Did you guys seriously go on a page-long tangent about littering? Wtf seriously? I don't even litter, it was just an example. Seriously, wtf
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Started by imtheman25
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Did you guys seriously go on a page-long tangent about littering? Wtf seriously? I don't even litter, it was just an example. Seriously, wtf
SDN in a nutshell
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I typed 12 words, 12Did you guys seriously go on a page-long tangent about littering? Wtf seriously? I don't even litter, it was just an example. Seriously, wtf
I think it’s generational.. those of us who grew up in the limewire days, get a good laugh (in a nostalgic context) at these threads and the arguments about torrented videos.
I don't see anyone condoning that behavior here... We all have seen someone litters at some point, but do we go out of our way to call authorities.... Nahhh!
That former friend is a scum...
It is like pot, even if you smoke it or think there is nothing wrong with it you shouldnt go sharing it with people you dont trust. Its medical school, and you get lectured on how you are supposed to act in a professional manner at school all the time.
I agree, I learned this the hard way. I honestly was trying to help classmates out. My school is pass/fail, and we are not ranked so I did not think there was any hostility. Some schools have google drives filled with ripped books, videos, etc.
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I really like my class. I feel like I lucked out. I do not generally agree with the sentiment often expressed on SDN that everyone is involved in cliques and will stab you in the back - on the contrary, it seems most people are quite inclusive and will go out of their way to help fellow classmates.
I think this is a perfect example of why people should get "real world" jobs before entering medical school. You'll learn about how people REALLY behave. People are petty AF. Like extremely petty. Even if you're doing something benign, someone will tattle on you. It's office politics, but it follows everywhere. Thankfully medical school is bit more collaborative and "friendly" but you still have to watch your back with some people. Don't overshare. Keep to yourself. Don't engage in gossip (as much as you want to). Be humble and passive.
Also people on this website need to get off of their high horses. Since when did everyone become saints?
Also people on this website need to get off of their high horses. Since when did everyone become saints?
So did you get permission to use a picture of Dr. Najeeb as your profile pic?
I would argue you can’t even compare this to pot.. you aren’t shaken down before entering school (Drug testing) to see if you have torrented resource material. Torrents are one of those things that it’s use is widely known throughout schools but everyone turns a blind eye until the student with a stick where the sun doesn’t shine makes a formal complaint which requires administration to do something. It’s petty but black and white if you want to get down to the nitty gritty
Let's see....I literally talk to like 5 people in my class. It's cause we're all gay, friendly bad b**ches and we dress well.
Doing drugs is illegal
torrenting copyrighted material is illegal.
I dont understand why you have an issue with that truth. If you are going to do illegal stuff infront of people in a professional setting you deserve the blowback you get. Its idiotic, even if you are torrenting why on earth would you share it with people you dont know enough to trust. It is common sense. If you want to die on this hill by all means do so. There have been students who have been expelled for torrenting material in the past. Why would you risk an entire career on something stupid like this.
If you think me using the najeeb picture is copyright infringement , please let najeeb know.
Also not every school does mass drug screening prior to matriculation.
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Maybe you missed the part where I said it’s a black and white issue.. but a petty one :rolls eyes:
Not a medical student. I used to run quality control for a pharmacy that would send out medications to nursing homes/hospitals. I would frequently run into an issue where I had a worker named "Person A" who was running through the motions and not doing their assigned job. "Person A" would neglect to check the right medications went out often with disastrous implications such as allowing wrong doses of warfarin to be send to patients without double checking the INR and was consistently reprimanded, but only given a slap on the wrist by the owners. I directly had talked to "Person A" many times asking them to be more diligent as the medications were caught by me several times a month, but this was apparently a "chronic issue" that management had turned a blind eye towards.
I spent a number of years with the company and during my last year, I caught another mistake and as a visceral response I immaturely slammed the medical cart for the facility. Seeing my reaction, "Person A" talked to my supervisor about my "unprofessional conduct" and then left the building for the day. I took over their responsibilities for the week on top of my usual duties without any issue, they returned apparently with another slap on the wrist. I noticed that the work environment shifted as I had apparently "harassed" her and her alliance of coworkers began to submit reports to HR such as me taking a "35 minute break" versus a "30 minute break" or for general "unprofessional conduct" which resulted in a review meeting. When daily logs were reviewed, it was assessed that I apparently was the only one who used the log book routinely to document the work I did which was more or less three times the average employee. Laughs were exchanged in the meeting when it was established that nothing was going to change. I gave my two weeks notice a couple days afterwards.
I had a visceral reaction because it became evident to me that this person was a danger to patient safety and had 0 concern for the risk they posed because of their idgaf attitude. I left because I had an acceptance to a nursing program which I pursued.
I spent a number of years with the company and during my last year, I caught another mistake and as a visceral response I immaturely slammed the medical cart for the facility. Seeing my reaction, "Person A" talked to my supervisor about my "unprofessional conduct" and then left the building for the day. I took over their responsibilities for the week on top of my usual duties without any issue, they returned apparently with another slap on the wrist. I noticed that the work environment shifted as I had apparently "harassed" her and her alliance of coworkers began to submit reports to HR such as me taking a "35 minute break" versus a "30 minute break" or for general "unprofessional conduct" which resulted in a review meeting. When daily logs were reviewed, it was assessed that I apparently was the only one who used the log book routinely to document the work I did which was more or less three times the average employee. Laughs were exchanged in the meeting when it was established that nothing was going to change. I gave my two weeks notice a couple days afterwards.
I had a visceral reaction because it became evident to me that this person was a danger to patient safety and had 0 concern for the risk they posed because of their idgaf attitude. I left because I had an acceptance to a nursing program which I pursued.
Fwiw almost every school I interviewed at had a compiled hosted drive of all the board materials. The guy who made it was classs president at one school.
I think the risk with getting in trouble is not worth it but it also very much depends on the culture of your school. I can’t imagine a scenario where any one would get reported for this here.
I think the risk with getting in trouble is not worth it but it also very much depends on the culture of your school. I can’t imagine a scenario where any one would get reported for this here.
As another poster eloquently put it . There are plenty of petty tyrants with a little bit of power that you will encounter during training. Either play the game and get through it or end up like op or worse, out of training. This is a valuable lesson for OP. It could have been much worse.
@imtheman25 Sorry. I'd like to highlight that many of the coworkers who reported me to HR were people that I thought were acquaintances as we had gone out to movies together and had dinner together. I had covered shifts for them on numerous occasions because I needed money and I liked them as people. I was genuinely surprised that they chose to honor some "work coalition" instead of speaking to me directly. I only found out about what was happening behind my back through "a coworker bestie" who told me that I was being targeted for what I had done. I actually don't take it personally. I think that people in general will more often than not have a tendency to hurt each other when they intend to do the right thing. They probably thought they were protecting someone who was a victim. I'd like to think that to be true.
I would suggest that you be more clever with how you help other people. Some people are receptive and have relatively loose code of ethics that they can bend if the intention is for the greater good, for other people they might believe that rules by the straight and narrow are the only definitive evaluation of what is deemed to be good. I think that unfortunately you should prioritize self care right now. You seem to have taken this loss to the heart and it affects your perception from one instance to mistrusting colleagues and everyone else in the medical community. I sense that you have a big heart for others and I hope this situation doesn't jade you from branching out in the future because I think it's a quality that is needed in healthcare. Again, from someone that is not a medical student.
I would suggest that you be more clever with how you help other people. Some people are receptive and have relatively loose code of ethics that they can bend if the intention is for the greater good, for other people they might believe that rules by the straight and narrow are the only definitive evaluation of what is deemed to be good. I think that unfortunately you should prioritize self care right now. You seem to have taken this loss to the heart and it affects your perception from one instance to mistrusting colleagues and everyone else in the medical community. I sense that you have a big heart for others and I hope this situation doesn't jade you from branching out in the future because I think it's a quality that is needed in healthcare. Again, from someone that is not a medical student.
Oh look, it's the "all my classmates are fake and I'm the only real human being" thread again.
Look, your classmates are people that are likely less awful than you think, and you are likely just projecting your insecurities on them. Some of them might be a little fake or cutthroat, but they'll grow up, and fast. Few stay that way, and people learn and grow as medical school moves along. If you isolate yourself, you may end up falling behind as they grow beyond you
I feel like every week I see a new thread pop up about people thinking their classmates are a bunch of a**hole gunners or part of exclusive cliques and that it's "high school all over again."
Maybe it's just because I haven't experienced that so much at my school but I always wonder why people feel this way. Not saying I think these people are lying but I definitely find it skeptical. Honestly, what are your classmates doing that makes them fake? Who is backstabbing and destroying careers? Do people even have the time for that stuff? Lol. The reporting for the torrenting is kind of lame but I can't imagine actions like that are widespread everywhere. I'm in a class of 200 people and for the most part, people are nice and friendly enough. There are some arrogant people, some people who are incredibly quiet/boring and some people are kind of weird but this is just a minority of students. The average medical student will be nice enough and will help you out if you need it.
Also, this isn't directed at you but at people in general, can we please stop with this whole "clique" thing? It's getting kind of stupid IMO. We're all medical students, we're all adults, a lot of people are in serious relationships, people are married, people have kids, etc. There aren't any cliques. It's common sense that people are going to become friends with other people in their class for whatever reasons, and then those people will mostly hang out together. People talk about cliques in med school as if all 200 people in a class are supposed to hang out with each other every day. There's never any intentional exclusion going on. It becomes tedious to try to reach out to everyone when you want to do something outside of class. You can nitpick all day about so and so not inviting person A to this dinner or person B to this event or whatever. Just do things with people depending on who's free and what's going on and reach out to others you might feel like you haven't seen in a long time and set something up. Don't get why it's so hard to grasp this concept or why so much drama has to be involved.
Maybe it's just because I haven't experienced that so much at my school but I always wonder why people feel this way. Not saying I think these people are lying but I definitely find it skeptical. Honestly, what are your classmates doing that makes them fake? Who is backstabbing and destroying careers? Do people even have the time for that stuff? Lol. The reporting for the torrenting is kind of lame but I can't imagine actions like that are widespread everywhere. I'm in a class of 200 people and for the most part, people are nice and friendly enough. There are some arrogant people, some people who are incredibly quiet/boring and some people are kind of weird but this is just a minority of students. The average medical student will be nice enough and will help you out if you need it.
Also, this isn't directed at you but at people in general, can we please stop with this whole "clique" thing? It's getting kind of stupid IMO. We're all medical students, we're all adults, a lot of people are in serious relationships, people are married, people have kids, etc. There aren't any cliques. It's common sense that people are going to become friends with other people in their class for whatever reasons, and then those people will mostly hang out together. People talk about cliques in med school as if all 200 people in a class are supposed to hang out with each other every day. There's never any intentional exclusion going on. It becomes tedious to try to reach out to everyone when you want to do something outside of class. You can nitpick all day about so and so not inviting person A to this dinner or person B to this event or whatever. Just do things with people depending on who's free and what's going on and reach out to others you might feel like you haven't seen in a long time and set something up. Don't get why it's so hard to grasp this concept or why so much drama has to be involved.
Med school is a high stress environment with competitive personalities who are stuck together regardless of how they feel about each other for two years and then the stress kicks up a notch and the groups get smaller for third year. There is inevitable gossip, cliques, relationships, etc. Some people thrive in that, some don't. I had a family already, which helped, but there will always be someone in your class that you can befriend or at least a little time for a hobby.
Regarding the torrents. Many students/residents use them. Board resources are ridiculously expensive. That said, the FBI raided my undergrad campus for that way back when I was there and some people did real jail time. Be careful.
Regarding the torrents. Many students/residents use them. Board resources are ridiculously expensive. That said, the FBI raided my undergrad campus for that way back when I was there and some people did real jail time. Be careful.
Hope you told everyone in your class what a snitch that person is. Wonder how many people will help that person in the future.
Whoever turned you in is human garbage. Honestly if someone thinks otherwise they probably aren't worth caring about. Anyway, if you don't want to interact with your peers just don't. Its not that hard.
This story is gut-wrenching. Sorry you had to go through it.
In real jobs - you meet people who literally are terrible employees like this. And in certain cases are putting others at risk. And because of office politics, literally nothing ever happens to them. The thought “if I was the boss, I would literally fire them today” probably crosses your mind all the time and there is nothing to be done about it.
I feel for you. It is something you learn just from working a job. Definitely teaches you something. Sucks that they then go after you, because misery loves company. Always teaches you to keep things professional and learn how to keep professional boundaries.
Someone once told me “don’t wrestle in the mud with a pig, because the pig will like it.” This pretty much applies to anything within the professional environment. It is the perfect quote for this idea. Don’t drop those professional boundaries unless you are close friends with someone. Very important lesson.
And plus OP - your punishment was essentially a slap on the wrist. Learn this lesson and it will definitely be worth it.
In real jobs - you meet people who literally are terrible employees like this. And in certain cases are putting others at risk. And because of office politics, literally nothing ever happens to them. The thought “if I was the boss, I would literally fire them today” probably crosses your mind all the time and there is nothing to be done about it.
I feel for you. It is something you learn just from working a job. Definitely teaches you something. Sucks that they then go after you, because misery loves company. Always teaches you to keep things professional and learn how to keep professional boundaries.
Someone once told me “don’t wrestle in the mud with a pig, because the pig will like it.” This pretty much applies to anything within the professional environment. It is the perfect quote for this idea. Don’t drop those professional boundaries unless you are close friends with someone. Very important lesson.
And plus OP - your punishment was essentially a slap on the wrist. Learn this lesson and it will definitely be worth it.
Yes, I have many classmates who I like. But to address the original poster: it is true that there may be people you don't like. It's not uncommon, in medical school, or in life in general. But specifically as for the "gunner" behavior, I think that it's best to try to find people who are not gunners-the class is bound to have some. Trust me, it makes a huge difference who you hang out with every day. I felt my mental health improve so much once I found the right group of friends-people who cared about me as a person and not just my grades, who weren't into friendship just for the sake of comparing grades.
Sorry you are going through a hard time and I hope things get better 🙂
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I guess unpopular opinion, but I don't think all my classmates are super cool/great. Some of them are really annoying
However, none of them are horrible people either at least from what I've encountered.
The truest thing op said though was that your classmates overall won't be happy for your success. When I've shared publications I've had accepted or scholarships I've gotten during my time in med school with friends, I've received a variable amount of anxiety, annoyance and stress thrown at me instead of excitement.
But honestly, this is my fault. I can see how classmates might think I'm being the obnoxious one by sharing. After I realized I wasn't picking my audience for this info well, I started reserving my good news for non med school friends.
So plot twist, even with good intentions if you constantly feel like your classmates are haters, maybe it's you
However, none of them are horrible people either at least from what I've encountered.
The truest thing op said though was that your classmates overall won't be happy for your success. When I've shared publications I've had accepted or scholarships I've gotten during my time in med school with friends, I've received a variable amount of anxiety, annoyance and stress thrown at me instead of excitement.
But honestly, this is my fault. I can see how classmates might think I'm being the obnoxious one by sharing. After I realized I wasn't picking my audience for this info well, I started reserving my good news for non med school friends.
So plot twist, even with good intentions if you constantly feel like your classmates are haters, maybe it's you
I sort of agree with you about med school people. I don't think most people in my class are evil, but I have noticed a lot of abnormal (maybe not in a good way) personality traits. I just don't think the med school admissions process really selects for well-balanced, non-competitive, not neurotic personality types. There also seems to be a not insignificant part of my class that wants to re-create high school except this time they want to be the cool kids they never were back in the day. Weird stuff.
L7 weenies. The lot of them.
I’ve had other classmates express that they feel a level of conformity in expressing their ideas that have become uncomfortable in order to stay in the cliques they identify with and a fear of social isolation. Admittedly, I don’t understand this position as this is a professional school, no one should be feeling the need to fit in with a clique that changes the way they live their lives. And if these people didn’t tell me this, I would have never noticed that was actually happening. I would not have found this acceptable in college either.
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Agreed. What drives me nuts is when people accuse others of being cliquey etc in med school or that its just like HS all over again. It was said a lot. Free time in med school is precious, and people generally just spend time with whoever they became close with from the beginning for whatever reason. You don't have the time or desire to invite every single person you know in your class to every social function/party/dinner and so you end up offending people. You end up just wanting to spend time with a few people you're closest with. I don't actively dislike anyone in med school, in fact I love my entire class in general, but that doesn't mean I go out of my way to spend time with everyone. I just don't have the time to get to know everyone that well or the desire to.
But I found that as the years went on, people ended up opening up to others naturally and being less insecure. By being thrown in together through M1-M2 and then randomly being paired up with others on clinical rotations you become closer with more people in your class and your class becomes more connected. In M1-M2 you just hang out with whoever you choose to but in M3-M4 you have no idea what rotation order your friends will have and thus you are working with and spending time with lots of random classmates. In fact I ended up partnered up on clinical rotations with people I didn't even know existed when I was an M1-M2.
I also wanted to add that when people ask me what the best part of med school is I usually respond with "my class". Not the learning medicine, not the faculty, not the hospitals or physicians but my class. So for future matriculants don't get too worried about seeing negative things on here regarding med school classes, guaranteed you will find a special group of people you will be close with forever.
That bond you build of just going through the gauntlet of med school with those people is something you don't get to share with anyone else and its special. You all have that common interest of becoming doctors at the end of the journey. In fact I identify and relate more with my classmates than with anyone outside of med.
That bond you build of just going through the gauntlet of med school with those people is something you don't get to share with anyone else and its special. You all have that common interest of becoming doctors at the end of the journey. In fact I identify and relate more with my classmates than with anyone outside of med.
Its gonna be ok. Most of this thread is crazy imo. Heck we have professors at my school putting text books on our class drives for us and i think organization of these materials is a duty of one of the sga officers.
I like the majority of my classmates tbh.
Personally, I do not relate with OP even remotely. I genuinely like >80% of my class, feel neutral toward 10-15%, and the last 5 or so percent I find kind of annoying but not in a way that really impacts me at all.
Sometimes people can be a little overly protective of what they are doing; like if I'm making conversation and asking questions about their research projects they'll act like I"m trying to steal a state secret, but I would absolutely not suggest anyone is stabbing anyone in the back.
Lucky me I suppose?
Sometimes people can be a little overly protective of what they are doing; like if I'm making conversation and asking questions about their research projects they'll act like I"m trying to steal a state secret, but I would absolutely not suggest anyone is stabbing anyone in the back.
Lucky me I suppose?
I liked my medical school class. very friendly and collegial for the most part.
So i don't know. Maybe I was That Guy.
So i don't know. Maybe I was That Guy.
I love my class, actually. Best group I've gotten to hang with in a long time!
I've had similar experiences as OP. Just recently I was accosted by the school dean who happens to be my advising dean who informed me that someone had seen my charging my vape pen on my computer while on the floors and had reported me. I also was summoned to an honor code committee because my classmates had seen me taking unexcused absences and reported me for unprofessional behavior. The absences were protected by HIPAA protected information and the same dean put a stop to it before I had to face anyone. So no real harm done but it did drastically shake my confidence in those three people who accused me one of whom I had considered somewhat of a cordial buddy. Turns out he's a prick too. I have a support system and community outside of school and would not have known what to do if I didn't have them. Because I agree with OP. Med school is just like high school. I used to think people grew out of that cliquey mean spirited mentality. But I'm realizing thats not the case. Btw I've had real life experience before coming to med school in my thirties and I must say while there's a lot of dysfunction in the blue collar working world it takes on a whole new dimension when you get to the white collar world. I think what's so distasteful about this thread is the downright LEGALISM and Gunneristic qualities. Legalism is straining at a gnat and then swallowing a camel. It's focusing on the less important issue like littering or torrenting widely used material, but then turning a blind eye to the ostracism that takes place in medical school or the rampant little egomaniacs in training. Are med school students fake not all of them but I would say most of them at least in my school. Or at least half and the watch your back mentality is certainly in effect. For those whose classes share authentic camaraderie count your blessings because I definitely don't think it's the norm.
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Torrenting copyrighted material is theft
For people who torrent, at least call it what it is. Stealing. Then you can bring your sob stories and mental gymnastics on how you spend 400k on your education and you can't afford your board prep.
which review class was this?
I don’t really like torrenting either, to be honest, and have never done this. I paid full price for books throughout med school, used the online resources through my med school library, or would order the occasional book through interlibrary loan. I also really hate littering.
That being said, there are a lot of common crimes associated with relatively small, nebulous and distributed harms. As a rule, I’m not going out of my way to report these things. I wouldn’t go out of my way to report an acquaintance who wasn’t in medicine to their place of work for downloading torrented music, littering, smoking a joint when they were off-duty, etc. Similary, I wouldn’t have gone out of my way to report an acquaintance in medical school for downloading torrented books.
That being said, there are a lot of common crimes associated with relatively small, nebulous and distributed harms. As a rule, I’m not going out of my way to report these things. I wouldn’t go out of my way to report an acquaintance who wasn’t in medicine to their place of work for downloading torrented music, littering, smoking a joint when they were off-duty, etc. Similary, I wouldn’t have gone out of my way to report an acquaintance in medical school for downloading torrented books.
I paid for Pathoma, B&B, FA, OME, and Sketchy. My school paid for most textbooks' online access (or had them in the library). I purchased several 1st-3rd year books from upperclassmen.
I also downloaded ALL of those resources as free pdfs or videos, because it's simply a better format. Even the online access for textbooks is clunky and inaccessible. And sometimes, you don't realize you need something until 10pm the night before.
Now, I also definitely download/steal sources that I don't pay for...not trying to pretend to virtue that I don't have. I am, undeniably, part of the problem.
However, I would argue that the fact that it is still 9/10 MORE convenient to steal the product once you have actually purchased it, because the accessibility is better, is also part of the problem. If I could rent a .pdf textbook from my library, I'd do that. I can't.
Every person on this planet has the potential to be hitler or ghandi. Just remember everyone has the same millions of years of evolution programming them up until this point. When you start to see things through this lens you start to not care. Everyone has an agenda: some want to be popular, some want to pass their classes, some want to be SGA president, others want to match derm. How people act is just based on what they want and their lives that have formed their views of reality up until that point. I can be a real Piece of Sh** at times but I also can be an awesome caring person. I am neither a piece of sh** or a saint. I am some weird combination of the two. Just like everyone else on this earth.
This is the dumbest take I have ever seen on this site.
Just because something is "illegal" doesnt mean you deserve blowback. That is a very low level take on morality.
If your classmate saw you driving over the speed limit on the way into school, that does not mean he should report that to the administration. It also does not mean the administrators should enforce a professionalism inquiry into your behavior on the basis that you have a wanton disregard for human life and safety.
This is the dumbest analysis of a comment I have seen on this site.
If you read the comment, I was not making a statement on morality. Rather discretion, I dont care if you do drugs or hire prostitutes or do coke in your free time in your home or outside school. The moment you start doing that on school property in view of others you have opened yourself up to ramifications.
Do you think the distinction of whether the torrenting occurred on-campus or off-campus is important here? If someone commits an indecent act, the determinant of whether they deserve punishment is their discretion?
