long medical study for females

Get help with your application

Use all the free resources available to you from SDN: articles, guides, expert advising, forums discussions, and school research.

selenaharvard24

Full Member
10+ Year Member
Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
Hey everyone.

I am a high school freshman, and I'm going to be a sophomore after summer vac. Now, I am planning to study medicine in the states, although ill be an international student. That is not the problem though. My parents believe in the notion that "females should not spend too much time on education"- they believe girls should just finish college and get married as soon as possible. I do not believe in this idea, I am very ambitious, and I hope to be a cardio surgeon.

Can anyone advice me on how to change their mind? I really need help, and your advice could be really helpful. Thank you!!!!!!!!!!🙂
 
Hey,

I'm happy you posted this question because I was too scared to do so. My opinion is that yes of course females can go through medical school but, there's a reason why some give it a second thought. My family told me to become a physician assistant instead because if I had kids it wouldn't be fair to them plus i'd have them at a really late age. I'm just a teenager so I don't know what to say to that.

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=361994
 
Last edited:
It's not easy to change parents and their way of thinking easily, just keep telling them you want to be a doctor and why you want to be a doctor over time they will get used to the idea of their daughter being a doctor.

EN
 
Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
when people ask my mother what i'm in school for she says 'To become a doctor' even though she'd rather i not do that. I guess she's used to it like Electronegative said.
 
Hey everyone.

I am a high school freshman, and I'm going to be a sophomore after summer vac. Now, I am planning to study medicine in the states, although ill be an international student. That is not the problem though. My parents believe in the notion that "females should not spend too much time on education"- they believe girls should just finish college and get married as soon as possible. I do not believe in this idea, I am very ambitious, and I hope to be a cardio surgeon.

Can anyone advice me on how to change their mind? I really need help, and your advice could be really helpful. Thank you!!!!!!!!!!🙂

Ultimately, you don't need to change their minds. Try and get a support system that will help you stay on the path that YOU want, not your parents. Find mentors in your teachers and get advice from them. Find role models for what you want to do, and get advice from them on how to succeed. If any of your science or math teachers are female, they might be a great resource. Or, if you have a female primary care physician, ask her during your appointment instead of wasting time on your routine physical exam 😉 Make sure you have friends that are supportive also, and if possible, have them be from more liberal families than your own 🙂 In other words, be as independent of your parents and their viewpoints as possible.

Your parents may be able to control you through college, if they pay for it, but remember -- you don't have to do ANYTHING that your parents tell you to, as long as they're not giving you money. That way, they don't have leverage. A lot of people pay for medical school themselves, so if you like, you can go through college, graduate, apply to medical school, and your parents can't do jack about it.

If they love you unconditionally, they will accept what you want to do with your life.
 
Thank you for your insight and advice. But the problem is that my parents will always pay for my education at all levels. My point is that I want to achieve whatever I want regardless of the fact that they'll always pay for my education. To be more direct, I do not believe in not finishing my education properly, to the best of my desire, just in order to get married quickly.

Do you know what I can do in this case?
 
If your parents will not support you through college and med school, there will always be financial aid. While loans aren't any fun, I think it's worse to go through life never reaching your potential because of the expectations of someone else.
 
If your parents will not support you through college and med school, there will always be financial aid. While loans aren't any fun, I think it's worse to go through life never reaching your potential because of the expectations of someone else.

It can be really really tough to get loans as an international student coming from a family that, while unwilling, is financially able to pay tuition. Of course, depending on what country you're coming from, some schools seeking to "increase diversity" may be willing to support you financially, or at least make loans available.
 
Thank you for your insight and advice. But the problem is that my parents will always pay for my education at all levels. My point is that I want to achieve whatever I want regardless of the fact that they'll always pay for my education. To be more direct, I do not believe in not finishing my education properly, to the best of my desire, just in order to get married quickly.

Do you know what I can do in this case?

When you turn 18, do you have the opportunity to become a naturalized citizen? Or dual-citizenship.. anything to qualify for financial aid?

If indeed there is no way to qualify for federal student aid in the US, I suppose you can only hope to persuade your parents to accept your decision. But that is 8 years away.. a lot can change in 8 years. I am 23 now and 8 years has seen my parents go almost 180 in terms of what they accept and approve of me doing.
 
This is a difficult question not because of the whole parent thing but because there is a huge cultural component that comes into play here. I don't agree with a lot of people that say that you should do what you want because it's your life. You are obviously an immigrant and although I don't know where you are from but many countries NOT the US are very family centered, not as individualistic as American culture. Being one myself I know the balancing act that you need to pursue in order to fulfill your dreams while at the same time remaining true to and respectful of your parent's decision. So, it's not as easy as just saying "I'm doing my own thing".

There are several things I want to address first before giving you advice.

1. You are only a sophomore in high school. Although I applaud you for having high goals, you are still a far from being in a position where you can realistically say "this is truly for me".

2. You want to do cardiothoracic surgery. This is a surgical field, and like many surgical fields are male dominated for good reason. The hours you put into the path to become a CT surgeon is VERY long. Not saying that women cant do it but women also have to deal with their internal clocks of wanting kids and then having to take care of those kids/family. Considering that residency you'll be working 80 hours per week MINIMUM, how would you deal with kids or if you get pregnant. You are still young and maybe this thought has not even crossed your mind but should definitely be considered. On a side note, CT surgery is a dying field as people tend to want non-invasive procedures and cardiologists/interventional radiologists are taking over so by the time you enter the field you may not have much to work with.

So my suggestions:

1. You should continue to work hard and towards your goal but gently remind your parents of your passions. Once you're in college and/or applying to med school you will have a stronger stance to back up your goal. By that time they will see whether or not you're serious and may begin to understand that this is truly what you're going to be doing. Again, talk to them and address their concerns but your actions in school will speak much larger than whatever you may say.

2. Your parents have legit concern here. You should consider that one day you may want children. You may take it as them holding you back but if you really think about it they're looking out for your future so that you don't pick a wrong career that will wreck your family life. You need to address those concerns directly. Talk about the opportunities that are open here in the US vs your original country. But the best way is probably to say that women are and have been able to do residency AND have families too albeit VERY HARD in surgical specialties.

Again, a lot of the issue you're facing with your parents I think stems from your age. Knowing immigrant parents they're not going to stop talking about it but you need to just grit your teeth and bare it until you're in a position of maturity and credibility to convince them you're serious. But another aspect of immigrant parents that is great is they will support your decision once they see your position because you are family. I can related as I went through a similar thing (I'm not a girl though). As a kid I couldn't see where they are coming from but if anything I learned as I got older is that your parents consider possibilities that you never really thought about because they've probably went through something similar also. It can be frustrating but just keep with it.

You may PM me if you have more questions or need someone who've been through the long process to bounce ideas off of.

Also, I want to address those that are suggesting OP take financial aid and be independent rather than have her parents pay for her college. I just want to say that that is the most ridiculous thing ever. Why would anyone want to go into thousands/hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt just to do "whatever they want". You'll be paying that money back ON TOP of your medical school loans to. You are sacrificing your short-term independence to be long term indentured servitude to student loans.
 
Also, I want to address those that are suggesting OP take financial aid and be independent rather than have her parents pay for her college. I just want to say that that is the most ridiculous thing ever. Why would anyone want to go into thousands/hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt just to do "whatever they want". You'll be paying that money back ON TOP of your medical school loans to. You are sacrificing your short-term independence to be long term indentured servitude to student loans.

I have immigrant parents (or, anyway, one of them is), and though I do understand that cultural differences exist, and while I am strongly aware of the pressure for things like filial piety, I do think that lines have to be drawn somewhere. It *should* be an option to go your own way if you care about something enough. Obviously that decision comes with major drawbacks. But have you ever had your parents tell you that they will hate you if you marry someone from a different race or culture? I know people who have been in that situation. The ones that went along with their parents are absolutely miserable. I have an Indian background -- I most certainly understand the pressures involved.

Paying for your own stuff should definitely be considered if the situation is extreme enough. I will take paying back loans for years upon years over having a life that I can't live according to what I believe. Obviously, this is an extreme reaction to an extreme situation. But to dismiss it out of hand is premature, I think. I know people whose parents really are out to get them. Or worse, have abusive or negligent parents. Is it okay to do whatever your parents tell you to then?

Anyway, I was never advocating for her paying for college herself, just medical school. A lot of people do in the first place, without having problems with their parents. My parents quite possibly could put me through part of medical school, or at least help me out with application fees, etc. But paying for all of this myself is one of my ways of showing them that I appreciate everything they've done for me over the years. They have their retirement to worry about.
 
Everybody's situation is different. Everybody has their own tolerance level. Everybody sets and determines their own future; how much they are willing to deal with before fighting back. Do I know the OP? Do I know her parents? Do I know the relationship she has with her parents? The answer to that is no. The OP only said that her parents believe in such and such ... now you can extrapolate that to "they are strong arming me to do what the want" or "they are nagging me about it but ultimately support my decision". I chose to go with the latter. The OP is very young and her end goal of being a CT surgeon is very, very, very, VERY far from being accomplished. She may enter college and decide that she wants to do something else, she may not even get admitted into medical school or she may continue to pursue being a CT surgeon. That's why I advocated a wait and see approach. Hey but in the end you do what you have to do. I'm on my path, you follow yours.
 
There are a lot of different issues here. Fortunately, you (OP) have time to work them all out.

Firstly, there is your own situation. Congratulations on your ambition to become a doctor, a surgeon and to specialise as a surgeon. That level of ambition will serve you well in life. The only thing I would add is that people and their interests can change over time, so don't blind yourself to the other possibilities for careers which will come to you and which could also satisfy your ambition.

Secondly, there is the attitude of your parents. You've already got a head start in that your parents think you should go to college. Too many girls have parents who think girls should not (or need not) be educated, and will not support them in getting an education. (Perhaps these parents don't realise that educated women have healthier and better educated children, who then have better life chances. What parent wouldn't want that for their grandchildren?)

I would suggest not trying to tackle your parent's attitudes head on at this stage. You should be able to do everything you need to in order to get to college on the medical track (there's lots of advice about this elsewhere on SDN) without getting into a pitched battle with your parents. Their views may in any case change over time. If you do want to start bringing your parents round to the idea of your being a doctor, you might for instance present becoming a doctor as one of a range of options for you (no more than the truth, at the moment). But you know your parents and their views best, so advice from a stranger over the internet over how to handle your relationship with them should be considered very carefully, and even if you think that advice is helpful you should tailor what you do as a result to your specific circumstances. (At its most basic, one of the most important things for you is to keep a good relationship with your parents, at least until you are legally an adult and can safety fend for yourself.)

Thirdly, there is the question of financing your study. Your posts suggest that your parents would be prepared to fully fund your undergraduate studies. Again, that puts you a long way ahead of where a lot of other people are. By the time you have completed your undergraduate studies and learnt whether or not you will be able to get into medical school (I'm assuming here that you follow the US model of medical education), you will be an adult and should have options for funding your own studies, including working for a while and/or getting loans. By this stage, I would hope that you would not be letting your parent's preferences, or unwilllingness to contribute financially, prevent you from doing something which is both personally rewarding and makes a valuable contribution to society.

Finally, getting married used to be almost essential for a woman in any society for economic and social reasons, and children followed almost inevitably. In large parts of the world that default position is no longer the case: marriage and children are options for women, not necessities. You almost certainly have that choice, too. Like all choices, it needs to be exercised with careful consideration, and without allowing the expectations and assumptions of others to determine what is right for you.

Good luck.
 
Also, I want to address those that are suggesting OP take financial aid and be independent rather than have her parents pay for her college. I just want to say that that is the most ridiculous thing ever. Why would anyone want to go into thousands/hundreds of thousands of dollars of debt just to do "whatever they want". You'll be paying that money back ON TOP of your medical school loans to. You are sacrificing your short-term independence to be long term indentured servitude to student loans.

It depends on the severity of the situation. I was faced with a very severe situation, and had to choose between working/taking out a few loans for college, or staying home and letting other people dictate what I would do and who I would marry. I could never live the life that my family wanted for me and remain happy or sane, and honestly, I ended up with very few loans anyway because I was willing to take a job. It's not ridiculous to choose to be independent--nor is it ridiculous to stay, if you are comfortable doing so. The OP would have to judge that for herself. I cannot judge how severe or livable her situation would be. She should know that no matter her decision, she has options. That's all I was trying to convey.
 
Everybody's situation is different. Everybody has their own tolerance level. Everybody sets and determines their own future; how much they are willing to deal with before fighting back. Do I know the OP? Do I know her parents? Do I know the relationship she has with her parents? The answer to that is no. The OP only said that her parents believe in such and such ... now you can extrapolate that to "they are strong arming me to do what the want" or "they are nagging me about it but ultimately support my decision". I chose to go with the latter. The OP is very young and her end goal of being a CT surgeon is very, very, very, VERY far from being accomplished. She may enter college and decide that she wants to do something else, she may not even get admitted into medical school or she may continue to pursue being a CT surgeon. That's why I advocated a wait and see approach. Hey but in the end you do what you have to do. I'm on my path, you follow yours.

I agree with you wholeheartedly. I just wanted to flesh out the opposing viewpoint so that the OP could see both sides 🙂
 
Advertisement - Members don't see this ad
2. You want to do cardiothoracic surgery. This is a surgical field, and like many surgical fields are male dominated for good reason. The hours you put into the path to become a CT surgeon is VERY long. Not saying that women cant do it but women also have to deal with their internal clocks of wanting kids and then having to take care of those kids/family. Considering that residency you'll be working 80 hours per week MINIMUM, how would you deal with kids or if you get pregnant. You are still young and maybe this thought has not even crossed your mind but should definitely be considered. On a side note, CT surgery is a dying field as people tend to want non-invasive procedures and cardiologists/interventional radiologists are taking over so by the time you enter the field you may not have much to work with.

I can't really speak for CT surgery programs specifically as I don't have much experience, but I've known multiple female surgery and OB-GYN residents get pregnant, so it's not impossible.

Also, if your program works you a minimum of 80hrs per week, that program is in danger of losing it's accreditation. You are only supposed to work at maximum 320 hours over a 4-week period. Do some programs violate this? Sure, but that doesn't mean they're going to get away with it indefinitely.

Most of the other stuff I agree with, including the part about CT surgery coming under fire. It's one of those things that sound cooler than it is (I want to do cardiothoracic surgery!).

The finance issue is personal preference. Let's face it, you're going to be financially dependent on somebody, either your parents or the loan company. Which direction you go is up to you and specific to your situation and relationship.
 
Reply to Ischemic


So are you advising me to go in the direction of my parents, and not do cardiothoracic surgery just because I am female? I just wanted to know the theme of your message.
 
Reply to Ischemic


So are you advising me to go in the direction of my parents, and not do cardiothoracic surgery just because I am female? I just wanted to know the theme of your message.

😕 Uhh... I don't know where you got the idea that I'm telling you not to do CT surgery. Why don't you reread my posts.
 
I'm sorry about that, and I didn't mean to offend you. But seriously I didn't get the theme of your message. Once again, I'm sorry about misunderstanding you.
 
Interesting...

The theme of my post is that you are young and there's no point in rushing to make your decisions. You don't have to fight your parents off and gain "independence" immediately and you don't have to sit there and let them run your life either. For the time being since you're only 16/17 you're going to have to listen to your parents like it or not but you should continue striving for your dream and letting your parents know your stance. Once the time comes where you're going to have to make a decision and your parents STILL don't get it then you should continue to pursue your dream and be independent of them. The road for you is still very long and things can happen which are unexpected that may change your perspective of things. Always consider all your options/possibilities, even the negative ones, and choose a path accordingly that minimizes the doors that will be closed to you while maximizing your ability to achieve your goals.

Furthermore, I'm giving you advice (more like broad guidelines) based on speculations since I don't know you, your parents or your relationships with them. You have to figure out what's best for you by considering ALL your options and possibilities.
 
Choosing between motherhood and a medical career is a hard choice but it can be done.

All of the immigrant female doctors/med students that I know all have family support when it comes to raising their kids. Either their mom or mother in law or aunt will come over and live with them to help with the kids.
 
I was in a similar situation myself when I first decided to go to medical school. My community did not totally support this decision and my parents were left conflicted about whether to be scared or proud for me.

I think the best thing to do is to be open and honest. Think of yourself as an ambassador for other females in your community. Express that you are not anti family and marriage, but that you believe with a realistic plan and lots of organization and support you can make this happen.

There is light at the end of this. Currently, I advise lots of other young women in similar situations. In fact, I started an organization to that effect with one of them.
 
Last edited:
Considering that residency you'll be working 80 hours per week MINIMUM, how would you deal with kids or if you get pregnant.
The 80 hour work week is the maximum allowed (on average), not the minimum threshold.