mcat scores in oct; how many schools to apply to

[Cloud 9]

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Hey everyone, I don't want this to be very specific since it really can't be without mcat scores and honestly I have no idea what I'd get. But I was wondering if anyone had a general idea of how many schools I should apply to given my other stats and my late application.

I'm a URM and I have a 3.8 something science gpa and 3.7 something overall gpa. I have a BA in a non-sci field. I'm getting involved in a physiology lab this summer and basically taking the MCAT in Sept. My teachers offered to write me recs so I think they would be good. I don't want to get really specific but I've been working as a medical assistant since last year and have a lot of community service with children in terms of tutoring and helping academically. I also have shadowed doctors since I was like 4, lol, no really I don't know how many hours but a lot and I can get a rec from that too. I can also get a rec from the lab as well.

I was wondering, given the nature of my situation, how many schools would it be wise to apply to this cycle? I know I am late but I firmly believe in trying. I thought 15 schools max, maybe less depending on MCAT scores...but if it's way too late then maybe like 6 so I don't waste a lot of money?? I don't know.

Also I am not sure if I will be able to get involved with a DO in order to get a rec to apply but I would totally be willing to apply DO as well if I could. Thanks all!

 

[Catalystik]

Hey everyone, I don't want this to be very specific since it really can't be without mcat scores and honestly I have no idea what I'd get. But I was wondering if anyone had a general idea of how many schools I should apply to given my other stats and my late application.

I'm a URM and I have a 3.8 something science gpa and 3.7 something overall gpa. I have a BA in a non-sci field. I'm getting involved in a physiology lab this summer and basically taking the MCAT in Sept. My teachers offered to write me recs so I think they would be good. I don't want to get really specific but I've been working as a medical assistant since last year and have a lot of community service with children in terms of tutoring and helping academically. I also have shadowed doctors since I was like 4, lol, no really I don't know how many hours but a lot and I can get a rec from that too. I can also get a rec from the lab as well.

I was wondering, given the nature of my situation, how many schools would it be wise to apply to this cycle? I know I am late but I firmly believe in trying. I thought 15 schools max, maybe less depending on MCAT scores...but if it's way too late then maybe like 6 so I don't waste a lot of money?? I don't know.

Also I am not sure if I will be able to get involved with a DO in order to get a rec to apply but I would totally be willing to apply DO as well if I could. Thanks all!

Do you have a physician parent? What specialty? How many formal shadowing hours do you have while in college and what specialties? It won't be clear until you have the MCAT score whether applying DO would be a good strategic move or not, but just in case, shadowing a DO is a good idea, especially since MD schools won't care which degree your shadowees have. If you don't have an office-based primary care doc, get one. BTW, an LOR from a relative would not be regarded.

What is your official state of residence?
Why can't you take the MCAT sooner?
Is the cost of an application cycle an issue or not?
Do you have any nonmedical community service that helps the disadvantaged? Do you have any ECs that keep you engaged with your cultural group?

 

[Cloud 9]

Do you have a physician parent? What specialty? How many formal shadowing hours do you have while in college and what specialties? It won't be clear until you have the MCAT score whether applying DO would be a good strategic move or not, but just in case, shadowing a DO is a good idea, especially since MD schools won't care which degree your shadowees have. If you don't have an office-based primary care doc, get one. BTW, an LOR from a relative would not be regarded.

What is your official state of residence?
Why can't you take the MCAT sooner?
Is the cost of an application cycle an issue or not?
Do you have any nonmedical community service that helps the disadvantaged? Do you have any ECs that keep you engaged with your cultural group?

Thanks for the reply. I do, they have a lot of friends that could write me one.
Va.
I don't know if I'd be prepared to take the MCAT sooner and late July to late Aug I'm fasting for my religion and I'd rather not take the MCAT then.
I do have nonmedical community service, like tutoring children after school. Would that count?
I have an African parent and was born there and have been back and did some non-medical teaching over there (volunteering).

 

[Catalystik]

1) I do, they have a lot of friends that could write me one.
2) Va.
3) I do have nonmedical community service, like tutoring children after school. Would that count?
4) I have an African parent and was born there and have been back and did some non-medical teaching over there (volunteering).

1) MD schools don't typically care about physician LORs. So don't go out of your way to get one from them. By they do care that you've had recent shadowing experiences, as you'd bring far more mature perspectives to the experience as a adult. The advantage of physican parents is that they can often help set you up with a friend so you can rack up the expected hours.

2) I don't personally have a perspective on in-state Virginia school's approach to the late applicant. Maybe PM flodhi1 and ask his opinion, as this might moderate my final comments below.

3) Excellent as nonmedical community service. If the school district is poorly funded or primarily serves special population groups, then it's even better.

4) Good.


If your MCAT score is decent, I'm leaning more on the side of it being better to apply to 15 schools, rather than a small number, to make the season a more-likely-to-be-productive one, but with the thought that it will be important to continue improving your application during the season in case reapplication is necessary.

I'd use the strategy of submitting to AMCAS 6-8 weeks before the MCAT score will be available so that you are verified before it is back, but only applying to less-selective schools until you know how competitive the score is, unless you are very, very confident due to multiple practice tests. You can prewrite Secondary essays from prompts found here on SDN, so you can return them quickly when invited to do so.

 

[Cloud 9]

1) MD schools don't typically care about physician LORs. So don't go out of your way to get one from them. By they do care that you've had recent shadowing experiences, as you'd bring far more mature perspectives to the experience as a adult. The advantage of physican parents is that they can often help set you up with a friend so you can rack up the expected hours.

2) I don't personally have a perspective on in-state Virginia school's approach to the late applicant. Maybe PM flodhi1 and ask his opinion, as this might moderate my final comments below.

3) Excellent as nonmedical community service. If the school district is poorly funded or primarily serves special population groups, then it's even better.

4) Good.


If your MCAT score is decent, I'm leaning more on the side of it being better to apply to 15 schools, rather than a small number, to make the season a more-likely-to-be-productive one, but with the thought that it will be important to continue improving your application during the season in case reapplication is necessary.

I'd use the strategy of submitting to AMCAS 6-8 weeks before the MCAT score will be available so that you are verified before it is back, but only applying to less-selective schools until you know how competitive the score is, unless you are very, very confident due to multiple practice tests. You can prewrite Secondary essays from prompts found here on SDN, so you can return them quickly when invited to do so.

Thank you for your feedback. Can you give me a range of what MCAT scores I'd need for this cycle to be worth applying to that high number of schools? i.e. if my MCAT is x or below, apply to x number, if it is higher, can I apply to less, or does this not really apply anyway since I already have strike 1 of applying late against me (and therefore need to apply to as many as I can for that reason alone)? I was thinking 10 MD and 5 DO schools, what do you think?

That's a great strategy about applying before the MCAT scores and I was planning on doing so. I actually bookmarked the thread with all the secondary prompts that I think you suggested to someone else.

(Btw I did find his MDApps (http://www.mdapplicants.com/profile.php?id=23718), however he has his home state listed as Alabama.)

 

[Catalystik]

In post #5 of this thread he refers to Va schools as being in-state: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=853249 Maybe it's changed since he first applied.

In this thread, you can see historical chances of success based on stats like yours and various potential MCAT outcomes, within your population group. It's up to you to decide what constitutes a Good-Enough chance: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=888650

Five DO schools sound fine right now, but may be more or less than it will turn out to be strategically necessary.

 

[Cloud 9]

Fair enough, I have another question regarding research. In this lab, the PI has graciously allowed me to pursue whatever direction I want...i.e. so far I have been learning about Western immunoblots and PCR, so a more basic science orientation. I did mention I would love to do clinical research and the PI said they can give me a project to work on like crunching data numbers. I would take on the project from a nursing student who's leaving soon.

Which looks better to the admissions committee?

Also thanks for that thread, I'm gaining more insight into where I should apply. But he didn't apply as late as I will 🙁

I will try to update this thread in Oct with the scores; hopefully you'll still be around to offer advice on where to apply..

Also one more thing. The DO philosophy sounds really interesting and ultimately if I planned to stay here for the rest of my life, I wouldn't think twice about pursuing it. But I really think there is a possibility I would go back and want to practice overseas, and unfortunately since DOs aren't recognized, I wouldn't be eligible to practice, hence my focus on MD schools.

My question is, if I had a decent MCAT that theoretically (as per the chart you linked) would give me a 70%+ chance, but if I didn't succeed this cycle due to the late MCAT, would it be better for me to only apply MD this cycle and reapply next cycle MD and DO (due to the late app)?

As always thanks a lot for your suggestions.

 

[Catalystik]

1) I have another question regarding research. In this lab, the PI has graciously allowed me to pursue whatever direction I want...i.e. so far I have been learning about Western immunoblots and PCR, so a more basic science orientation. I did mention I would love to do clinical research and the PI said they can give me a project to work on like crunching data numbers. I would take on the project from a nursing student who's leaving soon.

Which looks better to the admissions committee?

2) I will try to update this thread in Oct with the scores; hopefully you'll still be around to offer advice on where to apply..

3) Also one more thing. The DO philosophy sounds really interesting and ultimately if I planned to stay here for the rest of my life, I wouldn't think twice about pursuing it. But I really think there is a possibility I would go back and want to practice overseas, and unfortunately since DOs aren't recognized, I wouldn't be eligible to practice, hence my focus on MD schools.

4) My question is, if I had a decent MCAT that theoretically (as per the chart you linked) would give me a 70%+ chance, but if I didn't succeed this cycle due to the late MCAT, would it be better for me to only apply MD this cycle and reapply next cycle MD and DO (due to the late app)?

1) It's better to go with a project you design and implement, or at least have some creative control over, rather than one where you are following some else's protocol as a research assistant.

2) I travel at times, but I always pop back eventually. There are many other talented Chancers helping out here, as well.

3) The DO degree is recognized in many other nations (warning: old list):
DO International Practice Rights: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=107627

4) If MD is your primary goal, then that is a reasonable strategy. Considering your excellent GPA, which required some decent test-taking skills along the way, I'm not too worried that you'll bomb your MCAT.

 

[Cloud 9]

1) It's better to go with a project you design and implement, or at least have some creative control over, rather than one where you are following some else's protocol as a research assistant.

2) I travel at times, but I always pop back eventually. There are many other talented Chancers helping out here, as well.

3) The DO degree is recognized in many other nations (warning: old list):
DO International Practice Rights: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=107627

4) If MD is your primary goal, then that is a reasonable strategy. Considering your excellent GPA, which required some decent test-taking skills along the way, I'm not too worried that you'll bomb your MCAT.

Oh wow that is an awesome list! Thanks for sharing! Gosh, I thought it was waaayyy more limited than that, people IRL, even MDs, apparently have no clue. I was told it was a much bleaker situation than that list makes it out to be, by my own parent even. Wow, that is wonderful. I'll have to do more research certainly.

But are you sure it doesn't make a difference to do more technical research (pipettes, test tubes, incubators, etc)? Are they looking that we learned techniques from the research or we compiled and analyzed results? Or both? 😕 I'm already doing a lot of "researching" in the sense of pulling articles and data and editing grants now for basic science, but I haven't really gotten my "hands dirty", if you know what I mean.

And I do hope to see you around then, but enjoy your time off if you have any! I don't think the other chancers are as good 😛

 

[Catalystik]

But are you sure it doesn't make a difference to do more technical research (pipettes, test tubes, incubators, etc)? Are they looking that we learned techniques from the research or we compiled and analyzed results? Or both? 😕 I'm already doing a lot of "researching" in the sense of pulling articles and data and editing grants now for basic science, but I haven't really gotten my "hands dirty", if you know what I mean.

These are all components of a Lab Experience. So is cleaning rat cages, for that matter. The next step would be to "get your hands dirty." You need all these basic steps before a PI will trust you to make your own decisions/come up with a testable hypothesis/allow you to proceed on your own with some guidance. Most never get to that point.

Here is my favorite post on What is Research: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?p=7350809&highlight=rank#post7350809

 

[Cloud 9]

Oh I see, that is very explanatory. Again thank you soo much for the advice, you've been a great help to me! It's very appreciated 🙂

 

[Catalystik]

Happy to help.