Quantcast

MMPI-2 v. MMPI-2 RF in Clinical, Forensic, & Neuropsych Assessment

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.

Therapist4Chnge

Neuropsych Ninja
Moderator Emeritus
15+ Year Member
Joined
Oct 7, 2006
Messages
21,977
Reaction score
3,344
I was trained on the MMPI-2, and that is what I am most comfortable with...though there has been a lot more talk about the MMPI-2 RF in the last few years. I wanted to get a better idea of how widely (or not) the MMPI-2 RF is being taught and used in general clinical practice and also in the forensic setting.

My professional interest is in regard to using the MMPI-2 RF instead of the MMPI-2 as part of a neuropsychological battery, though I am hesitant to jump right to it if it isn't well supported yet. I haven't had a chance to dig into the most recent literature (or related achived listserv discussions), so I'm hoping there are some SDN folks who have looked into this area.

For those in clinical practice....are you using the MMPI-2, MMPI-2 RF, or both?

For those still in training...are you learning the MMPI-2 RF or are they still only teaching the MMPI-2?

For those in clinical forensic practice...has the MMPI-2 RF been adopted as a viable alternative to the MMPI-2, or is there still not enough data to support it in the court room?

For those in neuropsych practice...what personality measures (if any?) do you use when personality is clinically indicated?
 

AcronymAllergy

Neuropsychologist
Volunteer Staff
10+ Year Member
  • Joined
    Jan 7, 2010
    Messages
    8,406
    Reaction score
    3,594
    We were instructed in the MMPI-2; the RF was just coming out, but as far as I know, they're still teaching the 2.

    Personally, though, I generally prefer, use, and am overall more comfortable with the PAI.
     

    RoseRed2

    Full Member
    Joined
    Dec 15, 2011
    Messages
    18
    Reaction score
    0
    Yes, I learned the RF as well as the 2 as part of my clinical training. I am doing a neuropsych practicum currently at a medical practice and we only use the RF. I did another practicum at a local hospital and we used the 2 when we wanted a personality measure though.
     

    RGirl

    Full Member
    Joined
    Dec 17, 2010
    Messages
    98
    Reaction score
    1
    I'm currently on internship, working in part at an academic medical center. We are just ordering the RF now, with it being generally encouraged by the department as a way of saving time without sacrificing much information, although I think the MMPI-2 will remain an option.

    Perhaps because I did my psychometric training in my first year of my Masters, which is now several years back, I have heard very little about the RF until it was brought up in a staff meeting here.
     

    Pragma

    Neuropsychologist
    10+ Year Member
    Joined
    Dec 29, 2011
    Messages
    3,309
    Reaction score
    714
    I think my expectations for the RF were too high. I just haven't found it very helpful or to add much value in cases I have used it for compared to what I was expecting. The only thing I like is that it is a little shorter.

    Like AA, I use the PAI here a bit and like it a little better conceptually (although it is poorly worded in places). I throw an MCMI in as well when it makes sense.
     

    Rivi

    Full Member
    10+ Year Member
    Joined
    Jan 29, 2009
    Messages
    413
    Reaction score
    155
    I am in training, currently.

    In class I learned the MMPI-2, although my professors debated whether or not to teach the RF.

    I have been to two different sites, the neuropsych hospital site used the RF, the college counseling center site used the MMPI-2.
     

    Therapist4Chnge

    Neuropsych Ninja
    Moderator Emeritus
    15+ Year Member
    Joined
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages
    21,977
    Reaction score
    3,344
    IIRC the -RF was published in 2008ish, so I'm surprised that it hasn't made more progress in 3+ years. The field, in general, is slow to adopt new things. I only started using the WAIS-IV about a year and a half ago, even though it has been out since 2008. I know things are even slower in the court system, but I'm trying to avoid buying something that isn't going to be widely supported.
     

    JeyRo

    Full Member
    7+ Year Member
    Joined
    Mar 26, 2012
    Messages
    860
    Reaction score
    61
    I've been hearing about training being on the verge of being offered for the MMPI-RF here at my local VA for approximately the last year, but it's never materialized.

    Was trained in the PAI, the MCMI, the MBMD (which indexes more coping style / coping behaviors than personality), the PACL as well as the MMPI2. Currently I just use the MMPI2 every once in a while with patients, mostly use the PACL, mostly due to the setting I work in (long term care).
     

    Therapist4Chnge

    Neuropsych Ninja
    Moderator Emeritus
    15+ Year Member
    Joined
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages
    21,977
    Reaction score
    3,344
    Was trained in the PAI, the MCMI, the MBMD (which indexes more coping style / coping behaviors than personality), the PACL as well as the MMPI2. Currently I just use the MMPI2 every once in a while with patients, mostly use the PACL, mostly due to the setting I work in (long term care).

    Have you had any exposure to the CPI (California Psychological Inventory)? I used it a few times while in the VA, but I didn't find it any better than an MCMI or PAI. The MMPI-2 was the 'go to', but between the length and higher chance of an invalid profile...I tried not to use it too much.
     

    JeyRo

    Full Member
    7+ Year Member
    Joined
    Mar 26, 2012
    Messages
    860
    Reaction score
    61
    Have you had any exposure to the CPI (California Psychological Inventory)? I used it a few times while in the VA, but I didn't find it any better than an MCMI or PAI. The MMPI-2 was the 'go to', but between the length and higher chance of an invalid profile...I tried not to use it too much.

    Never used the CPI.... I only use the MMPI2 every once in a while with people because it seems like abuse, almost, for my older folks to make them perform a test administration that's so lengthy :laugh:

    PACL is much better because it's so short and the interpretive program is so user-friendly, also normed on a non-psychiatric population which is better with my population (e.g., not a psych. hospital population).

    Wish I used the MBMD and PAI more, I've largely just gotten out of the habit. Probably not good.
     

    Pragma

    Neuropsychologist
    10+ Year Member
    Joined
    Dec 29, 2011
    Messages
    3,309
    Reaction score
    714
    Never used the CPI.... I only use the MMPI2 every once in a while with people because it seems like abuse, almost, for my older folks to make them perform a test administration that's so lengthy :laugh:

    PACL is much better because it's so short and the interpretive program is so user-friendly, also normed on a non-psychiatric population which is better with my population (e.g., not a psych. hospital population).

    Wish I used the MBMD and PAI more, I've largely just gotten out of the habit. Probably not good.

    MBMD is kind of a nice measure. I use it sometimes.

    I use the personality measures, but don't put tons of stock into them by themselves. IMO, there is a lack of specificity and I hate it when I see clinicians just paste stuff from the printout, dx included, into their report.
     
    D

    deleted176373

    I was trained on the MMPI-2, and that is what I am most comfortable with...though there has been a lot more talk about the MMPI-2 RF in the last few years. I wanted to get a better idea of how widely (or not) the MMPI-2 RF is being taught and used in general clinical practice and also in the forensic setting.

    My professional interest is in regard to using the MMPI-2 RF instead of the MMPI-2 as part of a neuropsychological battery, though I am hesitant to jump right to it if it isn't well supported yet. I haven't had a chance to dig into the most recent literature (or related achived listserv discussions), so I'm hoping there are some SDN folks who have looked into this area.

    For those in clinical practice....are you using the MMPI-2, MMPI-2 RF, or both?

    For those still in training...are you learning the MMPI-2 RF or are they still only teaching the MMPI-2?

    For those in clinical forensic practice...has the MMPI-2 RF been adopted as a viable alternative to the MMPI-2, or is there still not enough data to support it in the court room?

    For those in neuropsych practice...what personality measures (if any?) do you use when personality is clinically indicated?

    Been trained in both, clearly you can get both out of the MMPI-2 administration. They are different tools for the same job, in a clinical setting the 2RF is easier to use, in a forensic setting the MMPI-2 has more published support. I think you can support the use of the 2RF in court given it's reasonably strong psychometrics. In most forensic settings the 2RF is just one facet and unless it is unreasonably different than all the other data, no one is going to challenge that one assessment alone.

    I would use both, but would standardize on the MMPI-2 for forensic setting and using the 2RF in cases where I believed that the 2RF report added value not apparent in the MMPI-2 (e.g. lack of scale interdependence). Some of the supplemental scales on the MMPI-2 are simply not present in the 2RF, which is something worth considering as well as the research base.
     

    TwinB13

    Full Member
    Joined
    Feb 23, 2012
    Messages
    12
    Reaction score
    0
    I am currently a psychometrist, have been for the last 6 years, and work in neuropsychology (outpatient, acute inpatient and rehabilitation). I will be beginning my doctoral PhD training this fall.

    We use the MMPI-2, MMPI-2-RF, PAI, SCL-90-R and BSI daily.

    There are 5 neuropsychologists in our practice and everyone has their preferences. As you can imagine in the neuropsychology department we see a lot of patients with chronic pain, substance abuse disorders, mood disorders with co morbid medical or cognitive disorders and those with memory complaints.

    Clinically, the MMPI-2-RF definitely has some benefits. The question wording is much better than MMPI2 and PAI and it is absolutely more brief. Really crucial for patients. We also have Q Local networked so all of these are done on the computer with audio. Even patients who have never used a computer can complete the questionnaires. The crucial improvement in the RF is the over-reporting sensitivity. Frequently the MMPI-2 would give "invalid" results with patients within our practice.

    One of our neuropsychologists who now only uses the RF went to a conference for training and then converted 2 to RF. In Q-Local you can have a patient complete the MMPI-2 and then once scored convert it to the RF. It is a really good tool to familiarize yourself with the instrument.

    good luck!
     

    Therapist4Chnge

    Neuropsych Ninja
    Moderator Emeritus
    15+ Year Member
    Joined
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages
    21,977
    Reaction score
    3,344
    Clinically, the MMPI-2-RF definitely has some benefits. The question wording is much better than MMPI2 and PAI and it is absolutely more brief. Really crucial for patients. We also have Q Local networked so all of these are done on the computer with audio. Even patients who have never used a computer can complete the questionnaires. The crucial improvement in the RF is the over-reporting sensitivity. Frequently the MMPI-2 would give "invalid" results with patients within our practice.

    One of our neuropsychologists who now only uses the RF went to a conference for training and then converted 2 to RF. In Q-Local you can have a patient complete the MMPI-2 and then once scored convert it to the RF. It is a really good tool to familiarize yourself with the instrument.

    good luck!

    Can anyone speak to this? I still haven't gotten around to the -RF, but I'm considering a few different options for how to best address personality eval for instances when I suspect more 'psych stuff' going on in a neuropsych referral.
     

    serotonin

    Full Member
    10+ Year Member
    7+ Year Member
    Joined
    Jan 9, 2007
    Messages
    157
    Reaction score
    1
    I learned the MMPI-2, but now on internship we are exclusively using the RF.
     

    serotonin

    Full Member
    10+ Year Member
    7+ Year Member
    Joined
    Jan 9, 2007
    Messages
    157
    Reaction score
    1
    well- it has been hard to get a good "feel" for it, as I am SO used to the MMPI-2 (taught the graduate practicum class on it for 2 years, wrote up 100+).

    Honestly I feel like too much of a beginner to have an informed opinion. I've probably written up 10 reports that incorporated it, and heavily relied on the manual's interpretations for the 3 or 4 sentences I put in. I need to learn a LOT more about it.
     
    Top