MCAT Verbal answer is wrong -- what the heck?!

[Bleg]

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From ARCO GoldMCAT Sample Exams, 5th Edition, 2004, practice exam II (pp. 134-5):

"Redwood trees once covered much of the world. Millions of years ago the climate was ideal for the development of many species of redwood trees throughout the northern hemisphere. They were particularly common during the Jurassic period, or the age of dinosaurs. As the climate grew less moderate, the range of the rodwood tree began to get smaller..."

99. The passage states that the redwood trees existed as far back as:
A. 50 million years ago.
B. 100 million years ago.
C. several million years ago.
D. about one million years ago.

The "correct" answer, according to the book, is C:

99. The correct answer is (C). The second sentence in the first paragraph states, "Millions of years ago..." Thus, choice (C) makes the most sense. Choice (D) can be eliminated as millions is plural, so it's not less than a million, and (A) and (B) are too large.

This is obviously bogus and wrong. The passage clearly states that redwoods were "particularly common during the Jurassic period", which was around 200 million to 150 million years ago. It can be assumed that redwoods evolved well before this, so all the answers are wrong; (B) is very obviously the most correct answer. Answers (A), (C), and (D) are clearly wrong.

My question: Does the real MCAT include such blatantly wrong answers as this, or is this just a bungle by Thompson/Peterson's, the publisher? If the former, how can any Verbal score from the MCAT be trusted?

 

[VOP]

unless the passage lets you know when the Jurassic period was, then they don't expect you to know that info IMO, so just go with the other answer. Plus the passage was vague but let you know it was atleast more than 1 million.

That's how verbal works, you really gotto be sharp

 

[Bleg]

unless the passage lets you know when the Jurassic period was, then they don't expect you to know that info IMO, so just go with the other answer. Plus the passage was vague but let you know it was atleast more than 1 million.

That's how verbal works, you really gotto be sharp

Most educated people know the dinosaurs died out around 65 million years ago, so even if they didn't know the extinction took place in the Cretaceous instead of the Jurassic, they would still know that we're dealing with a time period of >60 million years.

If what you say is true, then how are we to know which sets of knowledge we're supposed to ignore in order to get the incorrect "right" answer? This is not being "sharp"; this is lunacy, more like being intentionally stupid to try to guess the psychology behind the test writers.

 

[jboz]

OP I think you're over-thinking the question. It clearly states "Millions of years ago." The key word is millions, and it doesn't give a specific number of millions, so the obvious answer (at least to me) was "several" million years ago. Yes they do mention the Jurassic period, more as an FYI, but the more important word was "Millions" since it was in the passage AND question. It's this type of over analyzing that people have talked about in the past as to why people miss such elementary questions.

 

[Bleg]

OP I think you're over-thinking the question. It clearly states "Millions of years ago." The key word is millions, and it doesn't give a specific number of millions, so the obvious answer (at least to me) was "several" million years ago. Yes they do mention the Jurassic period, more as an FYI, but the more important word was "Millions" since it was in the passage AND question. It's this type of over analyzing that people have talked about in the past as to why people miss such elementary questions.

Again I ask: How are we supposed to know which knowledge to ignore? They specified "Jurassic", which immediately puts the time frame at >100 million years. Yet the "right" answer is "several million years" -- clearly incorrect.

This is not "overanalysis". It's as if you are penalized for knowing when the Jurassic period was. Are you saying that this is actually a type of answer that might be expected on the MCAT? If so, how is the score from such a test representative of your comprehension abilities? You are expected to get the WRONG answer in order to score well?

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

Again I ask: How are we supposed to know which knowledge to ignore? They specified "Jurassic", which immediately puts the time frame at >100 million years. Yet the "right" answer is "several million years" -- clearly incorrect.

This is not "overanalysis". It's as if you are penalized for knowing when the Jurassic period was. Are you saying that this is actually a type of answer that might be expected on the MCAT? If so, how is the score from such a test representative of your comprehension abilities? You are expected to get the WRONG answer in order to score well?

This is overanalysis. On verbal you are supposed to go in as a blank slate and everything you need should be in the passage.

You yourself say >100 million years, yet the answer says "100 million years" not >100 million years. Thus only "several million years" works.

Again this is how verbal works, you can fight it all you want and be happy with your "8" on the MCAT, or you can suck it up and conform to how the verbal section works.

 

[Oncoloman]

unless the passage lets you know when the Jurassic period was, then they don't expect you to know that info IMO, so just go with the other answer. Plus the passage was vague but let you know it was atleast more than 1 million.

That's how verbal works, you really gotto be sharp

Right remember no outside knowledge is required for the VR. Use the passage to answer the questions not previously acquired knowledge. Several can be anything...correct answer is C (according to the passage).

 

[Oncoloman]

Again I ask: How are we supposed to know which knowledge to ignore? They specified "Jurassic", which immediately puts the time frame at >100 million years. Yet the "right" answer is "several million years" -- clearly incorrect.

This is not "overanalysis". It's as if you are penalized for knowing when the Jurassic period was. Are you saying that this is actually a type of answer that might be expected on the MCAT? If so, how is the score from such a test representative of your comprehension abilities? You are expected to get the WRONG answer in order to score well?

What if people don't know when the Jurassic period is?? This knowledge isn't required for the VR section. If it was the BS section then you would be correct. If the MCAT was a content based exam then yes I can see you being correct as well. 👍

 

[Bleg]

What if people don't know when the Jurassic period is?? This knowledge isn't required for the VR section. If it was the BS section then you would be correct. If the MCAT was a content based exam then yes I can see you being correct as well. 👍

This is fine, I suppose, but how reliable is it? How much of a "blank slate" are you supposed to be? If the question says something about the American Revolution, are you supposed to pretend you don't know it happened in the late 18th century? If the passage talks about Columbus, are you supposed to pretend you don't know he sailed at the end of the 15th century? How much do you have to pretend you don't know before you can get the correct answer?

 

[UCB05]

This is fine, I suppose, but how reliable is it? How much of a "blank slate" are you supposed to be? If the question says something about the American Revolution, are you supposed to pretend you don't know it happened in the late 18th century? If the passage talks about Columbus, are you supposed to pretend you don't know he sailed at the end of the 15th century? How much do you have to pretend you don't know before you can get the correct answer?

What if, by religious teachings, the "age of dinosaurs" to you was 4000 years ago? What if you were a permanent resident from say, India, and never took high school American history? What if you had never been taught paleontology in any grade school Indian courses, and did not do so in college because instead you focused on biological sciences to get into med school? How relevant is Columbus to foreign students? Did you know the Qing dynasty lasted from the 1600's to early 1900's? Would you think it's fair to be docked for not knowing that on an exam that tests your ability to read and analyze, not recall history? It's verbal reasoning. Whatever you think you know about the background of the passage is not pertinent. Pick your answers based on what you have given in the passage. Don't assume anything.

 

[Bleg]

What if, by religious teachings, the "age of dinosaurs" to you was 4000 years ago? What if you were a permanent resident from say, India, and never took high school American history? What if you had never been taught paleontology in any grade school Indian courses, and did not do so in college because instead you focused on biological sciences to get into med school? How relevant is Columbus to foreign students? Did you know the Qing dynasty lasted from the 1600's to early 1900's? Would you think it's fair to be docked for not knowing that on an exam that tests your ability to read and analyze, not recall history? It's verbal reasoning. Whatever you think you know about the background of the passage is not pertinent. Pick your answers based on what you have given in the passage. Don't assume anything.

So here's the hypothetical passage:

"The roots of the American Revolution in the late eighteenth century extend back decades from the event. The underlying issues can be traced as far back as Columbus."

QUESTION: According to the passage, the issues that led to the American Revolution extend to:
A. the late 1300s
B. the early 1500s
C. the 1600s
D. the early to mid-1700s

ANSWER: The correct answer is (D). The first sentence state that the roots trace back decades from the late eighteenth century, which would be the early to mid-1700s. All other answers are too early.

Do you agree that (D) is the correct answer?

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

So are you posting here to actually get help with verbal, or to just find people to support your cause and listen to your whining?

The question that was asked is not that far fetched from a question you might see on the MCAT (with the same answer)...get used to it.

 

[Bleg]

I am surprised at the responses to this issue. Seriously, does no one here know when the Jurassic was? Is everyone truly convinced that a demonstrably wrong answer is nevertheless correct?

I am reminded of a test I took some years ago that purported to tell you your IQ if you answer 50 questions or something. I took the test and it pointed out that I got some certain answer wrong. I told the guy who made the test, "Hey, your answer for #4 is incorrect. You say that A is the right answer, but actually it's C." I gave him some citations to demonstrate that his answer was wrong and the other correct. He responded, "The answer I put is correct. It does not matter which answer is true. My test is based on the fact that most people with an IQ of over 170 answer A."

In other words, his answer being factually incorrect was irrelevant; it was the answer that corresponded to how he had decided the question should be answered. That seems to be exactly what's going on in this case.

 

[UCB05]

I would have gone with D, yes, as "decades back" from the late 1700's. Is that not the correct answer? If the passage instead said "centuries back" A and B could be on the table.

 

[Bleg]

So are you posting here to actually get help with verbal, or to just find people to support your cause and listen to your whining?

I want to know if such factually incorrect questions are in fact part of the MCAT. If you see this as whining, then don't post to the thread.

 

[Bleg]

I would have gone with D, yes, as "decades back" from the late 1700's. Is that not the correct answer? If the passage instead said "centuries back" A and B could be on the table.

I made a slight correction. Please reread the quote and see if you still think the answer is D.

 

[UCB05]

I am surprised at the responses to this issue. Seriously, does no one here know when the Jurassic was? Is everyone truly convinced that a demonstrably wrong answer is nevertheless correct?

I am reminded of a test I took some years ago that purported to tell you your IQ if you answer 50 questions or something. I took the test and it pointed out that I got some certain answer wrong. I told the guy who made the test, "Hey, your answer for #4 is incorrect. You say that A is the right answer, but actually it's C." I gave him some citations to demonstrate that his answer was wrong and the other correct. He responded, "The answer I put is correct. It does not matter which answer is true. My test is based on the fact that most people with an IQ of over 170 answer A."

In other words, his answer being factually incorrect was irrelevant; it was the answer that corresponded to how he had decided the question should be answered. That seems to be exactly what's going on in this case.

VR does not test the accuracy of the knowledge you possess. It's meant to test your ability to analyze the content of a passage and draw conclusions based solely on the information you are given within the passage and nothing else. So the passage made a note of redwoods in the Jurassic period. You are given no further information regarding the actual time period so you CANNOT draw a conclusion based solely on the passage that they existed 50/100mya. Based on your answer choices, you can at best say they existed at least "millions of years ago." They might have existed 50 and 100mya but that can not be concluded based on the explicit information given to you. The correct answer as stated is not factually incorrect. 50 and 100mya are not incorrect. one million years ago is not incorrect. But if you had to support your answer by referring to the passage, you can at most definitively say C, several million years ago, because the passage does not state the time frame for the Jurassic period.

 

[MLT2MT2DO]

I want to know if such factually incorrect questions are in fact part of the MCAT. If you see this as whining, then don't post to the thread.

Ah, to be young again and know everything. I will stop posting here now, I hope you are able to get over yourself and adapt. Either way GL with your verbal.

 

[UCB05]

I made a slight correction. Please reread the quote and see if you still think the answer is D.

Yep, still the same answer to me. The passage states that the roots of the Revolution extend "decades back" from the late 1700's. The passage also does not tell you what particular period of time when referring to Columbus. You cannot make a conclusion of 1300's, 1500's, or 1600's given only "as far back as Columbus" as the passage does not give you an explicit period of reference for that statement. The only conclusion you can draw is as being decades before the late 1700's. Most VR questions dont have 1 right and 3 wrong answers, but rather look for the best answer as justifiable through the passage.

 

[Bleg]

But if you had to support your answer by referring to the passage, you can at most definitively say C, several million years ago, because the passage does not state the time frame for the Jurassic period.

This is the crux of the matter. When I read the passage, I did not consciously think, "Oh, the Jurassic. How long ago was that?" Instead, I immediately understood it as saying "150-200 million years ago". When I answered, that is what I based the answer on. If they had wanted justification, I would have said, "Well, duh, it says Jurassic."

But apparently, not everyone realizes when the Jurassic period took place. I thought this was common knowledge. So how do I know which elements of obvious common knowledge I should ignore and which I should accept? Because I could argue with at least as much justification that they never actually said that redwoods existed millions of years ago; they said only that the climate was ideal for their development. Therefore the passage gives us no immediate information about how long ago the redwoods lived -- oh, except for the "Jurassic" part, which was >100 million years ago.

 

[Bleg]

Ah, to be young again and know everything.

Well, I'm not yet 50, so you just have to be patient with me.

 

[UCB05]

This is the crux of the matter. When I read the passage, I did not consciously think, "Oh, the Jurassic. How long ago was that?" Instead, I immediately understood it as saying "150-200 million years ago". When I answered, that is what I based the answer on. If they had wanted justification, I would have said, "Well, duh, it says Jurassic."

But apparently, not everyone realizes when the Jurassic period took place. I thought this was common knowledge. So how do I know which elements of obvious common knowledge I should ignore and which I should accept? Because I could argue with at least as much justification that they never actually said that redwoods existed millions of years ago; they said only that the climate was ideal for their development. Therefore the passage gives us no immediate information about how long ago the redwoods lived -- oh, except for the "Jurassic" part, which was >100 million years ago.

Again, "Jurassic" is "Jurassic" is not "100 million years ago." you're a couple numbers, vowels and consonants off. Nowhere in the passage does it state they existed 100mya or 50mya, only that they were around during the Jurassic. You can't equate one with the other unless the passage also makes that association first.

 

[Bleg]

You cannot make a conclusion of 1300's, 1500's, or 1600's given only "as far back as Columbus" as the passage does not give you an explicit period of reference for that statement.

I appreciate your answers and your attempts to explain this to me. Perhaps you can clarify this for me: I am not supposed to know that Columbus sailed in the late 1400s and early 1500s, but I AM supposed to know that "eighteenth century" means 1700s. Is that correct?

Both elements of information are extraneous to the passage. Why is one element expected and the other disallowed?

The passage very clearly says that the issues can be traced back to Columbus; therefore, the correct answer must be B. Yet your argument (which is probably valid) is that the "right" answer is D -- clearly not the correct answer, but "right" nonetheless. But this answer, too, requires you to know information not written in the passage; namely, that "the 18th century" means "the 1700s". In what sense is this testing your comprehension of the passage rather than your understanding of external elements mentioned in the passage?

Despite MLT2MT2DO's condescending nonsense, I am not arguing for the sake of argument. I missed several such questions on the practice verbal exams, and these are holding my score down below 12. I am appalled that a demonstrably false answer is nevertheless considered "true", and the explanations given are completely bogus. Yes, I'm unhappy at the unfairness and the utter stupidity of the situation, but I am more concerned with how I can sufficiently stupidify myself such that I can get the "right" answer on these questions. Which parts of my brain do I have to turn off so as to be sufficiently ignorant to get the questions right?

 

[Bleg]

Again, "Jurassic" is "Jurassic" is not "100 million years ago." you're a couple numbers, vowels and consonants off. Nowhere in the passage does it state they existed 100mya or 50mya, only that they were around during the Jurassic. You can't equate one with the other unless the passage also makes that association first.

Will you give your insight into another passage, then?

The Islets of Langerhans, found in the pancreas, respond to increasing glucose levels by raising insulin levels in the blood.

QUESTION: With which system are the Islets of Langerhans associated?
A. Digestive system
B. Endocrine system
C. Nervous system
D. Circulatory system

By your reasoning, the correct answer to this question is (D). Do you agree?

 

[UCB05]

I appreciate your answers and your attempts to explain this to me. Perhaps you can clarify this for me: I am not supposed to know that Columbus sailed in the late 1400s and early 1500s, but I AM supposed to know that "eighteenth century" means 1700s. Is that correct?

Both elements of information are extraneous to the passage. Why is one element expected and the other disallowed?

The passage very clearly says that the issues can be traced back to Columbus; therefore, the correct answer must be B. Yet your argument (which is probably valid) is that the "right" answer is D -- clearly not the correct answer, but "right" nonetheless. But this answer, too, requires you to know information not written in the passage; namely, that "the 18th century" means "the 1700s". In what sense is this testing your comprehension of the passage rather than your understanding of external elements mentioned in the passage?

Despite MLT2MT2DO's condescending nonsense, I am not arguing for the sake of argument. I missed several such questions on the practice verbal exams, and these are holding my score down below 12. I am appalled that a demonstrably false answer is nevertheless considered "true", and the explanations given are completely bogus. Yes, I'm unhappy at the unfairness and the utter stupidity of the situation, but I am more concerned with how I can sufficiently stupidify myself such that I can get the "right" answer on these questions. Which parts of my brain do I have to turn off so as to be sufficiently ignorant to get the questions right?

First I don't see where it says 18th century in your passage =/
Even so, 18th century is by definition the 1700's. It's not extraneous information to associate 18th century with 1700's. It is, however, a stretch to associate a name like Columbus with a particular century, or a geologic time period with an exact number, especially considering neither 50 or 100mya fall under the actual period of time defined by the Jurassic period. If your answer choices had been Triassic, Jurassic, or Cretaceous, I would totally have gone with Jurassic, but we weren't given that.

 

[Bleg]

Even so, 18th century is by definition the 1700's.

True. And Jurassic is, by definition, the period of time from 150-200 mya. What's the difference? How do I know to use the one and ignore the other?

It's not extraneous information to associate 18th century with 1700's. It is, however, a stretch to associate a name like Columbus with a particular century, or a geologic time period with an exact number, especially considering neither 50 or 100mya fall under the actual period of time defined by the Jurassic period.

This is my question. How do I know which association is "extraneous" and which is not? The difference is not at all obvious to me.

 

[Bleg]

First I don't see where it says 18th century in your passage =/

Sorry, my bad. I have corrected the passage.

 

[UCB05]

Will you give your insight into another passage, then?

The Islets of Langerhans, found in the pancreas, respond to increasing glucose levels by raising insulin levels in the blood.

QUESTION: With which system are the Islets of Langerhans associated?
A. Digestive system
B. Endocrine system
C. Nervous system
D. Circulatory system

By your reasoning, the correct answer to this question is (D). Do you agree?

Is this a VR question or a BS question? In BS you should at least know that in the pancreas, insulin is released in response to food intake and a glucose spike, and therefore the pancreas is associated with the endocrine and digestive systems.

If it's a VR question, what's the rest of the passage?

edit for more detail* If this were the passage in its entirety, the statement makes no mention of the Nervous system. It does not state that the glucose comes from dietary sources, so you cannot conclude that insulin and the Islets are associated with the digestive system. It also does not state the function of insulin and therefore you cannot conclude it's an endocrine function. Plasma cells release antibodies into the blood, but they're not endocrine. At best you know the islets have something to do with releasing insulin into the circulation, so yes, my answer based on the passage as a VR question would be D. As a BS question, I'd know the pancreas is both digestive and endocrine, with the islets themselves being endocrine, as the passage also refers to secretion of insulin into blood

 

[UCB05]

True. And Jurassic is, by definition, the period of time from 150-200 mya. What's the difference? How do I know to use the one and ignore the other?



This is my question. How do I know which association is "extraneous" and which is not? The difference is not at all obvious to me.

I'm not making an association. the 18th century is the century demarkated as 1701-1800. To not know what the 18th century means that is to simply not know the word. If however the passage referred to it as the time of Enlightenment, I would have to take is as just that, and not the 18th century. The Jurassic is a geologic period of time, and in the passage is merely defined as the "age of dinosaurs," nothing else.

 

[Bleg]

I think these two phrases are what's getting you confused. By saying "as far back as", they don't ask you the time when these trees were common, but rather they refer to the time when they started to decline in prominence. That's how I inferred anyway.

On the contrary, the passage says "existed". This would push them back beyond the Jurassic period, making their existence in excess of 200 mya.

I don't mind being wrong, and I don't mind (too much) not being smart enough to figure something out. I very greatly mind being given a problem whose solution is illogical and which explicitly requires you to ignore certain facts it presents without specifying which facts must be ignored.

 

[puravida85]

The overall idea of these types of questions is for us to let go of biases, stereotype, preconceived ideas, etc. to form logical answers. Reasoning through logic does not include your own past experiences (on these exams anyway). I could join this argument and try to prove why you're wrong or whatever, but basically it comes down to learning how to deal with things that are out of your control. Good luck and I mean it with sincerity.

 

[eablackwell]

I don't really see where the problem lies with this question. If you know the jurassic was 150+ mya and the answers are

a) 50 mya
b) 100 mya
c) several mya
d) about 1 mya

then obviously you would know a & b are not 150 mya +, so they are wrong, 1mya is an obvious wrong answer. Several can be anywhere from around 5-5000 mya, so it at least makes sense, even in an "I know my periods" argument.

 

[Excelsius]

I agree with the above. OP, you have made two mistakes here:

1. You marked 100 MYA even though the period is older than 175 MYA, on average. That is wrong even if we were to ignore the passage.
2. The questions asks you what does the passage tell you, not what you think is correct (even though the passage is not incorrect). So when you are reading a passage, you are trying to figure out what the author is trying to say. This is the point of the verbal section. If you could use your personal scientific knowledge to gain much in this section, it wouldn't be verbal anymore. I also highly doubt that the numerous instructors who are professionals would deliberately put more than one correct answer, especially an answer that requires you to ignore a more precise choice. That just won't happen. However, so that you fully consider your knowledge only as secondary, think of this scenario: what if a passage is an excerpt from an original paper written let's say in the 1920s? In that case, some of the information in the article could be outdated in light of the most recent scientific discoveries, but you would still be expected to select a correct answer based on your understanding on what the passage says. This is why they say that having too much information can sometimes be detrimental for MCAT because you might over-analyze a question and either answer it incorrectly or spend too much time on the question. The key here is that you are expected to answer "based on the passage." This means that even if by some unfortunate accident MCAT did add an answer that is scientifically correct by itself, you would lose your case if you bring it up because you will be told that the question asked about the passage and not the most recent scientific discoveries. Still, I agree that unless this happened by mistake, there would be an uproar if MCAT indeed dare to spread misinformation. This is why 150 to 200 MYA was not one of the choices. Now a private prep company? You never know.

 

[NameAlreadyTake]

From ARCO GoldMCAT Sample Exams, 5th Edition, 2004, practice exam II (pp. 134-5):

"Redwood trees once covered much of the world. Millions of years ago the climate was ideal for the development of many species of redwood trees throughout the northern hemisphere. They were particularly common during the Jurassic period, or the age of dinosaurs. As the climate grew less moderate, the range of the rodwood tree began to get smaller..."

99. The passage states that the redwood trees existed as far back as:
A. 50 million years ago.
B. 100 million years ago.
C. several million years ago.
D. about one million years ago.

I've never heard of that company before.. what makes you think their practice exams are actually representative of the actual MCAT? Based on what I've read from EK verbal.. most MCAT verbal questions are based on the main idea, and won't ask you questions like the one above.

 

[Oncoloman]

OK Guy's. This is reduculous...C if u wan't the point on the MCAT, none of the above if you wan't to impress someone with your knowlege. I say get a new book or just accept it. Done

 

[Oncoloman]

Will you give your insight into another passage, then?

The Islets of Langerhans, found in the pancreas, respond to increasing glucose levels by raising insulin levels in the blood.

QUESTION: With which system are the Islets of Langerhans associated?
A. Digestive system
B. Endocrine system
C. Nervous system
D. Circulatory system

By your reasoning, the correct answer to this question is (D). Do you agree?

Bleg this is rediculous. Relax man. Are you gonna argue with the proctors on test day if you find "errors" on the real exam.

 

[TexasMDtobe]

From what I understand, the only practice MCATs worth their weight are the official AAMC ones. Since these questions arise on some other kind of practice test, it seems you're wasting your time and effort.