Let me show you the true cost of going to an expensive private school

[Awarara]

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These school expenses are getting so ridiculous. I didn't realize tuition+fees for these schools are 100,000 dollars. Let me show you just how much this costs if you go to a school like this.

Income: $200,000
After taxes: ~$140,000
Loans: 550k with 6% interest

15 year payoff: $4,600 monthly or $55,000 yearly into loans. That means you have $85,000 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $115,000 salary for the next 15 years of your life

10 year payoff: $6,100 monthly or $73,200 yearly into loans. That means you have $66,800 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $90,000 salary for the next 10 years of your life

Let's change the income to make it a little lower

Income: $150,000
After taxes: ~$105,000
Loans: 550k with 6% interest

15 year payoff: $4,600 monthly or $55,000 yearly into loans. That means you have $50,000 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $66,000 salary for the next 15 years of your life

10 year payoff: $6,100 monthly or $73,200 yearly into loans. That means you have $31,800 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $40,000 salary for the next 10 years of your life

TLDR:
If your income is $150,000, you will be spending your next 15 years making the equivalent of $66,000 (lol), or your next 10 years making the equivalent of $40,000 (lol)
If your income is $200,000, you will be spending your next 15 years making the equivalent of $115,000, or your next 10 years making the equivalent of $90,000

Hope this helps you guys visualize the impact of high dental school loans. Just wait till you see the calculations for these graduates who go onto expensive perio and orthodontic residencies lol.

 

[Streax1]

This would probably be better served in the pre-dent forum as most members here are either current students or already graduated. A great breakdown though!

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[Cold Front]

These school expenses are getting so ridiculous. I didn't realize tuition+fees for these schools are 100,000 dollars. Let me show you just how much this costs if you go to a school like this.

Income: $200,000
After taxes: ~$140,000
Loans: 550k with 6% interest

15 year payoff: $4,600 monthly or $55,000 yearly into loans. That means you have $85,000 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $115,000 salary for the next 15 years of your life

10 year payoff: $6,100 monthly or $73,200 yearly into loans. That means you have $66,800 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $90,000 salary for the next 10 years of your life

Let's change the income to make it a little lower

Income: $150,000
After taxes: ~$105,000
Loans: 550k with 6% interest

15 year payoff: $4,600 monthly or $55,000 yearly into loans. That means you have $50,000 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $66,000 salary for the next 15 years of your life

10 year payoff: $6,100 monthly or $73,200 yearly into loans. That means you have $31,800 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $40,000 salary for the next 10 years of your life

TLDR:
If your income is $150,000, you will be spending your next 15 years making the equivalent of $66,000 (lol), or your next 10 years making the equivalent of $40,000 (lol)
If your income is $200,000, you will be spending your next 15 years making the equivalent of $115,000, or your next 10 years making the equivalent of $90,000

Hope this helps you guys visualize the impact of high dental school loans. Just wait till you see the calculations for these graduates who go onto expensive perio and orthodontic residencies lol.

It’s refreshing to see this feedback and the reality of paying off $500k+ in student loans. Those who carry close to $1M are paying twice as much in monthly repayments - about $10-15k (post tax) a month, which is equivalent to an associate dentist income on its own.

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[Osminog]

Why do private dental schools have drastically higher tuitions than private medical schools? For example, the medical school at Boston University has a $63K/year tuition, while the dental school has an $80K/year tuition. What gives?

 

[Anondds87]

This is great. Definitely post this where presents can see. It would be awesome 5o are a comparison made with someone who does a business/engineering degree or something and starts earning sooner and gets raises for the next 10 years

 

[P7898]

Why do private dental schools have drastically higher tuitions than private medical schools? For example, the medical school at Boston University has a $63K/year tuition, while the dental school has an $80K/year tuition. What gives?

Dental clinics are privately ran within the school. Hospitals, even private ones, have more funding.

 

[GoDental101]

Dental clinics are privately ran within the school. Hospitals, even private ones, have more funding.

That’s not true for every school. Many states provide funding for their state school.

 

[P7898]

That’s not true for every school. Many states provide funding for their state school.

Correct; like my state school. However they do not profit well so the tuition makes up for the decreased profits because most of the patients are Medicaid.

 

[charlestweed]

This is a very accurate analysis for a dentist who plans to work for the same boss for the next 10-15 years. He'll be just like an optometrist or pharmacist who works at Costco and Walmart....no salary increase....salary hits the ceiling. If he is a traditional student and starts working at 26, he should pay off the loan by the age of 36-41. And by the time he reaches his 50th birthday, many of his engineer friends will get laid off and struggle to find new jobs. He continues to earn 6-figure income. If he is willing to take risk to open his own dental office, the sky is the limit.

My wife and I owed $450k in student loans and the required minimun monthly payment was around $4500/month. Some loan terms were 10-year and some were 20-year. There were like 20 different loans. We tried to pay off the small $10-15k loans first. By getting rid of these smaller loans, our total loan amount was reduced by half in just 2-3 years and the required monthly payments were also reduced by half. With smaller required monthly loan repayment amounts, we were able to upgrade to a bigger house. And when we sold this 2nd bigger house for a very nice profit of almost $200k, we used it to pay off the entire student loan. After 5 years of hard work to pay off the student loans, my wife slowed down a little bit. I continued to work 6 days/week to pay off our business loans, to save for the down payments on the investment properties, to save for our kids' college education....and to pay for the 2 leased German cars😀. Currently, I work 33 hours/week (which is considered to be a lot by most of my ortho colleagues)...22 days/month.... 3 Saturdays and 3 Sundays (8am-11:30am) every month.

 

[artist2022]

Moving to pre-dental so predents know the reality of signing away into a life of debt!

 

[princeafrica]

about $10-15k (post tax) a month, which is equivalent to an associate dentist income on its own.

lets take a moment of silence for this comment

 

[princeafrica]

Why do private dental schools have drastically higher tuitions than private medical schools? For example, the medical school at Boston University has a $63K/year tuition, while the dental school has an $80K/year tuition. What gives?

I also think Medical schools are better at attracting donors than dental schools. Ex. NYU

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

These school expenses are getting so ridiculous. I didn't realize tuition+fees for these schools are 100,000 dollars. Let me show you just how much this costs if you go to a school like this.

Income: $200,000
After taxes: ~$140,000
Loans: 550k with 6% interest

15 year payoff: $4,600 monthly or $55,000 yearly into loans. That means you have $85,000 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $115,000 salary for the next 15 years of your life

10 year payoff: $6,100 monthly or $73,200 yearly into loans. That means you have $66,800 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $90,000 salary for the next 10 years of your life

Let's change the income to make it a little lower

Income: $150,000
After taxes: ~$105,000
Loans: 550k with 6% interest

15 year payoff: $4,600 monthly or $55,000 yearly into loans. That means you have $50,000 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $66,000 salary for the next 15 years of your life

10 year payoff: $6,100 monthly or $73,200 yearly into loans. That means you have $31,800 left over each year.
This is the equivalent of a person with $40,000 salary for the next 10 years of your life

TLDR:
If your income is $150,000, you will be spending your next 15 years making the equivalent of $66,000 (lol), or your next 10 years making the equivalent of $40,000 (lol)
If your income is $200,000, you will be spending your next 15 years making the equivalent of $115,000, or your next 10 years making the equivalent of $90,000

Hope this helps you guys visualize the impact of high dental school loans. Just wait till you see the calculations for these graduates who go onto expensive perio and orthodontic residencies lol.

Be careful! You don’t want to frighten the predents.

Big Hoss

 

[P7898]

Frighten them with the truth.

 

[deleted903013]

Be careful! You don’t want to frighten the predents.

View attachment 291285

Big Hoss

Something tells me there are still a healthy number of pre dents who believe dentistry is their "passion" and won't care about debt slavery until they start making payments unfortunately.

 

[ToothJockey]

Something tells me there are still a healthy number of pre dents who believe dentistry is their "passion" and won't care about debt slavery until they start making payments unfortunately.

It's our fault honestly. We always tell everyone, don't pursue a career for the money. And that is true, don't pursue a career solely for the money, but also don't disregard the money because it is a significant factor. It's good to have a passion for dentistry, but if that passion costs you 600k, maybe it's time to find a different passion...

Most pre-dents (me included) have never held a "real" job. We don't know the true value of money. Face it, a lot of us are from sheltered backgrounds. Oh boy are some people in for a rude awakening. People who've been out in the real world know the true cost of 600k with 7% interest.

 

[deleted903013]

It's our fault honestly. We always tell everyone, don't pursue a career for the money. And that is true, don't pursue a career solely for the money, but also don't disregard the money because it is a significant factor. It's good to have a passion for dentistry, but if that passion costs you 600k, maybe it's time to find a different passion...

I'm 25 now. I look back at when I was 22 and realize I was a total idiot (at least much more so than I am now). I was naive and had no concept of money. Young people make mistakes and are more idealistic than realistic. The pre frontal cortex doesn't even finish developing until someone is 25. This issue is, taking out six figures in loans is a mistake you can't undo. You have to pay it back. For instance, I was very passionate about research and almost did a phd. Had I realized mid way through there were little job prospects with a phd (which is true), I could've ended with a masters and started something new with no debt. Sadly, these kids don't have a reset button and will be stuck in debt slavery for quite some time.

Most pre-dents (me included) have never held a "real" job. We don't know the true value of money. Face it, a lot of us are from sheltered backgrounds. Oh boy are some people in for a rude awakening. People who've been out in the real world know the true cost of 600k with 7% interest.

Yeah I worked full time for a year before dental school. Seeing how much money I was losing to taxes, social security, and the undergrad loans I took out really put into perspective at least a minimal concept of work and debt. It was while I was working that I wisely decided I would only go to my state school.

 

[AONLINE]

I'm 25 now. I look back at when I was 22 and realize I was a total idiot (at least much more so than I am now). I was naive and had no concept of money. Young people make mistakes and are more idealistic than realistic. The pre frontal cortex doesn't even finish developing until someone is 25. This issue is, taking out six figures in loans is a mistake you can't undo. You have to pay it back. For instance, I was very passionate about research and almost did a phd. Had I realized mid way through there were little job prospects with a phd (which is true), I could've ended with a masters and started something new with no debt. Sadly, these kids don't have a reset button and will be stuck in debt slavery for quite some time.

Yeah I worked full time for a year before dental school. Seeing how much money I was losing to taxes, social security, and the undergrad loans I took out really put into perspective at least a minimal concept of work and debt. It was while I was working that I wisely decided I would only go to my state school.

Do you ever think that getting a PhD instead of pursuing dental school might end up being the better decision for your future finance? You have zero tuition and even get paid to do the PhD. It might take a few years but eventually you’ll get a 6-figure salary with job security.


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[deleted903013]

Do you ever think that getting a PhD instead of pursuing dental school might end up being the better decision for your future finance? You have zero tuition and even get paid to do the PhD. It might take a few years but eventually you’ll get a 6-figure salary with job security.


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Job market for phd's is abysmal. I don't know why you think you're guaranteed a six figure job with job security because you definitely are not.

 

[Dr Dimbsa]

Job market for phd's is abysmal. I don't know why you think you're guaranteed a six figure job with job security because you definitely are not.

If you're referring to the job market for PhD's in the sciences, this is far from true. However, the best job market is in big biomedical metro areas such as San Francisco and Boston. If you're willing to move to these areas, big pharma and start up biotechs are struggling to fill positions. If you have a PhD in some bio/chem field you are highly marketable.

 

[deleted903013]

If you're referring to the job market for PhD's in the sciences, this is far from true. However, the best job market is in big biomedical metro areas such as San Francisco and Boston. If you're willing to move to these areas, big pharma and start up biotechs are struggling to fill positions. If you have a PhD in some bio/chem field you are highly marketable.

I'm talking about molecular biology. I think a lot of it depends on where you went and what your research is in. There is a glut of phd's on the market so it is definitely competitive and I would guess the jobs you're referring to that are unfilled are extremely niche because 38% of biology PhD's do not have a job lined up upon graduation. I remember reading that PhD's were taking their PhD off their resume because they were overqualified for every position. I've seen enough unemployed biology phd's where I was worried. If you go to a good program and have a good subfield I'm sure you'd be able to find a job, but I don't believe job security is too high.

 

[Blueshirts]

Job security is super important, nothing worst than being older, with your kids in school, and getting fired/replaced by someone cheaper, then having to spend the next year before being able to be working in a new job because it takes so long to get hired the more high profile your job position is. I was thinking you were going to say job security, it's definitely a good long term decision you made, I would have done the same, if in the same position.

 

[Life of Pablo]

Why do private dental schools have drastically higher tuitions than private medical schools? For example, the medical school at Boston University has a $63K/year tuition, while the dental school has an $80K/year tuition. What gives?

It's because the overhead to run a dental school is much more than a medical school. When med students start going on rotations their 3rd year, they just send them to the hospital - no charge for the school and therefore less tuition. When dental students start seeing patients their 3rd year, where do they send them? To the school itself, so they have to provide the students with all the resources (chairs, supplies, faculty etc), which reflects a higher tuition.

 

[ToothJockey]

Here's something interesting I found. If you look at the numbers, the expenditures for dental schools are rising about as fast as their revenues. And over the years tuition is making up a larger portion of their revenue. Especially when it comes to private schools, in 2017 tuition makes up 62% of their revenues compared to 49% in 2007.

What do I make of this? Well I feel like if these expensive private schools see a drop in enrollment due to tuition, they won't be able to stay profitable anymore and will be forced to close down. That's probably why these private dental schools are so costly, they literally need the money lmao!! It's gonna backfire eventually when students can't afford their schools.

Thoughts?

 

[Anondds87]

I think a few things would happen before schools closed down.

Firstly, the drop in applicants would result in less "attractive" applicants being accepted, it will be a looong time before the schools cant fill all their spots.

Secondly, I imagine a huge portion of dental school expenses are administration etc things that arent 100% necessary and are only costing so much because money is flowing in. Kind of like when the recession hit law firms really looked at their business to find ways to cut expenses - they found way too many people were overpaid but it kind of went overlooked as the companies kept amassing huge profits. I would bet most of the money is currently fly going to administration positions that arent really necessary.

So once there was concern of not being so profitable the university would look within and start cutting such high administrative overheads rather than start losing money

 

[ToothJockey]

I think a few things would happen before schools closed down.

Firstly, the drop in applicants would result in less "attractive" applicants being accepted, it will be a looong time before the schools cant fill all their spots.

Secondly, I imagine a huge portion of dental school expenses are administration etc things that arent 100% necessary and are only costing so much because money is flowing in. Kind of like when the recession hit law firms really looked at their business to find ways to cut expenses - they found way too many people were overpaid but it kind of went overlooked as the companies kept amassing huge profits. I would bet most of the money is currently fly going to administration positions that arent really necessary.

So once there was concern of not being so profitable the university would look within and start cutting such high administrative overheads rather than start losing money

All your points are true and valid, however the same thing occured in the 1970s-80s, and dental schools began closing down. It's because application numbers tanked, and it wasn't even due to debt it was due to stagnating income. Today we have both high debt and stagnating income. It's happening in law right now, schools are closing, class sizes reduced, all because applicant numbers went down. These schools could have easily been accepting any hobo off the street who wants to be a lawyer, but instead they closed down.

 

[Blueshirts]

Here's something interesting I found. If you look at the numbers, the expenditures for dental schools are rising about as fast as their revenues. And over the years tuition is making up a larger portion of their revenue. Especially when it comes to private schools, in 2017 tuition makes up 62% of their revenues compared to 49% in 2007.

What do I make of this? Well I feel like if these expensive private schools see a drop in enrollment due to tuition, they won't be able to stay profitable anymore and will be forced to close down. That's probably why these private dental schools are so costly, they literally need the money lmao!! It's gonna backfire eventually when students can't afford their schools.

Thoughts?

Good catch, we were talking about this in the other thread.

 

[dmillie01]

Don't worry everyone will just hop on REPAYE and ignore their growing balance until the student loan bubble bursts or we vote in a socialist or jesus comes back.