M3 repeat or leave the school.

[eppu]

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My first post but really looking my options here .
M3 US MD school. Just find out that either I need to repeat the M3 year or voluntary withdraw.
I failed one rotation exam but pass it in second try (strike 1).
Then get Incomplete in 2 of the Clinical (strike 2 & 3).
My school saying repeat M3 but one more strike I will be dismissed. If i can get my 3 strikes back I wont mind repeating but they say No.
School also mention i am very professional, very caring , very knowledgeable, very hard working no disciplinary issues and they really want me to succeed.

Strike 2 & 3 are for some minor issues like not proper presentation and communication, I couldnt believe when i heard that because I thought I was doing really good and every one was very positive about me except couple of negative comments from someone i dont even know but they all were nice to me when I was in the hospital .
I feel like I was picked up by few . I am in shocked now with so much debt hanging on me.
Medicine is my passion I care about my patients.

My options ;
1) Repeat M3 ( I am sure they will give me one more strike and then dismiss me)
2) Transfer as M3 to some other US MD or Caribbean school but who will accept me.
3) Reapply to DO ( have 4.0GPA and MCAT 513+ but might have to take it again since its 4 yr old). Any chance i can get into DO with my history now. I am sure Dean and advisors will give me good letter they all like me very much, very supportive of me .
4) I did undergraduate in Nuero Science so should i go to some MS/Phd Program and if yes which one.
5) PA option
6) Any other degree to pursue.
7) not sure how FAFSa will work if go to DO, for MD they support for 6 yrs and I already finish 3. Will DO restart the clock.
8) Does Caribbean school covered by US financial aid I read very few if I am able to transfer in M2 or M3 I wont start from scratch there.


My family is devastated by this news and so am I. I am a bright student through out my carrier all As... I was accepted to few schools and choose this one over other.
Looking to me DO might be the only option if they accept me because of the 3 strikes I got which to me were very minor.

Please Advise..

Thanks

 

[Bobblehead]

I failed one rotation exam but pass it in second try (strike 1).

Why are you in this situation? If it's due to medical issues (mental health, other medical issues, etc.) get those fixed as best you can before proceeding. If there are other reasons be honest with yourself and take whatever action is necessary to eliminate that situation again.

Then get Incomplete in 2 of the Clinical (strike 2 & 3).

Again why? You are downplaying this as "minor issues" but reading between the lines the school clearly saw that you didn't perform to the minimum passing standard. This can occur even if none of the individuals you interacted with said it to your face.

School also mention i am very professional, very caring , very knowledgeable, very hard working no disciplinary issues and they really want me to succeed.

This is saving you. You are getting another chance because they see you as a decent person still. I would take the chance at your current school as you have a better chance of succeeding if you utilize all of the resources they are willing to give you as they see you as a decent person.

Strike 2 & 3 are for some minor issues like not proper presentation and communication, I couldnt believe when i heard that because I thought I was doing really good and every one was very positive about me except couple of negative comments from someone i dont even know but they all were nice to me when I was in the hospital .

Downplaying these couple negative comments will most likely cause you to fail again. There are no more minor issues for you. Everything needs to be addressed with the utmost importance.

I feel like I was picked up by few . I am in shocked now with so much debt hanging on me.

If you feel picked on, it means you still lack the insight for what went wrong and created this situation for yourself. After you've done some soul searching I would sit down with whichever institutional official is presenting you the option to repeat and get an idea of what people saw in you that caused this situation. The idea will be to try to figure out a way to fix all of them, immediately and to the best of your current abilities.

 

[eppu]

I have no Mental or health issues.
What they try to explain to me is that they look at many things but mostly how I presented my views to the attending physician.
But most or all of the Physician told me I have a deep knowledge of the issues and remedies.
I was not told of these short comings till the end when I have moved to other rotations and some with Honor.
Thats what shocked me why it was not conveyed to me that time.
I will not downplay anything I try to fix any thing they told me to do.
I was seeing other advisors like how to do presentations writing reports etc.
I even follow head of the dept for few days and they all told me i have improved a lot.

 

[efle]

Repeat and dont fail anything this time, much better than trying to start over. The only places willing to take someone who just failed out of another program are going to be for-profit schools (like the caribbeans you mention) that will hamstring your match and be quick to dismiss you themselves anyways. Your best outcome by far will be successfully completing this MD current program.

 

[Osminog]

Repeat M3. But do everything you can to fix the deficiencies that caused you to not pass your rotations. Also, stop viewing these deficiencies as “minor issues.” They’re obviously not minor if they’re causing you to be on the verge of getting kicked out of school. US MD schools don’t like to kick out students, and most students never get any “strikes” on rotations. Reach out to academic advisors, clinical affairs administrators, etc., and do everything you can to be fully prepared for the second go-around.

 

[Lucca]

Concur. Repeat. Be proactive about getting feedback on your performance and deficits to make sure you are always on track to pass.

I had a good friend who had to repeat M3 at a mid tier USMD. Still matched, has a great career now. This is the most viable path IMO.

 

[Osteosaur]

Sorry. I think your only chance is to repeat. You're in too deep.

What are 'clinical strikes'? Is this a formal report filed? Or the attending failed you on evals?

 

[eppu]

Sorry. I think your only chance is to repeat. You're in too deep.

What are 'clinical strikes'? Is this a formal report filed? Or the attending failed you on evals?

They have separate the Exam and the Clinical. They mention evals are not good and they use std deviation and when they add up I fall below required std dev. I read the evals and they were constructive to improve.

I forget to mention I fail step1 but then pass in 2nd try. they mention I will have hard time getting match due to my failures.
I think they want to weed out folks who might have issues getting matched, They told me few students already gone in M1, M2
Its a Top50 MD school but this year lots of there students did not get matched as compare to past years so I think they just getting stricter .

Can I go to DO or not if I decided not to continue.

 

[Goro]

You would be DOA at DO School.

You need to be more realistic and introspective about your situation. Feeling a rotation is rare among students.

And don't even think about going to the Caribbean, because your medical career would be over by that route.

 

[ACSurgeon]

This whole thing sounds weird. Most students never fail any rotation. 3 failures is a lot. You start by saying how great you’ve scored on exams all along but now you tell us you failed step 1. That’s also a very uncommon thing.

you say your attending didn’t agree with your “views”. I hope you mean clinical impression/assessment and not anything else. Work is not the place for students to share “views”.

your posts have imperfect English. Is it a second language? Do you have a bad accent? Is your communication with others a problem? Are there cultural norms you’re unaware of that cause you to not get along with people? These can all seem like minor things but unfortunately matter a lot in a small field like medicine. I’ve been told I have “dark features” as a resident and have to therefore be careful how I convey myself with nursing staff to avoid coming across badly. it sucks but it’s reality.

we were always told no negative comment should be a surprise to the student (ie should be given a chance to improve) yet I’m sure it happens a lot. It’s also possible you were given subtle feedback that you thought was a minor suggestion that you didn’t take too seriously or weren’t able to implement.

either finish at your current school or get out of medicine. Do not try Caribbean or any other...

 

[differentiating]

There's also the fact that, even if a DO school were to take you (which they won't), what makes you think you would perform better there than at your current school? I'd imagine the same problems would still come up come clinical years.

Your best bet is repeating MS3 and taking all of your evals/feedback to heart to improve. Yeah, you'd only have 1 strike left, but imo that seems pretty fair given everything thus far.

 

[Chads2]

I’m sorry, but in order to really help you, I think we must all state what we don’t want to say, for concern of how we would be perceived. Your biggest detriment is your ability to communicate. Your writing shows a lack of proficiency with the English language, and I’m going to assume it’s not your first language.

With your MCAT scores and GPA, you probably are smart and very capable in the sciences, but you are PERCEIVED as being lacking since your presentation / communication skills are poor and your documentation is probably not much better. And likely, you are probably very surprised by the “strikes” and poor reviews because no one wants to tell you to your face that you do not communicate well because they will seem racist or otherwise prejudiced.

Repeating M3 year is your only viable option but you can’t do it with the same approach. You may need to ask friends or residents above you, honestly, that you need help and you may need practice presenting and/or writing notes. They may be too busy to help you but it may be your best chance to improve.

Finally, when asking for advice, be prepared to provide specifics. If you can provide us with some exact comments from your evaluations, it will be useful.

 

[Banco]

If you want to be a doctor, you’ll have to successfully repeat M3 and improve.

All the other options (DO, Caribbean) are not logical at all.

 

[Redpancreas]

My first post but really looking my options here .
M3 US MD school. Just find out that either I need to repeat the M3 year or voluntary withdraw.
I failed one rotation exam but pass it in second try (strike 1).
Then get Incomplete in 2 of the Clinical (strike 2 & 3).
My school saying repeat M3 but one more strike I will be dismissed. If i can get my 3 strikes back I wont mind repeating but they say No.
School also mention i am very professional, very caring , very knowledgeable, very hard working no disciplinary issues and they really want me to succeed.

Strike 2 & 3 are for some minor issues like not proper presentation and communication, I couldnt believe when i heard that because I thought I was doing really good and every one was very positive about me except couple of negative comments from someone i dont even know but they all were nice to me when I was in the hospital .
I feel like I was picked up by few . I am in shocked now with so much debt hanging on me.
Medicine is my passion I care about my patients.

My options ;
1) Repeat M3 ( I am sure they will give me one more strike and then dismiss me)
2) Transfer as M3 to some other US MD or Caribbean school but who will accept me.
3) Reapply to DO ( have 4.0GPA and MCAT 513+ but might have to take it again since its 4 yr old). Any chance i can get into DO with my history now. I am sure Dean and advisors will give me good letter they all like me very much, very supportive of me .
4) I did undergraduate in Nuero Science so should i go to some MS/Phd Program and if yes which one.
5) PA option
6) Any other degree to pursue.
7) not sure how FAFSa will work if go to DO, for MD they support for 6 yrs and I already finish 3. Will DO restart the clock.
8) Does Caribbean school covered by US financial aid I read very few if I am able to transfer in M2 or M3 I wont start from scratch there.


My family is devastated by this news and so am I. I am a bright student through out my carrier all As... I was accepted to few schools and choose this one over other.
Looking to me DO might be the only option if they accept me because of the 3 strikes I got which to me were very minor.

Please Advise..

Thanks

We don't know each other so I can't speak to your inner character, but unless you really messed up on this SDN post, I don't think your grasp of the English language is passable for a medical student looking to practice in the US. Communication is the most important facet of medical training. It's not emphasized in training because the medical education system assumes the premedical education system already took care of this. There are people with a 24 MCAT and 3.0GPA who are in residency now because they're able to interact with others without raising any alarm bells. I can think of so many things you have said even in this thread which would trigger alarm bells. There also seems to also be a faulty world view. First you mention there have been 3 "strikes" and are trying to negotiate 3 more strikes on the redo. This is not a rule-based game like baseball where you need 3 strikes to be out. In 2 years, you will be immediately responsible for human life. Even 1 strike then is too much. The school seems to like you which is why 3 strikes were even given in the first place. Additionally, DOs are not inferior doctors to MDs. Their admissions criteria are less stringent when it comes to MCAT/GPA (which is not your issue) but when it comes to communication, you will encouter the exact same issues there.

The bottom line is you have to be able to communicate in medicine whether it's at an MD/DO school and no MCAT/GPA/USMLE scores are going to make up for that. The same applies for being PA or any other healthcare related field like nursing. At this point, do your best with the repeating the MS3. If you make it through, I would highly recommend a field with minimal communication like pathology. No other US MD/DO school will admit you because your English barrier will be readily apparent. A Carribbean school may take your tuition fees, but you will not match a residency so you would just be prolonging the inevitable while simultaneously accumulating more debt.

If you fail the M3, you're free to choose what you want to do next but I don't think healthcare is for you. Chasing it by trying for a DO or Carribbean school acceptance will only lead to prolonged pain. It's best to cut your losses and find a different career. If medicine is your passion, you may have success practicing it in a country where you are fluent in the language. I could also see a MS or PhD route working for you but you need to be interested in it and be able to do the job that such a degree would prepare you for. What exact MS or PhD program to apply to is out of the scope of this forum.

 

[eppu]

I like to thanks all you folks for your invaluable comments. I really appreciated it.. I am born and raised in USA English is my second language from my parents side but I only speak English and don't know any other language. I do tend to speak fast and stutter sometimes, words can get lost . I am trying my best to improve and keep working on the communication skills between a Patient and a Doctor.
During Clerkship I was repeatedly told by Residents and Doctors of my deep knowledge of the subjects but I agree that's not all, I need better communication and organizing skills if I want to be successful in the field of Medicine. Clerkship where I got flagged did coincide with an untimely death in my family and that was very heavy on my mind too but no excuses. Also I was notified of the shortcomings few months later when Attending send the evaluations . Most of the Residents and Attending gave me high grades but very few graded me very poorly.
My School takes each evaluation very seriously and I won't blame them they have every right to do so since that can decide if a Patient live or Die.


Most probably I will repeat M3 or start something else like MS/PhD or MBA/MPH program. Only reason I was looking at DO was that it will give me a clean slate to start with. I am not a Troll I have deep respect for both MD and DO programs.

Also not a fan of writing on a phone ap.

 

[Welshman]

I like to thanks all you folks for your invaluable comments. I really appreciated it.. I am born and raised in USA English is my second language from my parents side but I only speak English and don't know any other language. I do tend to speak fast and stutter sometimes, words can get lost . I am trying my best to improve and keep working on the communication skills between a Patient and a Doctor.
During Clerkship I was repeatedly told by Residents and Doctors of my deep knowledge of the subjects but I agree that's not all, I need better communication and organizing skills if I want to be successful in the field of Medicine. Clerkship where I got flagged did coincide with an untimely death in my family and that was very heavy on my mind too but no excuses. Also I was notified of the shortcomings few months later when Attending send the evaluations . Most of the Residents and Attending gave me high grades but very few graded me very poorly.
My School takes each evaluation very seriously and I won't blame them they have every right to do so since that can decide if a Patient live or Die.


Most probably I will repeat M3 or start something else like MS/PhD or MBA/MPH program. Only reason I was looking at DO was that it will give me a clean slate to start with. I am not a Troll I have deep respect for both MD and DO programs.

Also not a fan of writing on a phone ap.

As a genuine price of advice, if your notes were written in a similar style to your posts here, I could easily see this causing issues for someone reading them. Most of our clerkships require us to upload a few notes for the faculty to grade which must be passed in order to pass the clerkship. Writing in a unclear and imprecise way could foreseeably lead you to fail this component which may put the rest of your performance under more scrutiny.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

I agree with what others have posted here.. With a failed S1 and poor clinical performance, you're not going to get a spot anywhere else, you need to focus on making this spot work.

My biggest concern about what you've posted is that the two clinical incompletes were due to "minor" issues. Failure of clinical rotations in USMD schools is very rare. The exam issue isn't a huge problem -- exams are not your strength. But in order to offset this weakness on exams, you need to do well on your clinical rotations. And now you have two clinical failures. This is a huge problem, and represents a major deficiency on your part. I'm also concerned that you don't really know what the problem is. I encourage you to get as much feedback as possible from your two failed rotations.

Also, you're going to need to prep for S2 -- failing that might be considered another strike.

 

[eppu]

This year almost 10% of the class can not get matched. That's a huge number for this school. They changed there Clinincal policy recently. I already knew few who left voluntarily or been pushed out from M1, M2 and M3. I think they getting stricter to keep the matching numbers high. I got IP in first and they let me continue with next Clinical, I pass that with Honor then move to next and I thought I did very good on that pass the Exam too.
But then I heard I got another IP on last Clinical and that's what shocked me and let me think why they let me move forward when first IP was in progress and there was a chance through appeal process to remove the IP to Pass. Now I have 2 IPs and that put me in much worst position.

I knew my weak points and been working on them with the staff who are very friendly and want me to succeed.

 

[Redpancreas]

This year almost 10% of the class can not get matched. That's a huge number for this school. They changed there Clinincal policy recently. I already knew few who left voluntarily or been pushed out from M1, M2 and M3. I think they getting stricter to keep the matching numbers high. I got IP in first and they let me continue with next Clinical, I pass that with Honor then move to next and I thought I did very good on that pass the Exam too.
But then I heard I got another IP on last Clinical and that's what shocked me and let me think why they let me move forward when first IP was in progress and there was a chance through appeal process to remove the IP to Pass. Now I have 2 IPs and that put me in much worst position.

I knew my weak points and been working on them with the staff who are very friendly and want me to succeed.

Man...not to beat a dead horse but what is up with this writing? This isn't a minor issue. These can't all be phone-related typos. Why are you making all these mistakes while writing? I really say this out of pragmatism and not to mock you, but have you been evaluated for a learning disorder?

Even though it doesn't seem like it, I am actually a pretty forgiving of imprecision in speech as long as I can ascertain the essence of what someone is saying as I too sometimes mix up or botch a phrase if I'm anxious. In medical presentations, it's essential to be precise in your terminology and it doesn't seem like you can even do that in basic written conversation where you have the opportunity to edit/rephrase things. I can see 100s of ways where your presentations will struggle and you've already noted that your presentations were an area where there were issues.

 

[Redpancreas]

As a genuine price of advice, if your notes were written in a similar style to your posts here, I could easily see this causing issues for someone reading them. Most of our clerkships require us to upload a few notes for the faculty to grade which must be passed in order to pass the clerkship. Writing in a unclear and imprecise way could foreseeably lead you to fail this component which may put the rest of your performance under more scrutiny.

This OP. There is always a sentinel event which triggers people to look deeper into your performance whether fair or not.

 

[operaman]

Concurring with the others above- you have two options: repeat M3 at your current school or leave medicine. There is literally no other set of choices that leads to you becoming a physician. No other school will take you now and even if you find some bottom feeder Caribbean school you probably won’t finish there either and even if you did, no residency will take you.

If this really isn’t a troll post, then you have no concept of how poorly you are performing. Nobody forgets to mention a step failure. Nobody fails multiple rotations for “minor” issues. I’m going to go out on a limb and suggest that your foundational knowledge is very poor but that your clinical acumen is worseso people are saying your knowledge base is good when in fact they’re just trying to be nice.

I don’t know what happened between your stellar undergrad/mcat performance and such a struggle in Med school. You need to have some serious conversations with the support staff at your school and come up with a plan that actually addresses your underlying knowledge base as well as your challenges clinically.

Honestly, leaving medicine is not a bad idea if you can’t fix your issues. You still have 2 more Step exams to pass. You are also at high risk of not matching. If you do match, you are at high risk of failing out of your program. You’ve got some soul searching to do and the way you characterize your issues suggests you have little insight into how serious this is.

Sorry for being so harsh but it sounds like you don’t have a concept of how dire things are.

 

[Bobblehead]

For what it's worth, I've seen physicians that made it through residency without any significant issues with grammar like the OP uses. English language proficiency is not the primary issue. If there were no other issues (failed exams, "minor" issues which are likely not minor at all) the OP would be doing just fine. Everything he's written is understandable to a native English speaker and as long as clinical knowledge and judgment are adequate he wouldn't even be given a second glance.

There continues to be a drip of negative information with every few posts (failed Step 1?) so I suspect this is only the tip of the iceberg and there are major deficiencies which the OP has been told of multiple times and which he has dismissed as "minor" or lacked the insight to correct adequately.

 

[Osminog]

For what it's worth, I've seen physicians that made it through residency without any significant issues with grammar like the OP uses. English language proficiency is not the primary issue. If there were no other issues (failed exams, "minor" issues which are likely not minor at all) the OP would be doing just fine. Everything he's written is understandable to a native English speaker and as long as clinical knowledge and judgment are adequate he wouldn't even be given a second glance.

There continues to be a drip of negative information with every few posts (failed Step 1?) so I suspect this is only the tip of the iceberg and there are major deficiencies which the OP has been told of multiple times and which he has dismissed as "minor" or lacked the insight to correct adequately.

I’ve never met a unilingual English speaker who was born and raised in the US and makes the errors that OP makes in this thread. (Example: “Does Caribbean school covered by US financial aid I read very few if I am able to transfer in M2 or M3 I wont start from scratch there.”)

The information in this thread doesn’t add up. I apologize if I’m wrong, but I’m not buying what OP is selling.

 

[deleted966837]

Sorry but I just cannot believe that you are a native English speaker. Are you writing on behalf of someone else?

 

[DOFOSHO]

will you elaborate on what the "minor" issues are?

 

[Redpancreas]

I don't know what's going on but it's really strange.

1. The story gets deeper with each question. The OP starts by saying they attend a top X MD and did well in undergrad at least by the numbers, but then lists a few minor "strikes". The next post mentions a Step 1 failure., etc. They don't give any examples or delve into what any of these "communication issues" are but then they leave us with obviously fragmented English which to me seems comedic/purposeful (i.e. troll).

2. The English is poor but sometimes something's pretty well phrased. Some sentences are typed perfectly as American English would abbreviate something, but then other sentences are typed as if someone is trying to immitate the crude way Russians learning English speak.

I'm not trying to be rude but tons of really well-meaning posters have given this a fair shot, but things are not adding up.

 

[IMG69]

English can't be your native language? You write/type in English similar to how I write in German and i've only been learning for 7 months. Are you an FMG basically fabricating a story based on you failing in your own country and now wanting to apply to the US as a second chance at medicine?

Edit: I think this is important to mention as well, don't get over confident because they tell you that you're good. I get 'excellent' and performs at the level of a resident etc on my reviews when in reality i'm just sitting there not doing anything. Be realistic about your own ability.

 

[mrbreakfast]

Ehh, I have ESL friends in medicine who text/type informally just like this. Their spoken English and notes are fine, but making dinner plans in the group chat is a different story.

As a resident, I think a lot of residents and attendings soften the impact of any feedback they would give by complementing clinical knowledge, telling students they're doing "fine," whatever. Filling out evaluations, sometimes weeks after the fact, is tough and students blend together. The point is that any negative evaluations should be taken seriously, because that means you stuck out that far from the pack as to be remembered. When someone tells you your presentations are disorganized or deficient, for example, that probably means they're very disorganized or deficient. If multiple people have evaluated you poorly, it probably means that many other people thought you did poorly but didn't make it explicit in their comments.

Long story short, repeat M3 and ask everyone for feedback. At the beginning of your rotations, tell people "I've been told I need to work on X. I would appreciate any feedback you have on X during this rotation, as I'm motivated to improve."

 

[Lawpy]

They have separate the Exam and the Clinical. They mention evals are not good and they use std deviation and when they add up I fall below required std dev. I read the evals and they were constructive to improve.

I forget to mention I fail step1 but then pass in 2nd try. they mention I will have hard time getting match due to my failures.
I think they want to weed out folks who might have issues getting matched, They told me few students already gone in M1, M2
Its a Top50 MD school but this year lots of there students did not get matched as compare to past years so I think they just getting stricter .

Can I go to DO or not if I decided not to continue.

Uh..

Well your school is being really lenient here because they really don't want to kick you out

Do whatever you can to repeat and pass M3 and thank your lucky stars your school didn't kick you out long before.

 

[Osteosaur]

What I can't seem to figure out, and correct me if I missed it, is if the OP got any feedback beforehand.

Like it sounds like this came out of left field on an eval? Like do thecomments line up with "failing" the evaluation?

Is there any way to challenge it? I've heard of students who got graded by people who just didn't understand what an evaluation meant. Like "developing" can sound good, but a less savvy evaluator might not realize developing means 70% and every student should be getting "competent" on average?

 

[Phloston]

My first post but really looking my options here .
M3 US MD school. Just find out that either I need to repeat the M3 year or voluntary withdraw.
I failed one rotation exam but pass it in second try (strike 1).
Then get Incomplete in 2 of the Clinical (strike 2 & 3).
My school saying repeat M3 but one more strike I will be dismissed. If i can get my 3 strikes back I wont mind repeating but they say No.
School also mention i am very professional, very caring , very knowledgeable, very hard working no disciplinary issues and they really want me to succeed.

Strike 2 & 3 are for some minor issues like not proper presentation and communication, I couldnt believe when i heard that because I thought I was doing really good and every one was very positive about me except couple of negative comments from someone i dont even know but they all were nice to me when I was in the hospital .
I feel like I was picked up by few . I am in shocked now with so much debt hanging on me.
Medicine is my passion I care about my patients.

My options ;
1) Repeat M3 ( I am sure they will give me one more strike and then dismiss me)
2) Transfer as M3 to some other US MD or Caribbean school but who will accept me.
3) Reapply to DO ( have 4.0GPA and MCAT 513+ but might have to take it again since its 4 yr old). Any chance i can get into DO with my history now. I am sure Dean and advisors will give me good letter they all like me very much, very supportive of me .
4) I did undergraduate in Nuero Science so should i go to some MS/Phd Program and if yes which one.
5) PA option
6) Any other degree to pursue.
7) not sure how FAFSa will work if go to DO, for MD they support for 6 yrs and I already finish 3. Will DO restart the clock.
8) Does Caribbean school covered by US financial aid I read very few if I am able to transfer in M2 or M3 I wont start from scratch there.


My family is devastated by this news and so am I. I am a bright student through out my carrier all As... I was accepted to few schools and choose this one over other.
Looking to me DO might be the only option if they accept me because of the 3 strikes I got which to me were very minor.

Please Advise..

Thanks

Realize that you'd already be thrown out at various schools after three strikes. The fact that you're even being allowed a redo at this point is a blessing. If you really want medicine, you need to just put your head down and focus on MS3. The next two years will be hard, but that's part of the process.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Ehh, I have ESL friends in medicine who text/type informally just like this. Their spoken English and notes are fine, but making dinner plans in the group chat is a different story.

OP says they aren’t ESL though which is even more confusing.

 

[Lawpy]

OP says they aren’t ESL though which is even more confusing.

I don't know if OP is lying about something or trolling or actually being serious. Idk a lot of things aren't adding up but this is yet another of many threads where the school is doing the right thing

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I don't know if OP is lying about something or trolling or actually being serious. Idk a lot of things aren't adding up but this is yet another of many threads where the school is doing the right thing

For real. Sounds like they have had plenty of opportunities and are really minimizing their deficiencies.

 

[husky_doc16]

Agree with everyone that you should repeat M3 because it is your best shot. If you do repeat M3, ask for feedback at the end of the week from your residents and attendings. This way, you have an opportunity to show growth before a formal evaluation is written about you and kept on record. Ask your peers for advice, and seek out a mentor to guide you through this process. Best of luck.

 

[Mass Effect]

My first post but really looking my options here .
M3 US MD school. Just find out that either I need to repeat the M3 year or voluntary withdraw.
I failed one rotation exam but pass it in second try (strike 1).
Then get Incomplete in 2 of the Clinical (strike 2 & 3).
My school saying repeat M3 but one more strike I will be dismissed. If i can get my 3 strikes back I wont mind repeating but they say No.
School also mention i am very professional, very caring , very knowledgeable, very hard working no disciplinary issues and they really want me to succeed.

Strike 2 & 3 are for some minor issues like not proper presentation and communication, I couldnt believe when i heard that because I thought I was doing really good and every one was very positive about me except couple of negative comments from someone i dont even know but they all were nice to me when I was in the hospital .
I feel like I was picked up by few . I am in shocked now with so much debt hanging on me.
Medicine is my passion I care about my patients.

My options ;
1) Repeat M3 ( I am sure they will give me one more strike and then dismiss me)
2) Transfer as M3 to some other US MD or Caribbean school but who will accept me.
3) Reapply to DO ( have 4.0GPA and MCAT 513+ but might have to take it again since its 4 yr old). Any chance i can get into DO with my history now. I am sure Dean and advisors will give me good letter they all like me very much, very supportive of me .
4) I did undergraduate in Nuero Science so should i go to some MS/Phd Program and if yes which one.
5) PA option
6) Any other degree to pursue.
7) not sure how FAFSa will work if go to DO, for MD they support for 6 yrs and I already finish 3. Will DO restart the clock.
8) Does Caribbean school covered by US financial aid I read very few if I am able to transfer in M2 or M3 I wont start from scratch there.


My family is devastated by this news and so am I. I am a bright student through out my carrier all As... I was accepted to few schools and choose this one over other.
Looking to me DO might be the only option if they accept me because of the 3 strikes I got which to me were very minor.

Please Advise..

Thanks

No way you're getting into a DO school. Doesn't matter what your GPA or MCAT is. Once you fail out of an MD school, no DO school will give you a look. Not a chance.

 

[BidingMyTime]

OP, what a tough situation to be in. I'm not a doctor, but advice I can give you....when you repeat M3 year, don't wait until evaluations. Talk to the people who will be involved with your evaluation at least weekly, and take every bit of feedback they give you seriously. (But don't go overboard, bugging them incessantly for feedback.) Keep in touch with your school administrators as well, and ask them for recommendations going forward. Certainly consider being tested over the summer for any disabilities affecting your learning or communication. As others mentioned here, get advice from others in your written reports and notes. Get Grammerly, while I don't think your written communication is the major issue, it also isn't helping things, and you can't afford any negatives at this point. I wish you the best going forward.

 

[NicMouse64]

This is not a troll post, don't ask me how I know.......

Edit: My advice to OP would be get help for the speech and language issues that are coming across here before repeating M3. Otherwise that final strike will likely happen sooner rather than later........

 

[MickyMeowMeow]

Sometimes through our life experiences, our brains are wired in ways that accept certain convictions. I trust that you know what convictions you hold dear in your heart, and might have an idea on, out of those, what is holding you back in your current situation.

Those convictions are nothing wrong, and some might even be noble. Given the same circumstances, other ordinary people might hold them dear, too, and end up in the same situation as you are in now.

Out there, there are people whose role is to be the fortress of their field. They might not do it all in the same way though. They can sense the surface of it, but they don't know how to address it, nor do they know how to help you in a more concrete way. It takes a different being to guard against than to reconstruct and fix. Be courageous, be understanding, and be adventurous. I wish you all the best.

 

[DO2015CA]

This is not a troll post, don't ask me how I know.......

Edit: My advice to OP would be get help for the speech and language issues that are coming across here before repeating M3. Otherwise that final strike will likely happen sooner rather than later........

Are they really not ESL? That’s what the people of the thread really want to know

 

[El-Rami]

Even though it has been about a month since the OP asked the question, I would like to chime in.

1) Your best option, like others said, is to repeat M3. Period.

2) Don't go to the Caribbean.

3) It is technically possible to get into a DO program at this point (and maybe even another MD program), but absent any significant extenuating circumstances such as health issues, I don't see it happening. If you did try and were successful, you wouldn't be the first. That said, what would be different this time around if you were offered an acceptance?

4) If you got into a DO program, you would have to start over. You can't get advanced standing coming from an allopathic program. This means you will take on a lot of student loans by the time you finish, which is survivable if you take out only federal student loans in the past and the future, but it is not a fun situation to be in, to put it mildly. You could easily end up $1 million in debt. Do not ever take out Primary Care Loans, NHSC scholarship, or private loans if you were in this situation. If you failed to match, you would 99.9% be likely to default on your student loans. NHSC would triple your balance and accelerate the loan if you failed to match.

5) As far as FAFSA, that is complicated. If you borrowed over the aggregate limit for GRADUATE students while in MEDICAL school, and subsequently went to a GRADUATE program, you would have to sign a reaffirmation agreement or consolidate your student loans to be eligible for future Title IV financial aid; this is called "inadvertent overborrowing." If you went to another medical school, you wouldn't have this issue. I'd imagine that would be stressful to have to go through that.

6) That said, there are plenty of career options in healthcare that pay very well should you decide not to continue your medical education. PA and AA are good options. There are some other options, but they might require additional undergraduate training (which you will have to pay out of pocket for) and you could run into issues with pre-requisite "expiration."

 

[NicMouse64]

Are they really not ESL? That’s what the people of the thread really want to know

No. Native speaker.

 

[DO2015CA]

No. Native speaker.

Do they speak like this in real life? We are seeing it through a computer screen so we may be missing it. But from this vantage point, they don’t seem to have a grasp of the English language which would really hurt so much (ie presentations, patient relationship, resident/attending relationships, note writing).

 

[NicMouse64]

Do they speak like this in real life? We are seeing it through a computer screen so we may be missing it. But from this vantage point, they don’t seem to have a grasp of the English language which would really hurt so much (ie presentations, patient relationship, resident/attending relationships, note writing).

It's worse in real life than it comes across over text, but the syntax and situation are very comparable to the known case at my school. I will say that said person used to have fairly normal speech and comprehension. Not sure what happened since the beginning of medical school, but that is what I recommend they find out.

 

[deleted966164]

(...) reports and notes. Get Grammerly, while I don't think your written communication is the major issue (...)

Sorry, couldn't help myself 😆

@OP - repeat MS3 and pray. Try to really figure out what went wrong the first time.

 

[DO2015CA]

It's worse in real life than it comes across over text, but the syntax and situation are very comparable to the known case at my school. I will say that said person used to have fairly normal speech and comprehension. Not sure what happened since the beginning of medical school, but that is what I recommend they find out.

Oh wow. I wouldn’t be surprised if something medically happened. Obviously sdn isn’t for giving medical advice. But if a person was normal and now their speech/comprehension drastically changed then I’d recommend seeing a doctor for evaluation.

 

[NicMouse64]

Oh wow. I wouldn’t be surprised if something medically happened. Obviously sdn isn’t for giving medical advice. But if a person was normal and now their speech/comprehension drastically changed then I’d recommend seeing a doctor for evaluation.

Definitely agree! Multiple classmates have reached out and all in all, we want this person to succeed and get help/better. We've reached out to the dean and some neurologists to see if the person can get evaluated pro-bono and without fear of retribution. Whether the student has taken the advice/help has yet to be seen. We do, however, believe the school is doing the right thing so far as patient safety is concerned.

 

[GoSpursGo]

While I think it's natural to have some morbid curiosity about what happened to land the OP in this spot, I don't think that conversation really benefits anyone and so out of respect I would ask that we avoid speculating along those lines. Clearly the message suggesting getting help has been delivered.

Unless anyone has any useful advice beyond "repeat M3 and do better," I think we can just let this thread fade back to the graveyard.