MCW Class of 2010, Part 3

[Gimlet]

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Here's a not so flattering article about MCW's dog lab that made the front page of the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel this morning. I thought I'd post it as a follow-up to the discussion a few posts back for people who want to know more. Beware that the Journal-Sentinel's view is pretty unabashedly biased...my dad has always complained that the paper is way too liberal, and I'm starting to get an idea of what he means:

http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=407629

Medical College's use of dogs denounced

A group that advocates for humane practices in medicine is urging the Medical College of Wisconsin to stop using live dogs in a lab exercise for students, a practice that has ended in all but a handful of medical schools in the country.

The Physicians Committee for Responsible Medicine - spurred by two anonymous Medical College students - wrote to college administrators and the instructor asking that the practice be stopped as outdated and unethical.

The chairman of the Medical College's department of physiology, Allen Cowley Jr., defended the practice, saying that "we think it provides an educational advantage" for the students...[continued in link]

 

[Agent Splat]

Here's a not so flattering article about MCW's dog lab that made the front page of the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel this morning.

I hope my mom didn't read that article. I'm sure she wouldn't handle it so well.

 

[akpete]

I read that article this afternoon (ironically in phys lab). It is definately a biased article. My problem with it is that the first half talked about how we have bred dogs to be companion animals, etc. So what about all the high schools and undergrads across the country that dissect cats. Cats are companion animals too, yet nobody seems to care about that.

I'm not sure what I think about this Physicians' Committee on Responsible Medicine. I don't know a lot about them beyond the dog lab, and an ad in a magazine that basically said that everyone should become vegetarians.

 

[Gimlet]

I'm not sure what I think about this Physicians' Committee on Responsible Medicine. I don't know a lot about them beyond the dog lab, and an ad in a magazine that basically said that everyone should become vegetarians.

I think their efforts would be better spent on working against the institutions that breed these dogs in the first place than attacking the med schools that use the animals so their death wont be a total waste, at least. The fact that these dog "dealers" exist and that our animal shelters are full of unwanted animals speaks very poorly of our society's attitudes toward responsible animal use.

If they solved the problems that are creating the supply of Class B animals for research, med schools would have no choice but to switch to virtual labs. At least these animals were able to teach us something through their death, rather than just be unceremoniously put to sleep. I am deeply grateful to the dog whose life was sacrificed so that my group could learn from its body.

 

[Zman8602]

Would anyone, with better writing skills than myself, be willing to write an editorial letter back Journal-Sentinel with a more accurarte representation of what actually took place in the Dog Lab. I would be willing to sign it (as I'm sure the majority of our class would as well)

I think their efforts would be better spent on working against the institutions that breed these dogs in the first place than attacking the med schools that use the animals so their death wont be a total waste, at least. The fact that these dog "dealers" exist and that our animal shelters are full of unwanted animals speaks very poorly of our society's attitudes toward responsible animal use.

If they solved the problems that are creating the supply of Class B animals for research, med schools would have no choice but to switch to virtual labs. At least these animals were able to teach us something through their death, rather than just be unceremoniously put to sleep. I am deeply grateful to the dog whose life was sacrificed so that my group could learn from its body.

 

[guitarguy09]

Hi all,

I'm an undecided MCW vs Madison class of 2010 student. Any advice out there deciding between the two?

Anyways, I've also started checking out some of the apartments in Wauwatosa. Any comments on the Reserve? Or other popular spots (the Overlook?)?

Keep up the active class thread! How many tennis players are out there?

-joe zechlinski

I chose MCW for the same reasons as mentioned above, however, I especially took notice to the fact that the hospitals connected to MCW are overall much better and you will see a wider variety of patients at them (as opposed to only seeing drunk college students in Madison 😀 ). No but in all honesty, the hospitals are excellent at MCW and the children's hospital is the best in the state (and actually one of the top in the country... according to recent reviews). Not to mention, I think it was about 5 years ago or so, MCW had a 100% pass rate on Step 1 of the USMLE, and the only other school to have a 100% pass rate was Harvard. So, in that respect, I think we get a solid foundation of both the basic sciences as well as clinical exposure. Additionally, the people here are much more laid back, which I think creates a better learning environment. However, it really boils down to your gut instinct. You should go where you feel most comfortable and where you can see yourself at for the next 4 years. In the end, both are great schools. Just my two cents...

 

[Agent Splat]

I chose MCW for the same reasons as mentioned above, however, I especially took notice to the fact that the hospitals connected to MCW are overall much better and you will see a wider variety of patients at them (as opposed to only seeing drunk college students in Madison 😀 ). No but in all honesty, the hospitals are excellent at MCW and the children's hospital is the best in the state (and actually one of the top in the country... according to recent reviews). Not to mention, I think it was about 5 years ago or so, MCW had a 100% pass rate on Step 1 of the USMLE, and the only other school to have a 100% pass rate was Harvard. So, in that respect, I think we get a solid foundation of both the basic sciences as well as clinical exposure. Additionally, the people here are much more laid back, which I think creates a better learning environment. However, it really boils down to your gut instinct. You should go where you feel most comfortable and where you can see yourself at for the next 4 years. In the end, both are great schools. Just my two cents...

I may have already mentioned this, but also, our anatomy lab is in the same building as everything else...I'm pretty sure at Madison you still have to go to the old school building for anatomy. That may have (or will soon be) changed. But yes, Jake is very much right.

 

[guitarguy09]

Wow, it looks like we scared everyone away. Oh well, what can ya do. Happy pre-St. Patty's Day everyone!!

 

[munadel10]

yeah don't know where everyone has gone lately. Wake up 2010 people Aug is around the corner!

 

[opmed]

Sorry, I've been focusing too much on filling out my NCAA brackets and haven't been spending enough time on the SDN forums.

 

[guitarguy09]

Sorry, I've been focusing too much on filling out my NCAA brackets and haven't been spending enough time on the SDN forums.

What teams do you like?

 

[Tiger26]

2009 guys: So I was kinda following some of the forums yesterday with people excited about their match results, and I was wondering how crazy it was at MCW with everybody finding out?

 

[Agent Splat]

2009 guys: So I was kinda following some of the forums yesterday with people excited about their match results, and I was wondering how crazy it was at MCW with everybody finding out?

Some of the other students might have noticed more, but even though we were right across the room from where they were finding out, I didn't see much. I hear that there were definitely some tears out there, but I think that's going to happen no matter what. Things were pretty much "just like any other day" for the majority of us, I think. For the graduating students I'm sure that's not entirely true.

 

[Gimlet]

I walked over to the match ceremony between class to watch for a little bit. It was pretty cool...everyone had their families with them and you could really feel the excitement in the air. It's so crazy to think that inside those envelopes is the location of where you will be living for the next 3-7 years! So much of their lives is tied up into that one day.

I didn't stay long enough to see most of the people open their envelopes (most waited until everyone had theirs to open), but the few people I saw open early looked excited. There were some girls crying before they had even opened their envelope, I think mostly because they were realizing that this is the ending and beginning of an era for them. It very much had a "graduation"-like feel to it.

Not to freak anyone out, but I heard today that something like 18 people from MCW had to scramble this year, which is pretty high. The girl who told me that said that 12 of those scramblers had applied for Derm, though, and had probably not been realistic about their chances based on their stats. I'm trying to get ahold of a match list for the school so we can see what specialties/programs people matched at. I will post it when I find one...maybe someone on here has found a copy of it and would like to post?

 

[opmed]

Sorry, I've been focusing too much on filling out my NCAA brackets and haven't been spending enough time on the SDN forums.

I think either UCONN or Villanova will win it all. Beyond that, UCLA and Texas have decent shots at the Final Four.

 

[DoctorFunk]

Not to freak anyone out, but I heard today that something like 18 people from MCW had to scramble this year, which is pretty high. The girl who told me that said that 12 of those scramblers had applied for Derm, though, and had probably not been realistic about their chances based on their stats. I'm trying to get ahold of a match list for the school so we can see what specialties/programs people matched at. I will post it when I find one...maybe someone on here has found a copy of it and would like to post?

Yikes, that seems like a pretty high number in the Scramble. I wonder if that reflects poorly on the help we can expect to receive when it comes to counseling us on our specialty choices/odds. I would definitely be interested in seeing the match list this year though. Let me know if you need any help rounding it up or anything--I already did a quick check of the school website.

 

[Gimlet]

Yikes, that seems like a pretty high number in the Scramble. I wonder if that reflects poorly on the help we can expect to receive when it comes to counseling us on our specialty choices/odds. I would definitely be interested in seeing the match list this year though. Let me know if you need any help rounding it up or anything--I already did a quick check of the school website.

I just wrote an e-mail to Dr. Simons asking about the match list. Doubt he'll get back to me before Monday though...I'll keep everyone updated!

Edit: In terms of counseling, I'm not sure how good MCW is. It seems like some of the "older" students are relatively clueless about residency stuff. SDN is such a great resource for learning about this stuff, and I feel like I know more than some of the junior and senior medical student about the match process just because I pay attention to what I read on this site.

In the end, though, I think regardless of how good the counseling is that MCW provides, it really isn't that hard to seek out someone knowledgable about the field you're interested in and asking them to give you an honest assessment of your chances at getting in.

 

[Hawkeye Kid]

Due to the aforementioned match activities, I've been ignoring this thread for awhile. I'll try to shed some light on some of your questions...

1. I have a match list (points finger and laughs). Lesley's office will send one to the M3s at some point and you can usually get one to trickle down to you. Or, you can PM me your email address and I'll send it to you (this offer is for CURRENT MCW students only, as the lists do identify students and is therefore considered sensitive).

2. I also heard that 18 people scrambled, though I doubt that 12 were in derm. You have to understand how the process works to really analyze that number, though. Many of those people matched in PGY2 spots and needed to scramble into a transitional year. Some may have intended on scrambling for a PGY1 spot as there are usually several open and it would be easier than interviewing for a bunch of them. There were a few that I know of scrambling for derm (I don't know if any were successful) and some in surgery/subspecialties.

3. I don't know how much you can deduce about advising from the number of people scrambling. As I said before, some people go into the process knowing that they'll be scrambling for something. Others, like Andy said, were applying to very competitive fields with very uncompetitive applications. In my opinion, the majority of students are "matchable" if they play the game right. Playing the game right means talking to the right people, applying to the right places, ranking enough programs, etc. And, in fact, the majority of students do match. Most of the relevant advising I received came from my clinical advisor, whom I selected very carefully for this reason. YOU pick your advisor, so if you receive insufficient advising, it may be YOUR fault. Also, keep in mind that of the 18 that scrambled, all but one now have a place to go, which
I think speaks well for our advising.

4. Agreed, SDN is a great source of information pertaining to residency. Keep in mind, though, that--for the most part--you're getting OPINIONS from people not much further ahead than you. I would often read something on SDN and run it past my advisor since in the end he a) has a sense of responsibility toward me and b) has much more experience with the process. Just be cautious about how you use info you get from here; most of it is awesome, but some is off and it would suck to screw yourself b/c you took advice from an anonymous disgruntled bitter poster.

OK, I think that's it. Oh, and no hard feelings for calling me and my classmates clueless. I know you're talking about "them" and not me and you're right--some of them are. Feel free to post or PM ?s about whatever, cuz I'll have some free time now (no one left to impress for ahwile). Also, I'll be at the EM match panel for those of you interested in the greatest specialty ever, so we can chat there, too.

 

[Velma]

Could you give some advice on picking a good advisor? Why did you choose yours?

 

[Gimlet]

With spring break starting for a lot of people, I thought I'd make a quick plug for my landlord for those of you who will start looking at housing soon.

My landlord is a husband/wife duo (mostly the wife) who own 7 or 8 properties in the area that they rent out. All of their houses are VERY well maintained older homes (1920s-40s)and have a lot of charm. Dee Ann, the wife, is a very conscientious landlord, which has been a great change of pace from the crappy landlords I had in Madison who would take a week to get ahold of when I needed something.

Check out the properties she has available at www.kufahl-rentals.eboard.com. All of the places she has listed right now are in a great location for MCW (she rents almost exclusively to med students because they make good tenants for her). I live in the lower unit on 71st St., if you want to check out what my place looks like.

PM me if you have any questions.

 

[Franimal]

My landlord is a husband/wife duo (mostly the wife) who own 7 or 8 properties in the area that they rent out. All of their houses are VERY well maintained older homes (1920s-40s)and have a lot of charm. Dee Ann, the wife, is a very conscientious landlord, which has been a great change of pace from the crappy landlords I had in Madison who would take a week to get ahold of when I needed something.

Check out the properties she has available at www.kufahl-rentals.eboard.com. All of the places she has listed right now are in a great location for MCW (she rents almost exclusively to med students because they make good tenants for her). I live in the lower unit on 71st St., if you want to check out what my place looks like.

Wow, those places look pretty awesome. how much does utilities and cable cost on top of rent. I will definitely check those places out when I go out there at the end of May. I am definitely hoping to have a room mate. I just haven't decided if I want one or two of them. I just feel like 2 room mates could end up being a distraction. I am very easily distracted and seem to find ways to put off studying. HAH. Does anybody else seem to have problems living with more than one other person?
Anyhow, for those of you that PM'd me your contact info... I intend to send it out this week since Spring Break is starting for people. If you have not sent your contact info, send it to me soon if you are interested in contacting other students for room mates, or questions, or what ever else you may want.

 

[indo]

Word on the streets is that the neighborhood north and west of Marquette is a rough area of town. Does anyone know the area well enough to comment on this?

 

[opmed]

Word on the streets is that the neighborhood north and west of Marquette is a rough area of town. Does anyone know the area well enough to comment on this?

I went to Marquette for undergrad, and I would have to agree that the area west of campus (maybe starting at around 20th St. or so) and the area north of campus (starting at about State St.) isn't the safest area around. There are worse neighborhoods in Milwaukee, but I would avoid this area if you can. If you're looking for a more urban experience than living in Wauwatosa, there are some very nice apartments just east of Marquette (Library Hill) and tons of nice ones cropping up in the Third Ward. Apartments in these areas will run you a good amount of $$$ though.

 

[indo]

A while back a dermatologist asked me if I was going to live in "Comatosa" for my first and second years. haha.

 

[xSTALLiONx]

Word on the streets is that the neighborhood north and west of Marquette is a rough area of town. Does anyone know the area well enough to comment on this?

20th and Wisconsin.. Anything west of that for a bit is a "bad neighborhood".. However.. you don't hear too much bad stuff about it..

The bad part of milwaukee is North Avenue.. West of the river.. ie. 2nd and north.. that's where the homicides are and such..

Wauwatosa is a suburbia type place with very little if any crime.. (typical suburb type crime like kids breaking into car to steal CDs.. etc)

I wouldn't pick any place in milwaukee to live right now since they're re-doing the marquette interchange and the whole slew of highways in the next 2 years so we are currently having lots of traffic congestion problems.. best to be near the place you'll be working or going to school to save yourself traffic jams..

 

[Zman8602]

The "traffic jams" might be bad if you have lived in Milwaukee all your life, but I grew up in Chicago and the traffic is nothing like you would expereince in Chicago. Rush hour up here is like your average middle of the day traffic in Chicago. I drive from Wauwatosa downtown at least 4 days a week during rush hour and it still doesn't take me more than 20 minutes.

 

[Agent Splat]

Just a quick additional plug for MCW...we have some top-notch dry-erase boards in various study rooms and small group workspaces.

I highly recommend purchasing some of your own dry-erase markers before your arrival. A multi-color pack will probably be a good choice, especially one containing black, green, red, and blue.

That is all.

 

[drwannabe44]

Just a quick additional plug for MCW...we have some top-notch dry-erase boards in various study rooms and small group workspaces.

I highly recommend purchasing some of your own dry-erase markers before your arrival. A multi-color pack will probably be a good choice, especially one containing black, green, red, and blue.

That is all.

how is the first year at MCW
and do you know how many got accepted of the waitlist last year?

 

[Gimlet]

how is the first year at MCW
and do you know how many got accepted of the waitlist last year?

Word on the street has it a whopping 14 were taken off the waitlist last year.

 

[indo]

Is there an alotment for dry erase supplies in the budget? I'm concerned I won't have enough loan money to buy the dry erase board cleaner or an eraser.

 

[Gimlet]

Is there an alotment for dry erase supplies in the budget? I'm concerned I won't have enough loan money to buy the dry erase board cleaner or an eraser.

I can get you all the dry erase supplies you'll need on the black market real cheap. 😎

 

[Agent Splat]

Is there an alotment for dry erase supplies in the budget? I'm concerned I won't have enough loan money to buy the dry erase board cleaner or an eraser.

the erasers are usually available in any given room, but a lot of people like to have their own due to the wide variety in styles and performance. I'm sure if you google them you can find something that will work best for you and that will fit into your budget.

 

[indo]

I can get you all the dry erase supplies you'll need on the black market real cheap. 😎

 

[indo]

here is one

I think it was built for lefties though.

 

[drwannabe44]

Word on the street has it a whopping 14 were taken off the waitlist last year.

what do they look for when they rank you on the wlist

 

[mimi2006]

Have you guys all send in your credit report. I printed mine and just found out some outstanding balances that i wasn't aware of. Don't know what to do.

 

[nefarious]

Word on the street has it a whopping 14 were taken off the waitlist last year.

Was that from the in-state list, out-of-state list, or both?

I have an interview scheduled for Friday but $500+ just isn't worth it for what amounts to an ice-cube's-chance-in-hell waitlist spot when I'm already holding one acceptance and awaiting decisions from two other schools for direct acceptance. In fact, the only reason I scheduled the interview in the first place was because I had read on three or four threads that MCW had very healthy out-of-state waitlist movement.

Any more information would be greatly appreciated as I still have the option of a full refund on my flight 🙂

 

[Hawkeye Kid]

Was that from the in-state list, out-of-state list, or both?

I have an interview scheduled for Friday but $500+ just isn't worth it for what amounts to an ice-cube's-chance-in-hell waitlist spot when I'm already holding one acceptance and awaiting decisions from two other schools for direct acceptance. In fact, the only reason I scheduled the interview in the first place was because I had read on three or four threads that MCW had very healthy out-of-state waitlist movement.

Any more information would be greatly appreciated as I still have the option of a full refund on my flight 🙂

I can tell you that, traditionally, there has been a fair amount of waitlist movement (though I don't know WHICH list(s)). The best thing you can do if you really want to know the answer would be to call the admissions office and ask them how many OOSers have come off of the list in each of the past few years. Anything you get from here--no matter how well-meaning--is mostly word-of-mouth or anecdote. Go straight to the people that you know have the answers. Good luck.

 

[Gimlet]

The 14 figure is straight from Mike Istwan's mouth, but I'm not sure if he was talking about the in-state, out-of-state, or combined waitlist. So yes, please follow Hawkeye's advice and call the admissions office. They're very nice and will answer all your questions no problemo.

 

[Hawkeye Kid]

Could you give some advice on picking a good advisor? Why did you choose yours?

Your clinical advisor should have as many of the following qualities as possible:

-knowledge. often this will be someone directly associated with program leadership (chair, program director, etc). these people will advise you on which rotations to take, when to take them, who should write your LORs, where you should apply, etc. Many factors that should be taken into account are dynamic and some residency programs that are traditionally competitive are becoming less-so. Your advisor should be on top of this, and if they are routinely involved with resident selection (or advise a lot of students), they will be.

-accessibility. there will be forms you'll need signed, you'll need to meet periodically, and sometimes things might come up when you need to talk to someone in the know. your advisor needs to be someone who will make time for you (at least by email or phone).

-trust. above all, you need to trust that your advisor is going to do everything they can to get you to where you want to be. for me, the litmus test was this: if i have to scramble and an offer is on the table from a program i know nothing about, will i be confident following my advisor's advice when they say to take or leave the offer.

obviously, if you know what you want to do specialty-wise, go with someone in that department. If you have no idea, go with someone who will help you make that decision and not try to woo you into their field (this goes back to the trust thing). Also, if you're between a few things, pick advisors in both. You can only have one official advisor, but that doesn't mean you can't talk to lots of people, and in fact, this is a very wise thing to do.

ok, those are the big things that come to mind. hope it helps. let me know if you have other questions. peace.

 

[dsherida]

Regarding waitlist: I ran into Mike Istwan when I was turning in my financial aid info and I was talking to him about admissions this year. He said he expects the waitlist movement to be very similar to last year...not a whole lot as they traditionally had in the past. That was last month, so maybe things have changed. One great thing about the admissions office is you can talk directly to Mike if you ask to. He is a straight shooter and will tell you the scoop. Just call and tell him your situation and ask for his thoughts on the waitlist. If you are happy with your one acceptance, your solid. Otherwise look at it as a trip to Milwaukee. There are some good brewery tours you could hit up after the interview! Good Luck

 

[samenewme]

Have you guys all send in your credit report. I printed mine and just found out some outstanding balances that i wasn't aware of. Don't know what to do.

First, send it in because you have a hard deadline. Then call financial aid and ask their advice. Probably you need to start contacting the creditors and paying things off or challenging them if they're not actually your debts (which happens). Once you get your credit report cleaned up, you can send in a nice shiny fresh one. But in the meantime you won't mess up your admission by failing to turn in key paperwork.

 

[nefarious]

Regarding waitlist: I ran into Mike Istwan when I was turning in my financial aid info and I was talking to him about admissions this year. He said he expects the waitlist movement to be very similar to last year...not a whole lot as they traditionally had in the past. That was last month, so maybe things have changed. One great thing about the admissions office is you can talk directly to Mike if you ask to. He is a straight shooter and will tell you the scoop. Just call and tell him your situation and ask for his thoughts on the waitlist. If you are happy with your one acceptance, your solid. Otherwise look at it as a trip to Milwaukee. There are some good brewery tours you could hit up after the interview! Good Luck

Sorry to have hijacked your thread with all the waitlist talk. I ended up chatting with Mike Istwan yesterday afternoon and he confirmed that only 14 came off the waitlist last year and that the numbers are shaping up similarly this cycle. Definitely not worth it for those of us holding a number of other options. A big thank you to everyone who responded!

 

[akpete]

Sorry to have hijacked your thread with all the waitlist talk. I ended up chatting with Mike Istwan yesterday afternoon and he confirmed that only 14 came off the waitlist last year and that the numbers are shaping up similarly this cycle. Definitely not worth it for those of us holding a number of other options. A big thank you to everyone who responded!

Only 14 of us!! Man, do I feel lucky. I got in mid-July, though I did have another acceptance. I did interview in Feb though for what it's worth.

 

[drwannabe44]

Only 14 of us!! Man, do I feel lucky. I got in mid-July, though I did have another acceptance. I did interview in Feb though for what it's worth.

hey do you know what they look for when they rank?

I have everything just a bad MCAT.

What were your stats???

 

[akpete]

hey do you know what they look for when they rank?

I have everything just a bad MCAT.

What were your stats???

My MD applicants is still up (see below) but unfortunately I have no idea how they rank the waitlists. Sorry, I'm no help.

Edit: What the heck. Where did my signature thingy go? Well, look above then for the MD apps thing.

 

[dsherida]

Have you taken the MCAT more than once? They end up taking the best of each section I think if you have taken it multiple times. Good Luck!

 

[Tiger26]

forgot to do this before, but I wanted to thank franimal for putting the contact list together. if you're not on it, make sure to pm him your info

 

[Gimlet]

Edit: What the heck. Where did my signature thingy go? Well, look above then for the MD apps thing.

Yeah, they only show your signature 1x/page now to save on clutter.

 

[akpete]

Yeah, they only show your signature 1x/page now to save on clutter.

oooohhhhh. gotcha.