MSTP: UCSD vs UCLA for Biomedical Engineering

[kvm90]

Can't believe I'm actually doing this right now, but here it goes:

I got into UCLA and UCSD's MSTP programs, and I'm excited and humbled by both acceptances. I'm pretty paralyzed by choice, so I'm hoping for some insight from non-biased others. Frankly, I'm surrounded by MDs in my job, and so I'm having difficulty truly accessing the weight of the MD program (which my MD coworkers seem to weigh more heavily) versus the weight of the PhD program (which PIs along my interview path, as well as my intuitions, feel should be weighed more heavily). So, the following is my thought process so far, and commentary is most welcome.

I'm 95% sure I want to do my PhD in Biomedical Engineering (leaving 5% purely because who knows what can happen?). Some facts I'm struggling with are:

Pro UCLA:
1. PIs at both schools said UCLA's medical school is more highly regarded, and that's possibly a plus
2. A very impressive professor in BME took a particular interest in me, and really can take my career towards the path I currently aspire to (which has been the same since I've been 16). He spent the entire day with me, took me out to lunch, and showed me his lab/research environment/current projects etc.
3. The curriculum is really flexible, and the students have a really high QOL - the camaraderie of the class was evident
4. It's strong across the board, so I have insurance in case (for some reason) I switch PhDs or research interests

Con UCLA:
1. Housing is expensive and small
2. IMO I like SD a tad better than sprawling LA... though I do like LA
3. Their bioengineering is not really on the map, especially relative to UCSD

Pro UCSD:
1. UCSD has one of the strongest biomedical engineering programs (arguably #1, 2, or 3 in the country)
2. I like SD a little better
3. I really connected with the MSTP students as well as the MD students, and felt a similar camaraderie between all classes
4. The UCSD profs I met with were similarly strong; one was the #5 most funded in his field, another #30 in that same field. They all were more than interested in having me in their lab (but didn't take the entire day off for me - like the prof at UCLA - so I got less of a feel for their ability to mentor)
5. Grad housing is cheap - I'd live more comfortably

Con UCSD:
1. I'm sacrificing med school strength (arguably?)
2. I may just be charmed by the city's beauty and in reality could have little idea if I'll like it more than LA

I feel blessed to be in this position, and I want to just finally make my decision so I can rejoice and move forward. Thanks in advance for your help!

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[byaaaaaaah23]

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[Jay11jayjay]

Can't believe I'm actually doing this right now, but here it goes:

I got into UCLA and UCSD's MSTP programs, and I'm excited and humbled by both acceptances. I'm pretty paralyzed by choice, so I'm hoping for some insight from non-biased others. Frankly, I'm surrounded by MDs in my job, and so I'm having difficulty truly accessing the weight of the MD program (which my MD coworkers seem to weigh more heavily) versus the weight of the PhD program (which PIs along my interview path, as well as my intuitions, feel should be weighed more heavily). So, the following is my thought process so far, and commentary is most welcome.

I'm 95% sure I want to do my PhD in Biomedical Engineering (leaving 5% purely because who knows what can happen?). Some facts I'm struggling with are:

Pro UCLA:
1. PIs at both schools said UCLA's medical school is more highly regarded, and that's possibly a plus
2. A very impressive professor in BME took a particular interest in me, and really can take my career towards the path I currently aspire to (which has been the same since I've been 16). He spent the entire day with me, took me out to lunch, and showed me his lab/research environment/current projects etc.
3. The curriculum is really flexible, and the students have a really high QOL - the camaraderie of the class was evident
4. It's strong across the board, so I have insurance in case (for some reason) I switch PhDs or research interests

Con UCLA:
1. Housing is expensive and small
2. IMO I like SD a tad better than sprawling LA... though I do like LA
3. Their bioengineering is not really on the map, especially relative to UCSD

Pro UCSD:
1. UCSD has one of the strongest biomedical engineering programs (arguably #1, 2, or 3 in the country)
2. I like SD a little better
3. I really connected with the MSTP students as well as the MD students, and felt a similar camaraderie between all classes
4. The UCSD profs I met with were similarly strong; one was the #5 most funded in his field, another #30 in that same field. They all were more than interested in having me in their lab (but didn't take the entire day off for me - like the prof at UCLA - so I got less of a feel for their ability to mentor)
5. Grad housing is cheap - I'd live more comfortably

Con UCSD:
1. I'm sacrificing med school strength (arguably?)
2. I may just be charmed by the city's beauty and in reality could have little idea if I'll like it more than LA

I feel blessed to be in this position, and I want to just finally make my decision so I can rejoice and move forward. Thanks in advance for your help!

Congrats! Definitely a great dilemma to have! If your passion is research then UCSD looks like the best option. Med School at UCSD is also greatly respectable.

 

[TheShaker]

There's a physician scientist forum here that you should ask on. The people there are generally pretty experienced and give good advice.

 

[Xenoblade]

I am just gonna say it. I am super jelly.

 

[Xenoblade]

Oh yeah, congrats.

 

[Aerus]

Since when did UCSD or UCLA have Biomedical Engineering...?

 

[rain4venus]

Since when did UCSD or UCLA have Biomedical Engineering...?

bioengineering and biomedical engineering are the same thing. We voted on it at the 2005 BMES conference (no, really)
biological engineering is something totally different though

 

[Aerus]

bioengineering and biomedical engineering are the same thing. We voted on it at the 2005 BMES conference (no, really)
biological engineering is something totally different though

I'm not sure if this was sarcasm or not, so I'll assume the worst. Biomedical Engineering is more similar to Electrical Engineering than it is to Bioengineering.

 

[rain4venus]

I'm not sure if this was sarcasm or not, so I'll assume the worst. Biomedical Engineering is more similar to Electrical Engineering than it is to Bioengineering.

Not sarcasm. And I was serious that we (AEMB - the BME honor society) voted on it. The BMEs I know who do nothing but cell culture all day would disagree with you, and probably so would the straight up electrical engineers that are technically from bioengineering programs.

In fact, Georgia Tech (#2 grad program in BME/BioE according to USNews) has a BME program and a BioE program. They're called two different things just for to avoid confusion. Basically there's a BME department and bioengineering is a concentration that you can do whether you're in the BME department, or EE, or ME, etc... If you want to do the BME program, you have to be in the BME department. So if anything the BME program is the more bio-based one (it's a split program with bio classes at Emory and you end with a degree from both schools) and BioE is the more engineering-based.

BioE is often more diverse than BME, but the two terms are very frequently used interchangeably, even by us BMEs. Again, Biological Engineering is a very different thing. Since the field is still so new, there's not really too much standardization with the terms. USNews also lumps the two together in their rankings.

FWIW, I consider myself a BME because that's what my undergrad called it, although at Tech I was a BioE in the BME department. http://be.ucsd.edu/graduate_research sounds pretty much like BME to me.

 

[rain4venus]

As to the OP, I agree mostly with the first poster. If you want to do research long-term, I'd lean toward UCSD, unless there are specific opportunities at UCLA that you're more drawn to. Because in a lot of ways, an MD is an MD. I also like SD more than LA (okay except that I am really not a fan of LA, so I like San Diego a lot more)
If you don't think research is something you'll want to keep doing though, and you are worried about being competitive for tough residency spots, then UCLA probably has the edge. But I don't know anything about their med schools or curricula or anything so it's tough to say. I haven't even glanced in the direction of any of the CA schools... 😛

Oh and one more thing: Congrats! That's awesome to get into both of those programs!

 

[kvm90]

There's a physician scientist forum here that you should ask on. The people there are generally pretty experienced and give good advice.

Thanks - will do!

If you are serious about MSTP and having a career as a physician-scientist, then you should follow the research since that's what you will be focusing your career on, and not really take into account the medical education since you'll still be an MD if you go to UCLA or UCSD. If you are having second thoughts about incorporating research as a significant part of your career and think you may give up science and just practice medicine at any point in the future, then I'd come to UCLA 🙂

To address a few of your anti-UCLA points: IMO the cost of Weyburn is well worth how nice and well-maintained the apts are and the convenience of not having to commute. Plus you're MSTP so it's not coming out of loans. I never feel like my apt (a studio) is too small. I know nothing about UCSD so can't really offer much comparison however.

I probably am looking to split my time between research and clinical responsibilities. For this reason, I'm second-guessing myself for considering taking a slight hit in the MD front for a boost in the research rankings. Honestly, this doubt might come from my lack of knowledge around the paths that MD/PhDs can take after their program!

From what I've heard - the academic world is pretty keen on rankings, hierarchy, and prestige. Though I know the research opportunities/reputation in bioengineering at UCSD are top notch, I can't help but feel like the most frequent question I'll face from here on out is "Where did you go to medical school?"

 

[Xenoblade]

I am super jelly.

 

[Tijou]

Just to speak on the MD front, from what I've gathered from Doctors and PhD's alike in many different schools in CA is that you are not really getting dinged in the MD front if you choose UCSD. They are both highly regarded UC's and FWIW USNews rankings has UCLA tied at #12 and UCSD at #14. As an MD-PhD, people generally tend to focus on the PhD side, and if you're interested in Biomedical Engineering, UCSD definitely has the upper hand. I would say ultimately, go somewhere you think you will be happiest.

Edit: spelling errors