Missing statistics on COVID-19?

[Ailiniel]

I am wondering if there may be purposefully withheld or missing data on whom had died after contracting COVID-19. I had heard that there were news from China that there were younger population who had also died during this mishap, including patients who were in their 20's and doctors in their 30's, but these information were intentionally not included out of the government's fear of a crashing market. Therefore current thought that it is just the older population that is seriously affected may not be the complete truth. If this is the case, then this situation is not being taken as seriously as it should be. It would be interesting to see actual observations and research on this, like what is happening in the US.

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[pharmacy_sucks]

Of course~

Never trust the wicked Chinese government. They manipulate GDP data, stock market & everything.

If you look at Italy fatality rate, from JHU dashboard. Fatality rate is closer to 8%, 7.5% to be exact.

 

[Ailiniel]

If you look at Italy fatality rate, from JHU dashboard. Fatality rate is closer to 8%, 7.5% to be exact.

I think Italy supposedly was one of those countries that had a higher older population. We still need closer look at the data though.

Edit: Actually... "More than half of the critical cases in the Netherlands and Italy are under 50. " Halvdelen af de kritisk-smittesyge i Holland er under 50 år | Økonomisk Ugebrev

And this ... Truth Has Become a Coronavirus Casualty

 

[wagrxm2000]

This death rate will end up being under 1%

 

[Sine Cura]

CFR is certainly truncated in both directions but that is little solace to those on a vent 'cause of this

 

[mentos]

China tried to shutdown the original doctor who discovered the virus. They could have stopped the spread of the whole thing but instead they condemned the doctor and swept it under the rug. China is one of the most corrupt countries.

Of course the US government is withholding data. These stats are a joke. Why can't hospitals confirm their own cases? They have to wait for the CDC to confirm?

Life at the epicenter of N.J.’s coronavirus outbreak | ROI-NJ

(Editor’s Note: This story originally appeared on ROI-NJ.com on March 14. We interviewed Mike Maron again for a story that appeared April 1. Read it here.) Eleven cases. Six of which are in the ICU. And 40 more patients under observation. All at Holy Name Medical Center in Teaneck. The numbers...

www.roi-nj.com

The CDC hasn't even confirmed the first case at the epicenter of New Jersey.

 

[Old Timer]

This death rate will end up being under 1%

The death rate from seasonal flu is 0.1%. That means we can expect anywhere from 200,000 to 750,000 deaths in the United States. That is not an inconsequential number.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

I'm sure we can trust both Chinese and US government... PUHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA

 

[wagrxm2000]

The death rate from seasonal flu is 0.1%. That means we can expect anywhere from 200,000 to 750,000 deaths in the United States. That is not an inconsequential number.

I think the number of cases are much higher then reported is all I'm saying

Just reading about some of the mild cases, I could see many healthy people not getting tested thinking they just have a cold.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

I think the number of cases are much higher then reported is all I'm saying

Just reading about some of the mild cases, I could see many healthy people not getting tested thinking they just have a cold.

Same for the flu. Not everyone with the flu will be treated or tested. Death rate probably is the only accurate number for both infections. I personally have not officially been tested for the flu nor have I gone in for a treatment when I was sick with the flu. I'm sure that's the case for most of healthy people.

 

[wagrxm2000]

Same for the flu. Not everyone with the flu will be treated or tested. Death rate probably is the only accurate number for both infections. I personally have not officially been tested for the flu nor have I gone in for a treatment when I was sick with the flu. I'm sure that's the case for most of healthy people.

Flu is always an estimate, I'm curious if after this is all over if they will give an estimate or just leave it at confirmed cases.

 

[owlegrad]

Hard to imagine anyone right now being sick and NOT thinking it is corona. Heck I think healthy people think they have it.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Flu is always an estimate, I'm curious if after this is all over if they will give an estimate or just leave it at confirmed cases.

Right, which is why I think this nationwide panic is stupid. We have to consider not only the ones who chose not to go to the doctor but those who can't afford to which is a pretty large amount I imagine.

 

[rxkrafted]

These cases are severely under reported for sure. People are testing positive each and every day in hospitals that have reported it to the health department but haven't made it to the statistical number yet. The one factor that makes it so dangerous is its long incubation period and asymptomatic people are spreading it without knowing it... including healthcare professionals who could be spreading it to vulnerable patients who are already ill with other diseases.
My hospital has some confirmed cases that have been reported and many pending results for others. For those in retail, is your staff required to wear face masks while working?

 

[wagrxm2000]

These cases are severely under reported for sure. People are testing positive each and every day in hospitals that have reported it to the health department but haven't made it to the statistical number yet. The one factor that makes it so dangerous is its long incubation period and asymptomatic people are spreading it without knowing it... including healthcare professionals who could be spreading it to vulnerable patients who are already ill with other diseases.
My hospital has some confirmed cases that have been reported and many pending results for others. For those in retail, is your staff required to wear face masks while working?

Why would they wear face masks?

 

[Old Timer]

I think the number of cases are much higher then reported is all I'm saying

Just reading about some of the mild cases, I could see many healthy people not getting tested thinking they just have a cold.

There is absolutely no question you are 100% correct. The current administration has totally botched this, It's heartbreaking with three months notice we would not have prepared for this. Now we will have to shut the entire country down for a couple of weeks.... If we had the correct number of tests we would know who was infected and be able to trace them and we might have been able to isolate and control this. Now it's 100% about mitigation. If we do not flatten this curve we will be Italy.

 

[rxkrafted]

Why would they wear face masks?

because they interact closely with patients when they counsel, answer questions, and give vaccinations? Gloves may not be a bad idea depending on how sanitary all the pharmacy staff is... Imagine a tech ringing out a customer for some cough meds that they just coughed all over before bringing it to the cashier then that same tech began filling meds and handing stuff over to the pharmacist?

 

[Old Timer]

because they interact closely with patients when they counsel, answer questions, and give vaccinations? Gloves may not be a bad idea depending on how sanitary all the pharmacy staff is... Imagine a tech ringing out a customer for some cough meds that they just coughed all over before bringing it to the cashier then that same tech began filling meds and handing stuff over to the pharmacist?

Then they would be *****s who should have their license revoked. Unless they have M-95 masks that are for one time use only, regular masks will not do anything. They are for the following people:

People who are sick who do not want to spread their illness​

Asthmatics who wheeze when exposed to cold air​

People with oxygen​

​

Wearing a drug store mask will do nothing to prevent you from getting sick, unless a person with Covid breathes in your face and even that it can get in through your eyes that's why people in hospitals are in the hazmat suits.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

China tried to shutdown the original doctor who discovered the virus. They could have stopped the spread of the whole thing but instead they condemned the doctor and swept it under the rug. China is one of the most corrupt countries.

Of course the US government is withholding data. These stats are a joke. Why can't hospitals confirm their own cases? They have to wait for the CDC to confirm?

Life at the epicenter of N.J.’s coronavirus outbreak | ROI-NJ

(Editor’s Note: This story originally appeared on ROI-NJ.com on March 14. We interviewed Mike Maron again for a story that appeared April 1. Read it here.) Eleven cases. Six of which are in the ICU. And 40 more patients under observation. All at Holy Name Medical Center in Teaneck. The numbers...

www.roi-nj.com

The CDC hasn't even confirmed the first case at the epicenter of New Jersey.

cuz Trump wants to buoy stock market. Bloodbaths after bloodbaths. Geez, if sell-off continues, he won't get re-elected.

 

[mentos]

cuz Trump wants to buoy stock market. Bloodbaths after bloodbaths. Geez, if sell-off continues, he won't get re-elected.

Today was the first time he was not favored for reelection. Biden has the best odds to win now.

2024 Presidential Election Odds: Trump Favored To Win

We are quickly approaching the 2022 midterm elections, presenting Americans their first opportunity to show their feelings toward President Joe

www.oddsshark.com

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

I think Italy supposedly was one of those countries that had a higher older population. We still need closer look at the data though.

Edit: Actually... "More than half of the critical cases in the Netherlands and Italy are under 50. " Halvdelen af de kritisk-smittesyge i Holland er under 50 år | Økonomisk Ugebrev

And this ... Truth Has Become a Coronavirus Casualty

The Chinese whistle blower doctor was only like 30ish yo, otherwise healthy male. He died of covid-19, along with other 3000+ (again reported by Chinese government, largely underestimating) healthcare workers infected. Who knows what the true value is? Twitter accounts from Wuhan reported the city crematorium was burning corpses 24/7, and they were hiring people with something equivalent to $140 USD/hr.

If you trust what they tell you, this whole pandemic would have long been controlled.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Today was the first time he was not favored for reelection. Biden has the best odds to win now.

2024 Presidential Election Odds: Trump Favored To Win

We are quickly approaching the 2022 midterm elections, presenting Americans their first opportunity to show their feelings toward President Joe

www.oddsshark.com

From my own selfish perspective, I want Trump to remain president lol. Keep botching useless emergency proposals, and we will see a housing crash in no time lol. Before it goes up, I want it to go low, like real low

 

[mentos]

From my own selfish perspective, I want Trump to remain president lol. Keep botching useless emergency proposals, and we will see a housing crash in no time lol. Before it goes up, I want it to go low, like real low

In my area the housing market did not crash in 2008-2009. The prices remained flat, then quickly rose. Buy a house when you are ready. Don't try to time the real estate market.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

In my area the housing market did not crash in 2008-2009. The prices remained flat, then quickly rose. Buy a house when you are ready. Don't try to time the real estate market.

I am in SF bay, and Cisco & Hitachi Vantara are laying off hundreds of employees. With a stock and crypto market like this, Uber, Lyft, Slack, Coinbase and whole bunch of former unicorns will have to let go some of their employees very soon. Housing market didn't really crash here in 2009, but the value did drop significantly, like 1M to 700k, or something like that. It didn't fully recover to previous 2008 level until 2013-2014, I think.

 

[pharmacy_sucks]

Then they would be *****s who should have their license revoked. Unless they have M-95 masks that are for one time use only, regular masks will not do anything. They are for the following people:

People who are sick who do not want to spread their illness​

Asthmatics who wheeze when exposed to cold air​

People with oxygen​

​

Wearing a drug store mask will do nothing to prevent you from getting sick, unless a person with Covid breathes in your face and even that it can get in through your eyes that's why people in hospitals are in the hazmat suits.

I honestly don't believe a single word of what she said.

covid-19 is more contagious than sars, and i think this is now a consensus. even back in 2003, chinese officials asked all hospital staff to wear N95 with goggles to protect themselves from sars. so now she is saying it provides no benefit to people who is not sick? what a joke

 

[rxkrafted]

Then they would be *****s who should have their license revoked. Unless they have M-95 masks that are for one time use only, regular masks will not do anything. They are for the following people:

People who are sick who do not want to spread their illness​

Asthmatics who wheeze when exposed to cold air​

People with oxygen​

​

Wearing a drug store mask will do nothing to prevent you from getting sick, unless a person with Covid breathes in your face and even that it can get in through your eyes that's why people in hospitals are in the hazmat suits.

I guess all these healthcare professionals using regular masks when treating these patients should have their license revoked... They aren't enough N95 masks available, even in hospitals....

 

[wagrxm2000]

I guess all these healthcare professionals using regular masks when treating these patients should have their license revoked... They aren't enough N95 masks available, even in hospitals....

So you want everyone to wear masks in public?

 

[BMBiology]

I sense some panic in this thread. If you accept the worst case scenario (2M Americans will die), your mind will relax and you will think rationally.

Besides, if this is the big one, do you want to argue about masks?

 

[wagrxm2000]

Mark my words, we won't break 30k deaths in the US.

(We'll see how this ages)

 

[rxkrafted]

So you want everyone to wear masks in public?

i never said that... i am referring to those healthcare professionals who come in contact routinely with those potentially infected. You enjoy arguments.

 

[Old Timer]

I guess all these healthcare professionals using regular masks when treating these patients should have their license revoked... They aren't enough N95 masks available, even in hospitals....

Retail pharmacists are not those people. Hospital pharmacists aren't either unless they are going into patient's rooms and if they are masks won't help. They need the whole hazmat getup. Pharmacists should not wear masks, period....

 

[wagrxm2000]

i never said that... i am referring to those healthcare professionals who come in contact routinely with those potentially infected. You enjoy arguments.

No one is making you respond.

Any person still working is coming in contact with potentially infected people.

Should the front register wear a mask?

Are you going out in public still outside work? Do you wear a mask then too?

Congrats on your first argument with me. Not many can say that.

 

[rxkrafted]

No one is making you respond.

Any person still working is coming in contact with potentially infected people.

Should the front register wear a mask?

I can see what you're saying but i still think theres more risk of interacting with someone who may be infected then spreading it to others since they are confined within a small space

 

[BMBiology]

Mark my words, we won't break 30k deaths.

(We'll see how this ages)

I am certainly hoping for the best. Some of the projected numbers are the worst case scenario. I am preparing for the worse but I hope we don't get there.

 

[SClENCE]

I don't think USA will be nearly as bad as Italy, Spain, and China because we implemented travel bans way sooner, schools are closed, my gym is closed, restaurants are closed, and there hasn't even been a confirmed case within 50 miles of where I live. Europe waited until it was full-blown to do anything.

Yeah Trump downplayed it but you can blame the FDA for there being no tests, it was only a day or two ago that they waived their approval process so tests can be produced. Testing doesn't do anything to contain the virus anyways. All we can do is stay away from people and practice hand hygiene.

 

[Old Timer]

Mark my words, we won't break 30k deaths.

(We'll see how this ages)

This depends entirely and mean entirely on how we behave,. If we do the social distancing thing correctly, and we are not, we can push the cruve down and prevent a surge of patients that will collapse our health care system. We don't have enough ICU beds, ventilators or Isolation units to treat everyone. That is where the deaths come in. We may have the same number of infected people either way it's just we have to slow the growth. It's entirely up to us.

 

[Old Timer]

I don't think USA will be nearly as bad as Italy, Spain, and China because we implemented travel bans way sooner, schools are closed, my gym is closed, restaurants are closed, and there hasn't even been a confirmed case within 50 miles of where I live. Europe waited until it was full-blown to do anything.

Yeah Trump downplayed it but you can blame the FDA for there being no tests, it was only a day or two ago that they waived their approval process so tests can be produced. Testing doesn't do anything to contain the virus anyways. All we can do is stay away from people and practice hand hygiene.

You are living in dream world. Testing is everything. If we had enough tests we would have been able to contain this already. There are thousands and maybe hundreds of thousands of people who are infected and we don't know it.... History will not look kindly on Trump for this. It was a colossal failure of leadership.

By the way, Italy banned travel from China 3 days before the US.

 

[King2440]

2 healthy individuals in their 20s and 30s are in critics care right now in Dallas.

On the other hand, people are STILL congregating to their grocery stores in mass numbers.

This will not be like Italy at all, it will be much much worse.

 

[SClENCE]

You are living in dream world. Testing is everything. If we had enough tests we would have been able to contain this already. There are thousands and maybe hundreds of thousands of people who are infected and we don't know it.... History will not look kindly on Trump for this. It was a colossal failure of leadership.

By the way, Italy banned travel from China 3 days before the US.

Yeah and Italy is about 3 weeks ahead of us on the outbreak timeline. So they banned travel 3 weeks later than us in relative terms.

 

[wagrxm2000]

You are living in dream world. Testing is everything. If we had enough tests we would have been able to contain this already. There are thousands and maybe hundreds of thousands of people who are infected and we don't know it.... History will not look kindly on Trump for this. It was a colossal failure of leadership.

By the way, Italy banned travel from China 3 days before the US.

Oh come on, we have no idea how many people were already infected here by the time we heard about it.

So next time there is a scare do you want us to lock down the US immediately and give out a trillion dollars bailout right then?

False Claim About CDC's Global Anti-Pandemic Work - FactCheck.org

As the COVID-19 disease caused by the new coronavirus has spread around the world, a number of politicians, news organizations and public figures have made the false claim that the Trump administration cut the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention's anti-pandemic work in over 40 countries...

www.factcheck.org

People need to stop listening to everything they hear on the news.

Like they said today, if they were given a viable test, they would have used it.

 

[Farmgurl20]

Retail pharmacists are not those people. Hospital pharmacists aren't either unless they are going into patient's rooms and if they are masks won't help. They need the whole hazmat getup. Pharmacists should not wear masks, period....

I heard student being exposed to positive patient while being on rotation. This student went into patient room to do discharge.

 

[wazoodog]

Any person still working is coming in contact with potentially infected people.

Should the front register wear a mask?

Are you going out in public still outside work? Do you wear a mask then too?

FWIW, that's pretty much how it works in South Korea and Japan (and it's been culturally accepted there for several years).

If everyone is doing it, I think it does help prevent the spread. South Korea has among the highest population densities in the world and the number of cases may have very well been much higher if everyone wasn't practicing both social distancing and the use of face masks when out in public. The eyes are also suspect but wearing glasses, although not considered eye protection, might help block someone's cough spittle landing directly in your eye.

However, I guess here in the US we aren't really stocked for the everyone in the general public to wear masks. In South Korea, masks were in shortage but most people already had some and they're able to replenish the stock fairly quickly - not to mention each citizen has been getting issued a certain number of masks per week.

This is a rather interesting study also: Effectiveness of facemasks to reduce exposure hazards for airborne infections among general populations

Sure it's not a foolproof 100% protection, but it's bound to help block a good amount of respiratory droplets coming out of someone's mouth or landing on one's face.

 

[wagrxm2000]

FWIW, that's pretty much how it works in South Korea and Japan (and it's been culturally accepted there for several years).

If everyone is doing it, I think it does help prevent the spread. South Korea has among the highest population densities in the world and the number of cases may have very well been much higher if everyone wasn't practicing both social distancing and the use of face masks when out in public. The eyes are also suspect but wearing glasses, although not considered eye protection, might help block someone's cough spittle landing directly in your eye.

However, I guess here in the US we aren't really stocked for the everyone in the general public to wear masks. In South Korea, masks were in shortage but most people already had some and they're able to replenish the stock fairly quickly - not to mention each citizen has been getting issued a certain number of masks per week.

This is a rather interesting study also: Effectiveness of facemasks to reduce exposure hazards for airborne infections among general populations

Sure it's not a foolproof 100% protection, but it's bound to help block a good amount of respiratory droplets coming out of someone's mouth or landing on one's face.

That's your issue, we can't give everyone masks.

Masks should only be worn by those already sick and not by those worried.

Even if we did have enough masks, proper hygiene is all you need in public.

 

[BMBiology]

That's your issue, we can't give everyone masks.

Masks should only be worn by those already sick and not by those worried.

Even if we did have enough masks, proper hygiene is all you need in public.

What is your deal with masks? Who cares

 

[wagrxm2000]

What is your deal with masks? Who cares

Because we are having trouble making them???

 

[Sine Cura]

By "we" you mean made in China or Vietnam?

 

[Seriously Serious]

Today was the first time he was not favored for reelection. Biden has the best odds to win now.

2024 Presidential Election Odds: Trump Favored To Win

We are quickly approaching the 2022 midterm elections, presenting Americans their first opportunity to show their feelings toward President Joe

www.oddsshark.com

Lol because the thing this country needs to turn the economy around is a democrat with dementia

 

[Latentk]

This thread is unbelievable and should be locked. Y'all were having a decent discussion of possible under reporting and the stats themselves but then it devolved into Trump warfare and face masks. Y'all really need to reset your priorities and focus on the data and not on some politician who makes you angry.

The stats as they are presented (with confirmed vs CFR) still sits at 0.9% for ALL healthy humans regardless of co-morbidities. Add a single co-morbid condition and your ratio goes way way up (as high as 15%). This data actually excludes Wuhan province (I think its the epicenter?) which had an overall fatality rate of (at least thus far reported) 12%. That is absolute bananas considering it is a respiratory virus. If you consider the minimum it will harm folks you know and folks you are friends with. Please at least consider this seriously and ignore outside influences as it does absolutely nothing for you or for your patients.

 

[wagrxm2000]

Interesting, no new China cases.

What will be more interesting is if we surpass China in deaths

 

[Chrish]

I would never trust anything reported in China.

After all that has happened, do people seriously believe their true figure is 3000 deaths only? Give me a break!