Medicine Sub I?

[RaistlinMajere]

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I'll be setting up my schedule soon and will be applying for psychiatry next year. Does anyone have advice on when during 4th year I should schedule a medicine sub I? I'd want residency programs to see the sub I grade, right? Or is it just more important to do one to help prepare for the intern year?

I used the search function, but couldn't find any info on this as it pertains to psych.

 

[Anasazi23]

I don't think it's critical. We all had to do a medicine Sub-I or something equivalent. I would think they're more likely to be impressed with psych-related electives. i.e. peds neuro or some such stuff.

The only thing to keep in mind when creating your clerkship schedule, I think, it not to schedule non-audition rotation during audition time. i.e. don't schedule your medicine sub-I when others will using that time to audition at residency programs via electives prior to the match.

 

[PeeWee137]

my med sub-i will be some time after christmas next year. i have my psych sub-i, my 3 psych electives, and neuro all scheduled before christmas.

 

[josehernandez94]

i'm not exactly an expert in this, since i'm applying this year, but i don't think it matters at all. for the most part, interviewers rarely commented on my grades, beyond a blanket "you've done well academically" type thing. they certainly didn't discuss individual rotations or sub-is. i did mine in october, so the grade wasn't reflected in my transcript nor in my dean's letter.

i think if you get a good grade during your medicine clerkship as a third year, do the sub-i whenever you want. if you just get a "pass" perhaps it would make sense to schedule the sub-i earlier if you think you can do really well, but even then, i just didn't get the feeling that those grades mattered all that much to programs.

 

[sikegeek]

I think it's more important to do one for practice for intern year. I mean, if you can stand doing actual work late in 4th year, that's what I'd recommend.

Noone ever commented on any of my clerkship grades. I don't think anyone cared that much. Mine were nothing special though. I know for a fact that none of the residency programs saw my 4th year elective grades. When you apply through ERAS, only 3rd year stuff is entered. So you even if you did a 4th year medicine sub-i in september, I don't think they'd see the grade.

I think the audition rotation has been the most important thing for me. So, if you're planing one, keep that in mind.

 

[RaistlinMajere]

Thank you all for the advice.

As a follow up, when is the ideal time to schedule an audition rotation? I'm planning on doing one and it seems like getting the scheduling right for the away rotation is more important than the medicine sub I. Any thoughts on the timing of the audition?

 

[sikegeek]

Thank you all for the advice.

As a follow up, when is the ideal time to schedule an audition rotation? I'm planning on doing one and it seems like getting the scheduling right for the away rotation is more important than the medicine sub I. Any thoughts on the timing of the audition?

I did mine in January. I'll let you know if it works out!

 

[Encephalopathy]

Thank you all for the advice.

As a follow up, when is the ideal time to schedule an audition rotation? I'm planning on doing one and it seems like getting the scheduling right for the away rotation is more important than the medicine sub I. Any thoughts on the timing of the audition?

If you're trying to get an interview out of the audition, you should do it before October or so. If you're hoping for a letter, too, do it a little earlier so the writer has some time. As for the medicine Sub-I, I did it in July/August but, as mentioned above, no programs seemed to care about it at all.

 

[DrWuStar]

It's ideal to do audition rotations during the summer or early fall, but it can still be worthwhile to do them later. I had problems scheduling the away rotation I wanted during the summer, so I ended up doing it in November. Attendings I worked with there made some phone calls on my behalf to the PD of the program where I was doing the rotation and also to a couple other programs they had connections to. I think it was very helpful in getting the interviews I wanted. The program I was at also allowed my to submit a supplemental LOR from my attending there after I had already interviewed, and said it would be helpful.

 

[billypilgrim37]

I did a medicine Sub-I in August, and am doing another in March.

You can do two, ya know 😉

 

[cleareyedguy]

Competitive programs look very carefully at grades. If there are no problems, they may not mention them in your interview, but they look at them. In my program, your grade on core medicine may be the single most important grade on your transcript. Psych may be equivalent, but we're aware that there's a tendency to give better grades to people who announce an interest in the field, and so an honors in psych doesn't necessarily mean you'll be a good resident (well, nothing is a guarantee, but we're looking to reduce risk). Anyway, an honors in medicine tends to mean that you'll not only do fine in your internship but will probably pay attention and do the work during your psych residency. Not everybody can make honors, of course, so we then look carefully at the comments for signs of deficiencies, personality problems, etc. A medicine sub-i can be very helpful in that regards since it's a way to show your individual competence.

In thinking about it, grades and scores never lead someone to rise to the top of our rank order list--research, letters, and the interview are crucial for that. Instead, since many transcripts look similar, we probably use grades and their associated comments primarily in order to weed out people and to look for problems.

 

[psychattack]

I am applying (...matching!) this year, and I found my schedule both great for my learning and good for interviews.

I did a psych sub-i at my home institution in August in inpatient adult, then an away audition rotation in inpatient psych in September. After that I did several psych-related electives that I had an interest in.

This was helpful in several ways: The sub-i made it onto my dean's letter and I was able to get a great letter from it. I used the experience from it to do well at my audition rotation. Being there in September was good because I had already applied to the program so they knew my interest and to keep an eye on me during the month, but it was also before they sent out interviews so I had a chance to "get in" early with the PD and make sure I was one of those offerred an interview. At my interview, I referred back to my month there, and they kind of got the impression that I was hanging around a lot and they couldn't get rid of me (in a good way?). Also, doing all these electives early was helpful because when asked: well, how do you know what psychiatry is all about? I could mention these different areas I explored and that it wasn't just on a whim that I applied to the field.

Hope that long-winded answer helps!

 

[RaistlinMajere]

I met with a dean at my school who thought that a medicine or ICU sub I would be a good idea, given that there's a lot of medicine in psych.

Do you have any thoughts about whether a medicine or MICU sub I would be more beneficial?

 

[OldPsychDoc]

I met with a dean at my school who thought that a medicine or ICU sub I would be a good idea, given that there's a lot of medicine in psych.

Do you have any thoughts about whether a medicine or MICU sub I would be more beneficial?

General IM, definitely.

 

[diosa428]

My school offers a Med-Psych SubI. I would obviously do a Psych SubI because I want to do straight Psych, but additionally do you all think a straight Med SubI would be better/worse than a Med-Psych SubI? I'd rather do the Med-Psych SubI because I wasn't really a fan of Gen Med.

 

[billypilgrim37]

I was just wondering what other people meant specifically when they talk about Sub-Is. At my school, we have a two Sub-I requirement, and a Sub-I is defined as an inpatient medicine or surgery month with the responsibilities of an intern. We also have an ICU requirement, and most people use one of those Sub-Is to cover that requirement as well. Psychiatry rotations, even when they are essentially "psychiatry sub-I's" in responsibility, do not count towards the requirement.

But when other people talk about Sub-Is, they seem to speak much more loosely. Does your school use "Sub-I" and "elective" interchangeably? I get freaked out when people talk about doing psych sub-i's and a handful of psych electives, since we're only allowed to do two clinical months of psychiatry period our 4th year. Are there really people who go into internship having not done a month of inpatient medicine since 3rd year?

 

[diosa428]

I was just wondering what other people meant specifically when they talk about Sub-Is. At my school, we have a two Sub-I requirement, and a Sub-I is defined as an inpatient medicine or surgery month with the responsibilities of an intern. We also have an ICU requirement, and most people use one of those Sub-Is to cover that requirement as well. Psychiatry rotations, even when they are essentially "psychiatry sub-I's" in responsibility, do not count towards the requirement.

But when other people talk about Sub-Is, they seem to speak much more loosely. Does your school use "Sub-I" and "elective" interchangeably? I get freaked out when people talk about doing psych sub-i's and a handful of psych electives, since we're only allowed to do two clinical months of psychiatry period our 4th year. Are there really people who go into internship having not done a month of inpatient medicine since 3rd year?

Our requirement is one Sub-I and one critical care block. Our school offers Sub-Is in medicine, surgery, psych, family med, ob/gyn and peds. They are not the same thing as electives - we have separate electives in each area for students who are not expected to perform at the level of an intern. So yes, theoretically, I could take a Psych SubI and not do medicine at all.

 

[futuredo32]

Are IM Sub-I's essential? I only get four months of non-surgical electives and I'd really rather do a few psychiatry rotations and other things that I haven't gotten a chance to do yet. I wll be doing one of my required IM rotations during fourth year(we don't do all of our required rotations during third year at MSU).

 

[michaelrack]

My school offers a Med-Psych SubI. I would obviously do a Psych SubI because I want to do straight Psych, but additionally do you all think a straight Med SubI would be better/worse than a Med-Psych SubI? I'd rather do the Med-Psych SubI because I wasn't really a fan of Gen Med.

Unless you are planning on doing a med/psych combined residency, I would recommend a straight medicine Sub-I. I did a med/psych sub-I and found it difficult dealing with 2 separate attendings. At your stage of education, I would recommend getting a solid IM experince through a medicine sub-I

 

[PeeWee137]

Our requirement is one Sub-I and one critical care block. Our school offers Sub-Is in medicine, surgery, psych, family med, ob/gyn and peds. They are not the same thing as electives - we have separate electives in each area for students who are not expected to perform at the level of an intern. So yes, theoretically, I could take a Psych SubI and not do medicine at all.

my school is the same - you can do a sub-i in any one of those 6 areas. we have a 2 sub-i requirement, they cannot be in the same field, and one of them has to be done at our school's affiliated hospitals.

im doing a medicine sub-i for 3 reasons - i cant do 2 psych sub-i's, my 3rd year medicine rotation sucked, and i have to do a sub-i at my school's affiliates b/c none of our hospitals offer a psych sub-i.

i have 3 electives that are being spent on psych in some shape or form. i have a medicine "selective" thats going towards neuro. im doing an outpatient peds rotation (a required preceptorship, but i chose peds cause i like kids). my surgical "selective" is going towards ophtho or reproductive endo (has to be in surg or ob/gyn). and i have required EM and radiology.

 

[diosa428]

Unless you are planning on doing a med/psych combined residency, I would recommend a straight medicine Sub-I. I did a med/psych sub-I and found it difficult dealing with 2 separate attendings. At your stage of education, I would recommend getting a solid IM experince through a medicine sub-I

Our hospital actually has a gen med team that only takes med/psych patients, so I would be on that team for a month and therefore only have to deal with one attending. But yeah, I agree I should probably just do a medicine month... I just don't want to 😎