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Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - DO' started by lovelyaries, Apr 27, 2004.
any thoughts? I have been accepted to both.
Which campus at LECOM did you choose?
ive been accepted to both. LECOM didnt turn me on much. DRESS CODE and ATTENDANCE policy. Least at nycom they dont have that.
I had to make the same choice two years ago. I chose NYCOM simply because of the clinical rotations and the opportunities of NYC. Last summer I participated in research at the glaucoma institute in Mahnattan. I have been able to have one paper published, and I am working on an abstract. These opportunities would not have been there had I chosen LECOM. Ultamately, choose the school that fit YOU best, but these are the reasons I chose NYCOM. Feel free to PM me with any additional questions.
thanx for the replies....i chose erie over brandenton because i wanted to still have 4 seasons (I am from Maryland)...yeah, at first i was a little annoyed with the dress policy and food/drink policy. With NYCOM, i just got my acceptance last Friday but I would have to do a 4 week Med prep program..which I don't wanna do. I interviewed at Drexel Med last Friday and I totally loved everything about their program, their committment to the students, and its in philly....so that would be my top choice. Now I am realizing that I might have doubts about wanting to be in Erie....Once I hear from Drexel I can make a decision...so many things currently up in the air.
I was accepted to both places as well. IMO, Nycom is better hands down.
#1: Match list. NYCOM's match list is pretty impressive. A lot of people say its match list is comparable to match lists found at some MD schools and I believe it.
Have you seen LECOM match list? Of course you haven?t..... because LECOM won?t release it. They won?t make it public. LECOM obviously has something to hide. Big red flag against LECOM!!!!
#2: Location. Long Island beats Erie in terms of location. Erie gets about around 180 inches (15 feet) of snow each winter if I remember correctly. And its consistent because its Lake Effect snow. It snows where NYCOM is located in LI but not nearly as much as it does in Erie.
Plus, NYCOM?s location on Long Island is fairly close to NYC. All there is around Erie is Erie. I think Buffalo is also an hour?s drive away from Erie but is that really much of an upgrade?
Its funny because a couple of years ago there was a big deal in Erie about an indoor waterpark opening there. The brochure in my hotel said ?84 degree temps year round?. I guess even Erie residents dislike Erie weather. The facility also cost $10 million to build so the people around there will obviously go to extremes to escape Erie's winter dreariness. I guess that?s why LECOM opened a florida branch (more on that below).
And LECOM?s ?campus? is just one building. Looks more like a corporate building than an acadmic building.
#3: LECOM dress code.
Speaking of corporate building, going to school there must feel a lot like going to work?.especially for the guys. You enter a large building with hi-tech reflective glass on all sides and guys HAVE to wear a shirt and tie when in the building. (although I will admit med school is kind of like a full-time job but IMO med school should have a much more casual feel than what?s present at LECOM.)
Unlike Nova?s dress code, LECOM actually enforces it (but from what I?ve heard girls have it much easier than guys do). Regardless, I think LECOM?s dress code is ridiculously strict.
Also, LECOM?s staff is pretty anal. It was raining on my interview day and, believe it or not, students and teachers weren?t allowed to bring umbrellas into the building. They had to be left in the gap between the inner door and the outer door (forgot what these type of doors are called, like what you find at mall entrances at East coast\cold weather malls.)
#4: If LECOM-FL, beware of PBL. Going to med school in florida is nice but LECOM-FL is all PBL. I would never do PBL, I think a lecture based curriculum prepares students better for step 1. The range of knowledge needed to do well on step 1 is just too vast. I?m not sure PBL would cover all the bases thoroughly enough.
Lets just say I?m happy to be going to NYCOM this fall.
Attendance policy wouldn't really be relevant at Florida campus since it's PBL.
PCOM doesn't release a match list either, does that mean they're hiding something too? There is a limited list of some LECOM alumni on LECOM's website, plenty of anesth and rads - a derm, an optho, an ortho, an oto etc.
PBL students score very well on step 1 - actually a little better than the lecture students at LECOM I believe.
I don't know what you are talking about...I take my umbrella inside all the time.
Yes we have a dress code, yes we see people in class not in dress code. It's not a huge deal at all!
If you want to sit in a lecture room along with 300 other students - choose NYCOM.
I would def choose LECOM...smaller class, florida is a great option...same clinical rotation opportunities in Florida than in NY...and you can't beat the new facilities or great weather.
Since I go to LECOM and have done more than just interview or hear rumors, I feel I am a bit more qualified to rate it.
Everyone, I mean EVERYONE, talks about the policies. Believe me, LECOM is not as strict as you would believe. Just because they hand you a load of propaganda on interview day doesn't mean jack. People CONSTANTLY eat and drink outside of the cafeteria, don't abide by the dress code AND don't attend class. I've been told of one LDP that doesn't go to ANY classes. I'm PBL but I'm sure there are many more(LDP back me up). Believe me, the policies are the LEAST of your worries. Worry more about learning.
LECOM's LDP and ISP COMLEX I pass rate was somewhere around 90% from what I understand. PBL was 95%. One PBLer had one of the highest scores in the country. Speaking from a PBL standpoint, and not to upset my LDP comrads too much, but lecture is terrible. I couldn't imagine sitting in it all day. For those going to FL, be glad you're PBL.
Erie is not a fun place to live. It snows a lot. In fact, we were SUPPOSED to get snow last night but we didn't. If you are a weather freak, then I see your concern. Erie is the 4th largest city in PA, which I know doesn't say a lot. But when you're from podunk like I am, it's fairly large. Cleveland is 90 mins away as is Buffalo. I personally would hate NYC. I hate big cities with a passion. To each his own.
The somewhat unappreciated return of Dr_sax, PBL 2007
Pretty much every pass rate I've seen of DO schools is over 90%. I'm sure a few don't but its uncommon to see a US school with a pass rate under 90%.
Sure the LECOM staff has no problems with students bringing in DRY umbrellas but I just believe what my eyes told me. When students and teachers were coming in from the rain on my interview day, they had to leave their wet, used umbrellas outside the door.
Not rumors, not heresay but taken from direct observation.
How'd you go about getting that research position? I'm very interested in doing something like that.
What do umbrellas, dry or wet, have to do with medical school anyways. Beside, maybe they have tile floors and don't want to get them wet -- resulting in a fall and injury -- resulting in a lawsuit -- resulting in higher tuition for their students. Makes sense to me.
I can't comment on NYCOM, but I'll comment on LECOM.
First off, I have taken my umbrella, both wet and dry, into the classroom. There is no drill sergeant standing outside the door saying, "Drop your umbrellas! Now!" I usually left my umbrella outside, though, because if I didn't it would sit on the floor with my bookbag and get my bookbag all wet.
Regarding the attendance policy/dress code...It is not all that strict as they want you to believe. (I believe other of my fellow LECOMers have said this already.) Wait until your 2nd semester of MS-II - you'll be lucky if 1/3 of the class is there. (I was one of the dorks who usually went to class because I learn better by listening to the lecture.) And the dress code is not strictly enforced either. Everyone dresses up at first, but after a while guys come in without their ties, in tennis shoes, and so on. And you will be dressing up every day for rotations anyway - what's the big deal in dressing up for your first two years? I am a girl so maybe the dress code doesn't seem as big of a deal to me (as I don't know what it's like to sit in class with a tie), but I can't believe that someone would choose not to attend LECOM just for the dress code.
The match list is the one thing that annoys me about LECOM. I would like to see where our graduates go - but all LECOM says is that something like 70% of their OPTI spots are filled by LECOM grads. I wonder why the Ferretti empire keeps it under lock and key, but I guess we'll never know the answer to that.
My two cents.
(And by the way, welcome back, Dr_sax )
LDPer speaking up here...Some lectures are just horrible and a pain to sit through. And then some lectures are just great listen to! But that is to be expected at every school
someone posted that lecom has a 90% pass rate. i am a current 3rd and soon to be 4th yr student in the LDP. this information is not correct. my class had a pass rate of 84%. 17 people failed all together, and the pbl people did the best. only 1 or 2 people in their group failed. the class ahead of me, the class of 2004 had a pass rate of 86%. from my what i have heard, LECOM has never had a pass rate higher than 90% for step 1.
Sorry, my bad. The PBL info is correct though.
I'm not going to say who, how or why I know this, but trust me, statistics have been pulled on the class of 2006 and there are some shady dealings going on to get that number above 90%.
Didn't know a school could keep you from sitting *ahem*
Class of 2006 hasn't even taken the boards yet so I don't know how you get that %
Tsk, Tsk, Doctortobee. Don't you know H0mersimps0n can time travel
I mean, remember that Simpsons episode where Homer Simpson goes back and kills all the dinosaurs. Or the episode where Homer Simpsons goes back in time to prevent the banning of guns (to save the city from zombies)?
Oh - PCOM's match list is located in the class yearbook, so anyone w/ access to the library can check them out. Unfortunately, they're not listed on the web. It might be the same policy w/ LECOM but that's something that current LECOM students need to find out.
Here we go again:
1. There is no problem sitting in class w/ 300 other students, it is just as informative as a 150 student class room. It all depends on the teacher. No one can't possibly tell me that the instructors at LECOM speak w/ every student independently during class. PLus more people means more friends you can have for the future. =) (no smart a$$ remark as to "i dont need anymore friends" or "you need more friends" etc.... the more people you know the better)
2. One of NYCOMs best advantages is our clinical rotation site w/ our hospital affiliations. I think LECOM didn't have much on their hospital affiliations (correct me if im wrong) Our match list is on our school academic webboard.
3. NYCOM doesn't have a dress code, to have one is just a burden sometimes. Students shouldnt have to worry about what they have to wear even if its only for the 1st month or two.
4. NYCOM has streaming video of almost all lectures (ones that arent streamed are ones that aren't allowed by instructors for personal reasons). If you miss an 8am class, you can watch that very same lecture another time on your computer. Therefore, we have the Lecture mode, individual mode, and group mode as well.... same as LECOM =), but just not official.
5. NYCOM doesn't have 473927439 feet of snow every winter, plus queens is about 15min drive away. You can't possible compare cleveland or buffalo to NYC. I've been to both cities and they were kind of boring. So was Erie because I've interviewed there as well. They rejected me because i didnt know what i was talking about. =) I didn't sleep the night before and drove straight to the interview, 4hr drive from binghamton, hopped up on 2 stacker two and coffee... i was delirious.
I know they haven't taken the boards yet, I'm just saying that the deck will be stacked such that I can't imagine the % wouldn't hit at least 90%. Just wait Bee, you'll (we'll) see how it all works next year. Hope we have a high enough GPA just to sit next year...
EDIT: and group, my favorite part of that episode was when I came back to the present and marge and the family didn't know what donuts were and after I left it started "raining"
what kind of shady things are you talking about? do you think the school knows what is on the exam and will tell all of the MSIIs? if my memory serves me, each school IS told what subjects are focused on the most for each exam, but no specifics.
Maybe the "shady things" are suggesting that some people not sit for the boards (who are more at risk of failing)? I have heard that they did that for our class, but I'm not sure if it is true.
Yeah I said SHADY not illegal...
DOtobe, you my friend have hit the nail on the head...
My anonimity is not 100% around here so I won't divulge exactly what I know publically... but DOt is close enough...
They're not shady about it. Lecom states very clearly that if you fail 2 pathways during second year, then you are not eligible to sit for boards. These people are required to take remedial courses. I don't think that's shady at all. Why make someone pay $375 for Comlex if they're not ready to pass it?
Also, Lecom has over 70 rotation sites, in NYC, Pittsburgh, Philadelphia, Cleveland, Buffalo, Erie, Indianapolis, Florida, and Georgia. There are lots of options for Lecom students to choose from.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Lecom was my first choice. I couldn't be happier with my selection. I Lecom! (Ask me next week in the middle of 5 exams, and I may not give you the same answer!!!)
nope, that's not it...
it's nice to see someone enjoying that place... I myself never realized how awesome my undergraduate education, professors, facilities were until I got to LECOM...
I hear a lot of comments like that from LDP students. It's just one more reason that I'm glad that I chose PBL.
I agree with Homer and I am a PBL student...the grades are made up, I mean we have 30% curves, because "no one fails PBL!" I laugh everytime the K man says as long as you try hard you pass.
LECOM is tolerable at best!
Right on Bacmedic
What the hell is the difference what your grades are when it comes down to it...the only people who will look at that would be program directors for residency programs, and at that point you will be being compared to others who only get pass/fail grades.
Also like sddoc said, its no secret that some people are not allowed to sit for boards. This is told to us right out. Shady? Yeah, maybe, but its better than just kicking the people who fail systems out of school altogether, the way I see it.
Pick the school you like best and don't listen to any of us, we are all way too jaded at this point to be objective.
I am not complaining about the curves, I don't think there are many medical schools where I would be maintaining a 99% average, which is even better since we are now being ranked against the LDPers. I think it will look great for residencies. I just think it's a shame that they continue to pass people through PBL without making them retake tests or have checks in the system to make sure they are understanding the material.
There is one PBLer in my group who thinks the Thyroid produces WBCs and that when one has CHF all their blood pools into their feet and does not return to the heart. There are probably 5/40 who think like this. Things like these are alarming to me and yet they are allowed to pass because it would look poorly on the program if they did not, remember nobody fails PBL!
I don't think things are shady either, we also were told right up front that they ask people to not sit for the boards. I only hope they enforce it on certain people in my PBL group.
Listen to yourselves. You should be ashamed of yourselves for getting on this board and trash-talking your school with hearsay (Oh I heard this from so and so...blah blah blah) in most cases. The original poster asked for a comparison of the schools, not a LECOM-bashing contest. It's no wonder people have bad thoughts about LECOM when they come on these boards and hear all of you people put down your own school! Each school definitely has imperfections and ways to improve. And stop with the pathway-bashing (there's more to learning than the highest board scores). Each person is in a different pathway because that ideally suits his/her learning style (it's not a perfect process). A PBL person shouldn't necessarily LIKE sitting in a lecture because that's not their preferred learning style.
To the OP...If you would like an honest assessment of LECOM-LDP without the trash, please PM me and I'd be glad to offer you my advice. I didn't apply to NYCOM so I don't know much about it. My roommate was accepted to both and chose LECOM, so I can tell you his thoughts. Good luck in the process. It will ultimately come down to where you feel you'll get the best education with the best environment to suit you.
LECOM bashing aside...
I interviewed at a handful of schools and in the process noticed that LECOM students were the most miserable. I never interviewed at NYCOM so I can't speak on that.
My advice to original poster: go where you personally will be happiest, LECOM and NYCOM are day and night when it comes to living environment, housing, cost, etc. The academics is tough enough in medical school you don't need to be dealing with politics or living situations/social life issues on top of all that. Also, if you're a country bumpkin I'd say NYC (well close) might not be for you, but if you're a big city person then Erie might be out.
What you get out of your education is 90% you and 10% your professors. You're going to get a good education no matter what and in the end we all cram for the boards out of the same set of books.
I've turned away people from LECOM that were debating, it's shameful I know, but the truth is what matters most. We're all welcome to our opinions and I'm not going to lie about how things are. PM me if you want to talk about it more.
I'm done with this thread, I've said my peace. Good luck to the original poster, enjoy your acceptances, and never forget that having to choose between two med schools, no matter what two they are, is always a win-win situation.
Don't forget about the Florida campus!
Sorry Homer that you didn't pick the right school. Not everyone at LECOM shares those same ideas...Some of us did make the right decision by coming to LECOM
Thanks njdo. You couldn't have put it better. My thought is that those students who hate Lecom wanted to go somewhere else originally. Not everyone fits with the administration, but Lecom is a great place with a great education. Quite honestly, you get out of medical school exactly what you put into it. Ask most Lecom students, and they'll tell you that they are happy. Ask most Nycom students, and I'm sure you'll get the same answer. (Unless it's the night before a test, and then we all hate school.)
To the OP... Good luck with your choice and congratulations for being accepted to 2 schools. I know lots of people who would love to have your dilemma.
Since you are already a 2nd year student at NYCOM maybe you can give me a better idea of what kind of housing opportunities are available at NYCOM? I will be joining NYCOM in Aug 04. The admissions office has not mailed out anything yet and I am worried that all the 'good' housing will be taken before I get there. I live in NJ and have not visited NYCOM since my intervie in Jan 04.
Please let me know the names of places where I can start inquiring about housing on my own. Hope to hear from you soon.
There are a couple of ways to go about looking for housing. The easiest way is to call a broker and have them find you a place. It's fast and easy, you won't have to worry about all the good apartments being taken. The downside is, brokers are expensive. The other way is to access the web board at NYCOM. You can call admissions and they will hook you up with the person you need to speak with to set up access. There are many of us second years who are moving into the city closer to our rotations and giving up the Long Island apartments. Just check the web board for that.
I personally live in Queens, so I'm not the best person to ask about Long Island apartment specifics. Good luck!
Oh, to the person who asked about how I got the research position; I literally called the ophthalmology departments of every medical school in NYC. I explained to them who I was, and where I went to school. Then I asked if they allowed students from outside institutions to participate in research. There are 6 medical schools in the city (not including Stony Brook on LI), only one department has to say yes. Many of the other medical school in NY have very organized research programs for their students who are interested in a particular field. All you have to do is ask. The worst someone can say is NO. But, let me give everyone a word of advice.... If you land a research position at a big institution, WORK YOUR ASS OFF!!! Not only will it make you look good, it will also help to put aside any negative thoughts some people may have about osteopathic medical students. Good luck!!