Med school acceptance rate?!?

[bgil]

I've been doing a little research to see if I want to go to med. school after I get my bachelor degree. I looked at a few schools in my area (PNW) and I the acceptance rates are extremely low! I looked at both University of Washington and OHSU med. schools and their acceptance rates are like 3%. I just found it odd that they were this low, I knew it would be challenging to get it but not 3%. I was just wondering if these numbers are deceiving in any way? Also with such low acceptance rates how many students try to go to med. school any aren't able to get in?

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[Declinedgrunt]

That is about right. There is about 50,000 applicants, and less than half get accepted. Applicants also send around 20 applications (although, it varies from applicant to applicant). People are lucky if they even get 3 acceptances. I'm pretty sure the people on the forum here, are a bit "better" than other applicants, but that's because of the wealth of info on the site and advice (also a bit more serious). Anyway, that sounds correct. If a school gets only 5000 thousand applications, then accepting around 50, that's 1%.

This also probably belongs in just pre-allo not WAMC.

 

[LoveBeingHuman:)]

It is NOT that simple. You have no idea how many people with weak GPA's and MCAT score apply.

 

[WedgeDawg]

Moving to pre-allo

 

[Dr.Sticks]

It is NOT that simple. You have no idea how many people with weak GPA's and MCAT score apply.

Except the average M.D GPA is 3.7 and MCAT 508
Many get rejected for lack of ECs as well

 

[DoctorCakes]

That is about right. There is about 50,000 applicants, and less than half get accepted. Applicants also send around 20 applications (although, it varies from applicant to applicant). People are lucky if they even get 3 acceptances. I'm pretty sure the people on the forum here, are a bit "better" than other applicants, but that's because of the wealth of info on the site and advice (also a bit more serious). Anyway, that sounds correct. If a school gets only a thousand applications, then accepting around 100, that's 1%.

This also probably belongs in just pre-allo not WAMC.

1000 applicants and accepting only 100 is 10%. But agreed. Your chances are slim applying to one school (3%) but this increases as you apply to more schools.

 

[Dr.Sticks]

Anyways OP; Yes Medical school is an extremely competitive process
You not only need top grades, you also need to show altruism through volunteering with the underserved and in the community, interest through clinical volunteer, aptitude for science through research.
This isn't an easy thing to do, it is a marathon.
I am on it still, and it is becoming increasingly common for this to now be a 4-5 year journey instead of the former apply your summer after junior year and ta-da.

 

[Goro]

It is very hard to get into medical school.

Just as an example, for my school:

~6000 apps
500 IIs
~250 accepts
We seat ~100.
Acceptance rate = ~4% (all med schools, like airlines, overbook)
Matriculation rate = ~1.7%

These #s are similar for Harvard or Georgetown. Obviously, different pools of applicants apply to different schools. BTW, harvard gets about 7000 apps, while Drexel and G-town get ~14000

I've been doing a little research to see if I want to go to med. school after I get my bachelor degree. I looked at a few schools in my area (PNW) and I the acceptance rates are extremely low! I looked at both University of Washington and OHSU med. schools and their acceptance rates are like 3%. I just found it odd that they were this low, I knew it would be challenging to get it but not 3%. I was just wondering if these numbers are deceiving in any way? Also with such low acceptance rates how many students try to go to med. school any aren't able to get in?

 

[Dr.Sticks]

It is very hard to get into medical school.

Just as an example, for my school:

~6000 apps
500 IIs
~250 accepts
We seat ~100.
Acceptance rate = ~4% (all med schools, like airlines, overbook)
Matriculation rate = ~1.7%

These #s are similar for Harvard or Georgetown. Obviously, different pools of applicants apply to different schools.

What would happen if all 250 matriculated?
Also is this at a D.O school?

 

[Goro]

The accrediting bodies limit our enrollment.

If we overbook and can't find seats for the excess people, the Admission dean gets fired, and people have to defer. MD schools may have the cash on hand to give out scholarships to convince people to defer. This happened at Touro-NY this year, and at Stanford recently.

How admissions deans manage to do this year after year and actually hit their targets is something out of the Dark Arts.

What would happen if all 250 matriculated?
Also is this at a D.O school?

 

[Dr.Sticks]

The accrediting bodies limit our enrollment.

If we overbook and can't find seats for the excess people, the Admission dean gets fired, and people have to defer. MD schools may have the cash on hand to give out scholarships to convince people to defer. This happened at Touro-NY this year, and at Stanford recently.

How admissions deans manage to do this year after year and actually hit their targets is something out of the Dark Arts.

Have your class filled for next year too.. @.@
And half for the 3rd year

Yeah your dean loves living life on the edge lol

 

[LutGholein]

Yep 3% sounds about right. Most medical schools in the U.S(MD/DO) have single digit acceptance rates-- it's tough. Which is why you need to craft an appropriate list!!

A lot of folks look at those individual school acceptance rates and apply to 50+ schools without a firm understanding that you need to find schools where you "fit". Where you resonate with their mission.

 

[Lucca]

I believe it was @gyngyn who once said "half of all applications can be thrown out right away".

After that, it certainly is competitive but it's not unreasonably hard to have good stats and your boxes checked if you know what you are doing as early as possible.

 

[LoveBeingHuman:)]

Except the average M.D GPA is 3.7 and MCAT 508
Many get rejected for lack of ECs as well

None of what you said contradicts anything I said, especially since the stats that you gave seem to be for those that matriculated, not applied. OP was worried about very low acceptance rates. I was justifying that low acceptance rates are very misleading given how many people with very low stats apply. Therefore, saying that school X has a "1%" acceptance rate and school Y has a "2%" acceptance rate is completely meaningless because a huge chunk of people they reject are automatic rejections due to very low stats. There is a reason why the AAMC breaks down acceptance rates via an MCAT and GPA grid.

 

[Dr.Sticks]

None of what you said contradicts anything I said, especially since the stats that you gave seem to be for those that matriculated, not applied. OP was worried about very low acceptance rates. I was justifying that low acceptance rates are very misleading given how many people with very low stats apply. Therefore, saying that school X has a "1%" acceptance rate and school Y has a "2%" acceptance rate is completely meaningless because a huge chunk of people they reject are automatic rejections due to very low stats. There is a reason why the AAMC breaks down acceptance rates via an MCAT and GPA grid.

What do you consider a low gpa? Anything below a 3.7 isn't competitive
To make honors you usually need a 3.5 and 3.5 would put you in the danger zone as an M.D applicant

 

[Promethean]

All those offers of acceptance aren't given out on the same day. Because offers are made in batches, and because they are time limited, you can definitely write off some number of offers, freeing them up to be made to others. I think offering 250 seats to get 100 is pretty good.

 

[LoveBeingHuman:)]

What do you consider a low gpa? Anything below a 3.7 isn't competitive
To make honors you usually need a 3.5 and 3.5 would put you in the danger zone as an M.D applicant

You are underestimating the amount of applicants that apply with a lethal MCAT and/or GPA. I'm talking below 3.4 and 505. I'd attach a link but I don't think we are allowed to put up links to AAMC webpages or pdfs.

 

[blackroses]

The PNW is particularly difficult in terms of acceptance rates, especially if you're only looking at MD schools. With the opening of WSU med school, you're looking at 3 MD schools (UW, WSU, OHSU) to serve 6 states (Washington, Wyoming, Montana, Alaska, Idaho, and Oregon). That's a spectacularly ****ty ratio for applicants.

 

[aldol16]

What do you consider a low gpa? Anything below a 3.7 isn't competitive

Not exactly true. Depends on MCAT. High 3.6 with high MCAT from a top school is competitive. The average GPA of accepted applicants from my undergrad institution is in the high 3.5s if I remember correctly (it's been awhile).

 

[Dr.Sticks]

The PNW is particularly difficult in terms of acceptance rates, especially if you're only looking at MD schools. With the opening of WSU med school, you're looking at 3 MD schools (UW, WSU, OHSU) to serve 6 states (Washington, Wyoming, Montana, Alaska, Idaho, and Oregon). That's a spectacularly ****ty ratio for applicants.

Idaho should get a med school
Maybe Boise will have one in the next decade or so.. I would love to live there lol

You are underestimating the amount of applicants that apply with a lethal MCAT and/or GPA. I'm talking below 3.4 and 505. I'd attach a link but I don't think we are allowed to put up links to AAMC webpages or pdfs.

I have seen it
Average M.D applicant has a 3.55
Which outside of M.D is a stellar GPA
Just not great enough for med school

 

[Dr.Sticks]

Not an M.D but a D.O
Neat
New D.O for Idaho affiliated with the state
http://idahostatejournal.com/news/i...cle_db9b4a42-dc0b-11e5-b760-93dba7c68dbc.html

 

[Dr.Sticks]

Wow!!!!
I might try D.O just for this!!!! Lol
http://www.idahocom.org

 

[Declinedgrunt]

1000 applicants and accepting only 100 is 10%. But agreed. Your chances are slim applying to one school (3%) but this increases as you apply to more schools.

Woops was a bit distracted when writing the post (was in an online class session for scribing) I meant to write something like 5000 apps with 50 acceptances or something like that.

 

[Goro]

Not true. While a 3.6 might be around the the 10th %tile at many top MD schools, which have medians of 3.8-3.9, a 3.5 is still in striking distance for many MD schools, and even a 3.4 should be able to get you into your state school, depending upon which school it is. The best way to judge these is to examine MSAR Online. Mind you, this is only a single variable for acceptance.

Anything below a 3.7 isn't competitive

3.4-3.5 for most MD schools (there will be exceptions) and 3.3 for DO. At my school, we've noticed that people in the 3.1 range struggle. Now, these numbers are NOT black and white. Someone with a great upward GPA trend (say, 3.8 for the last two years of UG) but who has a cGPA of 3.4 will be taken far more seriously than someone with a straight-through 3.4 cGPA, by MD schools. A number of schools also place more weight tot he last 203 years UG years, than then entire cGPA.
What do you consider a low gpa?

 

[Dr.Sticks]

Not true. While a 3.6 might be around the the 10th %tile at many top MD schools, which have medians of 3.8-3.9, a 3.5 is still in striking distance for many MD schools, and even a 3.4 should be able to get you into your state school, depending upon which school it is. The best way to judge these is to examine MSAR Online. Mind you, this is only a single variable for acceptance.

Anything below a 3.7 isn't competitive

3.4-3.5 for most MD schools (there will be exceptions) and 3.3 for DO. At my school, we've noticed that people in the 3.1 range struggle. Now, these numbers are NOT black and white. Someone with a great upward GPA trend (say, 3.8 for the last two years of UG) but who has a cGPA of 3.4 will be taken far more seriously than someone with a straight-through 3.4 cGPA, by MD schools. A number of schools also place more weight tot he last 203 years UG years, than then entire cGPA.
What do you consider a low gpa?

I am aiming to graduate with at least a 3.75(hopefully better), over 1k(have a bit over 400 already in my 2nd year of college) hours of ECs, etc
And I have to tell you I still don't think that is competitive lol

Maybe I am just a neurotic pre-med but anything below a 3.7 makes me worry too much.

 

[Goro]

At times I worry much more about the neurotic tendencies, than the GPAs.

So realize that you probably have imposter syndrome, and will actually be very competitive. Like Stanford/Harvard/Yale ilk.

I am aiming to graduate with at least a 3.75(hopefully better), over 1k(have a bit over 400 already in my 2nd year of college) hours of ECs, etc
And I have to tell you I still don't think that is competitive lol

Maybe I am just a neurotic pre-med but anything below a 3.7 makes me worry too much.

 

[Dr.Sticks]

At times I worry much more about the neurotic tendencies, than the GPAs.

So realize that you probably have imposter syndrome, and will actually be very competitive. Like Stanford/Harvard/Yale ilk.

Only if I can get a 520+ MCAT, at least 2 years of research,and 100 hours of physician shadowing

Also imposter syndrome? Is that a new thing lol?
No wonder psych is the up and coming field..
I helped a psychologist in group therapy for a certain thing.. Was very neat seeing and observing behavior changes/communication changes with the therapy

 

[Goro]

For the top schools get a 516+.

For other good schools, a 514-515, should work. And even in the 512-514 range can work as well. I don't think anyone needs 100 hrs of shadowing.

Only if I can get a 520+ MCAT, at least 2 years of research,and 100 hours of physician shadowing

Also imposter syndrome? Is that a new thing lol?
No wonder psych is the up and coming field..
I helped a psychologist in group therapy for a certain thing.. Was very neat seeing and observing behavior changes/communication changes with the therapy

 

[blackroses]

Idaho should get a med school
Maybe Boise will have one in the next decade or so.. I would love to live there lol

Idaho really needs a med school. Oregon and Washington each need at least one more. I suspect that Montana could support one. The PNW is sending more med students to other regions than they're keeping - not exactly ideal when the region is hurting badly for more physicians.

 

[WedgeDawg]

You are underestimating the amount of applicants that apply with a lethal MCAT and/or GPA. I'm talking below 3.4 and 505. I'd attach a link but I don't think we are allowed to put up links to AAMC webpages or pdfs.

you are

For the top schools get a 516+.

For other good schools, a 514-515, should work. And even in the 512-514 range can work as well. I don't think anyone needs 100 hrs of shadowing.

I usually recommend 518+ (36+ old scale); a 516+ is doable, but you're more in mid-tier range there.

 

[Dr.Sticks]

I usually recommend 518+ (36+ old scale); a 516+ is doable, but you're more in mid-tier range there.

I agree; Based on what I could find without the MSAR thing my state school has an average MCAT of 511...
It isn't even a top state school, a good solid upper mid-tier state school but not a top of the line state school.
Oh and it says the average GPA is 3.79 @.@
My state school stats are almost like Harvard except Harvard has a 517 average mcat according to this source and a 3.8 GPA average

 

[WedgeDawg]

I agree; Based on what I could find without the MSAR thing my state school has an average MCAT of 511...
It isn't even a top state school, a good solid upper mid-tier state school but not a top of the line state school.
Oh and it says the average GPA is 3.79 @.@
My state school stats are almost like Harvard except Harvard has a 517 average mcat according to this source and a 3.8 GPA average

Your source is outdated. According to MSAR as of a year ago, Harvard was 3.93/37 (519-520 new scale)

 

[Dr.Sticks]

Your source is outdated. According to MSAR as of a year ago, Harvard was 3.93/37 (519-520 new scale)

Your source is outdated. According to MSAR as of a year ago, Harvard was 3.93/37 (519-520 new scale)

Jesus Christ...
Do you recall what my state school was?
Wowwwwww

What is next
4.0 GPA only???
And the average matriculant in M.D in general has a 3.7 according to AMCAS...

 

[bgil]

Thanks guys for all the information!!! I' just scared I'm gonna get my bachelor degree and not get accepted to a med. school. I know I can keep my gpa above 3.75 but I just suck at tests like the MCAT. When I'm timed and under pressure I don't do my best

 

[WedgeDawg]

Jesus Christ...
Do you recall what my state school was?
Wowwwwww

What is next
4.0 GPA only???
And the average matriculant in M.D in general has a 3.7 according to AMCAS...

No, I don't sorry. I wouldn't focus on that and would instead focus on getting the highest GPA and MCAT you can, then looking at school options from there.

 

[Dr.Sticks]

No, I don't sorry. I wouldn't focus on that and would instead focus on getting the highest GPA and MCAT you can, then looking at school options from there.

Yeah I just want to be at least competitive for my state school.
That is why I am taking a gap year
I have already decided on that.

 

[LoveBeingHuman:)]

you are



I usually recommend 518+ (36+ old scale); a 516+ is doable, but you're more in mid-tier range there.

In that case:

https://www.aamc.org/download/321508/data/factstablea23.pdf

Roughly 8k applicants had a GPA below 3.4

Over 15k had an MCAT below 506

There were about 27k applicants total (on the grid, which I believe is only for applicants that took the new mcat)

Although I don't know why it says 2016-2017 on the top, considering that the app cycle is still a long way to finish. Maybe the AAMC updates it throughout the cycle? Either way, since this discussion is concerning applicant stats rather than matriculant stats, my argument still stands.

 

[ZedsDed]

Yeah I just want to be at least competitive for my state school.
That is why I am taking a gap year
I have already decided on that.

What is your state school?

 

[787593]

This isn't an easy thing to do, it is a marathon.
I am on it still, and it is becoming increasingly common for this to now be a 4-5 year journey instead of the former apply your summer after junior year and ta-da.

Unfortunately

 

[787593]

Idaho should get a med school
Maybe Boise will have one in the next decade or so.. I would love to live there lol



I have seen it
Average M.D applicant has a 3.55
Which outside of M.D is a stellar GPA
Just not great enough for med school

Boise is awesome!

 

[787593]

Thanks guys for all the information!!! I' just scared I'm gonna get my bachelor degree and not get accepted to a med. school. I know I can keep my gpa above 3.75 but I just suck at tests like the MCAT. When I'm timed and under pressure I don't do my best

Take 20 practice exams under test day conditions.

 

[Dr.Sticks]

Unfortunately

It might be even worse in the next decade if they don't start expanding residency slots and med school seats.
You might have to start planning in HS then! Lol

 

[JB50]

It might be even worse in the next decade if they don't start expanding residency slots and med school seats.
You might have to start planning in HS then! Lol

Or applicants will realize to apply to DO school and don't look back

 

[Dr.Sticks]

Or applicants will realize to apply to DO school and don't look back

If you want to do surgery or anything competitive D.O could limit your options
Until that changes M.D will be the top choice

 

[JB50]

If you want to do surgery or anything competitive D.O could limit your options
Until that changes M.D will be the top choice

Yeah, but DO matriculant stats are on the rise, meaning what used to be qualified MD applicants are now beginning to head to DO school. I think there will be a change coming up soon especially with the merger. Anyhow, you are right!

 

[787593]

It might be even worse in the next decade if they don't start expanding residency slots and med school seats.
You might have to start planning in HS then! Lol

I knew nothing about this process in high school.
I knew little for most of college.
I remember a group of pre-meds in my freshman undergraduate biology class talking about the MCAT and I asked them, "What is the MCAT, does everyone have to take it?"

 

[787593]

Or applicants will realize to apply to DO school and don't look back

Idk, Osteopaths can be a little "manipulative." 😉

PUN PUN PUN PUN PUN PUN, thanks everyone, you've been a great crowd!!!

 

[Mrlewy]

If we overbook and can't find seats for the excess people, the Admission dean gets fired, and people have to defer. MD schools may have the cash on hand to give out scholarships to convince people to defer. This happened at Touro-NY this year, and at Stanford recently.

So you said you accept 250 and seat ~100. Say all 250 pick your school, Admission dean gets fired, etc. Say the 150 are happy to defer. Would your school not even bother accepting any applications the following year then? I realize it's unlikely that that many would defer as opposed to go elsewhere, but it's still an interesting scenario.

 

[787593]

So you said you accept 250 and seat ~100. Say all 250 pick your school, Admission dean gets fired, etc. Say the 150 are happy to defer. Would your school not even bother accepting any applications the following year then? I realize it's unlikely that that many would defer as opposed to go elsewhere, but it's still an interesting scenario.

I'm quite confident that the world as we know it would end...

 

[Dr.Sticks]

I knew nothing about this process in high school.
I knew little for most of college.
I remember a group of pre-meds in my freshman undergraduate biology class talking about the MCAT and I asked them, "What is the MCAT, does everyone have to take it?"

So where are you now?
Pre-med, med school, doctor?