Matrix - Game Thread

[marmot`]

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Anyway its either gikkle or shinichi today to see where wagons went day 1 eod and why

Unfortunately for you I can probably cite 5 games this past year where I like to re evaluate on day 4. It even won me a mash.

Get your hearing checked

Get my hearing checked?

 

[Achromatic]

Get my hearing checked?

I thought you said sounds like instead of feels like

Get your... hands checked?

 

[marmot`]

I am a marmot I have paws pls

 

[Achromatic]

Well the point is I am a big fan of a day 4 re evaluate.

 

[Zenge142]

Okay so let’s talk about the potential for an Acromatic & Samac Pack.

The Samacro Packro. The Acrosamacro Packo.

On Day 1 Acro pushed me and did so in a way that I felt was a floppy. Not really based on any strong convictions and ultimately backed off when met with resistance from me.

(It reminded me a lot of Falcon from the crossover game tbh. Throw a vote down on what might be an easy push, get decent pushback, back off to find a different parking spot. Etc.)

There were a few things that particularly bother me about some of our interactions, notably Acro’s apparent lack of interest in solving, and then pretending to not understand why a wolf would sheep a “village read” onto a misyeet (although this was countered by saying Acro was looking to see what my response was, which I feel was more like backpedaling)

At the time I was village reading Samac, and wanted to get her take on these things.

When I saw her responses all the pieces of me shattered as I hit the floor.

Spoiler

Still in favor of brutally murdering zenge

Okay, but where else would you go?

I would probably just sheep someone and see where the day takes me.

I'm more concerned with world building early rather than having multiple strong scum reads

@samac what are your thoughts on this post?

Im not thrilled about how outside of your tunnel of me, despite people who I think are coming across as village, telling you you’re probably wrong, your response about where else you’d be voting today if not me is to just be like:


That’s like… admitting to not having any interest in trying to solve and vote out scum.

That is incorrect.

What I am saying is if people I am townreading hold firm that I should be generous with my rope with you then, me not having any strong scum reads atm, would defer to my town reads and live in their world for the day and pursue their agenda to see if it benefitted the town or not. One of the lovely things about being town is I can choose to work with others and to validate them and see if they have a good idea or not. It's a secondary method of solving but it is still solving.

This still just feels as though you’re saying you’re doing much in the way of solving slots.

Like if you’re saying you’re going to develop village reads, and then sheep them, then by the very nature of developing those village reads you’re ultimately going to have reads that are not village reads.

So to say, outside of your tunnel of me you’re going to just pick one of your village reads and sheep them, instead of having an idea of where you want to vote for reasons based on your own reading and interpretations of the game is concerning.

What is the proposed scum angle for me taking this approach?

Seriously?

You don’t see the scum angle?

Sheeping someone you’re “village reading” onto a vote you know is a villager and then getting to shield yourself from the misyeet blame by saying “I was just sheeping a village read ”

The idea that you “don’t see the scum angle there” is also concerning.

Why would I say that? I made a willing decision to sheep someone. That being my decision means I have no right to shy away from accountability.

I am afraid your scum angle is beneath my scum range. If I wanted to choke the life out of a villager I knew was town I promise I would do it gleefully friend.

Hmm.

Yes I think this conversation was with a town member who felt like I would try to shirk accountability with my methods. Alright I have gotten what I needed from zenge.

unvote zenge

This is such a non-answer.

You went from: “I can’t possibly see how this play would be beneficial for a scum”

To: 1: “This wouldn’t happen; I’d still take accountability”
And
2: “I would never do this as scum”

Which,
1. No. This is my point. You now have a valid reason to be on a bad vote without the responsibility of having your own analysis scrutinized for lack of genuineness.

And 2: I don’t think that’s something we’re just going to take at face value, nor should we.

I like this post a lot as someone new to our site.
Seems like actively trying to get a handle on a a lot he’s familiar with
Town read.

Unbothered. I wouldn’t expect a new player on our site to volunteer that they’re sheeping without knowing the culture here and I’ve learned that a lot of people from other sites do start with the town bucket first method

Though haven’t you watched dubz and I do similar things in the past?
I know she’s sheeped me before and I’ve sheeped her d1.

So lets go into why Samac’s responses disturbed me so much

Acro’s statement that if they weren’t going to yeet me they’d probably just “sheep one of their village reads onto whoever”.

Like I get if you’re right before yeet close and you’re scrambling to find somewhere to vote, sure you might sheep a village read.

But my god! Imagine saying that in the middle of the cycle with hours left to go. Literally no idea about any other wolf reads, no plans to get other wolf reads, just pick a “village read” and sheep them.

And Samac DEFENDS it?!?! Like yeah sure I’ve seen it… in waffle hour. Not as a blanket statement about your plan for the rest of the cycle mid day.

Village Samac would be NAILING them to the wall for this. Village Samac has crucified so many players for so much less!

What is happening here!

And let’s not forget her stubbornness surrounding MKG all D1.

Spoiler

Spoiler: First page got me like

View attachment 386322

Unyeet Zenge
Yeet mkg

notes on SAMAC(TM)
- no caps lock
- yeeting me

my general mood: whomp whomp

You don’t feel like last game

*sigh* i went to heavy on the gifs, didnt I

wait you mean last game WHERE I WAS WOLF READ EVEN THOUGH I WAS VILLAGE? ISNT THAT A GOOD THING SAMAC

i'll get down to business soon ya know i just gotta get to 40

THE LAST GAME WHERE I HAD YOU IN THE TOP
VILLAGE SLOT MKG

Bitch you were my top village read
Santy only got above you for mechanics

(I feel like I need to qualify because it’s text the bitch is like “BITCH PLEASSSSEEE”
Not in a mean way
I realize you can’t hear my tone in text)

I'm catching up!! and rereading a bit, bc i thought stagg was fine at the start but it seems like people are really salivating over yeeting him
also this is like my 20th post chill i promise i wont get mod killed

It is serious.
But she’s skirting towards mod kill so not worth my energy until she comes back.
The last couple times I’ve played with village mkg she has been very obvious to me pretty early. Didn’t get any of those vibes this time.

Unyeet mkg
Yeet stagg

well duh. let me rephrase - with what little clem has said, the argument to yeet him off of that is hardly compelling. its just yeeting a low poster.

Welp

Why even comment on that though? There’s like 72 people on the board and Clem was in the lead with 2 votes with the other 71 having 1 vote

it was at the top of the page at the time i commented and it caught my eye

From vibes I feel like the feng shui is alright with mkg.

But also dont feel confident on it (or the content was enough to have confidence on that) for me to shield them

I still do not.

Okay.
I unvoted her in my catch up, before I realized she was also here.
But no, im still not seeing the village flags.

Like was MKG the greenest villager to ever live? No, of course not. Has she ever even eaten a green bean? Who knows!

But what I do know is Samac KNOWS she can be an easy push. She KNOWS MKG has a sketchy meta.

I really believe Village Samac would have been more cautious about a potential D1 MKG misyeet and would have taken my hesitation about it a little less blithely.

Now let’s talk about the start of D2!

Samac is literally PR hunting in broad daylight!

Spoiler

If someone is a motion detector I’d like to know what you learned. It’s worth the share I think.

Why? Doesn't MD have the vaguest results (motion, no motion, no result)?

Yes it does.

So then what're the benefits of the MD claiming that outweigh another PR reveal?

Secrets.

IS NO ONE GOING TO CALL HER OUT ON THIS?

Spoiler

Like hello? Assuming Moon is the doctor we’ve got 2 PRs left hidden.

If there is a motion detector and they reveal, then they’ve outted themselves and even worse yet they’re potentially going to out the last remaining PR.

You can’t tell me village Samac doesn’t know this!

SHE’S HOWLING!!!

 

[marmot`]

Zenge's wall is a good wall, I mean that level of research and attention to detail cannot be argued with.

 

[Zenge142]

I'm thinking the yeet today should be one between Gikkle, Achromatic or Stagg.

@Zenge142 who are the players you are 👀 with wolfy energy?

See above pls

Also, on this note. How good is the track record of dubz and samac reading Stagg?

A big part in how I perceive stagg comes from the thought that both of them seem to have soulvibed in that this is stagg wolfmeta

I mean when Samac’s wolfing her Stagg read is whatever she needs it to be…

I'm very excited for this

Spoiler

 

[Zenge142]

Here is Acro talking about their Samac Village Read

Can you talk to me more about the specifics of where your Samac village read is coming from?

I just like it when people who dont know me are suspicious of me early. It yields high rate of returns, well above rand, for villagers.

 

[Zenge142]

Some snip-its of Samac “Village reading” Acro and interacting together

I just would have expected you to interact with me more. You are aware of my scum game but I haven't felt like you've been too concerned with me.

I like this post a lot as someone new to our site.
Seems like actively trying to get a handle on a a lot he’s familiar with
Town read.

I want to give shot gun reads because sometimes that helps me

1. @Clem J - scum
2. @Santygrass - village
4. @potentialsheltervet - scum
5. @moonstermash - village
6. @samac
7. @holdthemayo - village
8. @Zenge142 - village
9. @genny - village
10. @WildZoo - village
11. @Stagg737 - scum
12. @ShinichiMD - scum
13. @Gikkle - village
14. @Achromatic - village

My scum side is too narrow.

Idk I have spent the better part of two years retooling my town game.

Like you saw me when you were scum going big in capitalism mafia having fun day 1.. killing town early but having fun

I lost that game too

Are you noticing a trend

That if you’re village you’re gonna lose it for us
Got it got it 😛

 

[Santygrass]

*gives a star to Zenge for good effort*

I still think Samac is solid in towncore. I like to see what they reply to the part about Achro. Replying to the part about the motion detector feels like its a bad idea since I have an idea on my mind as to why that could be . I think even if wrong samac is trying to figure out stuff about the setup and doing so in that way is pretty villagery imo

 

[Santygrass]

If there is a motion detector and they reveal, then they’ve outted themselves and even worse yet they’re potentially going to out the last remaining PR.

Like, you know that depending on info about PRs and whatever, a Motion detector outing could make another PR *know* one of the is a fakeclaim and all that sort of stuff?

Dont think is good to discuss where Samac may be coming from though

 

[Zenge142]

*gives a star to Zenge for good effort*

I still think Samac is solid in towncore. I like to see what they reply to the part about Achro. Replying to the part about the motion detector feels like its a bad idea since I have an idea on my mind as to why that could be . I think even if wrong samac is trying to figure out stuff about the setup and doing so in that way is pretty villagery imo

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

 

[Zenge142]

samac is trying to figure out stuff about the setup and doing so in that way is pretty villagery imo

You know how good she is at making it look that way as a wolf.

 

[genny]

(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

The green is a nice touch

 

[Santygrass]

You know how good she is at making it look that way as a wolf.

How so? I think my only experience with W!Samac was in Pawwta where I was also a wolf and dont really recall that sort of bold mech play hunt that fooled people. The bus chips invested from them were mostly a big factor to the win

 

[Zenge142]

How so? I think my only experience with W!Samac was in Pawwta where I was also a wolf and dont really recall that sort of bold mech play hunt that fooled people. The bus chips invested from them were mostly a big factor to the win

She’s crafty Santy! She’s berry tricksy!

Also look through her posts, tell me you really get the sense she’s trying to solve and figure people out.

Seems to me more like she’s going for easier pushes and low hanging fruit.

MKG, Moon, MKG again, Stagg/Shinichi/Clem.
Also PSV but mostly an “easier push” potential on account of her low attendance record.

Tell me this isn’t a list of potentially easy pushes.

 

[Santygrass]

Also look through her posts, tell me you really get the sense she’s trying to solve and figure people out.

I do.
Also you forgot about Gikkle in your list of pushes.

She also made a point as of why she is reconsidering Stagg

 

[Zenge142]

I do.

That’s what makes her tricksy!

She also made a point as of why she is reconsidering Stagg

I mean… okay. Wolves do also explain themselves and their actions, do they not?

 

[Santygrass]

@Zenge142 can you expand more on why you think Achro is a wolf?

I feel like most of the focus on your wall was to put them as a pack. If Achro is a villager, what would you think lf Samac?
And if Samac is a villager, what would you think of Achro?

 

[Santygrass]

I mean… okay. Wolves do also explain themselves and their actions, do they not?

*Shakes zenge*

You said she wasnt solving and considering her view. I told you of a specific post they made recently proving you wrong . Your answer to that has nothing to do with it hmph

Samac is a hard veto for today

 

[Zenge142]

@Zenge142 can you expand more on why you think Achro is a wolf?

I feel like most of the focus on your wall was to put them as a pack. If Achro is a villager, what would you think lf Samac?
And if Samac is a villager, what would you think of Achro?

Achro’s interactions with me D1 just never felt right. That stands alone. Especially with the knowledge of Achro being a 16 year long player.

Coupled with the fact that a fair number of people I’m village reading also find Achro suspicious, it’s more fuel for the fire.

Could Achro be a wolf without Samac? Sure maybe. Anything is possible.

But the ease with which they village read each other. Samac’s defense of Achro. They’re playfulness in some posts.

It paints a picture.

 

[Zenge142]

I told you of a specific post they made recently proving you wrong

Can you quote it?

 

[Zenge142]

Yeet Achromatic

 

[Santygrass]

Because I exude the BTE, big town energy

But tbh your tunnel makes me feel better because you always do this as town to me.
Doesn’t count in RvB when logic dictated I was the convert.

This is samac talking to her push since D1 .
I think its legitly solving because it explains why she moves from him to Gikkle today

Also look through her posts, tell me you really get the sense she’s trying to solve and figure people out.

Seems to me more like she’s going for easier pushes and low hanging fruit.

 

[Santygrass]

Also, Samac+Achromatic were both townreads of Space, the n1kill

Samac was top town , Achro just townread

 

[Zenge142]

Also, Samac+Achromatic were both townreads of Space, the n1kill

Samac likes to kill people who town read her.

 

[Zenge142]

Also Space was a safe kill in the sense that it was so unexpected. Low likelihood of Moon Doctoring Space

 

[Animal Midwife]

Day 2 Yeet Tally
Shini (2) - moon 20, Stagg 40
Clem () -
Achro (2) - PSV 21, Zenge 43
Stagg (1) - Dubz 36
moon (1) - Clem 50
Gikkle (2) - samac 56, Santy 114

8/13
yeet close in ~9 hours

 

[Santygrass]

@marmot` as for moon

D1 I had trouble seeing their approach as consistent / making sense of their reads (had a dissonance which I didnt like, and later Achro also gave another angle as to why their read on them didnt seem consistent f.e.)

Then the doctor claim means either they are PR or scum (in this setup a scum should always claim, and I have nitpicks like their breadcumb not feeling true enough or calling themselves town doctor and not mentioning the role name correctly)

Then they werent killed by scum , which is a red flag by itself. But then mostly their play this day... Doesnt seems one of a potentially cleared villager? Like, if they are town sooner or later they will be killed by mafia or setup will prove them as the doctor since there is no cc. But to me they vibe more as a player that know that its a question of time before setup points at them as a possible fakeclaim, and when that happens they are donezo.

Also game feels really harder if moon isnt scum, so in my head it kinda fits (?) and although I feel that moon is my principal scumread, the smart thing is for the setup to do its magic and solve there later

 

[Santygrass]

Also Space was a safe kill in the sense that it was so unexpected. Low likelihood of Moon Doctoring Space

Mafia had a blocker, they didnt have to worry about that.
Only case that could be true is that if moon is scum and mafia didnt know where a protection could be going

 

[Zenge142]

Mafia had a blocker, they didnt have to worry about that.
Only case that could be true is that if moon is scum and mafia didnt know where a protection could be going

Fine, that particular point is moot, but killing people who village read you is still a valid point

 

[Gikkle]

ig i'm a top wagon now lol

i'm used to it though. Time to put on some music and solve the game 😎

 

[Achromatic]

Being paired with people as town will never not amuse me tbh

 

[Achromatic]

Hello gikkle break down your town read on me please. This is important.

 

[samac]

Why are you worried about it?

Because I feel like like Scum is either really happy or not worried about us.

 

[Gikkle]

And what changed in regards to everyone else and now to make you feel that way?

Like, who are your new townreads compared to last EoD?

Moonster claimed doc and had to be taken out of my PoE
Space died and flipped town
mkg died and flipped town

my PoE sorta took a beating

This is a pretty wolfy EOD response from Gikkle. They shaded Nanook for pushing the doc claim, while also lightly shading the doc claim.

I don't like how they seem to leave themselves open to voting either one. I support a Gikkle chop today.

Lightly shading? I was casting full on shade on it

I don't trust moonster, but I also didn't trust Clem's response to his claim.

From my perspective clem's play today has been fairly one-dimensional and idk why people are clearing that slot, but I could have some bias from the fact a lot of it has been pushing me

Oh right

Why the frick would gikkle expect a breadcrumb from a doctor

I didn't expect anything from them, it just would have made their claim more believable if they had done a breadcrumb

 

[Gikkle]

Hello gikkle break down your town read on me please. This is important.

I'll get to that in a moment >.<

 

[Achromatic]

Where were you when I claimed armorer as wolf smh

 

[samac]

Okay so let’s talk about the potential for an Acromatic & Samac Pack.

The Samacro Packro. The Acrosamacro Packo.

On Day 1 Acro pushed me and did so in a way that I felt was a floppy. Not really based on any strong convictions and ultimately backed off when met with resistance from me.

(It reminded me a lot of Falcon from the crossover game tbh. Throw a vote down on what might be an easy push, get decent pushback, back off to find a different parking spot. Etc.)

There were a few things that particularly bother me about some of our interactions, notably Acro’s apparent lack of interest in solving, and then pretending to not understand why a wolf would sheep a “village read” onto a misyeet (although this was countered by saying Acro was looking to see what my response was, which I feel was more like backpedaling)

At the time I was village reading Samac, and wanted to get her take on these things.

When I saw her responses all the pieces of me shattered as I hit the floor.


So lets go into why Samac’s responses disturbed me so much

Acro’s statement that if they weren’t going to yeet me they’d probably just “sheep one of their village reads onto whoever”.

Like I get if you’re right before yeet close and you’re scrambling to find somewhere to vote, sure you might sheep a village read.

But my god! Imagine saying that in the middle of the cycle with hours left to go. Literally no idea about any other wolf reads, no plans to get other wolf reads, just pick a “village read” and sheep them.

And Samac DEFENDS it?!?! Like yeah sure I’ve seen it… in waffle hour. Not as a blanket statement about your plan for the rest of the cycle mid day.

Village Samac would be NAILING them to the wall for this. Village Samac has crucified so many players for so much less!

What is happening here!

And let’s not forget her stubbornness surrounding MKG all D1.


Like was MKG the greenest villager to ever live? No, of course not. Has she ever even eaten a green bean? Who knows!

But what I do know is Samac KNOWS she can be an easy push. She KNOWS MKG has a sketchy meta.

I really believe Village Samac would have been more cautious about a potential D1 MKG misyeet and would have taken my hesitation about it a little less blithely.

Now let’s talk about the start of D2!

Samac is literally PR hunting in broad daylight!


IS NO ONE GOING TO CALL HER OUT ON THIS?

Spoiler

Like hello? Assuming Moon is the doctor we’ve got 2 PRs left hidden.

If there is a motion detector and they reveal, then they’ve outted themselves and even worse yet they’re potentially going to out the last remaining PR.

You can’t tell me village Samac doesn’t know this!

SHE’S HOWLING!!!

 

[samac]

You know how good she is at making it look that way as a wolf.

PR fishing is something I do as wolf?

 

[Achromatic]

Zenge is a funny guy tbh

 

[samac]

Achro’s interactions with me D1 just never felt right. That stands alone. Especially with the knowledge of Achro being a 16 year long player.

Coupled with the fact that a fair number of people I’m village reading also find Achro suspicious, it’s more fuel for the fire.

Could Achro be a wolf without Samac? Sure maybe. Anything is possible.

But the ease with which they village read each other. Samac’s defense of Achro. They’re playfulness in some posts.

It paints a picture.

…. I’m playful with Achro?

 

[Zenge142]

PR fishing is something I do as wolf?

Well… not with that attitude…

 

[Achromatic]

In fairly playful with everyone if it makes you feel better samac.

 

[samac]

Samac likes to kill people who town read her.

That is a true statement.
I wouldn’t kill a guest N1 unless forced into it otherwise tho.
I’d probably kill dubz.
I like killing dubz.

 

[samac]

Im very interested to see what happens now though.

 

[Zenge142]

…. I’m playful with Achro?

This felt playful yes. Thicc as thieves.

Idk I have spent the better part of two years retooling my town game.

Like you saw me when you were scum going big in capitalism mafia having fun day 1.. killing town early but having fun

I lost that game too

Are you noticing a trend

That if you’re village you’re gonna lose it for us
Got it got it 😛

 

[samac]

This felt playful yes. Thicc as thieves.

😛

 

[Achromatic]

In this player list I probably wouldn't allow someone tring me to die. I could get away with killing someone strong and have it chalked up for other reasons while increasing thread control.

I power wolf as wolf and do so successfully most of the time tbh.

 

[Achromatic]

This felt playful yes. Thicc as thieves.

I will say that did come off as playful to me too.

Probably because it is an obvious joke. Are you OK zenge? People tell each other jokes