M1 Advice

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Coldplayfan123

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Hi Friends,

Finally at SDN! I'm a trad-student (22) at a state-school (allopathic) ranked in the 60s/70s on USN&WR. I've been recently trying to narrow down my specialty preference as my classmates seem to have very solidified desires. We had a dermatology lecture for a single hour last module, and I really loved it! I took UVAs medical specialty and as well as a separate medical specialty personality test, and dermatology was in my "top 5" for both. I began to look up more about the specialty, and lo and behold, I realize it's the most competitive speciality out there (ha). I had no idea. Anyway, I still haven't shadowed a dermatologist, so that's on my list.

We've had a couple of research forums at our school as well as a poster presentation by the M2s, and it seems as if research is a necessity for medical school and certainly for dermatology according to the Charting Outcomes PDF. I guess I had a few questions:

1. How did you decide between pathology and dermatology? I really enjoy what I've seen from both. I talked to my house mentor (our school has faculty assigned to every 6 students) who's a pathologist, and he told me he could see me in dermatology more than pathology, but he didn't carry on further.

2. I was really surprised by how many research publications/abstracts/reviews/etc. people have for the most competitive specialities. I have a few roommates, and all of them have 1-3 publications from undergrad, and we are all 22 and traditional. Though I have a couple years of research in undergrad, I did not come out with any publications. I was wondering if this will hinder a dermatology residency match? I figure it won't if I do a lot of deem research in medical school...but how to go about that?

3. Regarding research opportunities, I looked up some research opportunities on Google, but could only find a couple that were dermatology research opportunities. One was from American Skin, and it seemed as if you already needed a solid proposal before moving forward, but I've never even spoke to a dermatology researcher! It seems as if connections are pretty necessary in this field? In this Derm forum's stickies, I've read that connections are pretty important, but how to do this with seeming like you are sycophant.

4. My school actually has a dermatology residency of a few people per year. I feel as if the first step is to contact them, but I don't want to seem like a gunner or something. I don't want to say I was a bit dismayed by the fact dermatology is pretty competitive since we should accept the challenges facing us, but I am unsure how to go about any associated "stigmas?" Or maybe I am just incoherent right now, ha. I should probably just contact them. Perhaps the physician who gave our lecture.

5. I didn't think I'd be interested in academic medicine before I came in to medical school (just saw myself working in a rural area, actually), but I've been looking up academic medical research in dermatology and what I've been seeing is totally interesting. I was really blown away by the amount of funding Harvard's Derm dept (Harvard, I know--really not trying to sound like a "gunner" here) or Stanford for example. The kind of research these fellows are doing is fascinating. I talked to a faculty member at my school, and he said an MD/PhD isn't necessary anymore to do academic medicine anymore, which seems to corroborate what I've been seeing on the faculty pages at a lot of great schools. What do you think? I'm not terribly interested in cosmetic dermatology, but I've read that a lot dermatologist do cosmetics to "pay the bills." Is this true?

6. I know grades including Step 1 are very important (as well as AOA). I'll be trying to score pretty well on Step 1 here on out. I guess anything can happen, so I don't want to put my eggs in a single basket, but from the MCAT vs. Step 1 correlation stats I've seen, I think I *should* (jinx) be able to score the average Step 1 for a residency like dermatology.

Thanks! Sorry the text is so long. I guess what I'm asking is: what would you do in my situation? I really, really appreciate it.

Have the best day of your life!

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Hi Friends,

Finally at SDN! I'm a trad-student (22) at a state-school (allopathic) ranked in the 60s/70s on USN&WR. I've been recently trying to narrow down my specialty preference as my classmates seem to have very solidified desires. We had a dermatology lecture for a single hour last module, and I really loved it! I took UVAs medical specialty and as well as a separate medical specialty personality test, and dermatology was in my "top 5" for both. I began to look up more about the specialty, and lo and behold, I realize it's the most competitive speciality out there (ha). I had no idea. Anyway, I still haven't shadowed a dermatologist, so that's on my list.

We've had a couple of research forums at our school as well as a poster presentation by the M2s, and it seems as if research is a necessity for medical school and certainly for dermatology according to the Charting Outcomes PDF. I guess I had a few questions:

1. How did you decide between pathology and dermatology? I really enjoy what I've seen from both. I talked to my house mentor (our school has faculty assigned to every 6 students) who's a pathologist, and he told me he could see me in dermatology more than pathology, but he didn't carry on further.

2. I was really surprised by how many research publications/abstracts/reviews/etc. people have for the most competitive specialities. I have a few roommates, and all of them have 1-3 publications from undergrad, and we are all 22 and traditional. Though I have a couple years of research in undergrad, I did not come out with any publications. I was wondering if this will hinder a dermatology residency match? I figure it won't if I do a lot of deem research in medical school...but how to go about that?

3. Regarding research opportunities, I looked up some research opportunities on Google, but could only find a couple that were dermatology research opportunities. One was from American Skin, and it seemed as if you already needed a solid proposal before moving forward, but I've never even spoke to a dermatology researcher! It seems as if connections are pretty necessary in this field? In this Derm forum's stickies, I've read that connections are pretty important, but how to do this with seeming like you are sycophant.

4. My school actually has a dermatology residency of a few people per year. I feel as if the first step is to contact them, but I don't want to seem like a gunner or something. I don't want to say I was a bit dismayed by the fact dermatology is pretty competitive since we should accept the challenges facing us, but I am unsure how to go about any associated "stigmas?" Or maybe I am just incoherent right now, ha. I should probably just contact them. Perhaps the physician who gave our lecture.

5. I didn't think I'd be interested in academic medicine before I came in to medical school (just saw myself working in a rural area, actually), but I've been looking up academic medical research in dermatology and what I've been seeing is totally interesting. I was really blown away by the amount of funding Harvard's Derm dept (Harvard, I know--really not trying to sound like a "gunner" here) or Stanford for example. The kind of research these fellows are doing is fascinating. I talked to a faculty member at my school, and he said an MD/PhD isn't necessary anymore to do academic medicine anymore, which seems to corroborate what I've been seeing on the faculty pages at a lot of great schools. What do you think? I'm not terribly interested in cosmetic dermatology, but I've read that a lot dermatologist do cosmetics to "pay the bills." Is this true?

6. I know grades including Step 1 are very important (as well as AOA). I'll be trying to score pretty well on Step 1 here on out. I guess anything can happen, so I don't want to put my eggs in a single basket, but from the MCAT vs. Step 1 correlation stats I've seen, I think I *should* (jinx) be able to score the average Step 1 for a residency like dermatology.

Thanks! Sorry the text is so long. I guess what I'm asking is: what would you do in my situation? I really, really appreciate it.

Have the best day of your life!
:corny:
Dude, you just started medical school. You're right now at a 10 in intensity, you need to be at a 2.
 
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Hi Friends,

Finally at SDN! I'm a trad-student (22) at a state-school (allopathic) ranked in the 60s/70s on USN&WR. I've been recently trying to narrow down my specialty preference as my classmates seem to have very solidified desires. We had a dermatology lecture for a single hour last module, and I really loved it! I took UVAs medical specialty and as well as a separate medical specialty personality test, and dermatology was in my "top 5" for both. I began to look up more about the specialty, and lo and behold, I realize it's the most competitive speciality out there (ha). I had no idea. Anyway, I still haven't shadowed a dermatologist, so that's on my list.

We've had a couple of research forums at our school as well as a poster presentation by the M2s, and it seems as if research is a necessity for medical school and certainly for dermatology according to the Charting Outcomes PDF. I guess I had a few questions:

1. How did you decide between pathology and dermatology? I really enjoy what I've seen from both. I talked to my house mentor (our school has faculty assigned to every 6 students) who's a pathologist, and he told me he could see me in dermatology more than pathology, but he didn't carry on further.

2. I was really surprised by how many research publications/abstracts/reviews/etc. people have for the most competitive specialities. I have a few roommates, and all of them have 1-3 publications from undergrad, and we are all 22 and traditional. Though I have a couple years of research in undergrad, I did not come out with any publications. I was wondering if this will hinder a dermatology residency match? I figure it won't if I do a lot of deem research in medical school...but how to go about that?

3. Regarding research opportunities, I looked up some research opportunities on Google, but could only find a couple that were dermatology research opportunities. One was from American Skin, and it seemed as if you already needed a solid proposal before moving forward, but I've never even spoke to a dermatology researcher! It seems as if connections are pretty necessary in this field? In this Derm forum's stickies, I've read that connections are pretty important, but how to do this with seeming like you are sycophant.

4. My school actually has a dermatology residency of a few people per year. I feel as if the first step is to contact them, but I don't want to seem like a gunner or something. I don't want to say I was a bit dismayed by the fact dermatology is pretty competitive since we should accept the challenges facing us, but I am unsure how to go about any associated "stigmas?" Or maybe I am just incoherent right now, ha. I should probably just contact them. Perhaps the physician who gave our lecture.

5. I didn't think I'd be interested in academic medicine before I came in to medical school (just saw myself working in a rural area, actually), but I've been looking up academic medical research in dermatology and what I've been seeing is totally interesting. I was really blown away by the amount of funding Harvard's Derm dept (Harvard, I know--really not trying to sound like a "gunner" here) or Stanford for example. The kind of research these fellows are doing is fascinating. I talked to a faculty member at my school, and he said an MD/PhD isn't necessary anymore to do academic medicine anymore, which seems to corroborate what I've been seeing on the faculty pages at a lot of great schools. What do you think? I'm not terribly interested in cosmetic dermatology, but I've read that a lot dermatologist do cosmetics to "pay the bills." Is this true?

6. I know grades including Step 1 are very important (as well as AOA). I'll be trying to score pretty well on Step 1 here on out. I guess anything can happen, so I don't want to put my eggs in a single basket, but from the MCAT vs. Step 1 correlation stats I've seen, I think I *should* (jinx) be able to score the average Step 1 for a residency like dermatology.

Thanks! Sorry the text is so long. I guess what I'm asking is: what would you do in my situation? I really, really appreciate it.

Have the best day of your life!

1. You don't need to worry about narrowing your choice of specialty until later in med school

2. I don't recommend pursuing research until the summer AFTER your MS1 year. MS1 is all about acclimating to medical school and honoring everything in sight to give you the greatest possible flexibility in future specialty selection

3. See #2

4. I would not reach out to the department yet. There's nothing you can do yet to make a solid impression and worse, could end up getting on someone's bad side

5. I'm going to assume you are being genuine here. But the academic medicine spiel is the oldest trick in the book. We've all heard it. We've all repeated it. At this point in your career, you have no idea whether or not you want to be an academician. This is something better left unsaid until you are truly in a position to make good on it.

6. Step 1 is important but not as an MS1. Worry about the grades as an MS1 and you'll be building the foundation for a solid Step 1 score anyway

In short, your enthusiasm is admirable but unfortunately, there's not much else to MS1 beyond simply excelling in all your courses to keep all the doors open in terms of subspecialty selection. I assure you everything else will sort itself out in time
 
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5. I'm going to assume you are being genuine here. But the academic medicine spiel is the oldest trick in the book. We've all heard it. We've all repeated it. At this point in your career, you have no idea whether or not you want to be an academician. This is something better left unsaid until you are truly in a position to make good on it.
And yet every year, derm applicants say this refrain on interviews not knowing that many faculty can see right thru this.
 
I will go on a limb here and say you have a fair-to-moderate chance of matching at programs with PDs who are Coldplay fans as well. Make sure you put that on your personal statement.
 
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I will go on a limb here and say you have a fair-to-moderate chance of matching at programs with PDs who are Coldplay fans as well. Make sure you put that on your personal statement.
It could be worse, could be Nickelback.
 
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Thanks for all the replies! And I am quite the Coldplay fan. Nickelback, haven't listened to them much.

1. You don't need to worry about narrowing your choice of specialty until later in med school

2. I don't recommend pursuing research until the summer AFTER your MS1 year. MS1 is all about acclimating to medical school and honoring everything in sight to give you the greatest possible flexibility in future specialty selection

3. See #2

4. I would not reach out to the department yet. There's nothing you can do yet to make a solid impression and worse, could end up getting on someone's bad side

5. I'm going to assume you are being genuine here. But the academic medicine spiel is the oldest trick in the book. We've all heard it. We've all repeated it. At this point in your career, you have no idea whether or not you want to be an academician. This is something better left unsaid until you are truly in a position to make good on it.

6. Step 1 is important but not as an MS1. Worry about the grades as an MS1 and you'll be building the foundation for a solid Step 1 score anyway

In short, your enthusiasm is admirable but unfortunately, there's not much else to MS1 beyond simply excelling in all your courses to keep all the doors open in terms of subspecialty selection. I assure you everything else will sort itself out in time

Perhaps a better question would be: what should I do about research over the summer? I appreciate the reply. If I know I am interested in dermatology, pathology, or family medicine, shouldn't I be doing research in those fields? And if I do intend on pursuing a certain specialty, shouldn't I be trying to do research within that field? Thanks for the advice.
 
Perhaps a better question would be: what should I do about research over the summer? I appreciate the reply. If I know I am interested in dermatology, pathology, or family medicine, shouldn't I be doing research in those fields? And if I do intend on pursuing a certain specialty, shouldn't I be trying to do research within that field? Thanks for the advice.
Many students do research over the M1 summer and take part in a medical school research type program. Some do it at their own medical school if they are at a medical school that is strong in research, or somewhere else (another med school, NIH, etc.). Research is not necessary to match into Family Medicine. That doesn't mean you shouldn't do it - but it's not imperative to do so in order to match. Derm and Pathology have a lot of crossover (a.k.a. Dermatopathology) so if you're interested in both, get involved in a project that touches on both so in terms of CV you're prepared for both. The reason we are telling to slow it down a bit is bc you're just starting. Your interests could change, and also you don't want to burn out when there are other metrics that are closely looked at: preclinical/clinical grades, AOA, Step 1 score, etc. that are just as, if not more, important.
 
Thanks for all the replies! And I am quite the Coldplay fan. Nickelback, haven't listened to them much.



Perhaps a better question would be: what should I do about research over the summer? I appreciate the reply. If I know I am interested in dermatology, pathology, or family medicine, shouldn't I be doing research in those fields? And if I do intend on pursuing a certain specialty, shouldn't I be trying to do research within that field? Thanks for the advice.

You can start looking for a summer research position in the 2nd half of your MS1 year

It helps for it to be in dermatology but it doesn't have to be.

The reason I usually advise students to wait is to actually get your feet wet in school first. All the research in the world won't help if you have poor grades
 
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You can start looking for a summer research position in the 2nd half of your MS1 year

It helps for it to be in dermatology but it doesn't have to be.

The reason I usually advise students to wait is to actually get your feet wet in school first. All the research in the world won't help if you have poor grades
To add onto and agree to what asmallchild, to the lurkers out there, if you're currently an M1 right now - Derm should not even be on your radar screen. You should be concentrating on doing well in your M1 classes, maybe flipping thru First Aid a little and recognizing things in it that are covered in class (There are some people that use board review books during M1 but they do it more to hone down the stuff taught in M1 - since they are quick blurbs to cement it in your head).

If you go to a med school that is not a "true" Pass/Fail school (P/F grades with no internal grades/ranking kept) in the first 2 years, then preclinical grades are something you will have to do well on. Research is an ancillary part of your application to flesh it out. It doesn't make up for subpar grades or for subpar board scores.
 
Though I am not a dermatologist [or a doctor yet], I am an M2 student who had similar questions as you did when I first started medical school. I echo the other helpful comments that have have been said previously---school is your #1 priority as an M1. However, I find no harm in contacting your home dermatology department. You won't be seen as a gunner, and if you are, does it matter? What's wrong with liking Dermatology vs. liking Ortho, Gen. Surgery, Family Medicine, Psych, or OBGYN as an M1? From speaking to other dermatologists, it seems that they'd rather have people who are interested in derm from the beginning pursue the field, rather than those who decide to purse dermatology only because they got a a high step score and suddenly want to do something prestigious--with that said, don't disillusion yourself, as the competition to match into dermatology is intense and you really have to do well in school/boards/clinicals/extracurriculars/research if you want to best prepare yourself for admission. However, the early bird gets the worm--and if you want to do derm, at least talk to someone in your home derm department and see what they can do for you this early on.

One more thing--if your school has a Dermatology Interest Group, try getting in contact with their leadership and see how previous students were able to work with the department. They might be your best resource prior to cold-calling or emailing someone from the department.

Good luck!
 
Though I am not a dermatologist [or a doctor yet], I am an M2 student who had similar questions as you did when I first started medical school. I echo the other helpful comments that have have been said previously---school is your #1 priority as an M1. However, I find no harm in contacting your home dermatology department. You won't be seen as a gunner, and if you are, does it matter? What's wrong with liking Dermatology vs. liking Ortho, Gen. Surrgery, Family Medicine, Psych, or OBGYN as an M1? From speaking to other dermatologists, it seems that they'd rather have people who are interested in derm from the beginning pursue the field, rather than those who decide to purse dermatology only because they got a a high step score and suddenly want to do something prestigious--with that said, don't disillusion yourself, as the competition to match into dermatology is intense and you really have to do well in school/boards/clinicals/extracurriculars/research if you want to best prepare yourself for admission. However, the early bird gets the worm--and if you want to do derm, at least talk to someone in your home derm department and see what they can do for you this early on.
You couldn't be more wrong. The first thing a faculty member will ask someone who comes to them as a first semester M1 is WHY they're interested in Derm and you better have a good reason other than: great lifestyle, no call, no emergencies, and cosmetics. Being seen as a gunner by derm faculty, pretty much puts the kibosh on your chances, and they don't forget.

There are tons of applicants who are interested in Derm either right after M2 or after the completion of M3. Just bc you come to them as an M1 doesn't mean you have so sort of edge over those who don't.
 
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You couldn't be more wrong. The first thing a faculty member will ask someone who comes to them as a first semester M1 is WHY they're interested in Derm and you better have a good reason other than: great lifestyle, no call, no emergencies, and cosmetics. Being seen as a gunner by derm faculty, pretty much puts the kibosh on your chances, and they don't forget.

There are tons of applicants who are interested in Derm either right after M2 or after the completion of M3. Just bc you come to them as an M1 doesn't mean you have so sort of edge over those who don't.

I stand corrected then. I agree with @DermViser in that even when I met with my home department, I discussed at length reasons why I like dermatology and why I want to pursue this field. It's better to have an idea of what dermatology is before hand so you can articulate your interests in an educated and mature manner. But each school is different--which is why the OP should perhaps contact the Derm Interest Group at his/her school first.
 
I stand corrected then. I agree with @DermViser in that even when I met with my home department, I discussed at length reasons why I like dermatology and why I want to pursue this field. It's better to have an idea of what dermatology is before hand so you can articulate your interests in an educated and mature manner. But each school is different--which is why the OP should perhaps contact the Derm Interest Group at his/her school first.
I don't think there is anything wrong with going to Dermatology Interest Group meetings. Med students go to those all the time for many different specialties. Going to a DIG meeting doesn't mean a whole lot - although you can find which derm faculty are good mentors for students from upperclassmen. What I am saying is that if you come first semester all gung-ho about derm to a faculty member, your motives will most likely be questioned and faculty can usually tell when you're BSing them - not all faculty will be like this, but you have no way of knowing that in advance. Your efforts are much better to concentrate and excel on M1 coursework and then starting getting involved during the summer after M1.
 
Though I am not a dermatologist [or a doctor yet], I am an M2 student who had similar questions as you did when I first started medical school. I echo the other helpful comments that have have been said previously---school is your #1 priority as an M1. However, I find no harm in contacting your home dermatology department. You won't be seen as a gunner, and if you are, does it matter? What's wrong with liking Dermatology vs. liking Ortho, Gen. Surgery, Family Medicine, Psych, or OBGYN as an M1? From speaking to other dermatologists, it seems that they'd rather have people who are interested in derm from the beginning pursue the field, rather than those who decide to purse dermatology only because they got a a high step score and suddenly want to do something prestigious--with that said, don't disillusion yourself, as the competition to match into dermatology is intense and you really have to do well in school/boards/clinicals/extracurriculars/research if you want to best prepare yourself for admission. However, the early bird gets the worm--and if you want to do derm, at least talk to someone in your home derm department and see what they can do for you this early on.

One more thing--if your school has a Dermatology Interest Group, try getting in contact with their leadership and see how previous students were able to work with the department. They might be your best resource prior to cold-calling or emailing someone from the department.

Good luck!

I'm going to also disagree with this and agree with DermViser.

You want to have a reason when you contact your home department. My school had a program where M1 and M2 students are asked to take anywhere from a half day to a day off to leave the regular coursework curriculum to spend one day in a clinical situation. That would be a good opportunity to reach out to your home department. If you are interested in basic science or clinical research that your home department offers, that would be a good opportunity to reach out to your home department (perhaps sometime in the latter half of M1 to set something up for the summer after M1)

To just reach out in the middle of the year to share your interest in derm? Unlikely to be fruitful and more likely to rub someone the wrong way
 
I'm going to also disagree with this and agree with DermViser.

You want to have a reason when you contact your home department. My school had a program where M1 and M2 students are asked to take anywhere from a half day to a day off to leave the regular coursework curriculum to spend one day in a clinical situation. That would be a good opportunity to reach out to your home department. If you are interested in basic science or clinical research that your home department offers, that would be a good opportunity to reach out to your home department (perhaps sometime in the latter half of M1 to set something up for the summer after M1)

To just reach out in the middle of the year to share your interest in derm? Unlikely to be fruitful and more likely to rub someone the wrong way
The only exception I could possibly see is a basic science course that piques your interest that has a Derm tie in --- i.e. you covered skin histology, skin pathology, Microbio, Immunology, etc. as many of these can occur in M1 due to integrated curricula. Even then, you'll be asked why, and not having any clinical exposure tends to make faculty skeptical. I think that half-day program that's part of the official curriculum thru the med school, is the perfect segue to express interest. It doesn't raise eyebrows. It's like the ones who go on interviews saying they want to do academics when Faculty have heard the same lines over and over so their first impulse is not to believe you unless you have something in your history or on your CV up to that point that supports it.
 
The only exception I could possibly see is a basic science course that piques your interest that has a Derm tie in --- i.e. you covered skin histology, skin pathology, Microbio, Immunology, etc. as many of these can occur in M1 due to integrated curricula. Even then, you'll be asked why, and not having any clinical exposure tends to make faculty skeptical. I think that half-day program that's part of the official curriculum thru the med school, is the perfect segue to express interest. It doesn't raise eyebrows. It's like the ones who go on interviews saying they want to do academics when Faculty have heard the same lines over and over so their first impulse is not to believe you unless you have something in your history or on your CV up to that point that supports it.


Also, I know some dermatology departments host research opportunities for M1 students during their first summer---but you have to apply some time during the main school year, maybe as early as fall semester. That would be a great chance to get to work with members of the department and to learn about the field.
 
Also, I know some dermatology departments host research opportunities for M1 students during their first summer---but you have to apply some time during the main school year, maybe as early as fall semester. That would be a great chance to get to work with members of the department and to learn about the field.
Signing up for research opportunities for M1 summer is perfectly ok. Those things have deadlines for application and meeting them is important. That's quite different than setting up a meeting with a derm faculty member or your derm PD saying you want to do derm in the first few months of M1.
 
What made you choose derm, dermviser and asmallchild?
 
Thanks for all the replies.

I was intending on emailing the professor who gave our Dermatology lecture (also the head of the dept) about research over the summer (after M1 summer). Do you all think this is a bad idea?

If I didn't do dermatology research, I would do something related to tumorigenesis or pathology.

Also, would doing research in a separate field lower one's chances of matching into dermatology?

Thanks!
 
Thanks for all the replies.

I was intending on emailing the professor who gave our Dermatology lecture (also the head of the dept) about research over the summer (after M1 summer). Do you all think this is a bad idea?

If I didn't do dermatology research, I would do something related to tumorigenesis or pathology.

Also, would doing research in a separate field lower one's chances of matching into dermatology?

Thanks!

I think that would be a perfect way to introduce yourself to the department. If you have been handling all of the coursework with all honors thus far, you may even want to dip your feet in the water a little to see if there is anything you could help with during the remainder of MS1 year.

If you think either your coursework would suffer or you would be unreliable with your help during MS1, then I agree the summer after MS1 is the best time to get started with research. If you have a derm department that does significant research (basic science or clinical), it would be best to do your research with them. Doing research in a separate field doesn't necessarily hurt but you don't make the connections that would help you to match at your home department (this is dependent on you doing a good job of course)
 
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