, rewriting them in my own terms than just reading them or reading someone else's notes.

I think we do have a pretty strong reputation, rotations-wise, which is nice, but I can't comment on it personally yet. I have talked to third years, and I've pretty much heard good things about their rotations so far. Someone actually asked the Dean the other day (there are periodic Dean's hours during the semester when someone high in administration will answer questions) about Nova's low board pass rate. He said a lot of it was because they let anyone who's in good academic standing take the boards, while other schools may hold you back for other reasons (I don't know if the idea of a pre-test is a good or bad thing, but it will change the numbers between school). Again, I can't really say personally since that's next year.

I like the atmosphere here a lot - there's really not competition. The class above us has been really helpful with reviews, old tests and notes, and general advice, and our class has been ridiculously open sharing study question answers and things - there's a google docs group and facebook group, and right now, for instance, they're very busy with people posting questions and answers and note packets and things that professors said that people may not have been in class for.

There's not much I don't like so far - there's some teachers I like more than others, but I don't think that's a school-specific complaint; I think it would happen no matter where I went. If I could change anything about the school, I guess it would be the tuition - but again, that's not too school specific. Most of the schools I was looking at were in a similar tuition range.

I chose Nova after I came down for an interview. I really enjoyed the feel of the school and what I'd heard about it. I picked my undergraduate college the same way - research beforehand, then just a gut feeling on where I felt the best when I actually visited the school, and I have no regrets on either. Hope this helps, good luck with your decisions and congrats on going to med school next year, no matter what you choose .

 

[munchymanRX]

Nova

Pros:

-Ft Lauderdale is a beautiful place; lots of stuff to do
-Had patient simulators
-Able to do dissections, but also have prosected cadavers
-Great facilities, best I've seen so far
-Dress code; students can wear scrubs to class
-People all seemed very friendly
-Students can do rotations at bigger hospitals, see a wider spectrum of pathology
-Attend school with students from other health professions
-Lots of stuff to do in Ft Lauderdale


Cons:

-Tuition is $45,000/year
-Cost of living in Ft Lauderdale is probably higher than Bradenton or Blacksburg
-Have an attendance policy; may not be enforced as strictly as at VCOM
-Probably more crime and traffic near Ft Lauderdale


That's my take on the schools so far. Would people please post their opinions?

I'll weigh in on Nova, since that's what I do here.

-Dress code is really only scrub bottoms after the first couple weeks. You can wear anything you want on top and nobody is going to care. Of course, don't go to clinic or exams like this, but otherwise nobody could give less of a ****.

-Attendance is so unenforced it's not even funny and only becomes a problem if you start failing classes. I seriously have not been to class since mid October except for exams. Lecture materials are posted online, and 2nd year there's even a notetaking service you can pay for if you don't want to go.

-Everyone loves the patient simulators, but you won't get a huge amount of use out of them compared to the standardized patients. To me they just represent more tuition dollars.

-People are EXTREMELY friendly, although this has more to do with the specific class than the school. Med school sucks, and commiserating with your fellow classmates is going to breed an atmosphere of cooperation, unless everyone's a gunner.

-Yes, Nova has grades, but like most medical schools (read: all of them) they're really only used to calculate your class rank, if you care about that sort of thing. Unless you're shooting for ROADS, just do as well as you can and don't sweat it if you get a few Bs or even a C. Make sure you pass though. Things get expensive if you don't.

-As I keep saying, the rotations are what sold me on the school. I don't have to move at all during 3rd year, and I can rotate in large metro hospitals in a pretty diverse area. Being in SoFl also opens the door to the occasional tropical disease as well (personal interest of mine), something most of the rest of the US can't necessarily say.

 

[toxicwombat]

Cons:

-Students are not able to dissect; they use prosected cadavers only

Hmm... is that really a bad thing, though?

 

[Loudster]

Hmm... is that really a bad thing, though?

Agreed.

And about Lecom, you apparently can apply to dissect during the summer after first year. So, "not able" really means "not able during the first year". I don't know how competitive it is to be a dissector, but technically you are able to dissect if you really want it. I don't know much about the program, but it's there.

 

[toxicwombat]

Agreed.

And about Lecom, you apparently can apply to dissect during the summer after first year. So, "not able" really means "not able during the first year". I don't know how competitive it is to be a dissector, but technically you are able to dissect if you really want it. I don't know much about the program, but it's there.

Right. Personally I think mandatory-dissection is worse. Anatomical dissection isn't for everyone, and being able to see clearly labelled body parts arguably makes learning easier.

LECOM, SOMA, etc. all let you dissect if you really want to (either through summer programs, electives, or clubs) -- it's just not required. Not to mention, some rather reputable MD programs use prosected cadavers too.

 

[octupus]

Yeah, I kind of liked Nova the best based on my interview there, however it is also the most expensive school, and I am debating whether or not it is worth it to spend another $10,000-$20,000 a year to go to Nova. Nova would probably be ~$80,000 more than LECOM after four years, and that's not even considering interest.

I told the doctor I have been shadowing where I was interviewing, and she suggested that I go with the cheapest school, which would be LECOM. That said, other people have told me not to make the decision based on money.

What's your opinion?

I am also debating between LECOM-Bradenton vs another school, Touro-NY. LECOM will cost about $18,000 cheaper per year (cost of living included). Being close to family and friends (all in NY), is really important to me and the fact that I'll be in NYC again is great!... but in all honesty, $18,000 is a LOT of money, and like someone said, that's not even including interest.
Of the 2 doctors and 1 optometrist (Nova graduate) I spoke to, they all hands down said I should go with LECOM simply based on cost of attendance. I personally love the idea of PBL and I believe the quality of life will be much higher in Bradenton. I've been told the environment I study in should be more important than the few gun shot wounds I might see rotating in NYC.

With that said, Nova does seem awfully expensive as well... and assuming you will most likely adjust to PBL like most students, will the quality of education really be that different?

 

[Mbeas]

My biggest gripe about Bradenton was the rotations. They are pretty scattered if I remember correctly, and I don't want to have to move every few months for a different rotation.

 

[IAmTheCheese]

My biggest gripe about Bradenton was the rotations. They are pretty scattered if I remember correctly, and I don't want to have to move every few months for a different rotation.

Yeah, the rotations are one of the biggest differences between LECOM and Nova, and one of the areas in which Nova shines.

Personally, my biggest gripe about LECOM is that people just didn't seem that friendly there. If I'm going to be spending a couple years somewhere, I hope I can be happy there and establish good relationships. I just didn't get that warm fuzzy feeling at either Erie or Bradenton. This is in contrast to VCOM and Nova, where I feel like everyone seemed pretty happy and were very friendly and supportive.

I realize it would be significantly more expensive to attend either VCOM or Nova, but I'm debating if it would be worth it just to be happier and have a more friendly and supportive environment.

 

[Mbeas]

Yeah, the rotations are one of the biggest differences between LECOM and Nova, and one of the areas in which Nova shines.

Personally, my biggest gripe about LECOM is that people just didn't seem that friendly there. If I'm going to be spending a couple years somewhere, I hope I can be happy there and establish good relationships. I just didn't get that warm fuzzy feeling at either Erie or Bradenton. This is in contrast to VCOM and Nova, where I feel like everyone seemed pretty happy and were very friendly and supportive.

Yea, I got that feeling at Erie, but not as much as Bradenton.

As for the cost...if everyone wanted the cheapest school they would go to LECOM. Obviously, cost is a factor (read: one factor) but you have to go where you are happiest. Just depends on if spending the extra money will make you happier or not

 

[IAmTheCheese]

I am in my first year at VCOM and I can tell you that it is a wonderful place. I also got accepted to LECOM-B and LECOM-E but chose VCOM for a number of factors.

To address your pros and cons

Tuition is fairly normal for medical school. US private school average for 2008 was 37,800 -- which is basically VCOM's tuition.

The cost of living is low in the area. You can live in Christiansburg (5 to 10 minutes down the road from VCOM) for $850 a month (includes all utiltiies) in a 1300 sf appartment.

The patient simulators are cool, I suppose. We haven't used them yet. I can imagine them being useful for learning unusual heart sounds. Not sure.

The Virginia Tech affiliation is GREAT. We get all the feel of a small school with the big school connection. The VCOM buildings are a short walk to campus and they have tons of options there. Great study locations, huge university library, great work-out facilities. Free Hokie football tickets.

Everyone here (mostly) is extremely helpful and friendly. Our teachers are overwhelmingly committed to helping you succeed. The staff is extremely friendly.


As relates to your cons:

1. The attendance policy is really not that bad. It's worth your while. I haven't heard anybody complain about "having to go to class." It was not enforced for the first 3 months of this school year and still everyone came. If you focus on the lectures and take notes, you will do quite well in school here. Class is not from 8-5 each day. It is usually 8-12 with PPC-OMM labs 2 hours a week in the afternoon, and gross anatomy lab usually 4-8 hours a week (in the afternoons).

2. We do our 3rd and 4th year rotations in both big and small hospitals. Carilion Roanoake Memorial is the main big hospital (40 minutes north from VCOM). But you will rotate through small places MANDATORILY because VCOM requires a rural rotation. From what I have heard from 3rd and 4th years, they actually preferred their surgery rotations in smaller towns because they got to perform a lot of procedures as opposed to the folks who did their surgery rotations in larger hospitals which had surgical residents (who of course did the majority of the procedures). This is anecdotal, but it was refreshing and interesting to me.

3. The facilities are fine (for me). There's always room for everyone to eat. We all bring our lunches anyways (remember, that $5 sandwhich will cost you $1,000 dollars in 10 years when you're paying for it from borrowed money! Lol). The "tiny" library is not really a library. It's basically all the textbooks from every class. Very useful. You can just use the books as a reference if you prefer. Study room is small but stays quiet. You learn to adapt. Plus, Virginia Tech is 2 minutes away and has every possible place you could ever want to study. The small OMM rooms were designed that way intentionally. It's really quite nice. Instead of having 200 students in one room, we get focussed attention in small group rooms at a ratio of 8:1 (students:faculty). The OMM teacher for lab is teaching from a separate room which is live fed to your room on flat panel televisions. The bottom line is that you learn the procedures and have ample opportunity to practice. There are weekly optional OMM meetings with faculty and upperclassmen to practice OMM if you would like. The rooms with the sim people are "still being painted" because they are currently being renovated. The building has been completed and in use for several years.

4. Not sure what the big deal is about a dress code. Professional dress is the norm for... professionals. Maybe this isn't a big deal for me because I worked in the professional world before I came here. We often wear scrubs to class when lab is right after. Also, it's kind of nice to bump into your dean in the hall and look really sharp rather than wearing a hoodie and jeans. It's just one of those things about life. Plus, once you get out on rotations and become a doc, you will be wearing professional dress every day.

5. Blacksburg is rural. I love it that way. It's peaceful, serene, and there is actually quite a lot to do, especially if you love the outdoors. Let me be honest with you: you won't have that much time to "do things." Beyond exercising, hanging out with friends, going out to eat, going to the mall, going on an occasional hike, you will be on your butt studying for 6 hours a day. It's a ton of information and you have to stay on top of it seven days a week.



I will add a few more things:

1. Usually 2 exams every week. This is wonderful in my opinion because instead of having one week with 7 exams, you will have them all spread out with more time to study for each one. It helps you stay on top of the material and keep working faithfully on your material if you are getting fizzled out.

2. Very nice atmosphere in the school. They are just really chill. I had a totally opposite experience in my interview days at the two LECOMs.

3. Missions focused. This is a nice factor. Great opportunities for international rotations at established VCOM clinics in Latin America and Appalachia. Short term trips are a good way to get your feet wet in year one or two. For folks like my wife and I who are aiming on going into Christian medical missions, it's kind of a neat opportunity to go with classmates and faculty.

4. I have never seen such camaraderie in a class before. Everyone helps everyone else out. No cut-throat. There are constant study guides, student-made quizzes, and other internet resources posted on the student Facebook page.

Hope this helps.

Thank you for this response. This information is actually very helpful.

Do you have any idea what the first time pass rate is for the COMLEX at VCOM? I don't think they told us when I interviewed there, but I suspect it may be higher than Nova. I recall that the interviewer I asked about it said that students had around 2.5 months at the end of second year to study for the boards, which is fantastic.

In terms of matching, I recall that 57% of VCOM grads went into primary care, although they also said that they had people matching into really competitive specialties like Derm and Neuro.

I've heard positive things about the rotations at Nova and not so great things about the rotations at LECOM, but I'm still trying to figure out how the rotations at VCOM compare. I don't suppose there is anyone who has been through the rotations at VCOM who could comment?

 

[burki]

how about WVSOM vs Nova?

 

[FutureDoctorrrr]

I would go with NSU....NSU's OPTI is far superior to the LECOM OPTI (since the LECOM OPTI serves three medical schools). NSU OPTI beats VCOM OPTI anytime....any day.

VCOM OPTI houses the following

4 Internal Medicine program
4 Family Practice Programs
1 Dermatology Program
1 Neurological Surgery program

LECOM OPTI houses the following:


PROGRAMS
17 AOA approved/applied for osteopathic internships
70 AOA approved/applied for residencies/fellowships

NSU OPTI houses the following programs

Dermatology (3 separate programs)
Internal Medicine (6 separate programs; it also houses some Endocrinology/Cardiology/GI/Interventional Cardio/Geriatrics fellowships)
Orthopedic Surgery (2 separate programs)
Pediatrics (3 separate programs)
General Surgery
Anesthesiology (2 separate programs)
Psychiatry (2 separate programs)
Emergency Medicine (2 separate programs)
Opthalmology
Neurology
Diagnostic Radiology
Family Practice (I know no one cares how many....but there are 7 programs...lol)

Residencies:
Family Practice:
Aultman Hospital, Canton, OH
Clarion Hospital, Clarion, PA
Conemaugh Memorial Medical Center, Johnstown, PA
Cooper Green Mercy Hospital, Birmingham, AL
Erie County Medical Center/SUNY at Buffalo, Buffalo, NY
Guthrie/Robert Packer Hospital, Sayre, PA
Manatee Memorial Hospital, Bradenton, FL
Marquette General Health System, Marquette, MI
Meadville Medical Center, Meadville, PA
Memorial Hospital, York, PA
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA
Niagara Falls Memorial Medical Center, Niagara Falls, NY
PinnacleHealth Harrisburg Hospital, Harrisburg, PA
St. Petersburg General Hospital, St. Petersburg, FL
The Washington Hospital, Washington, Pa
The Western Pennsylvania Hospital/Forbes Regional Campus, Pittsburgh, PA
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH
UPMC Horizon, Farrell, PA
UPMC McKeesport, McKeesport, PA
UPMC St. Margaret, Pittsburgh, PA
Wellington Regional Medical Center, Wellington, FL
Westchester General Hospital, Miami, FL
Westview Hospital, Indianapolis, IN


General Surgery:
Memorial Hospital, York, PA
PinnacleHealth Harrisburg Hospital, Harrisburg, PA
UPMC Horizon, Farrell, PA


Internal Medicine:
Conemaugh Memorial Medical Center, Johnstown, PA
Manatee Memorial Hospital, Bradenton, FL
Memorial Hospital, York, PA
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA
Northside Hospital, St. Petersburg, FL
Sacred Heart Health System, Pensacola, FL
The Wright Center for Graduate Medical Education, Scranton, PA
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH
UPMC Horizon, Farrell, PA
UPMC McKeesport, McKeesport, PA
Wellington Regional Medical Center, Wellington, FL


Orthopedic Surgery:
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH


Dermatology:
Alta Dermatology Residency Training Program, Mesa, AZ
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH
Wellington Regional Medical Center, Wellington, FL


Emergency Medicine:
Conemaugh Memorial Medical Center, Johnstown, PA
Memorial Hospital, York, PA
Saint Vincent Health Center, Erie, PA
UPMC Hamot, Erie, PA


Neurology:
UPMC Hamot, Erie, PA


Obstetrics/Gynecology:
Memorial Hospital, York, PA


Ophthalmology:
*Florida Osteopathic Education Institute (FOEI), New Port Richey, FL
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA


Otolaryngology/Facial Plastic Surgery (ENT):
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA


Pediatrics:
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH


Proctologic Surgery:
Westview Hospital, Indianapolis, IN


Psychiatry:
*Manatee Glens Hospital, Bradenton, FL
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA


Child/Adolescent Psychiatry (residency or fellowship):
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA


Fellowships:
Cardiology:
Northside Hospital, St. Petersburg, FL

Gastroenterology:
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA

Geriatric:
Geriatric-Family Practice:
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA
Geriatric-Internal Medicine:
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA

Integrative Medicine:
*Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA

Gynecology/Oncology:
York Hospital, York, PA

Maternal and Fetal Medicine:
PinnacleHealth Harrisburg Hospital & Maternal Fetal Medicine of Central Pennsylvania, Harrisburg, PA
York Hospital, York, PA

Neuromusculoskeletal Medicine OMM:
Millcreek community Hospital/"Plus One" Residency Training in NMM and OMM, Erie, PA

Pediatric Allergy and Immunology:
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH

Allergy and Immunology:
*University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH

Sports Medicine:
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA
PinnacleHealth Community General Osteopathic Hospital, Harrisburg, PA
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH


Internships:
Clarion Hospital, Clarion, PA
Conemaugh Memorial Medical Center, Johnstown, PA
Guthrie/Robert Packer Hospital, Sayre, PA
Meadville Medical Center, Meadville, PA
Memorial Hospital, York, PA
Millcreek Community Hospital, Erie, PA
Northside Hospital, St. Petersburg, FL
PinnacleHealth Harrisburg Hospital, Harrisburg, PA
St. Petersburg General Hospital, St. Petersburg, FL
Saint Vincent Health Center, Erie, PA
The Allegheny General Hospital - Western Pennsylvania Hospital Medical Education Consortium, Pittsburgh, PA
University Hospitals Richmond Medical Center, Richmond Heights, OH
UPMC McKeesport, McKeesport, PA
Wellington Regional Medical Center, Wellington, FL
Westchester General Hospital, Miami, FL
Westview Hospital, Indianapolis, IN
York Hospital, York, PA


Here, NSU OPTI wins because it serves only one medical school....while LECOM OPTI serves three medical schools...
I would choose NSU.